Mr. President... What the Fuck? Where did that "steel in your spine" Biden talked about run off to? I am about to lose my house and you are about to lose yours! I/We Need your help.
As I sit typing this I am trying to figure out how to come up with 2700 dollars in the next 3 weeks. This health care reform crap has hit home (so to speak). I am weary of waiting of and watching the complete bullshit that is passing for an attempt at health care reform. I had high hopes for this administration and the MANDATE of the majority that was given it by "We The People" but so far, I am not at all thrilled with the way it is playing out.
Does anyone truly believe that the GOP is actually going to cast ONE vote for this? Does anyone believe that Max Baucus and Kent Conrad are really on board with true health care reform? I didn't think so. I think it is time to give them a kick in the ass and find people to run against them in a primary. As always, I'll try to pay the filing fee for the first person to step up and take on one of these DINOs in a primary.
It is time for Democrats in Congress and The White House to acknowledge that a Health Care Reform solution is well past the point of any hope for a bipartisan solution, and rather than continue to bang their heads against that proverbial wall, they need to start banging the heads of reluctant Democrats against that wall.
So here are few questions for the President and those Democrats that continue to insist and hope for, some kind of bipartisan reform bill.
1. What are you looking at that makes you actually believe that a bipartisan answer is still possible?
2. How many Republicans will it take for YOU to consider a bill bipartisan?
3. On what date will you "throw in the towel" for a bipartisan bill?
4. What Republican(s) do you think are still open to REAL Health Care reform? (Names Please)
5. What exactly is your "Line in the Sand"?
6. Will anyone apply ANY pressure to those Democrats that continue to take huge sums of money from Health Care Special Interest Groups and Health Care Insurance Companies and vote for the interests of those Insurance Companies rather than the well being AND SECURITY of the American People?
7. Will you seek out candidates to challenge these Democrats in the next primary election?
8. Will those Democrats that chair committees holding up Health Care Reform legislation lose the chairmanship of those committees?
9. If Republicans Filibuster Health Care Reform Legislation will you force them to ACTUALLY stage a filibuster on the floor of the Senate? If not why?
10. Why do Democrats, having won a TRUE MANDATE, seem to be unwilling to exercise the MANDATE given them by the AMERICAN PEOPLE?
11. Why does the Democratic Leadership in both the House and the Senate tolerate other Democrats that, I believe, are actually working against REAL Health Care Reform?
12. Will Harry Reid, threaten to use the nuclear option as Bill Frist did when Republicans were the majority in the Senate? If not, why?
At this moment I don't see any evidence that even ONE Republican will vote for ANY kind of REAL Health Care reform. Now I admit that I am no political genius and perhaps I am a complete fool, but based on what I have seen over the last few weeks I firmly believe that Charles Grassley would short change a blind, quadriplegic, newspaper vendor. I also believe Kent Conrad and Max Baucus would be right there at his side giggling about it like high school freshmen.
Mr. President,
You have let many of your supporters down. You seem to have abandoned those of us that took to the net, newspapers and when given the opportunity television, to defend you against the attacks from the lunatic fringe of the right. While you are doing good work in town halls across the nation, in Washington you appear to be standing silently on the sidelines while members of your own party dissect and discard the very things they were given a majority and a MANDATE to do. You have confronted exactly NONE of those Senators FROM YOUR OWN PARTY that are quietly behind the scenes making deals with Health Insurance Companies and their lobbyists' to prevent REAL health care reform, just to make sure that, the steady stream river of health insurance company money continues to flow into their campaign coffers. And YOU have yet to call them out!
It is time for you to get specific and start to name, names (on both sides of the isle) of those that are in bed with the health insurance companies. It is time to let those Democrats In Name Only know that unless they get on board with their "full throated support" they will find themselves with a primary challenger and that you will be campaigning for the person on a regular basis.
This issue of Health Care is, perhaps, the most important thing YOU will have to deal with during your time in office. More Americans die EVERY year from lack of insurance or under insurance, than the total of all of those brave service men and women who gave their lives in service of this country during the entire length of both the wars we are waging as I type this. EVEN if you add those murdered in the 9/11 attacks to the total of those killed during the wars, more people die EVERY year because they can't afford to go to the doctor or they can't afford to pay the co-pays required by their insurance policies'.
How many Americans die because they have to cut pills in half because they can't afford to actually follow the directions the doctor has given them? How many families have to choose between food and seeing the doctor? How many seniors start breaking pills in half in October because they are trying to prepare for that fall through the donut hole they will take in February? How many parents have to choose which child will get treated this month because they can't afford to take all their kids to the doctor because they can't afford the co-pays?
I firmly believe that until you begin to take a real hard line with members of your own party, you will NEVER accomplish any kind of TRUE health care reform. As long as you continue to let those in the Senate make policy for you, health insurance companies will be the winners, and the American Citizen will continue to suffer at the hands of those same insurance companies.
I urge you to start to lead; it does no good to tour the country answering questions from the public, while members of your own party undermine your efforts by negotiating away any chance for real reform behind your back.
I urge you to stand firm on the "public option".
I urge you to regulate Insurance companies in the same way Casinos are regulated. In Nevada casinos are required to take no more than 25% profit, (most keep their profits from gaming take 20%). In New Jersey, casinos are limited to 17.5% profits from gaming. I would argue that since Health Insurance Companies are dealing with life and death, they should be required to pay out at least 90% of total revenue in health care claims, and that figure is generous, especially if we are going to require everyone to get health insurance.
Here are a few other things that I would like to see included if we are to have real health care reform.
1. Everyone must be allowed to buy insurance for the same price.
2. There can be no denial of coverage because of a pre-existing condition.
3. There can be no Post Claim Underwriting.
4. The cost of insurance can not be determined by a person's age, current health of an individual, or a person's lifestyle.
5. All insurance companies must make public the percentage of claims paid as it relates to total revenue, they must disclose salaries of all executive and mid-level management employees.
6. Health Insurers must make public all denied claims, the reason for denial, who decided to deny the claim, and how the person who denied claim is paid.
7. To prevent insurance companies from denying claims as a matter of policy, any claim that is denied can be appealed to an independent board of health care professionals. If the denial is reversed by the board the insurance company will be fined an amount equal to triple the cost of the claim or $1,000,000 whichever is greater, and those funds will be used to expand care.
8. Health Care reform must include language for a Medical Bankruptcy.
Yea, I know... I'm dreaming. But you gotta admit I'm dreaming big.
Please add your own wants and dreams and then spread this around. I have no problem with anything I listed above and no problem at all with taking on the DINOs, they need to be knocked down a peg or two, or at the very least knocked out of a chairmanship.
So go ahead and tell me how crazy I am, print this out and hand it out to prove just how crazy I am, and be sure all your friends take a look at how crazy I am. You never know what might have an effect on a few of those DINOs!
PS: Sorry to be AWOL the past couple months. Sorry about the length of this post too. It didn't seem that long while I was typing it.
Good to see you back Face! Great post - rec'd! You've been missed.
August 21, 2009 12:11 PM | Reply | Permalink
O,
THANKS, Good to be back... hopeful to be a regular again soon!
August 21, 2009 12:33 PM | Reply | Permalink
Hey Face, quit apologizing. Good to see you.
Your post, who really can disagree.
I am hoping that life on the Hill is not serendipitous. There are chess games going on. MSM has no real idea what is going on.
I think Pelosi has drawn a line in the sand. Assuming they get 218, who cares. Let some people from conservative districts vote no a long as she has those 218.
The Senate causes problems because we have two Dems sicker than dogs. West Virginia and Massachusetts.
If we assume that there still is a Democratic Party, I do not see one Dem in the Senate giving the repubs 41 votes for a filibuster. I just dont.
As long as our two devoted dems as brought onto the Floor in gurneys, we are ok.
Then, fine six or eight vote against the bill. Who cares? Hell ten can vote against it, all we need is fifty.
And I do think that one rumor is true. I think the Senate can break up the bill into two parts.
Once the legislation is passed, however weak, there can be new legislation brought later.
If the economy is looking good, who knows? Next year we might lose a few seats in the House and keep the 60 in the Senate.
If that is the case, hell we can see a new set of Health Care legislation.
THE END
August 21, 2009 12:20 PM | Reply | Permalink
2D,
Thanks, I agree but until the Prez gets in some of those DINOs faces he is gonna have a pretty lift and he shouldn't be the ONLY one lifting.
I mention Conrad and Baucus because they are out front... well at least Conrad is on FUX no less.
It is time for all good dems to come to the aid of this country!
F
August 21, 2009 12:31 PM | Reply | Permalink
Me, though I don't think that's important.
I generally disagree when someone appeals for help from President by suggesting indirectly that he is "spineless"--though I guess that's a little better than calling him stone-less or lacking in cojones or something.
We have never had a harder working President in my lifetime. Would we even be talking health care if he hadn't won? I have my doubts about that, though I remind myself that history doesn't reveal its alternatives. This is August, I remember Presidents in Kennebunkport or chopping brush on a ranch, or maybe enjoying a sail at the Hyannis compound. Ike played golf, and caught flack for it.
This President? How many meetings in how many parts of the country? How many times has he faced the ugly side of America? Enough so MJ Rosenberg suggested he might be safer staying at home. How many telephone conferences has he had this week alone? So what more can he do?
I should add what more can he do within the duly appointed powers of his office? He's used the bully pulpit, though he hasn't perhaps been a bully in the pulpit. Even if he wanted to be a bully, what can he do? He's not God. He's not playing President on West Wing.
Who in his party is afraid of him, and why should they be? 90% of Incumbents win reelection to the house. In 2008 THIRTY incumbents won re-election without an opponent. Most of these were Democrats. http://elections.nytimes.com/2008/results/house/votes.html#/uncontested
So suppose he threatened to campaign against the recalcitrant members of his own party. Will they shiver in fear and sob, "poor us"? I doubt it.
Why should they fear him? His coattails in the last election were slim.
http://www.centerforpolitics.org/crystalball/article.php?id=FRC2009041601Rhodes Cook, author of the paragraph above, goes on to say
But put this in the context of Congressional Politics. What does it mean? Independent voters don't vote in primaries. Ditto the young, most of whom right now are catching a few last rays in what has been a disappointing summer. And the youngsters disappear disproportionately in off-year elections, not to mention that Health Care Reform is a zillion miles from the center of their consciousness...they're immortal, and they know it.
So I ask my original question. What one thing could our President do to prove he has spine. Polling point has Arkansas favoring Rush Limbaugh over him. Of the four seats in Arkansas, one was won by a Republican with a majority of over 75 per cent. Three were won by Democrats, two of them with margins of over 75%, one with a margin of 100%--no opponent. It doesn't take any spine for any of these to oppose Barack Obama.
I think it's time to state a movement to elect God as President--perhaps He has enough power to do what we ask of him...now only if he has the spine.
August 21, 2009 8:34 PM | Reply | Permalink
"So I ask my original question. What one thing could our President do to prove he has spine.'
1) He could state unequivocally that he will not sign a health care insurance reform bill without a strong public option.
2) He could stop the bailout giveaway to our financial elite and let the worthless troubled assets find their worthless real value.
3) He could invite Krugman, Reich, Stiglitz and others who correctly warned about the housing bubble and weaknesses of the economy to have significant input on economic measures; he could dump Geithner, Bernanke and Summers who have been a serious part of the economic crisis and who work to protect the value of the assets of the wealthy instead of promoting the welfare of the public.
4) He could put into effect significant foreclosure relief not the present fig-leaf that protects banks more than the vulnerable.
5) He could promote a new round of public works building,super-rails,roads,sanitation, bridges,improved water, aid to education.
6)He could fire the Rove US attorneys still in office 8 months into his term tolerating the worst appointments in these posts than any other President ever has.
7)He can actively promote diplomacy with Venezuela, Cuba, Iran, North Korea and stop the escalatuons in Afghanistan and Colombia.
8) He can support a single-payer system.
9) He can cancel "Don't Ask, Don't tell" at any point by a simple directive and enhance dignity for our gay fellow citizens.
10) He can call for a full accounting of the lawlessness of the Bush regime; he can show America's adherence to no torture policy by fully exposing what has gone on under Bush and Obama; he can close Guantanamo and Bagram and end secret renditions; He can stop the FISA abuses.
11)He can keep talking bipartisan but stop acting as if anyone over the age of 5 expects Republicans to act cooperatively or constructively with anyone trying to improve life in America for the poor, the working people and the vulnerable.
hard indeed to imagine anything he could do to show he has spine or even is serious in confronting the entrenched established ruling power. If you cannot recognize the growing problem Obama has with the most committed and passionate part of his support (no, not the "loyal" support of Obama the individual), then you do not understand the ongoing political dynamic at all.
August 22, 2009 12:51 AM | Reply | Permalink
Through very bad cursor work I placed my reply to you independently. Either the check boxes have to be made larger or I need new specs, or both. Here's the link to my response. http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/tmcpac/2009/08/mr-president-what-the-fuck-whe.php#comment-3571005
August 22, 2009 9:46 AM | Reply | Permalink
Jesus people....c'mon.
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2009/8/21/770063/-Obama-And-The-Public-OptionSetting-The-Record-Straight
August 21, 2009 1:17 PM | Reply | Permalink
We may be overreacting to an apparent waffling on the part of the WH and the Dems, but look at it from the other perspective. If we do not have things suggesting they are NOT determined to have a public option, what do we have to show that they ARE? There is nothing particularly convincing. I mean, if you feel you have to stretch to get there, then they are not there. Why don' they just clench their jaws and stand up for it already, unequivocobly. Stand up and say we are doing this.
August 21, 2009 2:00 PM | Reply | Permalink
I think you've made a lot of good points here.
I remember in February 2008, then Senator Obama said that Washington is where good ideas go to die.
But sometimes you kill them yourself.
I think Democrats have to do some soul searching.
Whose interests will they commit to serving first?
Those of K street? Or those of Main Street?
Whose health and well-being will they faithfully protect?
That of corporate citizens?
Or that of average American citizens?
Too simplistic a view? I don't think so. I think it's naive to continue thinking corporate America doesn't have our Democracy in a chokehold.
Private health insurers have nothing but contempt for the American people.
And what about our elected representatives?
Do Senators like Kent Conrad, Max Baucus and Evan Bayh have nothing but contempt for us?
If they do, then Washington will become the place where majorities go to die.
August 21, 2009 2:51 PM | Reply | Permalink
Dear Sir or Madam,
I found your post to be both thoughtful and cogent. For that I thank you. In my reading, it generated some questions I would be interested in hearing your opinion of
1. President Obama, his admin, and WH web site no longer refer to this as 'Health Care Reform.' They now talk exclusively of 'Health Insurance Reform.'
2. Harry Reed said the main problem in the Senate are the Democrates.
3. Olympia Snowe said the senate are not even considering a 'public option.'
4. Steny Hoyer has openly questioned the 'public option.'
5. Howard Dean (bless his soul) demands at the very least a 'public option.' If not there he states starting all over again.
To be up front, I want universal, single payer, health care.
And in my dreams I see Bill Moyers as the secretary of HHS.
August 21, 2009 4:36 PM | Reply | Permalink
S,
It would be "sir" but that would be giving me far too much credit. Face is fine too as in O¿O in the crowd (some don't get my name but I am stuck with it now)
In regards to your questions here goes:
1. 6 of one or half dozen of another. I think that "Reform" in whatever context will be helpful. I don't like the fact that Health Care and Health Coverage are used interchangeably (it is a huge pet peeve of mine). But a public option really must be included or some pretty onerous regs for the soul eating bastards called Health Insurance companies.
2.I firmly believe that if Harry Reid would take a chairmanship or two away from one or two DINOs the rest would get the message.
3.When the vote finally comes it will not matter what Olympia Snowe or any other republican says because I believe that we are on the fast track to a "reconciliation" vote.
4.Steny Hoyer's boss is Nancy Pelosi and he will fall in line eventually and do the right thing or face some type of retribution that I think is the way politics should be played.
5. Howard Dean is providing elected Dems a foil to play off of. As long as he keeps pushing for those things he supports Obama and the Dems can say "It could be worse were not that far left, just look at what Howard Dean wants". By the way I think Howard Dean is correct but I don't want to wait another 15 years to fix health care.
I TOTALLY AGREE with you on Single Payer Universal Health Care or "SPUHC" as I call it.
Finally, I had never thought about Bill Moyers as HHS secretary... but I share your dream!
Hope that helps and thanks for the questions. Amazing how we didn't have to yell at each other to communicate isn't it.
August 21, 2009 6:27 PM | Reply | Permalink
Sir Face,
You have provided me with even more thoughts to mull over. Thank you.
August 21, 2009 11:01 PM | Reply | Permalink
Excellent post - thought provoking questions asked and liked your list of ideas to be included in a future health care plan. Never recall President Obama calling for Health Insurance reform - terribly disappointing.
August 21, 2009 5:06 PM | Reply | Permalink
M,
THANKS for that. There are many other things that need to be addressed in whatever kind of reform that is passed. Please feel free to use my "little" post in whatever manner you see fit.
August 21, 2009 6:31 PM | Reply | Permalink
What's this about potentially losing your house. That worries me. I agree with every word of your post, but am concerned about your situation. Do you want to go into it?
August 21, 2009 8:17 PM | Reply | Permalink
Seconded.
We can haz chipin.
August 21, 2009 8:36 PM | Reply | Permalink
CD and Bwak and LL,
No lets not do that chip in thing just yet. Once upon a time I was a coin collector and have a few that are worth a little bit. I figure I can seel them if it gets right down to it.
I am however, touched by the thought. I will speak up if I get in too deep and need the help.
Now if anyone out there is a coin collector... let me know.
August 22, 2009 4:07 AM | Reply | Permalink
good luck with the coins. Otherwise just say the word, Face...
August 22, 2009 6:02 AM | Reply | Permalink
OB,
THANKS I will find out how this will play out next week, should be OK if my lender will be patient.
It is amazing just how quick health issues can send your life reeling out of control.
Again THANKS!
August 22, 2009 8:38 AM | Reply | Permalink
Seconded. We have chipped before!
August 21, 2009 8:45 PM | Reply | Permalink
Great post, Face. Your questions are spot on, and the eight ideas are extremely good ones.
I'll figure out a way to put your post to good use, but I'm worried, too, about what you said about losing your house. Stories like yours are all too common. We don't have time to wait until they "get around to it". There doesn't seem to be any sense of urgency, except on our part, and you know where we stand. Nowhere.
August 21, 2009 8:50 PM | Reply | Permalink
R,
THANKS for the concern but I will be OK I think. Also, Please feel free to use this post in whatever manner you like feel free to make it your own.
Again thanks for the good thoughts!
August 22, 2009 8:34 AM | Reply | Permalink
Can we recall Obama.
look at what he has done in the last 100 days. Theres no jobs anywhere there are people loosing there houses he trippled the debt.
Time for the American people to do something
August 21, 2009 10:20 PM | Reply | Permalink
let's look at what President Obama HAS done, courtesy of jonnie rae;
He stabilized the markets, so 401Ks are starting to slowly come back and we are not about to meltdown anymore. Unemployment numbers are coming down dramatically from when he took over. GDP went from 6.5 shrinkage to 1 shrinkage since he has been in office. Tens of thousands of state employees still have jobs, and services are maintained because of his stimulus.
He ended torture. He IS closing Gitmo.
95% of Americans are receiving a tax DECREASE.
He provided unemployment, food stamps and a 65% reduction in Cobra for those who lost their jobs.
He set new emissions standards.
He protected wilderness land set for oil leases.
He got Pakistan to agree to fight the Taliban, which Bush never could. The top leader was taken out this week.
He nominated and got confirmed the first latina Supreme Court Justice in history.
He signed Equal Pay for Equal Work, Children's Health Bill and Credit Card Reform.
He has a first time home owner's credit, a modification of mortgage plan in place. (This needs work, but it is in place)
He has made it easier for students to get college loans. (UMass just gave a 1500 rebate to all students because of the stimulus money.)
He has improved America's image around the world, especially with Muslim countries.
He got the 2 NK journalists out.
He got the non-proliferation treaties going again, and he will chair the next meeting. Already an agreement exists to reduce Russia's and US's arms.
A significant amount of the bailout money is being paid back. This is a good thing.
He has taken on healthcare, the most difficult thing to pass in the US. I am not completely happy with how he is doing it, but he is doing it.*
He ended the abstinence only thing. And the law that said a pharmacist could refuse to give birth control pills to women if they so chose.
He is sticking to the timetable to withdraw troops from Iraq.
He got funding for the useless bomber cut.And those heliocoptors. He plans to make more weapons' cuts.
He has cut 2 trillion from the budget over the next ten years.
He has taken on energy, the second most difficult thing to pass in the US and it has already passed the House.
He saved the American auto industry. (Cash for clunkers is doing great too, both for the industry and jobs, and for the environment.)
He is building a green economy for the US. First steps in the stimulus, others in the energy bill.
More jobs will be created in transportation when rest of stimulus kicks in in 2010.
He is facing complete disrespect and vilification from the media and the wingnuts,getting more than 30 death threats per day,and still goes on, calmly and with determination and intelligence.
* He has no champions in the Senate, only a small group of obstructionists who seem to have been given all the power by Harry Reid. The insurance industry has convinced people that he is Hitler; and this is only the beginning. If Pharma gets into it, what do you think will happen to healthcare? They have way more money than the insurance companies. You want him to fight all the corporate interests which actually OWN this country, including the Senate and Congress,and you want him to do that virtually alone? The left has attacked him almost from day one. The right is throwing the kitchen sink right now.
I think you have to decide whether he has done enough good in his first seven months to still support him. I think, overwhelmingly, yes.
by jonnie rae on Sun Aug 09, 2009 at 09:46:47 PM PDT
August 22, 2009 10:31 AM | Reply | Permalink
Thanks for the reminder. I do feel better for having read what you wrote!
August 22, 2009 1:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
Please read this as well as amike's and zipperupus on same thread,
http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/barack08north/2009/08/change-i-no-longer-believe-in.php#comment-3571209
August 22, 2009 1:47 PM | Reply | Permalink
Great questions
My big problem is this:
Even as the WH says the PO is "an important part" they refuse to be nailed down on it.
Then, from the Senate Baucus continues his sham of negotiating with Grasshole, and we hear Republicans like Olympia Snowe (aslo on the finance committee) declaring that the PO won't be in the final bill.
So, needless to say, I'm not convinced that the WH is committed to it, or has made it clear to congress. Steny Hoyer also waffled. So too many bad signs of caving, and not enough Pelosi like laying down the gauntlet.
Really starting to piss me off.
The WH is seriously miscalculating if it thinks it can screw us over on what is almost a religious topic for Democrats.
August 22, 2009 12:50 AM | Reply | Permalink
Thanks for taking the time to give such a complete answer to my remarks.
Let me start by saying that I wrote my own question badly. I should have tied it into the health care issue more closely. I thought the context of the original post would make that clear. It didn't. Sorry about that.
Having said that, let me Start by trying to draw this back into the context of the original post--which is about health care, and the effect that the current insurance program run amok is endangering a mortgage? Is this a fair summary of the topic?
IF so, the calls to action you suggest which are most closely related to this are these:
and
I'm not sure he can do one and eight at the same time. Maybe there's a way, but if so, it eludes me.
Then we take number one. At this stage of the battle would make the opponents of any health care reform happier. Significant members of the organizations supporting health reform now...the A.M.A. for example, which fought health care the last time and is advocating for it now, wouldn't particularly mind seeing it go down in flames, especially as they could then blame that on Obama. All the republicans would clap their hands with glee, and the gang of six would have won even more than they wished to win.
Number eight strikes me as a windmill tilt. It would weaken the argument for a public option and play into the hand of those who whip democrats as being "socialists". Note: My preference is single payer. I have friends in England alive because of it, and when I a health emergency in England a few years ago I was treated very well. In fact, back when I was blogging regularly I wrote a post on the English defending the National Health Service. In the comments I got mugged for diverting peoples attention away from the real issue, public option. Go Figure. (sigh).With regard to the rest of your points, some I think he's doing already. For example
The second most exciting thing to watching diplomacy work is watching the grass grow. But can you imagine Bush shaking hand with, accepting a present from, and allowing himself to be photographed with Hugo Chavez? And of course He was dumped on for do this---not only among the usual suspects, but in some of the posts here.
I can't believe Clinton's trip to North Korea or the Korean U.N. Delegates' visit to see Bill Richardson "just happened".
I am one of those gay fellow citizens, and nothing would please me more than revoking don't ask, don't tell--except for one thing, reinstituting universal public service (that drafty thing--but this time with no exemptions for the academically talented the well connected or those merely too tall)--want to give the peace movement a big boost and get us out of foreign adventurism--the draft's the way to do it.
But this isn't going to pass health care reform--it's just going to turn comments from "Obmam hates gays" (he doesn't) to "Obama loves faggots" and that's not going to move health care one step forward.
I think he should do many of the things on your list--and I haven't given up these happening in due course. But sometimes prioritizing shows more "spine" than any other course of action. Above me as I type this is a comment which reads
The spelling is original, I'll say that. I'm hoping it it snark, but I can't tell anymore.
I'm going to forgive you for this one, though doing so may make you madder than hell. It makes it seem as if I have to pass a committed and passionate test according to standards established you and those who think like you.
If you want to have a contest as to who is most passionate and committed, let's establish mutually satisfactory ground rules before we start round one, and lets agree on an impartial judge, o.k. Just don't make the judge dontputmeonyourhatelist
Thanks for taking the time to think about what I had to say rather than bashing me outright. I do appreciate that.
August 22, 2009 8:20 AM | Reply | Permalink
I like all your points, Amike. The Presidency does not grant superpowers. That said, I'd like a veto threat against a bill without the Public Option. But that's just me disagreeing with the President on what counts as a good bill.
Apart from that - and I don't like to pull the trigger on this kind of stuff - donputmeonyourhatelist looks like a troll.
August 22, 2009 8:52 AM | Reply | Permalink
I'm not against a veto threat, but I think the time for it is when whatever comes out of the two houses goes to conference.l That's when he'll have the most clout about that. Should he actually veto the bill he can hang the veto on specific legislators who forced the public option out of the bill.
August 22, 2009 10:55 AM | Reply | Permalink
Ah. That sounds reasonable. Fingers crossed...
August 22, 2009 11:12 AM | Reply | Permalink
amike, respectfully, conference is too late. House and Senate members who have stuck their necks out arguing for a public option deserve some support. And if either house passes a bill absent a public option, they will be angry as hell if conference meddles with their "finely tuned" legislation by fiat.
August 22, 2009 11:35 AM | Reply | Permalink
Could be. I was far better at scrabble than any game requiring too much strategy. But Obama has already said he's willing to go the reconciliation route, so what I'm thinking is that putting the veto threat out there at that time would strengthen the hand of Henry Waxman and the house side of the conference. Maybe not. I'd just like him to have one big gun left when October rolls around. And I don't know what bigger gun he has.
August 22, 2009 9:37 PM | Reply | Permalink
amike I am in the midst of job-related travel so I cannot reply as fully as I'd like. Of course we do not see eye to eye and I hope to return to this at a later point. On the point of whether Obama has a serious problem with the committed and passionate advocates for change, I did not mean all such...clearly Obama does not have a problem with adherents like you (passionate and committed) who think he is doing the best he can in the face of difficult circumstances but with a large number of equally committed and passionate adherents of policy change who are increasingly at odds with Obama's approach, his priorities, in short his politics. This is not just my opinion...I believe it is reinforced by numerous recent polls.
August 22, 2009 11:39 PM | Reply | Permalink
Yes, and I think your suggestions would make a huge, huge difference. Yet, in my opinion, we need absolutely fundamental change. We need to nationalize all health care. All insurance companies, and all lawyers should be out of health care. Nationalize the pharmacutecal firms. No one should make a "profit" from health care. Health care should be about doctors and nurses who are allowed to do their job in a regulated system. We don't allow the "profit incentive" to be a part of our police or fire protection.
Monetary incentives have a place in our economy, but it is a corupting force that should not be part of certain segments, including health care.
August 22, 2009 8:24 AM | Reply | Permalink
FO,
Agree, making money by in effect killing people is just wrong and that is how Health Insurers go about making profit. I also agree on nationalizing pretty much all health care manufacturers.
I also think that anytime big pharma developes a drug that is based on public funded research the government should get a cut of the profits. Unlike big oil that pays royalities for drilling off shore of certain states right now big pharma pays NOTHING for using the research and breakthroughs of federally funded discoveries.
August 22, 2009 8:53 AM | Reply | Permalink
I have been going over the list of Obama's accomplishments by jonnie rae. The list is actually pretty impressive considering that Obama has only been in office for only 8 months and the poor state of the nation that he inherited from GWB. Much of the accomplishments are due to Obama's undeniable charisma such as foreign relations so I dropped those and looked at what's left since I am interested in how the man thinks rather than what he is capable of. What remain still constitute a respectable list and what strikes me from that is that he seems to have a healthy level of Liberal values. Also he knew what he wanted done and he went ahead and got congress to get them done. He has my respect for that. Of course it helps to have democratic majority. What puzzles me is that when it came to health care, he chose to roll the dices and went for the bipartisan approach. Given the people in the opposition, he must have known that those dices were loaded. To add to the puzzlement, health care is a huge and important issue compared those little ones that he has already tackled. Why did he choose the roll the dices in tacking the big item and not on the little items. I know that he didn't want the outcome that Hillary got when she tried to ram Hillarycare through congress. Nobody does. But Hilary didn't have democratic majority either.
August 22, 2009 3:53 PM | Reply | Permalink