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Where were you? (Sheldon's Lament)


In this Business Meeting of the Senate Judiciary Committee, Whitehouse called on Committee Republicans to explain their opposition to Dawn Johnsen to be Assistant Attorney General for the Justice Department's Office of Legal Counsel (OLC), after remaining silent during Bush's abuse of that office. His impassioned words make us really remember the high standard that American Justice once held, and how much it was destroyed by the Bush Administration.

The office of legal Counsel at the Department of Justice is a contender, and perhaps the lead contender, for the most rotten place in the United States government during the Bush administration. The rot ran deep, the rot is reflected in legal opinions that are so far below OLC's regular standard of scholarship, indeed so far below simple run of the mill levels of scholarship that a whole slew of them have already been withdrawn. It is a rarity for an OLC opinion to be withdrawn because it was wrong. Obviously they are constantly adjusted as case law changes going forward, but I can't recall anything like this ever having happened. The OLC was like a temple of scholarship within the Department of Justice. The notion that it would be the subject of a examination by the Office of Professional Responsibility of the Department of Justice, was before the Bush administration, unthinkable. And yet, there has been considerable stall, but sooner or later, and I hope soon, we will get the report from the Office of Professional Responsibility that looks into what has taken place.

For those of us who have taken a first hand look into those opinions, the spectacle we have seen has been appalling. Perhaps the most disgraceful example is the torture opinion, omitting any discussion whatsoever of a decision of the 5th circuit court of appeals of the United States of America, describing waterboarding, and repeating - I think it was 11 times in the opinion - describing it as torture, using the word torture.

Another area of historical research that completely eluded the Office of Legal Counsel in making these opinions. The Department of Justice has had some very dark days through the Bush Administration. The joy and relief with which Atty General Eric Holder was greeted when he came back to the Department, the sense that propriety has been restored, the bipartisan nature of that relief - has all been a very good thing. It has brought the Department of Justice back from some very dark days.

But the darkest part of those dark days is what became of the Office of Legal Counsel. And so I welcome this discussion. I think the more we discuss the Office of Legal Counsel and what took place during the Bush Administration, the better the American people will understand how previously proud agencies of their government were corrupted and turned to ideological pursuits. I hope we spend a lot of time on the floor discussing this because I think it is an important piece of America's learning and coming to grips with just how bad the interference with the integrity of government became in areas, that I said before, had been temples of scholarship. People who have been around the Depart of Justice just cannot accept, cannot believe, cannot countenance what took place there. The more you know the Department of Justice the more you know the reputation the Office of Legal Counsel had within that department and what became of it is shameful and disgraceful.

If there is a single irony in these proceedings that outdoes all of the other ironies, which are legion right now, it is my friends on the other side of this table who were silent through those long dark days of degradation of this proud office, now suddenly come forward and have discovered that they have concerns about partisanship or ideology or rule of law.

[looks directly at the republicans across the table]
Where were you when the problem was really acute? Where were you when these incompetent ideological opinions were being issued one after another? Where were the reassuring remarks after these opinions had to be withdrawn? What will they have to say when the OPR report comes out? It will be interesting to see all of this. And as I have said, the larger this debate gets, the better it is for America, and I can't tell you how much I look forward to energetically having this whole question thoroughly air out on the floor of the United Sates Senate before the American people.

For those who cannot see the video, Whitehouse's words were delivered with both frustration and yet a heartbreaking forlornness which is hard to describe. Being a former US Atty himself, his pain at seeing this degradation seems especially acute. Which brings me to the point of my post.

For a hypothetical, let's say you are a CIA interrogator. Let's say you are asked to do things that you know are torture. You know it down to your bones. You refuse stating ethical and legal reasons why. The admin then breaks down your ethical argument by laying the weight of another attack on your shoulders by your refusal. Let's say you still refuse, stating even if the ethical problems were abolished, there were still caselaw preventing torture. Now here is where it gets sticky.

Your CIA bosses give you a legal opinion from the OLC assuring you your actions are legal and you will be free from prosecution. As shown by Whitehouse's impassioned statements, most DOJers believed the OLC to be the first and last word for legal scholarship. But you could even say no to that, knowing that what you are doing is torture. But lets remember that this is the Bush Administration we are talking about. They outed a CIA agent, they put Don Siegleman behind bars, and don't even get me started on the US Atty scandal. All of this kind of makes you wonder just how intimidated the longtime CIA agents themselves were. I am not talking about Bush lackeys in the DOJ, I am talking about the career professionals, who, like Whitehouse, took pride in the rule of law.

This is just my hypothesis. I could be totally wrong. But I think Obama's reasons for not prosecuting the CIA interrogators could be something along those lines.


25 Comments

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Thanks for posting the video of Whitehead's remarks, mage. He's done the people of Rhode Island proud. Your hypothesis regarding the intimidation of CIA professionals is undoubtedly true to some extent, though I do not think it excuses such civil servants from caving in to what those persons perceive as being morally, ethically, or legally wrong.

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Absolutely miguel. But there are too many out there that are perfectly willing to pain both sadistic Bush CIAers and the loyal long time career CIAers with the same brush.

We need to keep our wits about us lest the angry mob mentality prevents real justice from happening.

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oops "paint".

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I think yours is an important voice in TPM discussions on this subject, Madge. If your thread disappears, would you post it again as Gregor did his? Thank you.

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cosign.

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Thanks guys.

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UPDATE:
You know how Whitehouse couldn't wait for the OPR investigation report? Saying it was "devastating". Apparently it is still devastating even after it has been watered down.

Can you believe that OPR let the OLC review the report? Then OPR made changes based on their comments? WTF???

Since when do the subjects of an investigation get to weigh in on the findings?

Durbin and Whitehouse question OPR's questionable review process.

Revisions by the torture trio Bybee, Bradbury and Yoo

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The degree of manipulation and calumny of legislators, CIA operatives, and the American people is so horrifying in its consequences that all of us will spend the rest of life in a sense of Shame at what has been to America, to its place in the world, to the humans forever "broken" by them, to our Constitution, and so on. It is gruesome to contemplate. Worse than killing is torture! It is a crime worse than murder.

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"Worse than killing is torture."
You are so right Thera. I think the video here is so striking to me because Whitehouse seems to express passionately what you have been saying - that we will spend the rest of our lives in shame at what has been done in our names. The rule of law justice, and freedom - the cornerstone of our nation - has been dealt a horrid blow.

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By the way, your title was the greatest!

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:) :)

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And one more thing must be added to your superb and eloquent essay: Read your last, long paragraph. And add this thought:

Psychologists used their professional authority to not only justify the use of torture "being safe," but to justify it in terms of how they described the personalities of people "needing to be tortured" because they were subhuman, different from us, but at time so strong of will that only torture would break them down.
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A very important point to note Thera, thanks!

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Thanks for the post.

I hope those Republicans that he speaks to are willing to examine their conscience, and do the right thing. I hope.

I am not optimistic, however, because we wouldn't be where we are now had our elected officials been more willing to listen to conscience. But maybe with the sunlight they'll wisen up.

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Excellent post, Mage...They say sunlight is the best disinfectant...we'll see.

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And people get upset because I referred to the Bush Regime as fascists. The compliance with the agenda of the Bush Regime was either voluntary or coerced, but an apt description of their actions is also known as a putsch, or a purge, to use a Stalinist era term. The government imprisoned a governor and the nation barely heard anything about it. The law was stood on its head as now recognized by members of both parties. I believe it those Republicans can honestly admit their actions were wrong and explain to the American people why they were wrong, we might bring the nation back together, where we could disagree, but still get along. Where we had some pride about having room for opposing opinions, rather then letting an urge to remove dissenters from the conversation overwhelm that fraternity.

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Thank you for posting the video. Whitehouse's *lament* was powerful and obviously completely sincere, as were Leahy's remarks.

I have what is probably a cynical take on the CIA. I can't help but wonder if they haven't always used extra-legal methods from time-to-time while those in charge looked the other way. It would be ever so easy to escalate the scale and/or severity if one were inured to the idea itself.

The bush administration carried torture beyond the spy agencies and expanded it into the rank and file military. If the CIA operatives shouldn't be punished, what about the Abu Gharib grunts who have already been hung out to dry? I have no doubt they were given at least tacit permission from Rummy through their direct commanders.

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I like Whitehouse (and have ever since I posted about him taking on the White House only to get trashed by TheraP and others).

"Your CIA bosses give you a legal opinion from the OLC assuring you your actions are legal and you will be free from prosecution."

Actually, that is a fiction. If you read the Bybee to Rizzo memo (which went to the CIA) there is no such "assurance".

If CIA officers or others abused the memo, that's not Bybee's fault unless he explicitly in other correspondence or conversation went much further than he did in Rizzo. Rizzo doesn't authorize anything much less offer a guarantee or "assurance". It looks at a specific narrow question in a specific narrow context, and reviews the situation.


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Actually eds, according to Jack Goldsmith in his book (see downthread) regarding the August 1, 2002 Yoo memo:

The opinion identified torture with acts that cause the amount of pain "associated with a sufficiently serious impairment of body functions." Any action that fell short of these extreme conditions could not, in the OLC's view, be torture. Even if the interrogators crossed this hard-to-reach line and committed torture, OLC opined, they could still avoid criminal liability by invoking a necessity defense (on the theory that torture may be necessary to prevent a catastrophic harm) or self-defense (on the theory that interrogators were acting to save the country and themselves). Finally, OLC concluded the torture law violated the President's constitutional commander-in-chief powers, and thus did not bind executive branch officials, because it prevented the President "from gaining the intelligence he believes necessary to prevent attacks upon the united states."

The message of the August 1, 2002 OLC opinion was indeed clear: violent acts aren't necessarily torture; if you do torture you probably have a defense; and even if you don't have a defense, the torture law doesn't apply if you act under color of presidential authority. CIA interrogators and their supervisors, under pressure to get information about the next attack, viewed the opinion as a "golden shield," as one CIA official later called it, that provided "enormous comfort."

Jack Goldsmith - The Terror Presidency - pg 143-144
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What's your point? Torture as defined amounts to "severe", so some standard is required. Misreading the memo, or lying about it, doesn't help progress. If you abandon all standards, as some critics do in service to their radical anti-pragmatism, there is no meaning except that supplied by the imagination.

Or are you just another knee-jerk stenographer who doesn't know his Yoo from her Bybee (and probably you aren't talking about the Rizzo memo anyway)?

Can we have some honesty around here please?

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Ok your comment made no sense. Mine however, did. Whether you believe Jack Goldsmith or not, obviously it is the Yoo memo he is talking about. It is also obvious that the 2002 Yoo memo (no one said anything about Bybee or Rizzo. Where did you come up with that?) had holes big enough to drive a truck through and Goldsmith had no choice to withdrawn them.

As Whitehouse said, it is "a rarity to withdraw an opinion because it was wrong"! But here it is and I thought I would offer Goldsmith's view of why he withdrew it.

So excuse me if you don't like information presented to you.

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Oh? I guess you don't pay attention to the comments to which you reply. I brought up Rizzo (CIA) and Bybee in the very comment to which you first replied above. It's very relevant to matters of the OLC and the CIA.

Which comment made no sense to you? If you would ask about my use of plain English directly, I'm sure I could clear it up for you.

It's one thing for Bybee to authorize something, it's another for Bybee to present a tempered analysis and for OTHER PEOPLE to abuse that and pretend that it was a shield.

You brought up what you say is a reference to Yoo. That's a non-sequitur, or you're trying to agree with my prior point which I've now explained a bit for you in case I guessed what your problem was.

??

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Looks like Ashcroft is one of the OTHER PEOPLE:

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/22/us/politics/22detain.html?pagewanted=3&_r=2&hpw

Rice fingers him as giving a blanket "it's okay, domestically and globally" to something. That goes a lot further than Bybee to Rizzo or Gonzalez did.

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I agree to a certain extent FDR. The CIA probably had used some "enhanced" techniques in the past. But I think they must have been passive compared to what they were now being asked to do.

Jack Goldsmith (former OLC head who withdrew the memos) pointed out in his book "The Terror Presidency" CIA interrogators were flabbergasted at what they were asked to do by their superiors. And wanted a "Golden Shield" to protect them legally.

If it is as you say, that methods "outside" were routinely used in the past, how much more horrid were the acts they were ordered to perform?

Goldsmith writes on page 151-152

My bosses considered interrogation of detainees with knowledge of al Qaeda's plans to be the most effective way to prevent the next attack. The program "is worth more than [what] the FBI, the Central Intelligence Agency and the NSA purt together have been able to tell us," George Tenet would later claim, expressing the view that permeated the executive branch during my time in office. The program had been approved by the National Security Council, legally blessed by the Attorney General, and briefed to congressional leadership. But the entire interrogation edifice was built on the OLC opinions, and might collapse if I withdrew them.

So a CIA interrogator could very easily question his own judgment with so many different agencies appearing to give their blessing.

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A masterful presentation. Sheldon Whitehouse is expressing eloquently the frustration that most of us feel. I have to wonder, though--where was HE? Where were they all when it was obvious to almost everyone that throughout the Bush years the DOJ and the Office of Legal Counsel were following a radically ideological path that didn't jibe with American standards?

Again--how could this happen in America in the 21st Century? I sound like a broken record, I knew, but it's just stunning to me that we've come this low in so short a time. Every person in congress had to know what was happening in the DOJ and, other than slap a few hands, they did nothing.

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