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A Simple Question: Would God Condone Torture?


 

BENEATH THE SPIN • ERIC L. WATTREE

 
A Simple Question: Would God Condone Torture?
 
 
Maybe I'm missing something but I find it uniquely ironic that some the same people who clamor for prayer in school, claim that same-sex marriage is an abomination under God,who insist that America is a Christian nation, and fight for the Biblical version of creationism over science, are also the very same people who demand the right to be armed to the teeth with some of the most destructive private weapons on Earth, the right to slaughter and bring the most excruciating kinds of death upon God's other creatures for nothing more than their own entertainment, and now, condone the torture of other human beings as a legitimate tool of government. Is it just me, or does anyone else see this as the very height of hypocrisy?

It seems to me that the mere fact that we're even debating the merits of torture is a clear indication that we've gone much too far towards allowing America to become a decadent nation. It has become clear that due to our all consuming preoccupation with personal titillation and hedonistic materialism to the exclusion of intellectual, moral, and ethical development, we're rapidly transforming this nation from that shining light on the hill, to a decadent hellhole in the valley of iniquity. Hypocrisy, self-delusion, deceit is no longer the exception, it has become the rule.

And this is no accident. I've been watching this nation gradually sink into the abyss for the past thirty years. The late Sen. Claiborne Pell of Rhode Island, and sponsor of the Pell Grant said, "The strength of the United States is not the gold at Fort Knox or the weapons of mass destruction that we have, but the sum total of the education and the character of our people." No truer words were ever spoken, and they directly address the source of many, if not all of the problems that we face today. We've allowed ourselves to be manipulated, robbed, and cheated, as a direct result of becoming morally and intellectually bankrupt.

We've become so preoccupied with big houses, big cars, and the pursuit of pleasure that we've completely lost perspective regarding what is real, and what is important in life. A prime example of that is a guy who was in the news earlier this week - I forgot his name, and it's not even worth researching, but in any case - after catching a football and running a few yards, he thought he was so important that he could thumb his nose at the President of the United States.

This guy is so caught up in the superficial, and has become so completely overwhelmed with his own delusion of importance that the meaning of graciousness and simple courtesy has been completely lost on him. He was quoted as saying the only reason the president invited us to the White House was because we won the super bowl. Well, of course that's the reason! He failed to realize that an invitation from the president represents the people of the United States congratulating him and his teammates for a job well done. But obviously, he misunderstands the relative importance between the president of the United States, and a guy who caught a football.

This guy is apparently under the impression that he's become so important that by rejecting the invitation to the White House he was depriving the president of the honor of meeting him. He fails to realize that playing football represents the toy department of life - just like too many more of us. Thus, I must admit it was partially the president's fault for inviting him in the first place. The president should have invited all of the young people across this country who graduated as the top scholars in their respective classes. By doing so, it not only would have placed what's important to the nation in perspective, but they would have also had the intellect to recognize the honor that had been bestowed upon them.

Education is the key to a viable society, and the lack thereof is the key to our destruction. We often discuss, for example, how badly we need campaign reform, and how unrestricted lobbying prevents the government from functioning as it should. While that is undoubtedly true in our current circumstance, if we had a better educated electorate it wouldn't matter how much money poured into a politician's campaign coffers, he still couldn't be elected without being responsive to the needs of the people. After all, the only thing campaign funds are good for is brainwashing the ignorant.

An educated electorate wouldn't be as prone to respond to the ten second sound bite, or the logical inconsistencies that demagogues present as patriotism. And they'd understand enough about America's traditions to recognize that torture is the perfect anthesis of not only Christianity, but the very foundation that this nation was built upon. They'd also recognize that promoting the interests of the people wasn't some sort of evil, socialist plot, and they'd see the inconsistency of attacking Iraq, while the people who attacked the United States were in Afghanistan. They'd also ask pertinent questions like"Why aren't the children of the rich, and political class, dying in this war like our love ones?"

An educated electorate would have demanded to know what Cheney discussed with the business leaders he gathered together when the Bush administration first entered office - and they wouldn't have accepted "it's none of your business" as an answer. And a red flag would have immediately gone up when the corporation that Cheney headed received a lucrative no-bid contract as a result of invading an oil-rich nation.

A thoughtful electorate would have asked early on why would an administration who claim to love and honor our troops send them into harms way without the wherewithal to protect their lives. And why would a patriotic administration throw billions of dollars at their cronies without any accountability, yet make the troops that they so honor have to pay for equipment lost on the field of battle, and are even forced to pay for their own meals while lying in the hospital after being wounded? After all, even prisoners of war don't have to pay for their own meals.

Finally a thinking electorate would ask themselveswhy did the Bush/Cheney administration forced our troops to endure multiple deployments, and even held them hostage after their enlistment was up, when virtually every member of the administration moved hell and Earth to avoid military service when it was their time to serve the nation? Then, and even more curious, why did they do everything that they could to block an enhanced GI Bill to assist these same troops that they so honored, upon their return to civilian life.

And now Cheney comes before us once again - at this point, filthy rich - to convince a grossly undereducated, naive, and self-absorbed public that he did it all for America. And you know what, he went up 10 points in the polls.

God help America.



  Eric L. Wattree

wattree.blogspot.com

 

A moderate is one who embraces truth over ideology, and reason over conflict. 


18 Comments

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God is not gonna help America because he's only an imaginary friend. But to answer your question as to whether he would torture? Obviously. He must get off on suffering, or else he wouldn't allow for it. The imaginary appears to be getting in the way of the omnipotent.

Enjoy.

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Wow, what an utterly unsophisticated view. Must be nice.

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If sophistication requires God goggles and a search for deeper meaning in shallow water, I will pass.

Enjoy.

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I just wish that you would also pass on making cute asinine comments against a title when you obviously didn't bother to read the post. As to your proud atheism I really don't give a fuck.

"Enjoy"

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The entire first paragraph is nothing more than begging the question of why a supposedly Christian nation is so enamored of torture and violence.

I posit it is because of God (not in spite of as the author must believe). The Christian God has shown himself to be a ruthless bastard. It is also consistent to believe that the omnipotent, all-knowing God of the Christian faith could have made us otherwise and yet didn't. He is also imparted with the power to intercede, and doesn't.

Would have been nice if he had mentioned that mosquitoes will kill you and to drain the swamps.

Enjoy.

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Tim,

You’re doing the very same thing as Cheney - you’re flying way off the handle in pursuit of your own agenda. As was mentioned to you above, you are so blinded by your hostility towards Christianity, that you missed the entire point of the piece. If you had bothered to focus on more than the title, you would have recognized that the title was simply a rhetorical question challenging the religious right to face their hypocrisy.

The fact is, the article itself had absolutely nothing to do with God. What it was actually about was our tendency to approach reality with thoughtless knee-jerk reactionism over disciplined and structured thought - and your knee-jerk reaction to the title, without even bothering to consider its context relative to the piece, validates the point of the article completely - you’re more interested in promoting your hostility than thinking.

The point of the article is that most of our problems are a direct result of our giving more priority to our various agendas than we do thought. Now, take a minute and actually read the article, then revisit your comments. Thereafter, if you have a shred of intellectual honesty, you should feel like a perfect fool.

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I respectfully disagree with your conclusion that the article isn't about religion or God. The title is obviously referencing God. The opening paragraph invokes Christian morality, and you invoke God to help America in closing.

I am not hostile towards religion simply because I call it out as being total crap. I suppose I could couch my terms in a way that might seem less incendiary to religious folks, but it's hardly worth the time and trouble.

You're concerned that Americans are too ignorant to see through the bullshit. I agree to a point, but to fail to recognize that many OTHERWISE intelligent people will cheer the torture of "other" humans is directly because of religious indoctrination.

Left to their own devices, good people will do good and bad people will do bad. It takes religion to get good people to do bad stuff.

Enjoy.

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You know, Tim, I'm no religious fanatic, but it always amuses to watch the intellectually superior attitude that atheists take when discussing the existence of God.

Atheist generally take a condescending tone when discussing the issue with believers as though the latter position is quaint. But the fact is, the believer has more empirical evidence to support his position than the atheist has to suppor his. At the very least the believer has a thriving universe to point, while the atheist has absolutely nothing to support his position.

Personally, I take the position that God does exist, since for me, God, nature, and the universe are one. For me, existence itself is God - the creator and that which was created are one and the same. So even if the atheist takes the position that the universe sprang into being spontaneously, it then becomes my position that spontaneous existence is, therefore, God.

Thus, according to my belief, if one accepts the proposition that existence exists, that in itself provides prima facie evidence of the existence of God. Thus, we are no longer arguing whether or not God exists, but rather, the nature of God’s existence.

In other words, although I’ve never seen the person who made my watch, I know he exists, because I have a watch, and it exists.

Religious bigotry:

It's not that I hate everybody who don't look, think, and act like me - it's just that God hates them.

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Torturing and killing Muslims is a Christian mission that goes back for ages. It's rooted deeply in the religious DNA of many faiths. There's no mystery about it. That's why it was so interesting to see the Bible quotes that Rumsfeld put on those high level war briefings.

The Muslims feel the same way about Christians (and anybody else not Muslim) and a strict reading of their scriptures is just as damning as that of the Bible.

I've no problem with your making up a God out of sunshine and daffodils. As far as I know you're not making any other claims or encouraging actions based on your beliefs. I'm not claiming I can prove God doesn't exist. I am claiming that if he does, we are all equally unaware of the details and anybody professing otherwise is not to be taken seriously.

Enjoy.

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Tim,

I completely agree with you position, but I totally disagree with your approach to disseminating it. I find you to be much too strident and combative.

Reason is the key to enlightenment, not condenscension. What's more important, helping people to understand your point of view, or simply winning an debate. There's a big difference in the two - One is constructive attempt to enlighten, and the other is nothing more than an exercise in egotism. So tell me, what motivates you?

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Excellent point, Eric, about developing an educated electorate. It's difficult to get kids to even graduate from high school, let alone try for higher education. Just today I was just reading about the colleges raising tuition yet again and I wonder how are the kids/parents gonna cover the rate hikes in this bad economy? Still, education is the only antidote to ignorance. A way will have to be found.

As for your title question, "Would God Condone Torture?"

I'm not touching that with a ten foot pole. ;o)

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NO GOD WOULD NOT CONDONE TORTURE.
(Romans 12:17-21) . . .Return evil for evil to no one. Provide fine things in the sight of all men. 18 If possible, as far as it depends upon YOU, be peaceable with all men. 19 Do not avenge yourselves, beloved, but yield place to the wrath; for it is written: “Vengeance is mine; I will repay,.....” 20 But, “if your enemy is hungry, feed him; if he is thirsty, give him something to drink; for by doing this you will heap fiery coals upon his head.” 21 Do not let yourself be conquered by the evil, but keep conquering the evil with the good.

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Evidently, our self-appointed God (Dick Cheney), would.

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Eric, great blog; I agree that an educated electorate [people who are able to sort through information and come to an informed conclusion] is what we should strive for. With the emphasis on SOL's (where teaching is geared to standardized tests), there is very little practice in our schools of objective evaluation of evidence.

There also has to be a feeling of fairness and power of that same electorate; the fact that Bush was not even fairly elected made many of us feel impotent. I think that Obama's election, on the shoulders of many of us who worked for the first time to get someone elected, and whose campaign money was greatly funded by small contributions; have given us a welcome, if tentative feeling of empowerment.

I also respectfully decline to answer the question of the title, but your essay says it all.

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CVille,

Thank you, and I totally agree with you point of view.

The question was rhetorical at best. It was designed to point out the hypocrisy of the religious right.

Religious bigotry: It's not that I hate everybody who doesn't look, think, and act like me - it's just that God hates them.

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Re your great video up there.
"Excuse me, the vice-president is calling..."(to John McCain).

He must have had McCain's office bugged too!

"We elected a Halliburton government contractor as vice president."

He will never divest his interest in torture.

A different question might be: does cheney torture God?

Thanks for this enlightening post. Education is the antidote if not the cure...

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Another fine post Wattree. Your voice speaks decency. Tangental comment follows:
In Japan teachers are the most highly regarded profession, and their students do well. And Japanese society would seem to benefit. In the U.S. teachers are villanous union member socialist yadayadayada dog poop according to the GOP and Republicans at every level of government; and there is a 50:50 chance of one of our students making it through high school. It is beyond me how the nation is supposed to benefit from deliberate lowbrowing.
Peace.

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Unfortunately, due to our John Wayne, "aw shucks", wild west tradition, Americans have developed a disdain for knowledge.

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Eric L. Wattree is a writer, poet, and musician, born in Los Angeles. He’s a columnist for The Los Angeles Sentinel and The Black Star News. He’s also the author of A Message From the Hood, and a contributing writer to Your Black World, and The Huffington Post.

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