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Crisis of trust.


Think about what you really believe in, what you want, what would improve your life, the life of your children, your parents and grandparents.  Think about what will improve our society, what standard of moral and ethical and social responsibility and accountability you hold yourself to, and what standard you expect leaders in our community to hold themselves to.  

Think about all these things and ask yourself a few questions:

Who can you count on in government?  
Who can you count on in the financial industry?  
Who can you count on in the transportation industry?
Who can you count on at the Department of Justice?
Who can you count on in the pharmaceutical industry?  
Who can you count on in the insurance industry?
Who can you count on in the telecommunications industry?
Who can you count on in the church? 
Who can you count on in the defense industry/Pentagon?
Who can you count on in the energy industry?  
Who can you count on in the corporate media?
Who can you count on when it comes to keeping our air and water clean?
Who can you count on when it comes to food safety?
What system of accountability for anything can you presently trust?
Who can you count on to actively root out corruption and apply the rule of law?

How do you know for sure that anything your told about Al Qaeda or Bin Laden or  "those who seek to do us harm" or the nuclear weapons ambitions of other countries is actually true?

How do you know that what your told about Iraq or Afghanistan or Pakistan or Iran or Israel or Lebanon or Egypt or Saudi Arabia or Syria or Somalia or anything that seems to require our military engagement is the absolute truth?  

What about the war on drugs?

How many stories that you now read about in the news do you trust as an honest objective assessment of any situation?  How many anonymous sources are you willing to offer the benefit of the doubt?

How many news organizations do you trust implicitly?

And finally, do you think things are getting better or worse?

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I've been thinking about this subject for the last couple weeks, especially reading Baker's book, "Family of Secrets".

I don't trust any news organizations to report honestly or objectively. They have a corporate agenda and that agenda is to protect the corporate establishment, which of course, makes them part of that establishment. There is such a sense of community between the press, corporations and government that there can be no objectivity. They rely on that community for their livelihood and society and that society is insular and exclusive - remember David Broder's comment when Clinton was in office "this is our town and we don't like outsiders coming in and trashing up the place." This is how they think, this is how they identify themselves.

Is it going to get worse? I don't know if it can get any worse than it is - we're a nation without any kind of oppositional, reliable press corp, who are willing to give up any kind of autonomy they might have had to accept government support for their newspapers. That about sums up the future.

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I think it can get worse, BevD.

It's really up to us. To Americans. We step up. And things change. But we can't step down right after a presidential election and expect things to change on their own. Got to keep pushing.

I think Americans had been, to some extent, asleep at the wheel. I include myself. I think those who have committed massive fraud and corruption and war crimes no longer feel they have to hide those actions for fear of accountability. Look at the torture issue. We have an ex-VP going on TV bragging about his actions, despite breaking the Geneva Conventions and other laws and statutes. Look at the relationship between the government and corporations. We had Hank Paulson heading up treasury--essentially he was a former Goldman Sachs CEO bailing out Goldman Sachs. We have Sen. Max Baucus heading up healthcare reform--his top corporate contributors are Blue Cross, Schering-Plough and New York Life Insurance--and he won't allow discussion of single payer healthcare--single payer advocates aren't even allowed a seat at the table. We had corporate news media, like GE(a company with defense holdings) hiring Pentagon "defense analysts" to sell the Iraq war. Those "analysts" were lobbyists for defense contractors.

The list goes on and on. There is an interesting thing going on right now though that has some relevance. Rush Limbaugh and other loud voices in the Republican party are now walking back their racist comments about Judge Sotomayor. Sure, it's all political. But they're being held accountable for the ridiculous assertions they've made--really absurd assertions--and they're walking back the rhetoric.

It's not much but it's something.

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Oh, I agree, it probably will get worse. Our intelligence agencies are completely out of control and we have no way of assessing the truth from their machinations.

Along with Kevin Phillips, I believe that it is too late fix it.

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I honestly think things are staying the same.

The uber-wealthy are patching up their financial boat by raiding the treasury, the less-affluent will cover it with our taxes (and the taxes of our children), the banks are using our money to throw everyone out of their homes and consolidate their complete ownership of everything, the military has free reign to continue their eternal war, and those who ordered the atrocities that discredited our nation are being rewarded.

Still holding out some hope for significant health reform ... but not much.

At least I like Sotomayor. My new dream is to watch her stuff Obama's detention and state secrets policies right back down his own throat. Of course the way things have been going, she'll turn out to be a secret member of the Federalist Society.

Sigh. Forgive me if I don't celebrate a couple of powerless blowhards being "held accountable" and forced to sort-of walk back their meaningless comments. What a victory!

(Ha! how's THAT for a wet-blanket comment? :-)

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you're being honest. "Wet blanket" comments. "Dry blanket" comments. All blankets are welcome. I don't particularly like troll blankets, but it's a free country. It's still a free country, right? We can still say that, can't we?

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On odd Wednesdays. It's been restricted. You got lucky.

=D

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Co-sign. So agree with you. It is always up to 'us' - and our silence as well as our short attention span contributes to MSM's (and others) lack of motivation to do anything other than pander to their demographic.

Factual data is available to all, but it takes time and energy which the majority of our populace is disclined to spend on acquiring facts. Far easier to engage in blame game - that is 'everyone and everything else' responsible for problems.

Thanks for blog, et al. rec'd

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thanks for stopping by. Always appreciate it when you contribute:)

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The government is based on checks and balances designed to limit the powers of unscrupulous politicians.

The justice system is based on stylized rhetorical combat designed to appeal to the emotions of a group of citizens who have no expertise in or knowledge of the matter.

The economic system is based upon competition between greedy people pursuing their self-interest.

The church is based on regular repentance of recurring sin, which is present in all humans from birth.

And the media is geared toward acquiring as many eyeballs for advertisers as possible.

Depend on human institutions at your own risk.

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'depend on human institutions at your own risk'

Merrill, unless we come to rely on institutions of another species, we're going to need to depend on our own.

But before we can depend on our own insitutions, we have to endeavor to change them. However, it's a mutual responsibility. The people we elect to lead must endeavor to change them.

With equal fervor and integrity and urgency.

I think Americans came out in force on November 5th. We didn't say "we'll do the best we can to get out the vote but we really can't promise anything.

Americans didn't say "Okay Senator Obama, we'll hold up signs and donate but let's be pragmatic about this, things don't change overnight. If things don't work out, you can always give it a shot in 2012."

Americans weren't asked to compromise on November 5th. We were asked to come out in full force and do what conventional wisdom considered absolutely impossible.

We came through big time.

Now it's time for our leaders to come through for us the way we came through for them.

Before they cast a vote in the Senate or on the house floor, before they ask a question in a committe meeting, before they take a dime from corporate donors, before they meet with a single lobbyist, before they go on TV and recite talking points about energy, health care, education, justice, war, Gitmo, torture, the right to privacy, the right to a fair trial, all rights afforded to citizens of this country by the constitution and basic human rights afforded to citizens of the world, our elected representatives should ask themselves one question, over and over again:

Did Americans do more for me than I'm willing to do for them?

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Did Americans do more for me than I'm willing to do for them?

That is not a question that I would expect politicians to ask of themselves. More likely they ask:

"What do I need to do to get re-elected?"

Which means that they are influenced by the prospect of future campaign contributions and votes more than positions they held in the last election or the perceived intentions of those who voted. Therefore, political activism needs to be continuous and cannot assume that gains made in an election will not evaporate once the politicians take office.

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"Americans came out in force..."

Actually, we came out around 30% in the primary elections and 64% for the general. A little higher for the general than 2004 and double the primary average, but still well below other advanced democracies around the world.

The only thing we turn out in force for is American Idol and NASCAR. Pathetic.

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true, but overall, it was the highest voter turnout in 40 years.

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Actually, I was wrong, though the data is conflicting as found here and here. The GMU site at the second link is pretty comprehensive though. We seem to be substantially less involved than voters in the 1960s. The primary numbers are even more grim.

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A quote from Margaret Meade painted on the side of a junior high here in DC mirrors my thoughts on how change has always been accomplished in America:

Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has.
I think we are slowly waking up and this generation's small group of thoughtful and committed citizens has the awesome potential of actually changing the world by simply changing our government.

All we need to do is convince our fellow citizens to vote in every election without fail.

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I don't trust any of the institutions or organizations on your list.

There are a couple of politicians I trust - Bernie Sanders and Dennis Kucinich - but I don't trust them implicitly (no questions asked)

I don't trust any MSM news organization and haven't for decades. As soon as I started to know enough of what really happened in the world and that it was NOT what was being reported.

However, not trusting institutions and sources of official power and voice does not mean there is no one or nothing to trust (or to build trust).

To the best of my knowledge there are a number of folks who have never lied to me. They may have had a blind spot or a perspective that obscured or colored what they communicated, but they did not lie. Noam Chomsky, Howard Zinn, Michael Parenti, Amy Goodman, Sy Hersch, Rachel Maddow, Maya Angelou, Angela Davis, the list could go on and on.

I see the way of "fighting back" against the lies and deceptions by finding and telling the truth, by debunking systems and rhetoric, by doing the hard work of making sense of things and not letting the "lies" pass unchallenged.

Do I think things will improve? Not unless we make them better, and that will not happen without ongoing effort. It will also not happen without a number of people changing the frame of understanding and assumption. We need to realize that the issue is not "bad" actors corrupting a "good" system, but that the system is creating and recreating "bad" outcomes.

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"the issue is not "bad" actors corrupting a "good" system, but that the system is creating and recreating "bad" outcomes."

I want to understand what you're saying here better, Rowan. People are the engine of the system. There are passengers and there are drivers. Are we trying to move in a system that's been totalled?

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Are we trying to move in a system that's been totalled?

YES

The systems we have created, and the cultural ideologies that facilitate and support their continuation, are reproducing every larger "bad" outcomes.

If we create a system that rewards greed with personal gain, power, and influence, then we are likely to get that. If we further hold an ideology that people will always act in their own self interest - we maximize and legitimate the snatching of power by whatever means.

If we create a system where there is a fundamental separation (or even conflict) between humans and "nature" then we will consistently structure our social institutions in opposition to "nature."

If we create and enforce systems where there are those member who are "worth less" or even "worthless," then we will continue to legitimate that through ongoing inequality at all levels of the society.

Social institutions (the state or political order, economy, family, religion, education, media ...) are constructed out of the basis of cultural belief systems about the way things work and should be. Those institutions produce a "reality" that tends to legitimate and make true the beliefs and and values and social constructions that created them.

The "structures" we operate in force certain ways of thinking, doing and operating. One fundamental shift I have seen in my lifetime that is in operation at all levels of the society, is "the ends justify the means." I believe that this was launched society wide (though not invented) with the election of Ronald Reagan - it was the true "Reagan Revolution" in a variety of ways.

This "bad system" and the power of the system has played out repeatedly in "revolutions." Well, we'll change the people in power and everything will work better. All too often, the systems and institutions are NOT changed and you have almost exactly the same abuses occurring within a very short time. It is not that the people are bad, or even the leaders bad (or start out being bad), the system and structure will reproduce itself.

I have watched this happen over and over again within organizations. You have folks who are "change agents." They are dedicated. The organization that wants to shut them up (or redirect them) will promote them and usually within a very short period of time they have conformed to the organizational expectations - and often enforce them with great vigor. If they don't, then you fire them. However, promoting them serves to lift the morale of the rank and file. Someone who's "on their side" now has a voice. The leadership of the organization is "listening" and "responding" to the concerns. Those change agents did not start out as "bad" people. We often write it off as they got "co-opted by the system." Indeed they did, but most do. On the broader scale, the same thing is happening on a million levels in all of our lives. Frankly, if you don't compromise somewhat to the demands of the structure, you starve, or are locked up.

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thanks for taking the time to respond. Do you have a suggestion on how to build a better system?

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I think in some ways there is movement in the "environmental" area. There is growing awareness that the way we think about "nature" has largely failed. In other areas, there is much less awareness. Unfortunately, I think that most folks think that our systems are fine, things have just gotten "out of control." I fundamentally believe that this is not an accurate perception.

The failing of the economic system is serving as a revolutionary reform force around the world - but not here. I believe that the opportunity that is being missed to really examine the economic and power structures in the US are being missed. Unfortunately, we are likely to have the opportunity again very soon - perhaps within the year. However, the silent losses (meaning uncovered by the MSM) is that more people are losing everything and becoming more desperate every week.

There are systems that may arise relatively spontaneously as social structures continue to erode - such as more cooperative strategies within communities, barter type systems, increased support for basic systems such as food. In other words, as systems fail people's awareness of why they are failing may occur. There are thousands of groups around the planet (and hundreds of cultures) who operate successfully within different frameworks) to serve as possible models of ways to rethink, restructure, and move forward in a saner way.

That is my hope, and I must say that it is a slim hope, because the window of opportunity is narrowing. On my pessimistic days I think it has closed.

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If we have lost the judicial branch, if we can't count on the enforcement of consequences for breaking the law, then I become more pessimistic.

I think the Obama administration has overestimated the tolerance for a lack of accountability for U.S. war crimes and corporate crimes and government crimes that twisted the constitution beyond recognition.

And I think they underestimate the value that accountability can have at a time when a society has the least faith in its institutions.

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I hope you are correct about pressure for accountability, because I fear the masses are singing "I'm leaving it all up to you" in the inculated cult of personality.

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Yeah, Gary, but this is nothing new. You are describing an America that has existed well before it was officially a country.

We 'lost" the judicial system as soon as colonists were getting locked up for non-payment of debt. We "lost" any notion of liberty when we codified Three-Fifths considerations into the Constitution. This country as never been as good or as noble or as moral as its marketing materials would lead us to believe.

The only difference between now and early times is that some of us have access to greater levels of information, but for the most part, this country is carrying on with the script that was written at its founding - a government of, by and for rich people.

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I think one of the differences is that the U.S. can no longer afford to push its weight around the way it has in the past. Not with the rise of other democracies and capitalism in other parts of the world--with our debt, perhaps that arrogance we projected around the world will no longer be tolerated--maybe some humility and social responsibility will trickle down and benefit the citizens of America. Either that, or it will slowly trickle up.

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We have no choice but to change our society (and government) from the grassroots. That is the only way things have ever changed in America.

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Like BevD, I have been reading Family of Secrets and am not much in the mood to rely on much more than who knows the password to my bunker that I encrypted last night.

But your question about dependence upon other people's narratives reminds me that the idea of what is real cuts a lot of different ways. So I would like to lay out two completely non-complimentary points of view without pretending that they eventually meet up to make a comprehensive point of view.

The first is that there are a lot of people in government who signed up for the purpose of serving the public and that their motivation and work has given them a ground to stand upon concerning the matter of what is actually happening versus whatever political message might be crafted in their name. Their work is a "balance of power" element that isn't exactly underlined in the Constitution.

The second point is that the alienation pointed out in your question whether we can trust any narratives in a world of self-interested narratives becomes a philosophical matter. In this regard, maybe our standard of skepticism is too trusting.
Jean Baudrillard talks a lot about how the demand for the absolute real that we all can experience is itself a narrative subject to manipulation. In this vein, he says something that at first glance would seem at odds with your questions:

The absolute rule is to give back more than you were given. Never less, always more. The absolute rule of thought is to give back the world as was given to us - unintelligible. And, if possible, to render it a little more unintelligible.


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okay moat. You lost me a little. I confess. Maybe simplify?

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To rephrase:
There are certain people in power now and they have an unknown potential to direct public discourse. The unknown in this regard is very disturbing. How are we supposed to talk about policy if it is going to be hijacked by another process way beyond any collective effect. Freedom somehow has to be about a discourse beyond the determination of established power.

But this "power" could be looked at as whatever the market has to offer or actually can't offer. The question that you so righteously put forward was whether any of the people trying to influence a larger group of people were nothing more than pawns in the game of selling what we have already agreed to buy.

I was trying to say no, there are lots of people who wish to say something entirely different and they work for you and me everyday.

I was also saying that the demand for the bottom dollar to an absolute truth has its own problems.

Please tell me if this doesn't help.

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That I understand better, thanks for clarifying.

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Extraordinary excerpt, Moat. Giving us a lot to think about, on this topic and several others. Thank you for it.
Thank you, Gary, for raising the issue of trust.
Thank you, Rowan, et al, not only for your varied expertise but also for the demonstration that serious discussion really can occur within a framework of civility.

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I think things are getting worse and I doubt they'll get any better without a broad based reform movement and I don't mean one of the "pragmatic" "postpartisan" kind. Such a movement needs some driving passion. How about rescuing the American Dream and the American middleclass? It requires a moral dimension - the restoration of ethics in all instituations and the restoration of community. It requires the unmasking of the "free" market for what it is a ruthless, survival of the fittest, amoral, unprincipled, valueless, loot, sack and pillage ethic beyond the control of democratic government if not actively hostile to it.

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Lots of movements claim to have a moral dimension and are anything but. What does seem to be missing as an American value is social responsibility--environment, health care, the betterment of lives of all citizens.

This American value gets mis-wrapped in "socialism" packaging.

Somehow anything that helps upgrade the quality of life for the middle class got tagged as welfare.

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That's partly because Democrats stopped debating and started surrendering. If people of faith didn't believe in social responsibiity they wouldn't need a house of worship to gather socially. How the religious right managed to con church goers into the notion that churches are unique social institutions not one of or a model for others is something.

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I do not trust anyone I guess Gary, like I said in the chatroom. I mean I have no control over anything.

In order to trust your water, you need to do research and check out all aspects of your local water utility. Then check the drainage testing, the testing done on all the rivers and lakes and ground water and the plants in the ground....

You cannot just say, hey I like Al the water guy.

And the CIA. Hell I do not really know what they do.
They used to kill a lot of leaders and stuff. Kissinger was proud of that.

TENET:hELL ITS A SLAM DUNK

RElatively, I think the dems make me more hopeful.

Maybe I am just in despair.

BUT THESE ARE THE QUESTIONS WE SHOULD BE ASKING AND ANALYZING. aND YOUR COMMENTS ARE TOPS GARY.

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Well, let me say this:

You learn to trust from your family. If your mother or father says, "Yum yum," you take a bite. You go to the lake and that same mother or father says, "Jump! I'll catch you!" You wake up in the morning hungry and that same mother or father feeds you.

That is where you learn trust. Where you learn DIStrust is when you have an administration that ruins the water you drink, the meat you buy, the vegetables you cook, etc, etc, etc.

Adolescents, as a part of what they must do -- separate from their parents. Those people they have trusted to be perfect all their lives are suddenly scrutinized.

In order to become adults they must challenge all their childhood memes -- painful for them and also for their parents, but it is the only way to get adults into the next generation.

When these children of ours see that the "trusted family" screwed them out of clean water and more, they hopefully will rise up.

But they have no examples to follow. BINGO! Neither did we in the 60's, so maybe they will do it on their own.

I'm getting tired now, or I would go on about how the Viet Nam War brought a whole lot more push-back since everyone's son was at risk (except HW Bush and whatever Cheney's father's name was).

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You show an image of a face. Cut to an image of a kitten. What is the face thinking? "How cute"

You show an image of a face. Cut to an image of a bowl of soup. What is the face thinking? "I am hungry"

Same face.

I guess what I am saying is that we are being presented a disjointed melange of images and information, and we each piece the info presented to us into a cohesive story that conforms to our beliefs. Then the pundits appear to massage the beliefs into comfortable categories of right and left.

How can any of it be trusted if the truth is cut apart and presented in such a mishappen manner? And how can we trust our government when they rely on this muddled spectacle to operate. Zero transparency. Zero.

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As a writer or a painter creating something, I believe in content over form. Content is the essence. People disagree. But in politics, form mostly determines content, or at least dominates. And in both, pattern recognition is the key. Like Bateson said, there’s just something about repeating patterns that we recognize and have in common with everything else. So the inclination to orderly systems seems inevitable. The paradox is that the random produces the new. So maybe there is hope.

In sociology, trust assumes that the form of the system determines the outcome. Gary, are you talking about the content like in psychology where the content determines the form – the people are the content and the system is the form? The good people make the good government?

I’ve lost trust in the form of our government because it no longer works for the people, as I've witnessed. And I’ve lost trust in most of the people who work it from the top because they don’t represent the people’s needs. The MSM is mainly about predictable form and barely worth a mention.

I can’t affirm those things you listed above. That’s why I think humor helps. It’s a survival mechanism.

On a personal level, I mostly trust individual people unless they give me reasons not to. You have to read the patterns. I trust that the content holds the truth, regardless of the form.

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I don't know exactly, Strato. Does it make any sense at all to say that I think people are both the content and the form?

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Think of the patterns that Rowan, CVille Dem and Zip and others here are talking about. This new combined form of our government with the large corporations has usurped the content of our democracy.

I voted for Barack Obama because of the content of his words that held a lot of meaning for me. Now it seems the form of the government is working to bring him around to the same old, same old. Where is the end of the war? Obama Has 250,000 "Contractors" in Iraq and Afghan Wars, Increases Number of Mercenaries - http://www.commondreams.org/headline/2009/06/01-6.

Tonight he’s nearly become a Brain Williams advertisement. I hope I’m wrong but I have lost that trust in the form of most abstrations.

However, on a personal level, I find plenty of meaning in you and I’ve never seen your form. Thanks for your post.

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At least once a week I call my senators and representatives office and give them an earfull. Everyone should do this. It is at least soothing even if it doesn't do any good.

Yesterday I called both about leaking the plant layouts for our nuclear generation facilities all over the web. Gave them both barrels. Just silence on the other end. Told them both they were dumbasses. Unless we explicitly express our outrage at their stupidity they'll never change.

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I believe that trust is based on one's accumulated past experience with the dependability/accuracy/truthfulness of an interaction with a thing. Trust is increased as new experience validates whatever current level of trust exists (if any), and trust decreases as new experience invalidates such. It's like Reagan used to say about arms limitation agreements with the former Soviets, trust but verify. Trust is a feedback based process and is developed or retarded by our on-going positive or negative feedback (verifications) of our experiences.

The trust of government, or news sources, or churches, or our mothers and fathers, for that matter depend on our accumulated validations of their past dependability. Our current low trust of our institutions is well earned by them. We will give them more trust only after our future experiences with them validate that such increased trust is warranted.

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I've been wondering for years during bushco if this was the "decline and fall" we were seeing. With Obama I had hope. I'm waiting. Watching.

I've certainly written some things about loss of trust. For example, my blog Systemic Deception and the Breakdown of Civic Trust.

The neocons/straussians believed in Big Lies. But it's part of advertising and it's filtered through society.

I don't have an answer. But am trying to be part of the solution.

Lately I have very little to say. Therefore not commenting or writing blogs. Just comments here and there.

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thanks for taking the time to read this, Thera.

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:-)
I certainly have missed your powerful thoughts and trusted analysis.
And I believe you ARE a huge part of the solution!
You RAWK TheraP!!!

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And the loss of Trust leads not to Revolution but to Apathy.

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That is an interesting observation. Loss of trust most often seems to lead to disappointment, in turn leading to apathy. I wonder when/if/how it could instead lead to motivating anger?

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I do think accountability helps when there is a loss of trust in U.S. institutions. I made a comment about that further up.

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Excellent post, tpmgary, great discussion, thanks.

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thanks Bev, you were the first to comment and set a good example with your thoughts.

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