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Mgmax's Blog Today, Broder's CW Tomorrow!


It may be surprising to see David Broder, king of the already accepted conventional wisdom, take on something a little touchy in a column. Nevertheless, today he is one of the first to take on an elephant in the bedroom that no one seems to be talking about: the Constitutional and practical issues of having an ex-president hanging around his wife the president, injecting marital drama into national affairs.

I say one of the first, but not the first-- here at Mgmax's Blog, we covered this angle on November 2:

When she holds Cabinet meetings, he will likely be there. When she meets with foreign dignitaries, he will stay where Laura or Nancy would have gone. When she has to make a decision, we will always wonder if she did-- or he did.

Bill Clinton will have circumvented the 22nd amendment-- or we'll think he may have. We will have a co-president possibly fighting with the actual president over final decisions-- or not, depending on which ex-aide's tell-all book you read. Disappointed that his first eight years didn't give him the kind of big historical stage on which to be an FDR, Bill will join FDR as the only president with two more terms in which to make his mark by some outsize, self-dramatizing act in the post-9/11 world.

Or will he? The point is, we just don't know. We don't know what really goes on between them. All we know is the spin.

Okay, we weren't the first either, since we quote Charles Krauthammer. But anyway, Broder raises the issue too:

As my friend says, "there is nothing in American constitutional or political theory to account for the role of a former president, still energetic and active and full of ideas, occupying the White House with the current president."

No precedent exists for such an arrangement, and no ground rules have been -- or probably can be -- written. When Bill Clinton was president, the large policy enterprise that was entrusted to the first lady -- health-care reform -- crashed in ruins.

The causes were complex, and some of the burden falls on other people -- Republicans and Democrats in Congress, the interest groups and, yes, the press. But as one who reported and wrote in great detail and length about that whole enterprise, I can also tell you that the awkwardness of having an unelected but uniquely influential partner of the president in charge affected every step of the process, from the gestation of the plan to its final demise. She was never again asked to take on such a project.

And this was simply the confusion sown by having the first lady in charge. Put the former president into the picture -- however "sanitized" or insulated his role is supposed to be -- and the dimensions of the problem become even larger.

No one who has read or studied the large literature of memoirs and biographies of the Clintons and their circle can doubt the intimacy and the mutual dependence of their political and personal partnership.

No one can reasonably expect that partnership to end should Hillary Clinton be elected president. But the country must decide whether it is comfortable with such a sharing of the power and authority of the highest office in the land.

It is a difficult question for any of the Democratic rivals to raise. But it lingers, even if unasked.

Will anyone ask it before it happens, unasked?


27 Comments

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I don't find it at all unusual for Broder to concern himself with the Clinton's marriage and his disengenuous remark "and yes, the press" had something to do with the failure to move the health plan forward is right up there with "I didn't know the gun was loaded" and "Tenet said it was a slam dunk." What a piece of work Broder is - he pretends that this is quite a concern for everyone, especially her rivals, and he's the only person brave enough to ask the "difficult question" (which by the way, if he had bothered to read his own newspaper or any other for that matter, has been asked numerous times and answered)which has her rivals fraught with fear for the republic.

Someone needs to wake up Rip Van Broder and welcome him to the 21st century where husbands and wives can be partners in law firms or work in the same corporation and be perfectly capable of making corporate or partnership decisions without being ordered about by the other spouse.

Bill Clinton didn't "share power and authority" with Hillary Clinton" and if Broder had taken the time to read the powers and duties of the presidency in the constitution he would know that it doesn't work that way in this country.

Why shouldn't Hillary Clinton ask her husband for advice and counsel on troubling issues? He's one of the few people who has been there, done that and give her good advice and counsel. Why should anyone in this country be afraid that the President is seeking other opinions, advice and information that can help them make better decisions? That's what intelligent people do - they look for all kinds of possible answers and solutions to problems.

As for Broder's friend stating the obvious for the oblivious, "that there is nothing in the constitutional or political theory...to account for the role of a former president...occupying the house with

the current president" - no kidding. That's because the constitution provides for one president making decisions with congress advising and consenting (and need I point out that the one president who seems to have not understood this is the current one) and with the system of checks and balances it wasn't necessary for the constitution to make provisions for any other situation.

Perhaps Broder will wonder who is making the decisions in the White House (although it doesn't seem to concern him much now) but those of us who live in the 21st Century, understand that women are capable and intelligent and can make decisions without their husband telling them what to do.

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Bill Clinton didn't "share power and authority" with Hillary Clinton

Bill disliked the press, too--but not with the loathing of his wife, who even tried to throw the press out of the White House itself. In January 1993, she and her friend Susan Thomases proposed to move the White House press room next door, to the sleepy Old Executive Office Building. When that scheme was deemed untenable, aides closed off a hallway connecting the press room to the West Wing. Outraged reporters pounced on press secretary George Stephanopoulos, who later recalled thinking, "I'm not your problem; Hillary is. ... [Bill] Clinton seems to be on my side. He asked me again this morning why we were closing the door. Um, have you talked to your wife about this, Mr. President?" --The New Republic

Just one example to show that-- we really don't know, do we?

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The "sleepy old executive building" right next door that houses White House staff, because as all the stories at the time said she so extravagently wanted to reopen the indoor pool? The White House press offices that the press so bitterly complained was crowded and dirty and too small and incapable of supporting the new technology and was a "fire hazard" just as the Dept. of Parks and the White House Historical Preservation Association said it was? Do you mean the door which when Gergen informed her was "closed" she was surprised and "readily agreed that it should be reopened" - do you mean that awful, terrible power play that resulted in the muzzling of the free press and brought down the republic?

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Shows what I get for believing what I read in The New Republic!

Seriously, I have no more details than I quoted above, I have no idea who's right but in any case, kind of tangential to the point there.

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What a piece of work Broder is - he pretends that this is quite a concern for everyone, especially her rivals, and he's the only person brave enough to ask the "difficult question"

The same can be said about this post, which basically tries to create controversy when none exists.

Bill Clinton is the most popular Democratic figure, and is the reason Hillary is on top of the polls.

There is no controversy or mystery here -- people want Bill Clinton in the White House again. People want him influencing her decisions.

Voting for Clinton is a two-for-one package. 

"Thank God George Bush is our president." -Rudy Giuliani

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There is no controversy or mystery here -- people want Bill Clinton in the White House again.

I admire your honesty about it, although there is a little amendment to the Constitution in the way, but the point is, there's no controversy because hardly anyone is willing to speak honestly about what's happening here.

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No, everyone is speaking honestly about it. Everyone wants Clinton in the White House.

You're trying to stir up controversy where there is none.

I'm sure Drudge, if he hasn't already, will be stirring this pot soon enough. 

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Really? Link to one solid piece by a liberal or Dem-leaning commentator on the serious consitutional and governing issues involved in an ex-president getting back into power via his wife.

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Let's make sure we are talking about the same thing first. If what you are saying is that Bill is using Hill so he can be Pres in all but name, and that Hill has agreed to do this, we are not talking about the same thing.

What you need is sustained outrage...there's far too much unthinking respect given to authority. Molly Ivins

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Well, I may think Broder is a hack, but MGMax should be free to post it if it interests him, would you not agree?

All H.Clinton is going to have to do at the convention is ask the question, "are you better off now than you were 8 years ago?"

And the crowd goes wild...

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Well, I may think Broder is a hack, but MGMax should be free to post it if it interests him, would you not agree?

Well, yeah. Of course.

Did I ever once suggest Max or anyone else here shouldn't post? I don't understand why people insist on confusing criticism and debate with censorship.

That's Max's specialty, in fact. It's one of his tricks. Anytime anyone calls him on his bullshit, he cries about how liberals want to shut out dissenting views.

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You're just attacking me because I'm a woman!

Actually, I only complain (I never cry; I sit through Lassie movies untouched) when people misuse the rating system to try to make my posts invisible (or, at least, don't realize that inappropriate ratings can have that effect). And I make no apologies for insisting that people follow the rules and play fair. But otherwise, savage my views all you wish, and I'll swashbuckle with you to the top of the mizzenmast, but an alternative point of view never silenced anyone. And I certainly didn't take your disagreement with my post as doing so to me.

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We disagree about everything, Max, but I am glad we're united in this one respect (free speech), possibly the most important thing we can agree on, at least as far as the blog is concerned.

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My apologies, I don't mean to offend anyone.

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The press wondered over and over in March 2003, as we were on the eve on war with Iraq, if GWB had consulted with his father, GHWB. Eventually, GWB got exasperated and said he had consulted his 'other' Father.

Why do you suppose nobody in the Republican party had any trouble with either consultation, but now it's a problem with Bill and Hill?

What you need is sustained outrage...there's far too much unthinking respect given to authority. Molly Ivins

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First of all, my point is, it's not a problem because no one's talking about it.

Secondly, Bush fairly clearly broke with his dad, who also fairly clearly was really and truly retired. Bill Clinton, on the other hand, is obviously rarin' to go.

I wouldn't elect a living ex-president's son, but the situation clearly isn't the same in any case.

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Mgmax, that reminds me of a question I posed here in August: What would be the constitutionality of Bill being given a Cabinet position?

Bill is still awfully popular here and abroad, and one of his strongest points was his diplomacy. He would be a perfect fit for Secretary of State, but would it even be Constitutional? 

~~~~~~~~~~~

Come visit PROJECT: Lucidity
Where everybody knows your name...
unless you use a pseudonym

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I don't know why it wouldn't be - JFK named his brother as AG. Bill Clinton however, has said that he wants to continue his foundation work and help as needed and wanted. This was in Broder's own newspaper, it's a shame he has to spend so much time agonizing over the Clinton's marriage and doesn't have time to read it.

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Yes, but the AG is not in line for the Presidential Succession. Nor did RFK already serve as the President. It's completely different, with regards to the questions I posed. It had more to do with the Constitutionality of the Presidential Succession Act if Bill was appointed a Cabinet position.

~~~~~~~~~~~

Come visit PROJECT: Lucidity
Where everybody knows your name...
unless you use a pseudonym

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The Attorney General is in the line of presidential succession, as is most of the rest of the Cabinet. As for there being no precedent for an ex-president being in the White House, true, but then there's no precedent for anything before it happens the first time. There are precedents at the gubernatorial level.

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Henry Kissinger and Madeline Albright were both in line for the presidency despite being ineligible for the office, so I don't think that's an issue preventing cabinet service. It would simply skip them and go to the next one.

I would actually have far less objection to Clinton having a cabinet post than being a shadowy figure around Hillary, but I suspect Richard Holbrooke wouldn't be very happy about it...

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I was mistaken about the AG, thanks for correcting me on that. 

~~~~~~~~~~~

Come visit PROJECT: Lucidity
Where everybody knows your name...
unless you use a pseudonym

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Yes, you're perfectly correct, but if we're in the position that the government is scrambling at the cabinet level to find someone to serve, I think we'd probably be having more problems than constitutional eligibility, although it would be a very interesting discussion.

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From what I read somewhere, the only thing Bill cannot be is V-P, because the Pres and Vice Pres cannot be from the same state.

What you need is sustained outrage...there's far too much unthinking respect given to authority. Molly Ivins

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Also "no person constitutionally ineligible to the office of President shall be eligible to that of Vice-President of the United States." Clinton is ineligble to be president by the 22nd amendment. Some have argued around that but as a practical matter no president would choose a veep who couldn't take the job and thus pass it to the Speaker of whichever party happened to be in power then.

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Presidents can consult with whomever they please, former presidents included.  There aren't any constitutional issues involved.

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The smart ones do it all the time. Hell, Harry Shearer even has Dubya consulting with his earthly father every couple of weeks on Le Show.

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