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   <title>Zeno_of_Citium&apos;s Blog</title>
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   <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/zeno_of_citium//3719</id>
   <updated>	2009-09-19T14:20:44Z	2009-09-19T14:15:47Z	2009-09-19T14:10:08Z	2009-09-19T13:26:57Z			2009-09-19T13:13:56Z	2009-09-19T13:06:46Z	2009-09-19T12:57:24Z		2009-09-19T12:42:55Z	2009-09-19T12:35:41Z	2009-09-19T12:17:36Z	2009-09-19T12:01:56Z	2009-09-19T11:58:46Z	2009-09-19T09:31:27Z	2009-09-19T09:31:27Z	2009-09-19T09:20:29Z	2009-09-19T09:20:29Z	2009-09-19T09:07:41Z		2009-09-19T08:36:34Z		2009-09-19T07:46:26Z	2009-09-19T07:25:50Z	2009-09-19T07:18:52Z	2009-09-19T07:12:32Z		2009-09-19T07:04:13Z	2009-09-19T07:03:40Z</updated>
   
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			<entry>
            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/robert_reich//4885.281075-comment:3536848</id>
		    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/robert_reich/2009/07/the-wall-street-rally-watch-yo.php#c3536848" />
		
		    <title>Zeno_of_Citium Commented on The Wall Street Rally: Watch Your Wallets by Robert Reich</title>
		        
			<published>2009-07-24T03:19:13Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-07-24T03:19:13Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>Best statement of the day!</p>]]>
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			<entry>
            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009://14.278851-comment:3523168</id>
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		    <title><![CDATA[Zeno_of_Citium Commented on Top 10 Reasons the U.S. Isn&apos;t Getting its Panties in a Bunch over Honduras by Katie Halper]]></title>
		        
			<published>2009-07-10T05:46:26Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-07-10T05:46:26Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>After reading your bio Katie, I'm now your #1 fan. Your my hero.... </p>]]>
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			<entry>
            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009://14.278851-comment:3523162</id>
		    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/07/09/top_10_reasons_the_us_isnt_getting_its_panties_in/#c3523162" />
		
		    <title><![CDATA[Zeno_of_Citium Commented on Top 10 Reasons the U.S. Isn&apos;t Getting its Panties in a Bunch over Honduras by Katie Halper]]></title>
		        
			<published>2009-07-10T05:41:41Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-07-10T05:41:41Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>I thought it was great satire, and right on target. Bravo! Bravo!</p>]]>
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            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/rainkeep//6326.278340-comment:3520085</id>
		    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/rainkeep/2009/07/-plunge-protection-team.php#c3520085" />
		
		    <title>Zeno_of_Citium Commented on Goldman Sachs and the Code of Gold by DonDi</title>
		        
			<published>2009-07-07T18:11:21Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-07-07T18:11:21Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>Go read Zero Hedge, they paint a different picture.</p>]]>
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            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/rainkeep//6326.278340-comment:3520081</id>
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		    <title>Zeno_of_Citium Commented on Goldman Sachs and the Code of Gold by DonDi</title>
		        
			<published>2009-07-07T18:09:05Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-07-07T18:09:05Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>Zero Hedge blog has been following this pretty closely.</p>]]>
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			<entry>
            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/carlbentham//7730.277760-comment:3515888</id>
		    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/carlbentham/2009/07/sen-inhofe-on-franken-were-goi.php#c3515888" />
		
		    <title><![CDATA[Zeno_of_Citium Commented on Sen. Inhofe on Franken: &apos;We&apos;re going to get the clown&apos; by CarlBentham]]></title>
		        
			<published>2009-07-02T19:07:02Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-07-02T19:07:02Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>The court jester is the only one allowed to tell the truth to the king and keep his head. The anger of the right directed at Al means he's no clown. </p>]]>
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			<entry>
            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/tmcpac//3804.277191-comment:3511378</id>
		    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/tmcpac/2009/06/i-really-need-your-help-b4-jun.php#c3511378" />
		
		    <title><![CDATA[Zeno_of_Citium Commented on PLEASE!  I TRULY do NEED your help b4 June 30th!! Just take a look . (Please REC this post, normally I wouldn&apos;t ask but this SHIT is serious) by O¿O in the crowd]]></title>
		        
			<published>2009-06-28T03:00:05Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-06-28T03:00:05Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>Anyone arguing for no government control is an idiot. This "either or" bullshit of yours is simple minded. You know damn well without the law things would really go to shit. But you don't care about that because a good conservative knows they can just buy the government they want. No what you really hate is poor people getting some of your precious money just for being poor. And democracy allows that to happen. So it's a good guess you despise democracy too.   </p>]]>
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            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/zeno_of_citium//3719.275966-comment:3503081</id>
		    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/zeno_of_citium/2009/06/i-found-this-exchange-interest.php#c3503081" />
		
		    <title>Zeno_of_Citium Commented on I found this exchange interesting... by Zeno_of_Citium</title>
		        
			<published>2009-06-20T09:31:25Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-06-20T09:31:25Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>otherwise barter systems couldn't exist.</p>]]>
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            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/zeno_of_citium//3719.275966-comment:3503080</id>
		    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/zeno_of_citium/2009/06/i-found-this-exchange-interest.php#c3503080" />
		
		    <title>Zeno_of_Citium Commented on I found this exchange interesting... by Zeno_of_Citium</title>
		        
			<published>2009-06-20T09:29:42Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-06-20T09:29:42Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>"That only muddles the producer/consumer picture, and in fact capital is *part* of production. "</p>

<p>I disagree. capital is wealth and thus status. the transfer of capital is the transfer of status which also provides the means to control assets. It's separate from the asset or service it is used to obtain. </p>]]>
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            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/zeno_of_citium//3719.275966-comment:3503071</id>
		    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/zeno_of_citium/2009/06/i-found-this-exchange-interest.php#c3503071" />
		
		    <title>Zeno_of_Citium Commented on I found this exchange interesting... by Zeno_of_Citium</title>
		        
			<published>2009-06-20T08:36:38Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-06-20T08:36:38Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>"not Communist in the ridged sense you describe"</p>

<p>"rigid? Even so, I don't see how you inferred any particular sense to my brief remark. Are you feeling rigid/ridged?"</p>

<p>I meant rigid...</p>]]>
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            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/zeno_of_citium//3719.275966-comment:3503069</id>
		    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/zeno_of_citium/2009/06/i-found-this-exchange-interest.php#c3503069" />
		
		    <title>Zeno_of_Citium Commented on I found this exchange interesting... by Zeno_of_Citium</title>
		        
			<published>2009-06-20T08:32:37Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-06-20T08:32:37Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>I would add that even though we disagree, i have enjoyed the exchange... Many thanks.</p>]]>
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            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/zeno_of_citium//3719.275966-comment:3503068</id>
		    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/zeno_of_citium/2009/06/i-found-this-exchange-interest.php#c3503068" />
		
		    <title>Zeno_of_Citium Commented on I found this exchange interesting... by Zeno_of_Citium</title>
		        
			<published>2009-06-20T08:28:13Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-06-20T08:28:13Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>No you inferred. I did no such thing. You described me as communist, when what I described was clearly not communist.</p>

<p>You are right, you and I clearly disagree on who deserves what in this country, the capitalist or the producer. Clearly the capitalist is taking as much as he can and less is being produced as a result. When you say you don't have responsibility for the well being and health of others that is automatically dividing out yourself. </p>

<p> "Even if I am my brother's keeper, am I to keep an eye on him or by contrast, in effect jail him according to my personal moral opinions?"</p>

<p>jail is not a concern when providing health care, but morality on the other hand is. The statement "am I my brothers keeper" as I understand it does not pertain to watching my brothers actions but to my brother's needs. The community is perfectly able to deal out justice through the collective application of the law as administered through elected government. </p>]]>
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            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/zeno_of_citium//3719.275766-comment:3503034</id>
		    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/zeno_of_citium/2009/06/universal-heath-care-petition.php#c3503034" />
		
		    <title>Zeno_of_Citium Commented on Universal Heath care petition! by Zeno_of_Citium</title>
		        
			<published>2009-06-20T06:15:39Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-06-20T06:15:39Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>"I think single-payer is really socialized medicine with a facade of "it's only social insurance".</p>

<p>nonsense, single payer is the government collecting the insurance money and paying the doctors without taking a profit for doing so. <br />
It's non-profit insurance. </p>]]>
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            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/zeno_of_citium//3719.275766-comment:3503033</id>
		    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/zeno_of_citium/2009/06/universal-heath-care-petition.php#c3503033" />
		
		    <title>Zeno_of_Citium Commented on Universal Heath care petition! by Zeno_of_Citium</title>
		        
			<published>2009-06-20T06:12:49Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-06-20T06:12:49Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>"I don't believe in the Collective except as 1) a statistical ensemble of individuals and 2) a [usually] muddled notion in people's psyches which can range from a delusion to a basis for lemming-like behavior."<br />
 It is not necessary to believe in the power of collective will or responsibility. All idealism operates inside a conversation between people. Community in that it exist at all exists in the shared language and concerns of the people. The separateness of the elite is at the root of the disillusion of the community and the root of the current conflict. Democracy has failed because the power of the community's will has been usurped by the power of money and high status. That is the result of unfettered Capitalism. </p>]]>
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            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/zeno_of_citium//3719.275766-comment:3503032</id>
		    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/zeno_of_citium/2009/06/universal-heath-care-petition.php#c3503032" />
		
		    <title>Zeno_of_Citium Commented on Universal Heath care petition! by Zeno_of_Citium</title>
		        
			<published>2009-06-20T06:03:01Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-06-20T06:03:01Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>A communists expects to take all property for the use of the community. I do not. I see my views a close to Socialism. I believe that as a community, or society if you will, we all have a shared responsibility to look after the health of everyone in the community.  I believe there are certain services that are essential to a functioning community such as access to fresh water, food and energy production which should be treated like communal property and regulated to the benefit of the community. The idea of communal space is not Communist in the ridged sense you describe. Communism in the idealistic form you describe is complete abdication of private property and enterprise. Please, explain to me why it has to be an either or dichotomy. Democracy is shared power and shared responsibility. Democracy is a form of socialism. Capitalism as it is practiced in the US is anti-democratic and leads to autocratic rule. </p>]]>
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            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/zeno_of_citium//3719.275766-comment:3502858</id>
		    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/zeno_of_citium/2009/06/universal-heath-care-petition.php#c3502858" />
		
		    <title>Zeno_of_Citium Commented on Universal Heath care petition! by Zeno_of_Citium</title>
		        
			<published>2009-06-20T01:08:15Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-06-20T01:08:15Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>eds, said something which got my attention up the comment que. It got me thinking about why I support single payer and nothing else.</p>

<p>The gist of the situation for me is that we are a community, a society if you will, and as such we have a responsibility for the well being of everyone and thus the preservation of the community itself. Each of us should contribute what we are able to a pool that pays for the care of all, in the same way our taxes pay for our defense. The current "private" system leaves health care to those who can afford it only. This allows those who can to only take responsibility for themselves. The power of the collective will is felt through democracy itself. The exercise of democracy is being denied through the force of financial power. The health and well being of the community as represented by our taxes is suffering as a result. No private health system or private army can ever represent the will of the community because it has no responsibility to do so.    </p>]]>
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            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/zeno_of_citium//3719.275766-comment:3502841</id>
		    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/zeno_of_citium/2009/06/universal-heath-care-petition.php#c3502841" />
		
		    <title>Zeno_of_Citium Commented on Universal Heath care petition! by Zeno_of_Citium</title>
		        
			<published>2009-06-20T00:51:14Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-06-20T00:51:14Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p> ""I don't reach the level of"</p>

<p>"believe single payer is the right way to go""</p>

<p>And what is the better way to go? Or better yet what should health care look like ideally? What should it be about to you?</p>]]>
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	<entry>
		
	<title>Zeno_of_Citium recommended How many people do you know that would be self employed if there was Universal SINGLE PAYER Healthcare? and A Little Help Please! by O¿O in the crowd</title>
    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/tmcpac/2009/01/how-many-people-do-you-know-th.php" />
   <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/tmcpac//3804.253617</id>
  <published>2009-01-26T13:44:42Z</published>
   <updated>2009-01-26T18:50:57Z</updated>
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            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/zeno_of_citium//3719.275766-comment:3502106</id>
		    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/zeno_of_citium/2009/06/universal-heath-care-petition.php#c3502106" />
		
		    <title>Zeno_of_Citium Commented on Universal Heath care petition! by Zeno_of_Citium</title>
		        
			<published>2009-06-19T09:08:07Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-06-19T09:08:07Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>You sign?</p>]]>
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            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/rowanwolf//10211.275761-comment:3502076</id>
		    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/rowanwolf/2009/06/lets-re-regulate-the-financial.php#c3502076" />
		
		    <title><![CDATA[Zeno_of_Citium Commented on Let&apos;s Re-Regulate the Financial Sector? by Rowan Wolf]]></title>
		        
			<published>2009-06-19T06:40:52Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-06-19T06:40:52Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>Off subject, Go sign Bernie's petition..... Check my blog for the link.</p>]]>
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            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/kenneth_thomas//3727.275759-comment:3502034</id>
		    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/kenneth_thomas/2009/06/why-hasnt-anyone-pointed-out-t.php#c3502034" />
		
		    <title><![CDATA[Zeno_of_Citium Commented on Why Hasn&apos;t Anyone Pointed out the Obvious on Health Care Reform?? by Kenneth Thomas]]></title>
		        
			<published>2009-06-19T04:17:19Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-06-19T04:17:19Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>Just think if we had ended the war in 2005 we could have payed for SP UHC. Just think about who got that money instead with that fat government contract going to the company they hold 10% share of, who's driving that Lamborghini down the 280 at 90 mph.... Better hope a deer doesn't jump in front of them. No, No new taxes for him he's keeping the "economy" going. Ain't it funny how that works? </p>]]>
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            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/rowanwolf//10211.275761-comment:3502022</id>
		    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/rowanwolf/2009/06/lets-re-regulate-the-financial.php#c3502022" />
		
		    <title><![CDATA[Zeno_of_Citium Commented on Let&apos;s Re-Regulate the Financial Sector? by Rowan Wolf]]></title>
		        
			<published>2009-06-19T03:40:04Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-06-19T03:40:04Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>co-signed</p>]]>
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	<entry>
		
	<title><![CDATA[Zeno_of_Citium recommended Let&apos;s Re-Regulate the Financial Sector? by Rowan Wolf]]></title>
    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/rowanwolf/2009/06/lets-re-regulate-the-financial.php" />
   <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/rowanwolf//10211.275761</id>
  <published>2009-06-18T22:55:29Z</published>
   <updated>2009-06-18T23:09:56Z</updated>
	</entry>
	




	
        
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            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/aunt_sam//2777.275765-comment:3502013</id>
		    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/aunt_sam/2009/06/proof-of-innocence-not-allowed.php#c3502013" />
		
		    <title>Zeno_of_Citium Commented on Proof of Innocence Not Allowed Constitutionally?!? by Aunt Sam</title>
		        
			<published>2009-06-19T03:31:41Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-06-19T03:31:41Z</updated>
		    <content type="html" xml:lang="en-us" xml:base="">
		        <![CDATA[<p>The answer is nothing. This is the price you pay for not allowing conservatives to go unchallenged. To think bush placed many many people throughout gov. that have no interest in allowing it to function.</p>]]>
		    </content>
		    
		</entry>
        
    




	
	<entry>
		
	<title>Zeno_of_Citium recommended Proof of Innocence Not Allowed Constitutionally?!? by Aunt Sam</title>
    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/aunt_sam/2009/06/proof-of-innocence-not-allowed.php" />
   <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/aunt_sam//2777.275765</id>
  <published>2009-06-19T01:57:18Z</published>
   <updated>2009-06-19T02:20:20Z</updated>
	</entry>
	




	
        
			<entry>
            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/zeno_of_citium//3719.275766-comment:3502001</id>
		    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/zeno_of_citium/2009/06/universal-heath-care-petition.php#c3502001" />
		
		    <title>Zeno_of_Citium Commented on Universal Heath care petition! by Zeno_of_Citium</title>
		        
			<published>2009-06-19T03:14:03Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-06-19T03:14:03Z</updated>
		    <content type="html" xml:lang="en-us" xml:base="">
		        <![CDATA[<p>I don't know if its true not but someone told me that close to 40% of health care cost in the US is profit for the industry and Wall St.<br />
If that number is even half correct it's outrageous.  </p>]]>
		    </content>
		    
		</entry>
        
    





	
        
			<entry>
            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/zeno_of_citium//3719.275766-comment:3501996</id>
		    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/zeno_of_citium/2009/06/universal-heath-care-petition.php#c3501996" />
		
		    <title>Zeno_of_Citium Commented on Universal Heath care petition! by Zeno_of_Citium</title>
		        
			<published>2009-06-19T03:08:57Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-06-19T03:08:57Z</updated>
		    <content type="html" xml:lang="en-us" xml:base="">
		        <![CDATA[<p>Thank You, oleeb!</p>]]>
		    </content>
		    
		</entry>
        
    




	
	<entry>
		
	<title>Zeno_of_Citium recommended Universal Heath care petition! by Zeno_of_Citium</title>
    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/zeno_of_citium/2009/06/universal-heath-care-petition.php" />
   <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/zeno_of_citium//3719.275766</id>
  <published>2009-06-19T02:53:40Z</published>
   <updated>2009-06-19T03:06:55Z</updated>
	</entry>
	


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