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Love him or hate him, but at least know what he is


Finally, the numbers are in and we have determined which American political brouhaha wins the trophy as the most tiresome, predictable, and ultimately unproductive. It wasn't really close. Let's review the finalists:

The most obvious contender, of course, is the battle of the extreme right wing -- that is to say, the Republican Party -- versus the Democrats who attempt to hide the fact that their constituency is Big Money . From the right, we hear  incessant mindless chanting about sacred Market while the right-of-center Dems discuss Social Justice while supporting legislation to cripple the Bill of Rights. If this "debate" weren't so infuriating, it would induce more somnolence than opium (while still being far less addictive.)

But as frustrating as the donnybrook between the Publicans and 'Crats is, it would serve neither accuracy nor fairness for us to give it our Most Likely to be Enervating Award. No, those laurels must go to the guaranteed-soporific carping between the Obama Lovers and the Obama Haters here on TPM. Congratulations to all participants for driving most intelligent debaters out of the Café and into pleasanter drugs.

This -- ha! -- discussion, lead mostly by people who wouldn't recognize a political fact if it were giving them a blowjob, seems to center on the question of whether the current President is an Evil Buffon or a Wise and Subtle Savior. Inasmuch as he is neither, allow me to enumerate what Pres. Obama is, is not, and may be.

Pres. Obama IS socially moderate, who seems willing to grant a minimally-acceptable level of rights, services, and status to the poor and oppressed. His stance on the rights of gays is a good example of his attitude.

Pres. Obama IS fiscally conservative. His immediate impulse is to throw money at giant corporations in trouble -- AIG, Bank Of America, General Motors --  and rich people -- for example, by retaining the Bush tax cuts. At the same time, his "middle-class tax cut"  awarded something like $8 per week to the median American household.

Pres. Obama IS an extremely capable politician. Two years ago, it was unthinkable that he could be the nominee of his party, let alone President.

Pres. Obama IS NOT a liberal. The very idea is ludicrous and drives real liberals up a wall. Liberals don't vote to indemnify communications companies for spying on their customers. Liberals don't act to protect torturers from accountability in court. Liberals don't keep people in jail indefinitely without legal recourse.

Pres. Obama IS NOT a person who would recognize any action of his own as overtly evil. He thinks he is a pragmatist, and if some little people need to get shafted or killed to achieve something grand, well, them's the breaks. He will do many great things for many people, some of them actual people as opposed to corporate "persons." He will do little, perhaps less than nothing, to close the gap between rich and poor.

Pres. Obama MAY BE the best thing to happen to this country for the last three decades.

Pres. Obama MAY BE the worst thing to happen to this country, even worse than George W. Bush.

May I make a suggestion? If you choose to respond to this article, please don't bother telling me that I am an idiot, that I am a terrible writer, that I am the very cause of the same napping I am trying to prevent, or any of that kind of stuff. I know all that. OTOH, please do point out where my facts are wrong or where my characterizations or opinions lack coherence.  If you can.

I hope I have not induced insomnia among those who depend on TPM to nod off each night.

 


24 Comments

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I don't think you're an idiot, but I do have a question.

Can you explain what you mean by this?

He thinks he is a pragmatist, and if some little people need to get shafted or killed to achieve something grand, well, them's the breaks.

Little people...shafted...OR KILLED? What are you talking about?

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Little people...shafted...OR KILLED? What are you talking about?

Obviously Obamabots miss a lot of the news...

KABUL, May 26 (Reuters) - A U.S. air strike in western Afghanistan early this month was a disproportionate use of force that killed 97 civilians and no more than two Taliban fighters, an Afghan rights watchdog said in a report on Tuesday.

Afghan officials, including President Hamid Karzai, have put the death toll as high as 140 and say the strikes hit houses in two villages in western Farah province in which mostly women and children were hiding.

The U.S. military has acknowledged 20-35 civilians were among 80-95 mostly Taliban fighters killed in the strikes during a May 3 battle in which U.S. Marines and Afghan security forces were attacked. It said Taliban used the villagers as human shields.

Afghanistan's Independent Human Rights Commission is the first group not tied to the U.S. military or Afghan government to present a report into the incident.

"This was a reaction with extreme use of force to destroy a group of opponents, and would have been disproportionate even if they were there," Nader Nadery, a commissioner for the group, told a news conference in the Afghan capital.

The group's initial investigation into Farah's bombing showed the 97 dead included 65 children and 21 women, he said.

Its investigators found no evidence that any of the victims were armed or that they had been used as human shields, Nadery said, although provincial officials had told the team that two of the dead were Taliban fighters.

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The use of the term "Obamabot" is not a useful addition to the conversation, but thanks for playing. I'm sure you're doing the best you can.

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Is "suckers for Obama" better?

And as long as you're volunteering for the euphemism police, I assume you'll be cleaning up all those nasty references to "torture" which disfigure the liberal blogosphere, along with so many other terms of abuse like "neo-con" and "crimes against humanity," which include slaughtering children as the obviously foreseeable result of maintaining rules of engagement which Barack Obama inherited from George W. Bush, and if that son-of-a-bitch Obama is happy to bomb villages based on always dubious intelligence and kill 61 children in one day, then I'm also happy to call his koolaid chuggin' cheerleaders "suckers for Obama," because a more accurate description like "collaborators with genocide" includes too many syllables for those suckers to parse.

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RR - Don't try to reason with Tankard. I guess you're not allowed to use the word "Obamabot" but Tankard is OK throwing out insults of his/her own. Discussion and debate come in a far second.

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I have repeatedly asked you not to attempt to interact with me, No Class Dick Licker. Go away or be abused.

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I wasn't interacting with you. I was letting RR know that you like to throw out insults rather than engage in an honest debate.

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You're doing it again. Don't I hear your mother calling you? I think she needs you to bone her again.

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My comment was not directed at you. I am free to respond to other people's comments.

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You are also free to keep your head planted firmly in your rectum. You are also free to exercise some of the most acrobatic logic known to man. I just prefer that you do them elsewhere. While you do those things in my presence, I will continue to remind you and anyone else who reads your comments that you have admitted to the most extreme perversion and that your ability to cognate has obviously been warped by said perversion. On the other hand, I am sure that your conscience is clear inasmuch as your lips provide such pleasure to your canine and porcine clients.

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I will continue to post things on TPM as I see fit. If you don't like that, I'm sorry.

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And as you continue to post as you see fit, all the while nuzzling the crotch of that orangutan you keep chained in your basement, I will continue to amuse myself by finding more and creative insults to respond to your room-temperature-IQ whining, lying, and echoing of the right-wing line.

I'd have to call it a win-win, wouldn't you? You get to snivel, I get to display my overwhelmingly superior intellect. Everybody's happy.

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Whatever makes you happy.

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No no. But being abused and abusing animals and children seems to make YOU happy, No Class. I am only here to encourage happiness in unfortunate sub-humans such as you. Keep coming back for more, I'll keep delivering the stuff your dreams are made of.

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Careful, RR, you actually allowed a fact to slip into your post. You could forfeit your membership in the Right-Wing Extremist Debating Society.

When you complete your lessons and actually learn to read, you might review my writing and find that I, like you, have a great deal of criticism for the current President. However, I like to think that mine is not mere parroting of Messrs. Limbaugh and O'Reilly. That's because I choose actually to employ my intellect. I suggest you give that paradigm a chance. You might find that it's actually more fun than your current practice of simple (and I mean that in both senses of the word) name calling.

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While I disapprove of the way he (she?) did it, RR provided one answer to your question, Jan. There are also the innocent people for whose lives he is now responsible and whose lives he continues to ruin in American and foreign prisons around the world. And of course there's the small matter of you and me, who can no longer depend on a private telephone conversation nor on our ability to question the government when they lock us up without cause.

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Tank...you aren't around a lot any more, but RR is the new incarnation of Jacob Freeze. You'll remember him from the old days. This isn't a guess...he said it in a comment a few weeks ago.

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BTW, you are not an idiot, your writing is just fine, I didn't fall asleep reading it, and I hate to admit that you are probably right, about almost everything. I still hope he turns out to be the best thing that has happened to this country in a long time. If he isn't I may have to change my name.

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Idiocy and deception wear many names, but all of them ultimately resolved back to "Rush."

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I do not recall calling you an idiot. But on this one I do disagree. Maybe because I hope what you say is not true.

I could be wrong.


But right now, I am happy with my President. Right now I am in agreement with him on about 75% of his decisions. That could change. I suppose.

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I hope what you say is not true

I wish what he says weren't true.

I hope he's right about the best thing part, but I damned if I can understand how a *"pragmatist" would fail to grasp the importance of living up to the "Scarface" rule:

"What do you think I am? You think I'd kill two kids and a woman? Fuck that! I don't need that shit in my life.
[Alberto reaches for detonator's button]
Tony Montana: You die motherfucker!
[Tony shoots him in the head]
Tony Montana: What'd you think of that, huh? What you think, I'm a fucking worm like you? I told you, man, I told you! Don't fuck with me! I told you, no fucking kids!(emphasis added...) No, but you wouldn't listen, why, you stupid fuck, look at you now."

I distinctly remember when Prez picked up his first "collateral damage" tally, and I wanted to puke.

My father always told me I was hopelessly naive...


*There is no such thing as pragmatic collateral damage when you need hearts and minds. Everyone knows that "free-fire" is gangbanging writ large.
That's why "terrorism" is a LAW ENFORCEMENT problem. (Think of the MOVE bombing in Philadelphia, for an example of how we view such actions domestically...)

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I confess myself somewhat nonplussed at the scant attention this post has drawn in its (now waning) 24 hours of mandated maximum activity.

I recced (I rarely do), hoping to bump it to the TPM front page. No such luck.

That said, i make a further recommend to Tankard.

Between you and me, if you return to this entry via Manage Entries, you may save a new publish time (manually) and, so to speak, live on, with current recs intact as a floor (not the case if you re-publish).

Just a thought.

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Well, he must be right about everything, because so few "dare" challenge the mighty Tankard!

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so few "dare" challenge the mighty Tankard!

Few indeed, and none of the wise.

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Tankard2

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