"He's not done yet."
I am writing in the moment of having just hung up the phone with someone who I love very much. Let's call this person Zeus.
Zeus said "Obama is Hitler."
I said, "Please don't make that comparison, Zeus."
"That's how I feel about it, I have the right to feel that way, besides when I said you will be the one that turns me in to them, I was just kidding. Didn't you hear me laugh?" said Zeus.
"It's offensive to compare anyone to Hitler. I don't care how you feel about it. Please don't do it around me, besides it makes you sound crazy." I said. "... And by the way I don't like being compared with the members of the S.S."
"Well I was just kidding, but Obama is taking everything over, just like Hitler did. And now you will probably turn me in for saying that" said Zeus.
I said, "Please stop referring to President Obama as Hitler, Zeus, and never compare me to a member of the S.S. It is not funny and it's not true."
"Well when I'm 65 and they come to take me away and you sign the papers ... I despise Barbara Boxer too. All of them. They are taking over. You are a dreamer and it is so sad to see how they have lied to you. You have a good heart, but when they take me away to kill me, you are the one who will sign the papers." Said Zeus.
"Zues, I'm happy to have this conversation with you. I love you. I will never turn you in." I said. "There's only a couple of things I ask. First let's be rational when we discuss this. Okay? Alright, you're like four thousand years old already but that's beside the point, which is that at 65 you were eligible for Medicare, (which is already run by the government who, by the way, is really good at protecting us from our enemies, criminals, fires, and many other things already) and that will remain unchanged. Medicare itself will remain unchanged, Zeus. Next if we are gonna discuss this issue in the future, I want you to actually read the proposals out there-"
"I ALREADY READ OBAMA'S PROPOSAL!" Zeus screamed. "HE IS TRYING TO KILL ME AND LET IRAN ATTACK US!"
"Huh?" I asked. "Hey Zeus, I know that we have different philosophies. That's cool. I know that you will support actual humane medical care and health insurance for everyone that is in this country, citizen or not, because that is the right thing to do, right? To protect your own children, especially the ones you had with human women, you shoud make sure that the poorest people are healthy, right? Cool. So don't get defensive when I say that I don't believe that you have actually read any of the proposals out there. That you are actually just repeating the lies of industry lobbyists who are fleecing America right under your nose, and that if you informed yourself we could actually have a sane discussion about this ..."
"I have read Obama's proposal, well parts of it and it is evil and corrupt like Chicago. But there are parts of the Republican proposal that I like."
"Um. Okay you just proved that you haven't read any of the proposals out there, because Obama has not put forth any proposal yet-"
"He's not smart enough to come up with his own proposal." Zues said, interrupting me again.
"Please stop interupting me. I let you talk."
"Okay," said Zeus.
"Okay you proved that you are just repeating things you've heard. Things that are being said by liars who work for two industries that are interested in scaring you into keeping things just the way they are. Neither President Obama's Administration, nor the Republicans in Congress have put forth a proposal, so when you say you read them it's clear to me that you're making that up because even you, Zeus, can't read something that isn't there. It's cool, I've made stuff up before plenty of times to support my argument. But not this time Zeus. It's too damn important for us all."
"I would sign on to this so-called "public option" if every member of Congress, the Supreme Court Justices, and the President and all their families signed onto it too. Hah. They will never go for that so as long as that is part of the plan, then I support it! Hah! Got You!" Said Zeus.
"I hope that you would also still support their right to accent their care with a private plan should they so choose." I said.
He paused a good while, then said "I would have to consider it once I've seen the details, but if it's good enough for a sewage worker then it should be good enough for the President."
"Do you support the right of the sewage worker to augment or choose between a public and private plan."
"No. . . " He said. "Yes." He paused. "I don't know. But I am never buying a GM car again. I do know that!"
I sighed and said, "Alright, Zeus, we should stop here for now. At least you stopped calling me a member of the S.S., and stopped comparing President Obama to Hitler, one of the most tragic, cruel and insane men in history."
"He's not done yet," said Zeus.
Oy,
what disturbs me most is that there are people who intentionally build their power and wealth and are behaving much more like Hitler by lying to and manipulating people with fear. The political members that belong to 'The Family' led by Doug Coe actually model after Hitler, Mao, and others like them.
I wish we had a magical spell we could use on people like this to dispel the hold the psychos have on them. To reveal the lying, theiving, maniac behind the curtain.
July 30, 2009 3:34 PM | Reply | Permalink
I know. That would be nice. Maybe the spell is love and patience ... but if that doesn't work, is there somewhere I can really turn them in?
(just asking)
July 30, 2009 3:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
I discovered this morning that there are a dismaying number of hotlines to turn in illegal immigrants. Since immigrants are also referred to as illegal aliens, maybe you could turn focus on the "alien" part -- which the ideology you've cited seems to me to be - - and turn the believers in there, for deportation, preferably to another planet. Excepting your loved one, of course, whom you will undoubtedly deprogram.
July 30, 2009 4:05 PM | Reply | Permalink
lol a wingnut hotline. maybe we could send those reported some brownies and snuggies.
July 30, 2009 7:31 PM | Reply | Permalink
Next time ask Zeus to please read to you verbatim the proposal he thinks he's read.
July 30, 2009 4:21 PM | Reply | Permalink
Unless you go at the speed of 1 second per page, that might take a little while.
Better wait until we have the "public option" on telephone service.
Although I suspect that's the speed our lovely Congressmen read it at, too.
July 30, 2009 4:30 PM | Reply | Permalink
This is good snark. Thank you all. As to jsfox's suggestion, I would then have to define 'verbatim'
... and when I explained that it was Latin I might be accused of being an Alien sympahtizer.
I think instead I will just fax another letter to the yellow 'blue dogs'.
Which always makes me think of the line:
"... why no I do not like your party hat."
from Go! Dog! Go!
July 30, 2009 7:27 PM | Reply | Permalink
Will you go
No I'm a dog no
I do not like your health care bill
I want more pay before I will
If you do not appease me
I will chase you up a tree
I love the power I get to throw
I won't go
I'm a dog so I say no
(well it's a bit of an insult to dogs but...)
July 30, 2009 9:03 PM | Reply | Permalink
Hey, at least you drove the conversation from "You're trying to kill me!" to "I'd have to read the proposal."
I actually agree everyone who is currently on a government-subsidized private plan (TRICARE, Congress, Medicare, VA, etc.) should be required to switch to the public option, with the ability to decide on private coverage should they so choose. Combine all of them with the small business owners and self employed and uninsured and the public option could start out with as many as one hundred million people.
There would be a huge positive effect on costs due to the shear size of the largest risk pool in America as well as force health insurance companies to compete within the new regulatory environment. All without spending much money beyond creating the organizational structure to manage it and supplementing whatever percentage of the uninsured who can't afford it.
Anytime you can get someone who is diametrically opposed to your ideas to start agreeing with something, anything, then a crack has been made. The fact that Zeus is someone you love makes it that much easier. If he is really that fringe, I suspect he would have never given an inch, much less the mile he needs to go. I suspect that even stuff as sarcastically hyperbolic as the conversation above seems to be said in jest more than seriousness. There seems to be a locker room mentality for many male conservatives that will be hard to dispel and sort of needs to be dismissed as irrelevant even as it is confronted when it goes too far.
This blog actually gives me some hope that many of my assumptions may actually be part of the counter narrative that is going at the grassroots of both parties and the conversations taking place like the one you describe. I had a similar experience during the primaries that I wrote about here, though I wasn't called a Nazi during the exchange or accused of rounding people up for camps.
If we could get the republicans to advocate for comprehensive and common sense plan they have finally been convinced to support, which may take some time given the natural skepticism of conservatives, then the health care system we come away with will have been passed by the same margins as the last time the left and right came together to produce evolutionary change in America.
That sort of triumph can't help but create a system that is sustainable and supported by all of us rather than rammed through by fiat on behest of yet another imperial president.
July 31, 2009 11:14 AM | Reply | Permalink