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I miss Clearthinker
I understand CT has taken down his blog posts and indicated he is moving on.
I have not always agreed with him (understatement?) but I have appreciated his inquisitive nature and rigor in trying to pin down the facts. He can throw his elbows too wide at times, but all in all, I think he provided an important voice among many important voices here. Sorry we may have heard the last from him. Hope it ain't so.
I have not always agreed with him (understatement?) but I have appreciated his inquisitive nature and rigor in trying to pin down the facts. He can throw his elbows too wide at times, but all in all, I think he provided an important voice among many important voices here. Sorry we may have heard the last from him. Hope it ain't so.
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I signed off early, yesterday. What happened?
July 26, 2009 5:17 PM | Reply | Permalink
So what did actually happen? Was their an event here that precipitated his departure? Did he decide the CT brand carries too much baggage here, and he needs to reinvent himself? Does he actually have a position in the government/industry that he felt he had to wipe out his posts in order to 'protect' himself? My best guess: whatever the reasons, he'll be back.
July 27, 2009 2:00 PM | Reply | Permalink
Ripper -- I hope this is not true.
I see CT as an idealist, but one who covers his belief in his particular pure vision with posturing, lest he lose face by admitting how much he cares.
I see him as someone who does cares, though as someone possibly not cared for, then or now, enough -- although that opinion is an invasion of both his privacy and his pride.
I also see him as a royal pain in the ass, who can defeat himself repeatedly by insistently posturing rather than risking exposure. And I criticize him for that, because by attempting to protect himself he often hurts others, which is not, actually, acceptable.
Nonetheless, it would be an irony if CT left after posting the friendliest, most helpful blog I have seen him offer in over a year.
So, CT, if you're reading, come back. Because I think you have lots to say of value, if you will only risk your ego, as you attempt to share your experience.
July 26, 2009 5:20 PM | Reply | Permalink
I concur and I hope that he will come back.
July 26, 2009 5:48 PM | Reply | Permalink
As someone who sits in the Cafe bleachers, I found CT equal parts interesting and frustrating. There is definitely a difference between his blogs and his comments. As informative as he could be, he was sure able to push some folks' buttons.
Maybe someone blew his cover and he had to move on.
July 26, 2009 5:52 PM | Reply | Permalink
I too concur and hope he comes back. I was sorry to see that his blog posts were gone.
July 26, 2009 6:25 PM | Reply | Permalink
I won't miss CT and I'm not sorry he's gone. He is insufferable and unrelentingly condescending, Whether that comes from some deep psychological trauma or by nature of his personality doesn't matter much to me. I found his comments irritating and his posts unreadable.
Sorry I can't join your love fest.
Also, nobody ever realy leaves. They lurk, they create a new identity, or they say good-bye and it doesn't take. But if anybody is going to miss being talked to like you're a toddler, I'm sure there are other posters who will be happy to fill in.
July 26, 2009 6:04 PM | Reply | Permalink
I can't disagree with much except the "lovefest" thing. This wasn't intended as such.
July 26, 2009 6:07 PM | Reply | Permalink
I agree. His childish need of constant reinforcement was forgivable; his continuous condescension to all of us who always endeavor to put our thoughts out in an effort to continue an honest conversation; never worked, despite his unending efforts to blame it all on everyone else.
Maybe he will come back when he grows up a bit; maybe not. There are plenty of smarter people here at tpm.
July 26, 2009 8:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
Whatever. I am with Orlando. Prick was articulate, and often interesting, but Jesus what a whiner. So now he has decided to take all his blogs down and move on. Drama Queen to the very end.
I wish him the best and look forward to his future TPM manifestations.
Clear thinker is dead, Long live clear thinker
July 27, 2009 1:50 AM | Reply | Permalink
I found CT's intentionally nasty, intensely personal comments to be abhorrent and unacceptable. It is a fine line between wanting him back and putting up with him. I have pretty thick skin or else I would not have written this post at all.
July 26, 2009 6:05 PM | Reply | Permalink
Oy.
Ripper you rawk, but CT?
mark me down as (gag)
July 26, 2009 6:40 PM | Reply | Permalink
Sometimes a respite is very much needed.
July 26, 2009 7:09 PM | Reply | Permalink
He took down all his posts? Is he a baby, or what? After all the shit he has given many of us (including me), he just couldn't take the heat in the kitchen?
This is the guy who has told us he has advised Cabinet Secretaries? That he has advised Congressmen and Senators?
He has been in the upper echelons of policy?
And he has taken down his TPM blogs because his feelings are hurt?
ClearThinker, this message is for you:
You are okay. You are smart. I hope your life is going okay as well. As I've said before, it might do you well to just give some respect to those who disagree with you, and maybe even be objective about things.
July 26, 2009 8:51 PM | Reply | Permalink
No wonder the country is in such a mess.
July 26, 2009 11:01 PM | Reply | Permalink
Did CT really make that kind of claim?
July 27, 2009 12:27 AM | Reply | Permalink
I remember him stating that he'd testified before congress and was generally privy to some inner circles in DC. With the concern over public figures blogging on the internet, there is however some room for doubt as to the veracity of this.
July 27, 2009 1:46 PM | Reply | Permalink
A very kind and positive gesture this blog, Ripper.
I read someone in comments asking a blogger to be less judgmental. On TPM and in the café. Today. And the blogger said he would try. In that case I hadn't seen any overabundance of judgmental behavior. But agreeing "to try" is always a good thing.
If CT chooses to come back after a respite I will welcome him. If he prefers to hold onto his injury that would be his choice also. He will decide.
July 26, 2009 9:00 PM | Reply | Permalink
I am the one who suggested that someone be less judgmental. It had to do with judging writing style, not opinions. The last thing you need is someone saying writers a, b, and c are "good" and writers d, e, and f are not.
I was provoked by the holier than than thou tone.
July 26, 2009 9:15 PM | Reply | Permalink
An old blogger never dies, they just fade away.......
July 26, 2009 9:54 PM | Reply | Permalink
Wot! They don't make Grand Exits?!
who knew?
July 26, 2009 10:27 PM | Reply | Permalink
In this case, they should be permanent. Either way.
Buttsekks!!!
July 26, 2009 10:57 PM | Reply | Permalink
Doncha ever wonder why no one ever writes: "I miss workerbee"? :-)
Speaking of fading away, one I really still do miss is "irishkg." Thinking of that, I just looked at her user page, and it is hilariously ironic what her last diary/blog post here was: Come out, come out, wherever you are!--November 10, 2006:: To once frequent Cafe voices, who have been in hiding in recent weeks, "Ally ally in free. Come out, come out, wherever you are!" In honor of the funny names of the missing, one of my favorites from Dr. Seuss' Sneeches...
Heck, going even further back, I wish Kate Cambor, TPMCafe's original editor, had stayed on with TPM; I miss her and the potential she showed, I think she would have added something that is still very much missing at TPM Media, Inc., something that it could very much use, something that could determine whether its future growth is special, or more like HuffPo's. Actually, I still think it is kind of sad that TPMCafe didn't go in its original promising direction...but then, this is the thing basically about internet forums...I think it was put well by a famous poet, talking about something else:
In the room the women come and go
Talking of Michelangelo.
July 27, 2009 1:03 PM | Reply | Permalink
I miss workerbee, and billy glad. I'm sure many of us have a few we remember now and then. But after so long it just doesn't seem worthwhile posting about it.
July 27, 2009 3:21 PM | Reply | Permalink
=D
I know where you can find Billy Glad.
http://annalsofthehive.blogspot.com/
I feel certain that even faded bloggers miss you, oceankat.
July 27, 2009 10:43 PM | Reply | Permalink
Not really. Should I?
=D
July 27, 2009 10:26 PM | Reply | Permalink
An old blogger never dies, they just lose their links.
We hope.
July 26, 2009 10:54 PM | Reply | Permalink
It's unfortunate he's packed his blogs and left. I thought there was potential there for someone who was articulate, although at times a bit twisted. He certainly brought a different perspective. Problem for me was his attitude towards others. CT simply does not play well with others and no matter how obvious it may seem to the rest of us, never managed to see any degree of self-determination in the reactions people had to his comments. I really appreciated his last blog on meeting Congress critters. That was good material. I hope he comes back and I hope he brings some self-awareness and responsibility for his part in confrontations. I'm not saying things are not the fault of others with CT. There is plenty to go around, but to be convinced it was all one-sided is just absurd.
July 27, 2009 1:14 AM | Reply | Permalink
What? I go on a mini-vacation and get back to this?! Weird. I kind of see CT as a bastion here. Extremely antagonistic oftentimes. But offering really good insights at others. It always seemed to me that there were 2 Clearthinkers. Unless I'm mistaken, CT had only started posting blogs again after a year hiatus when some here asked him to repost the original "fax your politicians" blog (CT had continued to comment, just not do original posts). And then afterwards other blogs followed.
I think I've only been at the receiving end of his ire once, last week right before I was to go on this trip. I was seeing red. But then again, he made me doublecheck myself and think about why I'm writing. Can someone who claims to be a scientist post an informal blog? I had finally come to the conclusion, why the hell not?
Oh well, I wish CT happiness.
July 27, 2009 1:16 AM | Reply | Permalink
Seconded.
July 27, 2009 1:34 AM | Reply | Permalink
I know I can be obtuse or confusing sometimes so I have to give CT a break. That said I didn't usually comment on his postings because I disagreed with him more often than not. More specifically, I didn't really know how to respond to some of his conclusions.
July 27, 2009 5:22 AM | Reply | Permalink
I don't know this Clearthinker person. Tell me more about him/her. Was he a Cultist or an independent-minded progressive?
July 27, 2009 5:40 AM | Reply | Permalink
The latter of course but he ran into issues with his social skills and thus sometimes became a punching bag at inappropriate times because of his rudeness from previous interactions which escalated into an unhealthy dynamic with many people.
I did not have a problem with him other than wishing he could restrain himself and take higher ground when communicating with people here so that the things of value that he shared would not be so easily overlooked. And I found a lot of value in some of the things he shared with us and especially appreciated his help in our efforts to support the single payer rally.
July 27, 2009 11:31 AM | Reply | Permalink
My preference would be that persons not be given the opportunity to take down blogs. What is written stays written, period. If I change my mind, or if I cool off, and feel embarrassed by a rant (if I sober up, whatever), I can acknowledge that what I said wasn't my best, correct the misinformation I put forward, apologize to whomever I dumped upon, and swear to myself to do a better job the next time.
I think a change in policy regarding this would have three effects. First, it would make people think a little more about what they're casting out there. "Will I regret saying this?" is a powerful question. Second, it will elevate the legitimacy of the blogosphere. No other written information media can control the life of its content. This doesn't mean everything endures, but it takes the decision of what endures out of the hands of those who initiate the conversation. Finally, it is much more fair to those who will try to make sense out of this era in the future. Historians are touchy about the deliberate eradication of the historical record. Like it or not, Clearthinker is part of the public record, and removing evidence of his/her presence is a kind of intellectual suicide.
July 27, 2009 7:38 AM | Reply | Permalink
July 27, 2009 9:19 AM | Reply | Permalink
I think about them every time I hear of "missing" e-mails or "shredded" documents. I suppose I started thinking about this in a serious way during the Nixon Impeachment Hearings. Those famous (then, if not now) 18 minutes missing from the tape recordings...including the picture which demonstrated (not!) how the Secretary accidentally erased them.
July 27, 2009 9:29 AM | Reply | Permalink
I'm with you here. The infamous 18 minutes were a dramatic illustration. It's so frustrating to read history and see how hard it is to piece things together when there's a lack of documentation. And then to see people nowadays destroying documentation is heartbreaking. (Well, maybe that's a bit of an exaggeration.) Part of me understands wanting to remove information that is embarrassing or incriminating, but more of me wants the full record to be available to future historians or investigators. Even if we don't know the full story right now, I feel better knowing that someone in the future may be able to piece together the story.
July 27, 2009 11:57 AM | Reply | Permalink
In my experience, Mike, you can't really take down a blog. Even if you delete it, it remains when you click on all the account and the place where all the blogs show. Thus, if the blogs have really all disappeared, it sounds more like he's been banned - and when they ban someone, yes, they do take down all the blogs - and suspend the account.
July 27, 2009 10:42 AM | Reply | Permalink
He was not banned.
July 27, 2009 11:25 AM | Reply | Permalink
I just "unpublished" one of my blogs. Poof. Blog and comments disappeared from public view.
To verify: Make sure you are logged in. Go to Blog Now. Click on the arrow next to Manage and then click on Entries. Put a check mark next to one of your blogs and then click on More Actions in the drop down box. Click Unpublish Entries.
Unpublished blogs have what looks like a pencil in the column to the left. The published blogs have a check mark within a green circle.
To republish the blog, put a check mark in the box and click on the Publish button to the left of the More Actions drop down box. Blog and comments are now restored.
July 27, 2009 5:01 PM | Reply | Permalink
I hit reply to tell you that I agreed with you about not being able to take down blogs. But then I thought what if I put up something in the heat of the moment or even in a clear headed manner that could have been interrupted in a different way from what I intended. I haven't blogged but I will give an example of something I said nearly 30 years ago that still burns. I was talking to someone about a person I had met the day before and she asked me his name (he was a new co-worker) and I said "Oh, Goldberg, Greenberg, Blueburg, something like that, they all sound the same." My friend didn't say anything but later that day I realized how anti-semitic that made me sound and I certainly didn't mean it that way. What if I put that in a blog in someone google me for employment purposes? Sure doesn't look good for me does it?
I really wish I had seen Clearthinkers farewell blog but I can understand while he may have removed his blogs and I will defend his right to do so.
July 27, 2009 11:54 AM | Reply | Permalink
I think there's a difference between "saying" and "writing", but I take your point. I might add that the logistics of blogging here give me the opportunity to avoid hastiness if I so choose. I can save the blog without publishing it for awhile, and when I've cooled down or even when I've just developed enough distance to see what I said as opposed to what I meant to say, I can edit and then hit the publish button.
Alternately, I can do what I usually do--type the post up in Word Perfect (my word processor of choice) and cut and paste it to the blog when it is in good enough shape to suit my critical eye.
July 27, 2009 12:01 PM | Reply | Permalink
Well, it is obvious I just fire off without checking anything I say or write. It should be interpreted, not interrupted!
July 27, 2009 3:45 PM | Reply | Permalink
Does this mean those who commented on the Clearthinkers blog had their comments and/or Clearthinkers replies disappeared also?
Maybe I am over sensitive to this but since or original past efforts of the original TpmCafe blog were thrown away by management it has made me more sensitive and thoughtful of comments and blogging relationships disappearing from the present and from the history of our online reality.
Online communities contain heartfelt present and historical emotional attachments that may dwarf many of our passing relationships in our physical communities.
Blogging history, the relationships that have been formed and the bloggers in these on line communities should be thought of and valued no less that many of the attachments for the good or irritating in our physical community. In both the irritating in both may make the relationships with others stand out.
July 27, 2009 12:41 PM | Reply | Permalink
Yeah, I think the comments are all gone too. Which is often why a post deletion is such a jarring thing. Often it's the conversations generated by a post that prove to have far more value than the post itself.
And here's the conundrum, I think: If you write something, you have absolute control over the copywrite of it. I mean, you can do what you want with your words. But each comment belongs to that other poster. Or does it? If you generate a good healthy dialog with your post, does that conversation belong to you? Or is it like 60% yours?
July 27, 2009 1:03 PM | Reply | Permalink
I'm hoping one of the lawyers will correct me if I'm wrong, but as I understand it, merely writing something doesn't convey copyright rights to it. Securing copyright requires positive action--and more than just adding the copyright sign. At least that was true the one time I copyrighted something: my dissertation back in 1971. I copyrighted it for one reason only...back in those days one provided two copies of the copyrighted material to the Library of Congress--and I guess that granted me as much immortality as I wanted. :-)
The copyright application process can be found here: http://www.directlegal.com/copyright_process.htm
July 27, 2009 3:05 PM | Reply | Permalink
Copyright is secured the moment an original work is created and and may be defended in the courts by suing for cease and desist orders or actual damages caused by infringement. However, only a copyright that has been registered through the formal process you describe can be defended with the additional possibility of receiving punitive damages for the infringement.
July 27, 2009 4:36 PM | Reply | Permalink
He'll be back. He always comes back. Sometimes as separate personalities. But always recognizable.
July 27, 2009 8:50 AM | Reply | Permalink
Jeez...I take a few days off and this place falls apart!
Ripper, thanks for posting this or I wouldn't have known he left (again)only in a way that makes it seems like he's REALLY gone this time...
I fall into the camp that enjoyed CT when he played nice, which granted, wasn't often. He derailed more than one of my posts with his obnoxiousness.
I think he's a smart guy with some good ideas. He often challenged my thinking in a way that helped me clarify my viewpoint, and I appreciated that (and told him so!) What drove me crazy was his condescending attitude, and the way he spiraled into hatefulness when his ideas were challenged (and I told him that, too!)
It is like there were 2 CTs in one, you know - a split personality...I'll miss one of him and be glad the other is gone.
July 27, 2009 10:15 AM | Reply | Permalink
I was on a mini-vacation and came back to this too. You are right, he was kind of a mixed bag to say the least. He did make one really analyze what they were saying. Regardless of how spiteful he was, his presence really helped one articulate!
July 27, 2009 1:13 PM | Reply | Permalink
i'll miss him too.
July 27, 2009 12:53 PM | Reply | Permalink
The decision to wipe out his threads and all the conversations in them erases any desire I might have to see him post again. Leave if you must ... trash shit on your way out the door nothing to say but "FUCK YOU!". Once there are comments, you aren't just taking down your own work anymore - you are erasing the work of others as well.
Rosenberg is kind of a shithead for doing it occasionally (I'll never waste my time on one of his threads again), now Clearthinker has made himself a total piece of shit in my mind. Good riddance.
July 27, 2009 1:20 PM | Reply | Permalink
I made a place to talk about comments and who owns them--http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/ripper_mccord/2009/07/i-miss-clearthinker.php#comment-3540631
sorry, my notes how to embed a link are elsewhere....
July 27, 2009 3:43 PM | Reply | Permalink
I always appreciated CT's comments for their critical analysis, the education I received while reading them, and the education I received from reading others' comments. And I'll leave it at that.
I think it was extremely nice of you, Ripper, to post this.
And I'm sorry CT has decided to take all his/her comments (and those of others) and just go home. I don't know how you remove your own blog without taking the comments with it, but it's too bad.
July 27, 2009 1:57 PM | Reply | Permalink
i am upset that he took down his blogs. He and I went hammer and tongs over his perspective on overpopulation... I could never pin him down on just how far he was willing to go to address a problem that involves reproductive rights. The conversations (well, arguments) were important because we both had valid perspectives that addressed the liberty/equality tension in democracies.
One thing CT never did was take another's opinion and perspective and refine his/her own thoughts. The underlying assumption behind everything CT wrote was "I am right and if more people in the world thought like me, then the world would be better for it." Instead, I found a haughtiness and sloppiness to his thinking that was more Randroid than logician.
I don't want to say good riddance, but it is tempting.
July 27, 2009 3:32 PM | Reply | Permalink
of course if everyone was like clearthinker, the cacophony of argument would be crazy. No one would ever actually listen to the other. May be too harsh towards CT, but a big part of discussion is listening to the other party.
July 27, 2009 3:46 PM | Reply | Permalink
Seems more than a bit cowardly to me. After reading his blogs and his comments, I'm surprised. Really surprised.
Whatever happened to "the courage of your convictions"? ClearThinker was the last person I would have considered a quitter.
The constant challenger can't take being challenged. Who'd a thought??
July 27, 2009 10:16 PM | Reply | Permalink
You know what, forget CT. I miss eds.
July 27, 2009 11:11 PM | Reply | Permalink