Helen Thomas to Obama: If you see the importance of Neda video, why won't you release abuse photos?
Crossposted in Democraticunderground.com
Glen Greenwald has the details (6-24-09):
For the last question at his press conference yesterday, Obama was asked by CNN's Suzanne Malveaux about his reaction to that video and to reports that Iranians are refraining from protesting due to fear of such violence. As Obama was answering -- attesting to how "heartbreaking" he found the video; how "anybody who sees it knows that there's something fundamentally unjust" about the violence; and paying homage to "certain international norms of freedom of speech, freedom of expression" -- Helen Thomas, who hadn't been called on, interrupted to ask Obama to reconcile those statements about the Iranian images with his efforts at home to suppress America's own torture photos ("Then why won't you allow the photos --").
The President quickly cut her off with these remarks:THE PRESIDENT: Hold on a second, Helen. That's a different question. (Laughter.)The White House Press corps loves to laugh condescendingly at Helen Thomas because, tenaciously insisting that our sermons to others be applied to our own Government, she acts like a real reporter...
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She really is like the ghost of democracy, walking the battlements and scaring the Prince's guards.
June 24, 2009 12:55 PM | Reply | Permalink
"ghost of democracy" - that's good.
June 24, 2009 1:17 PM | Reply | Permalink
Yes, Larry you have that sooooooooooooo right. hahahahahaha. God how I love her!!
June 24, 2009 2:21 PM | Reply | Permalink
Indeed! Helen says "BOOOOOOO!"
June 24, 2009 6:27 PM | Reply | Permalink
wow. what a provocative question. Good for Helen Thomas. Interesting, Truthseeker.
June 24, 2009 1:03 PM | Reply | Permalink
Obama believes in the "international norms of freedom of speech, freedom of expression," except when it comes to Helen Thomas.
Ironic.
June 24, 2009 1:57 PM | Reply | Permalink
If this is supposed to be another entry in your "Dead Women Week" series of posts, I'd just like to point out that Helen Thomas is not dead yet.
And there is some debate as to whether she ever will be.
June 24, 2009 2:03 PM | Reply | Permalink
LOL!
Perfect pitch, q. ;-)
June 24, 2009 2:27 PM | Reply | Permalink
Quinn's comment feels so odd among all the other comments praising Helen and addressing the issue at hand. your "dead woman" meme is not attracting much interest.
June 24, 2009 3:09 PM | Reply | Permalink
It's true. I just feel.... I donno... maybe, as the poet once wrote, "lost in a sea of anger and cluelessness." Oh, sorry. That was you. Yesterday. ;-)
Anyway. Sorry dude. You're still an attention whore, and you've been playing with your dead women meme this week, and you don't respond even when questioned on substance (see: yesterday), and this little gem is nothing more than you clear-cutting a half-acre of Greenwald's blog, with absolutely nothing added, and now... I'm supposed to address my deepest thoughts and darkest fears to you?
Sure, Glenn.
June 24, 2009 3:59 PM | Reply | Permalink
You are supposed to comment on what Helen said, but you are simply seeking attention. Yes. You think I'm seeking attention and I think you're seeking attention. Isn't debate great?
You seem to be here to have fun, odd one.
June 24, 2009 4:56 PM | Reply | Permalink
Amongst the reporters, Helen's one of the few bright sparks in an otherwise dim crowd.
As far as the photos go, Obama should release them.
Arguments about the added risks this might create for the troops are short-sighted, and are completely outweighed in any sensible analysis by their much larger potential role in changing how we enter, prosecute and end wars.
Those who have changed their view on this issue from Bush to Obama have, in my mind, simply decided to bootlick the President, and I don't think they have anything to stand on. However, I've said this a half-dozen times already, so not much sense repeating it.
Peace, out.
June 24, 2009 8:15 PM | Reply | Permalink
Cosign.
I suspect that TS is trying to make up for the first Neda post. His conscious might actually recognize that it was not only incredibly offensive, poorly timed, but also pretty stupid. The image of Neda dead will join the pantheon of powerful historic photographs (like these). I think he realizes it and is just throwing posts out there to paper over his own pc idiocy by wrapping himself in sanctimonious insights.
I am glad you are hammering his fascination with dead women. You gave him a good chance yesterday and he gave you a whole lot of nothing. He is just an attention whore.
Btw- Really good point about Helen. I'm not sure where I stand on the debate about her mortality. Both sides have some good arguments.
June 24, 2009 8:32 PM | Reply | Permalink
Saladin, you make no sense, since I called Neda a martyr in my first post, and this one about Thomas gives no indication whatsoever that I am, as you suggest, "trying to make up" for my "first post."
I'm scratching my head. Can you explain?
June 24, 2009 10:21 PM | Reply | Permalink
I would rather not. but here:
Offensive, Insensitive, poorly timed, utterly asinine.
Fuck you.
June 25, 2009 5:58 PM | Reply | Permalink
He's Canadian. That's why. ;-)
June 24, 2009 4:30 PM | Reply | Permalink
heeehheeeeeeeeheeee. ok This is so cruel and funny at the same time. hahahahahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
If you look real closely, I mean she has Danny Thomas' nose. hahahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
Now Danny is gone, passed away, no longer in use as the parrot so to speak. hahahahahahahah
But breath still passes thru Helen's whatever....
THE END
June 24, 2009 7:13 PM | Reply | Permalink
Listen Dick, if you'd ever seen me in person, you'd know why I'd be the last one to make nose jokes!
June 24, 2009 8:17 PM | Reply | Permalink
All those hockey fights?
June 24, 2009 9:04 PM | Reply | Permalink
If anyone wants to know who lives in the Fourth Estate, that would be Helen Thomas, alone.
June 24, 2009 2:07 PM | Reply | Permalink
Hi Gregor. Yes, Helen is the fourth estate, capitalized or otherwise.
When I found out that she was from the Mideast I was awed. Helen is history. Remember how w would ignore her?
ha!!!
June 24, 2009 2:23 PM | Reply | Permalink
Yeah, Obama shutting her down was eerily familiar. I want to believe the media was laughing at Obama for not being able to respond to the question and having to duck a shoe from a very old lady. But, alas, I suspect they were laughing at her because she is again being ignored and they get to ask questions. The insidious self-censorship of the press has rendered them useless to the people. We are in bad shape when people refrain from asking questions because they might lose access.
June 24, 2009 2:41 PM | Reply | Permalink
Edward R Murrrow, CBS Broadcast from Buchenwald, Germany, 15th April, 1945.
'...I pray you to believe what I have said about Buchenwald. I have reported what I saw and heard, but only part of it. For most of it I have no words. If I've offended you by this rather mild account of Buchenwald, I'm not in the least sorry..."
Helen Thomas- BRAVO, BRAVO, BRAVO.
June 24, 2009 2:35 PM | Reply | Permalink
Helen Thomas is probably one of the last journalists left in DC who has the sort of access she has. I think she's great! Obama should be pressed by the media to answer the question she posed because it is an exellent one and highlights Obama's hypocrisy on the issue.
June 24, 2009 3:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
Barry was naughty. But Oleeb I cannot agree with you more. I have loved this lady for forty years.
June 24, 2009 4:05 PM | Reply | Permalink
When Josh announced that he was going to hire a White House/Washington correspondent, I sent him my resume with a cover email in which I think I said that when I began my career as a design journalist I wanted to be Ada Louise Huxtable, but that as my interests broadened and I aged, I wanted to end my career as Helen Thomas.
I thought that was pretty good, but he never responded. Good thing Helen Thomas is still kicking, not only in terms of heartbeat but also in terms of ass. And a good thing that the person Josh has hired is young enough and energetic enough to take the pace.
June 24, 2009 4:29 PM | Reply | Permalink
Wow! I wish he'd hired you! Do you live in DC, Wendy?
June 24, 2009 5:34 PM | Reply | Permalink
No, C'Ville, but I'd prefer it to where I am, which is inconveniently suburban New York. Trying hard to find better work for next year in a better location.
You, actually, are an excellent, Helen Thomas candidate, because you are as smart and as fearless as she is. Did you send Josh your resume? I would have supported you.
June 24, 2009 8:57 PM | Reply | Permalink
Wow, what a compliment! Anyway, didn't he already pick someone? I like the guy he picked, Bueler, or something. I am kind of fearless, but as someone told me the other day, I tend to "step in it a lot."
Think about Charlottesville as a relocation spot; lots of teaching possibilities, and I'd love to have you nearby! Seriously!
June 24, 2009 9:30 PM | Reply | Permalink
I would move to Charlottesville in a heartbeat, C'Ville, but there were no teaching listings at the headhunter in that location.
However, when I make the annual southern relative tour, perhaps I could meet you for coffee or lunch, passing through?
June 24, 2009 9:44 PM | Reply | Permalink
You can even spend the night! I would love it. Let me know via email when you might be passing through so I can schedule my work around it!
June 24, 2009 9:56 PM | Reply | Permalink
Please move somewhere nice, so all of us stuck here in the tri-state area can live vicariously through you!
June 25, 2009 10:43 AM | Reply | Permalink
First - Helen was being a good reporter by asking the question.
But there is a difference between the two issues, namely that the US is no longer conducting the torture depicted in the photos. If they were (or evidence appears that it has begun again or never stopped) then releasing the photos would more equatable to exposing the truth about the way the Iranian government is currently acting.
June 24, 2009 5:03 PM | Reply | Permalink
If Mitt Romney and Sarah Palin want to torture, they will torture, if one of them becomes President.
All they have to do is tell some lawyers to claim that torture is legal and that's it. They won't be afraid of being prosecuted because now we know that Big Dems want to look forward and not backward.
Your claim that the US is "no longer conducting" the torture refers to a temporary fix.
June 24, 2009 5:38 PM | Reply | Permalink
And no doubt . . .
Bulls give milk . . .
Talk about twisted reasoning ...
~OGD~
June 24, 2009 7:14 PM | Reply | Permalink
And while I might be referring to a temporary fix, you're speaking of acting based on what might happen in the future.
And releasing the photos has nothing to do with bringing justice to bear upon the past administration. Releasing the photos is about public consumption, not judicial.
One of the things that got under my skin during this whole Iranian situation has been people equating the 2000 US elections with what happened in Iran. Although there were similarities, there is a big difference between a rigged election where they didn't bother to even count votes and just gave an arbitarily derived number, and an election where there was counting irregularities and the "corruption" came in how the irregularities were dealt with once they were discovered.
And now releasing the photos from a previous administration's trip into darkness is being equating with video of a protester in Iran being gunned down by the current regime.
I just think equating the two in the end muddles the discussion on both, and both need to be discusssed and pondered by the public, the media, and our government.
June 25, 2009 10:16 AM | Reply | Permalink
Perfectly said, acamus! Thanks!
Tho it was an imperfect analogy, it made for a good segue into the question that she wanted to ask. I don't think he'll give a good answer to her (attempted) question for quite some time.
By the way, I went to the White House website to see how they transcribed the exchange and because I was interested to see whether he addressed Thomas' point at all. Here it is:
THE PRESIDENT: Yes. I have concern about how peaceful demonstrators and people who want their votes counted may be stifled from expressing those concerns. I think, as I said before, there are certain international norms of freedom of speech, freedom of expression --
Q Then why won't you allow the photos --
THE PRESIDENT: Hold on a second, Helen. That's a different question. (Laughter.) And I think it's important for us to make sure that we let the Iranian people know that we are watching what's happening, that they are not alone in this process. Ultimately, though, what's going to be most important is what happens in Iran. And we've all been struck by the courage of people. And I mentioned this I think in a statement that I made a couple of days ago. Some of you who had been covering my campaigns know this is one of my favorite expressions, was Dr. King's expression that "the arc of the moral universe is long, but it bends towards justice." We have to believe that ultimately justice will prevail.
All right. Thank you, guys.
June 24, 2009 6:17 PM | Reply | Permalink
Sometimes Obama frustrates me because I know he can articulate a reasoned response, but instead he sidesteps. I guess I still have this expectation that he is going to be everyday that candidate speaking about race relations in America, treating us like sane and intelligent adults and the subject with nuance and depth. That guy still shows up from time to time, but politics and times being what they are, not as often as I would like.
June 25, 2009 10:21 AM | Reply | Permalink
Again well said. But, I think he/his Administration already gave their explanation, and he doesn't feel the need to keep repeating. Probably because so many of us don't think it is a good explanation. (I have mixed feelings on it.) And, it certainly was a less-good time to answer Helen's (good) question (than some other time).
June 25, 2009 12:33 PM | Reply | Permalink
Ah ... full context ... thanks azpaull
Helen is correct in asking the question. And Obama should answer the question. Although, not just at that point in time.
Within the context of the importance of the message that the President was attempting to convey to the Iranian people, there was no need for her to interrupt and pose that question that can wait for an answer. But the moment at hand for the Iranian people won't wait.
I feel it was much more pressing for Obama to get the vital message out to the world and the Iranians at that moment in time.
Your mileage may vary of course.
~OGD~
June 24, 2009 7:28 PM | Reply | Permalink
I appreciate Helen Thomas, but I think the question was off point. In fact, I think the situation she identified proves Obama's point (whether we agree or not) in not releasing the Abu Graib photos. Specifically, the Neda video demonstrates the emotional power these images have and the potential to adversely impact the nation responsible. Iran didn't release the Neda video, but the impact of it on Iran is incalculable. Helen is asking Obama to justify not releasing the torture photos, but Neda is the justification.
June 25, 2009 10:32 AM | Reply | Permalink
I do love the fact that Helen Thomas is still out there and that she didn't just tuck her tail and slink away When Boy Bush tried to banish her. I don't always have to agree with her questioning in order to appreciate her being there.
June 24, 2009 9:01 PM | Reply | Permalink
Just as in Obama's first news conference, he dodged when Thomas asked him if he knew any countries in the middle east which had nuclear
weapons.
June 25, 2009 4:31 AM | Reply | Permalink
Good post...And you could not be more right about how Helen Thomas is treated by MSM. More often than not, it's the crazy uncle in the attic that is telling the truth about what's happening in the family!
June 25, 2009 8:40 AM | Reply | Permalink
Helen Thomas should get a Pulitzer Prize as all around best questioner of those in power.
Rather than most of what passes for journalists today, those who see speaking truth to power as a roadblock to fame and fortune, Helen Thomas is relentless in her confrontations with the movers and shakers in DC.
She should have been given the Meet the Press job after Russert passed on.
June 25, 2009 8:47 AM | Reply | Permalink
Actually, she should have been given the job at MTP long BEFORE Russert was ever given the job in the first place. David Gregory seems to be a logical progression in what passes for an objective press these days. Expect Karl Rove or Ollie North to get the chair next time it opens up.
June 25, 2009 9:25 AM | Reply | Permalink
Sleepin,
lets face it, if Helen Thomas got the job they wouldn't be able to find any guests to appear.
Was it Mary Matalin who said 'when we need to get our message out we send Cheney on Meet the Press'?
I doubt they would have followed this practice if Helen Thomas was the Interviewer.
June 25, 2009 10:24 AM | Reply | Permalink
You are undoubtedly right, john. But for my liking, an hour of Helen Thomas solo would beat the hell out of a room full of the usual suspects anytime!
June 25, 2009 10:27 AM | Reply | Permalink