When Those Tanks Come Marchin' In
Shacks, put up by the Bonus Army on the Anacostia flats, Washington, DC, burning after the battle with the military, 1932.
Rutherford B. Hayes kind of out maneuvered poor Tilden in the presidential election of 1876. There have been those who claim there was a 'deal' struck with the South that would end Reconstruction. That in return for putting a Republican back in the White House following the second term of President Grant, the troops would be pulled out of the South permanently.
Personally, I feel that the repubs just wanted to get back to 'business' anyway. It was Grant and some other moral forces in his administration that had followed through on the promises of the Radical Republicans before and after Lincoln that kept the old Confederacy from reinslaving the African Americans.
There had been Black Congressmen elected to office in the South. Judges included ex slaves. There was a real change a comin' and it all vanished in a flash.
The Posse Comitatus Act is a United States federal law (18 U.S.C. § 1385) passed on June 18, 1878, after the end of Reconstruction, with the intention (in concert with the Insurrection Act of 1807) of substantially limiting the powers of the federal government to use the military for law enforcement. The Act prohibits most members of the federal uniformed services (today the Army, Air Force, and State National Guard forces when such are called into federal service) from exercising nominally state law enforcement, police, or peace officer powers that maintain "law and order" on non-federal property (states and their counties and municipal divisions) within the United States. The statute generally prohibits federal military personnel and units of the National Guard under federal authority from acting in a law enforcement capacity within the United States, except where expressly authorized by the Constitution or Congress. The Coast Guard is exempt from the Act during peacetime. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posse_Comitatus_Act
The purpose of the Posse Comitatus Act ostensibly was to get the Federales out of the South. But it also served to curb presidential power per his position as Commander In Chief of the Armed Forces.
WWI veterans were camping out at our capital in 1932. There
was quite a protest over the terrible way they had been treated by their
country. It was in the midst of the depression before FDR.
MacArthur was the Army Chief of Staff and spouted that this protest represented a communist uprising.
Conspicuously led by MacArthur, Army troops (including Major George S. Patton, Jr.) formed infantry cordons and began pushing the veterans out, destroying their makeshift camps as they went. Although no weapons were fired, cavalry advanced with swords drawn, and some blood was shed. By nightfall, hundreds had been injured by gas (including a baby who died), bricks, clubs, bayonets, and sabers. http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/amex/macarthur/peopleevents/pandeAMEX89.html
This is an interesting article, implying that MacArthur actually disobeyed direct orders. And the incident involved Ike as well as Patton. But this was the most bothersome part of the article:Although many Americans applauded the government's action as an unfortunate but necessary move to maintain law and order, most of the press was less sympathetic. "Flames rose high over the desolate Anacostia flats at midnight tonight," read the first sentence of the "New York Times" account, "and a pitiful stream of refugee veterans of the World War walked out of their home of the past two months, going they knew not where."
The public appeared to 'buy it'. A strong press demurred.
But here is the quiz of the day.
Who do you think recently desired to settle 130 years of settled law and send the Armed Forces into action on our soil?
Well, if I had never read the following article I would have guessed Dick Cheney.
And guess what? I would have been correct.
Top Bush administration officials in 2002 debated testing the Constitution by sending American troops into the suburbs of Buffalo to arrest a group of men suspected of plotting with Al Qaeda, according to former administration officials. Some of the advisers to President George W. Bush, including Vice President Dick Cheney, argued that a president had the power to use the military on domestic soil to sweep up the terrorism suspects, who came to be known as the Lackawanna Six, and declare them enemy combatants.
w demurred. Thank the good Lord. (really blesses himself this time)
Now the second part of my quiz would be:
On what legal basis did our ex Vice-President rely upon to buttress his wish for a Military State?
Why our favor OLC including Yoo and Gonzales and all the boys with a Memorandum of Law:
"The president has ample constitutional and statutory authority to deploy the military against international or foreign terrorists operating within the United States," the memorandum said.
The memorandum -- written by the lawyers John C. Yoo and Robert J. Delahunty -- was directed to Alberto R. Gonzales, then the White House counsel, who had asked the department about a president's authority to use the military to combat terrorist activities in the United States. http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/25/us/25detain.html?_r=1&src=twt&twt=nytimes
If you think we are all in deep doo doo now, think about how bad we could be off at this point in time.
Still, at least one high-level meeting was convened to debate the issue, at which several top Bush aides argued firmly against the proposal to use the military, advanced by Mr. Cheney, his legal adviser David S. Addington and some senior Defense Department officials.
Oh and there is our friend Addington again. Isn't he a picture of patriotism. I have despised this asshat since his first appearance on cable news. He has testified before Congress and shown nothing but distain for our entire Constitutional Government.
To be fair to w's administration:
Among those in opposition were Condoleezza Rice, then the national security adviser; John B. Bellinger III, the top lawyer at the National Security Council; Robert S. Mueller III, the director of the Federal Bureau of Investigation; and Michael Chertoff, then the head of the Justice Department's criminal division.
And there, by the way, is Robert Mueller. As time goes on I have more and more respect for this guy. If you recall he was the one who ordered to guards standing in front of Ashcroft's hospital bed to prevent Gonzales and Card from entering until the acting Attorney General showed up. Remember w was seeking extension of an illegal order for wiretaps without warrant. But that is another story.
Director Robert Mueller along with the then Acting Attorney General James B. Comey offered to resign from office in March 2004 if the White House overruled a Department of Justice ruling which concluded that warrantless domestic wiretapping was unconstitutional.[8] Attorney General John D. Ashcroft refused to intervene in attempts by White House Chief of Staff Andrew Card and then White House Counsel Alberto R. Gonzales to waive this ruling and permit the domestic warrantless eavesdropping program to proceed. Former President George W. Bush ultimately gave his support to making changes to the program on March 12, 2004, thereby defusing a crisis there.[8]
I know this is healthcare day. A lot of blogs on this issue.
But this story was another example of how close we all were as American Citizens to living under a military dictatorship. With no Constitutional Rights whatsoever. It underlines to me anyway, what a precarious world we really live in. Almost as if all our rights are only on paper and how any yahoo or Yoo anyway, can take a scissors and destroy all our assumptions about democracy, and divided government.
That is local, State and Federal Governments. Executive, Legislative and Judicial Branches of all those governments. Checks and balances as they say.
And we could have all woken up one morning and seen a couple of Army Tanks outside our homes. I can picture a nice Captain crawling out of a tank and greeting the curious neighbors. JUST KEEPING THE PEACE MAAM.
Everybody would indeed be so friendly. All the cable channels would begin with a Pledge of Allegiance, carefully keeping the phrase 'Under God.'
After reading all of these health blogs over the last month it really strikes me that there is another underlying story going on here.
We are witnessing Democracy at work. Thousands upon thousands of pages of bills and addendums and appendices are floating around. Our representatives are arguing and arm twisting and sometimes ranting and raving for change. Of course the repubs are sitting on the sidelines telling us how Democracy never will work and real change for the people is only a dream.
I don't know. I just was struck by this New York Times Article. It really scared the bejeesus out of me.
Cheney and Yoo and Addington really represent the true Enemies of the People. An extremely evil group of men who would undue 230 years of real democratic progress in this country.
They should be prosecuted for what they have done.
But the real story of some of the things THEY WANTED TO DO must be aired so that the people understand what catastrophes might have actually occurred.
I will tell you this. As long as Barack Obama is sitting in the oval office, I believe, deep down inside my very soul, that a military coupe is out of the question.
Four years, eight years from now, WHO KNOWS?
















Yahoo or Yoo-whoo?
Oy! That got a bellylaugh.
What I don't understand is, how I can laugh in the face of such unsettling stuff, Dickon.
Indeed, that Cheney creature needs to be in some leg irons. For treason.
Cheney, et al, were and are traitors to the United States of America and it is far past time to hold them accountable.
July 25, 2009 7:31 PM | Reply | Permalink
Now there ya go Bwak. You have more than a hold of the subject matter!!!!!
ack ack ack
July 25, 2009 9:34 PM | Reply | Permalink
To be fair to the military, the coup would have been by a gang of chickenhawk neocon thugs misusing the military for their own agenda.
July 25, 2009 7:37 PM | Reply | Permalink
Absolutely Bluebell. Yes. And as we have seen, there were resignations of military personnel in the wake of other misconduct by our leaders.
July 25, 2009 9:37 PM | Reply | Permalink
Your mind works in mysterious ways, Dickon. But that it works, I have no doubt. Rec'd.
July 25, 2009 8:08 PM | Reply | Permalink
Mind? WHAT MIND!!!
July 25, 2009 9:40 PM | Reply | Permalink
LisB I cannot get in the chatroom today.
July 25, 2009 10:05 PM | Reply | Permalink
DD, this is scary stuff--but you have a way of making it read like The NYT as told by Will Rogers.
Chris Matthews, et al, could never say THIS was dry stuff. They might even learn something--think I'll pass it on.
July 25, 2009 8:29 PM | Reply | Permalink
PASS IT ON!!! Good as always to see ya Ramona.
July 25, 2009 9:41 PM | Reply | Permalink
Here is my question: What is in place to stop Executive crimes? We are just finding out now that Cheney wanted this. What if he had done it?
Would it be as bad as torturing people? Would it be as bad as giving fake reasons for our country to start a pre-emptive war on another country (innocent of the accusations)?
What were the consequences?
How was our Constitution upheld?
So, if he had used the army in one state or another, who here believes that there would have been consequences?
The President signs a law into being and then, behind his back, signs a "statement" that he really doesn't need to pay attention to it.
The VP states that he is not really in the Executive Branch and is never officially refuted for that.
Are we a nation of laws or not? I think things have gone too far, and that Obama doesn't want to rein it back, and I don't know why. We seem to have no recourse. What can we do?
Impeachment? Only for blowjobs when a bunch of powermad crazies have the power.
If Bush/Cheney were not impeached, I am certain there will never be a justified impeachment.
July 25, 2009 9:25 PM | Reply | Permalink
The long time problem of a lack of enforcing the law in DC and for the wealthy has been overlooked but now is staring us starkly in the face.
I have never before witnessed such extensive crimes perpetrated by the highest offices of our land nor such absolute disdain for enforcing the law concerning these crimes. It shows how much power they still wield and THAT is extremely disconcerting.
As I wrote to Bush/Cheney during the vote in the senate about going to war in Iraq. They were and apparently still are tyrants.
July 25, 2009 11:21 PM | Reply | Permalink
This started off as a simple short comment, and drifted into a review of the growth of the right-wing political infection of America since Nixon. It's really just a collection of my thoughts that have been set off by this post and thread. But it's 5:50 am and I've been up since 10:00 am yesterday, so I'm not sure if it's creativity, analysis or insanity. Or a little of all three.
Anyway, it starts with the corruption of the Warren G. Harding administration. Dick Day has superbly covered the attack on the Veterans. Almost everything that matters in the last century really goes directly back to the Great War and its aftermath, since WW I changed the nature of both Western Civilization and of the World so very much.
We are still living with those changes, as the invasion of the strange and awkward British-created amalgam we still call Iraq, the Middle East in general, the USSR and its still unsettled aftermath, Communist China, modern India and Africa and the end of all the Empires except those of Russia and China all demonstrate. Oh, and add to that the fact that modern Mexico is still a direct outgrowth of the the Revolution of 1910 - 1920. But let's look at modern political America now.
The Teapot Dome scandal during the Warren G. Harding administration had financial corruption similar to that of the Bush administration, but not, as far as I know, the efforts to create a tyrannical government in the way that Cheney/Addington/Yoo/Gonzales implemented. Nor was there the level of political activity by fundamentalists that we have seen since the Reagan administration saw the alliance between the fundamentalists of the Christian Coalition and the John Birchers/Wall Street free marketers/Post Nixonites/Libertarians. Nor do I think the military were as lionized during the post WW I period as they have been since the Reagan administration. Instead the atmosphere was much more anti-war back in the Warren Harding period.
Consider the recent Wall Street Journal that stated that one-third of all wages paid went to executives, and the fact that (as you mentioned) the rule of law is no longer applied to the wealthy, powerful and to top government officials, and America is in one Mell of a Hess right now.
I think that America has just been through a very scary three, perhaps four decades. Whether it is over yet, I don't know. There are a lot of people who don't want it to be. Wingnuts, secessionists, anti-abortion extremists, Sarah Palinists and other Evangelicals, Free Market crackpots, ideological descendants of John Birchers, and NeoCons abound. Here in Texas Governor Rick Perry is running for reelection again in 2010 by picking up the crackpot rhetoric from Ron Paul. Ron Paul represented the extremist right-wing of the Republican Party, and that's where Perry is currently mining for votes. (That's for the Republican primary in which not many of the growing number of voting Texas Hispanics will vote. He'll have to shift if he wins the primary, which seems likely.)
Fortunately I think that those people generally have proven pretty conclusively to a majority of American voters outside the South and Texas that they are incompetent at effectively running a government. The Republican leadership in Congress is depending on the failure of Obama to deal with the economic crisis, which is why they also have to defeat him on health care reform. If Obama wins either of those bets, the national Republican party is doomed and the semi-rational leaders know it. Their only possible bet is pure obstructionism.
Have I left out any significant groups of right-wing whackos? Those are the players. So what are the social forces that are driving them? They have rather diverse demands, so it took some special circumstances for them to go into the alliance they have had since the Reagan administration.
In looking at that collection of misfits, I think it was primarily a reaction to the Civil Rights movement (Nixon's Southern Strategy), then to the anti-Vietnam war protesters, and to the social changes brought about by the birth control pill that caused them to ally with each other during the Cold War. Now that the Cold War is clearly over and the nation has adapted to the civil rights movement (as well as adding women's rights and GLBT rights)and birth control has become just part of the normal landscape, a lot of what held that alliance together has died away. The evangelicals were a relatively late addition to that mix, but they were the key to electing Bush in 2000. Now they, too, are becoming less of a political force in much of the US. That was Rove's great contribution. (Sadly it has not yet died away here in Texas where the christianists still dominate our State politics.)
The shift of the media from news to entertainment and to political propaganda has been very noticeable, but I think it was more of a secondary result of other basic political, technological and economic changes. Those media changes should be pretty close to the nadir of their descent. That's just my current guess, though. I'll be looking for indicators of a change in trends. Fox and the right-wing propagandist radio shock-jocks will be the last to change. But didn't I hear that Clear Channel Radio was looking at bankruptcy?
With luck the elections of 2006 and 2008 may represent the beginnings of the reversal of all the negative trends. But if they do, the situation is still in flux and could be reversed if the economy does a big second dip. The passage of the health care reform will also be a strong impetus towards an improved American political climate, since it will actually show a lot of Americans that the government can actually do something positive for Americans and doesn't entirely belong to the wealthy conservative oligarchs. The media is (as usual) missing the real story on what the Democratic health care reform will mean. I think Dr. Michael Porter (Harvard) understands how it really will lower runaway medical costs, but the mechanisms are not something that the CBO can measure. (I've blogged about his Here. Dr. Porter lays it out rather clearly in the video and I summarized a lot of what he had to say before the video. Then I added my opinion after. Just as Detroit could not predict the actual cost of installing safety devices in autos, the CBO can't evaluate the real savings of universal health care with a revised form of measurement of medical outcomes.)
And if you have gotten this far you are a glutton for punishment. This really is the "interesting times" of the old Chinese curse, and we really are living through them. Welcome to the time between the dynasties. Thanks to all of you for this excellent article and outstanding thread of comments. I love the insights you guys are throwing out.
July 26, 2009 7:48 AM | Reply | Permalink
The VP states that he is not really in the Executive Branch and is never officially refuted for that."
CVille this is a very well related comment. I just have to cackle at this sentence. hahhaah
I do not know. It looks like the Prez answers to no one.
Very fine comment though, could have used it as another page of this essay. Every word.
July 25, 2009 9:47 PM | Reply | Permalink
The title along dredged a cartoon image from my brain of battalions of tanks rolling along, marching along, waltzing along--even tip-toeing along. Of course I couldn't find it, but I found something a little along the line of that. For you DD. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHFu8Cos7Zg
July 25, 2009 9:58 PM | Reply | Permalink
This is great Amike. They knew how to make cartoons in those days. great link.ha!!!
July 25, 2009 10:19 PM | Reply | Permalink
Thanks dickday, very well said.There are three levels of evil to Cheney, level one is the laws we know he broke and have evidence,level two is the laws that we have indication he broke but are still trying to prove, level three are laws that he desired to break but was impeded by decent men.
What you discuss here is on level three and may be more frightening than the other two.Had he succeeded in using the military on American soil this would have led to an armed uprising and further repercussions we really don't want to think about.Throughout history we have seen Cheneys' type before, he have fit in well with the Third Reich cabal.In another country where he might have faced less restraint,can you imagine the evil he could have inflicted on that people and mankind? Another thing that bothers me is that he has defenders which I can not understand
July 25, 2009 11:06 PM | Reply | Permalink
You got it DonDi. And as I pointed out, dickyc did not even have problems finding allies for his cabal but he found 'sound legal reasoning' And as CVille points out, he would have defended himself at the war crimes trial by saying he was only an advisor and not even part of the executive branch.
July 25, 2009 11:22 PM | Reply | Permalink
He has people who support him and who hand his daughter a microphone on a national stage. Deplorable. Whenever she is on, I change the channel. She carries zero weight on anything. Assistant Deputy something? Big F&cking Deal.
July 26, 2009 1:15 AM | Reply | Permalink
Air time. That is all it takes.
I mean that fox segment shown a few days ago with the 'guest' saying that it is a damn shame that Al Qaida will not attack us now. And the interviewer just agreeing with him.
This is a war. A real war. Battles going on everyday over what kind of country we wish to live in.
I should have added something about the Romans here.
They had a law that the troops NEVER ENTER ROME. Of course they broke the law several times.
But it underlines the real issue here.
July 26, 2009 1:21 AM | Reply | Permalink
It is indeed. All the bipartisan postpartisan stuff that so many want to believe is just not possible when you are confronting the likes of Cheney. Sure, we may be able to negotiate on healthcare with Chuck Grassley but we MUST STOP "NEGOTIATING" AWAY OUR CIVIL LIBERTIES.
(Aside: Hillary would you just shut the f**k up on your macho saber rattling to David Gregory. You sound like Dick Cheney. Stop trying to out neo-con the neo-cons).
July 26, 2009 10:21 AM | Reply | Permalink
I had to ponder this some more Bluebell. I am sick and tired of negotiating Civil Rights. Forget patent or latent racism for a minute.
The First Ten Amendments to the United States Constitution only applied to the relationship between the individual and the Federal Government and the individual states and the Federal Government.
It really was not until the 1930's that the Supreme Court began to apply the rights contained therein to individuals in the sense that the states could not abrogate those rights. So that the individuals rights were not dependent upon their location within these United States.
It was a long and challenging road. Remember 'impeach Earl Warren'? This was the chant of the South as well as conservatives across the country.
People did not wish to see all citizens being granted the rights stated in our Constitution.
And after all these fights, and after all of the legislation supporting this change in the Judicial Approach to individual rights, cheney and w and all their cohorts just declare...
WELL THAT WAS THEN AND THIS IS NOW
Just as they treated our International Treaties.
THESE ARE JUST WORDS AND WE HAVE A LOT OF OTHER WORDS SO F..K YOU.
All this law, all of these cases, all of the legislation....
And after all, people are in charge and some of them just feel they can do whatever they wish.
This really bothers me.
July 26, 2009 5:27 PM | Reply | Permalink
You got it.
I'm no lawyer, but it seems to me that laws become mere words when they are not enforced by the Rule of Law. The reason we have independent courts is to evaluate if the law is being enforced.
The connection of the law to behavior in English law makes the concept of stare decisis critical. When the court determines what actions are controlled by the law and that determination is upheld at the Appeals Court level, then the specific facts and behavior the court says the law controls in one case becomes precedent after that. In effect, that initial determination that a certain patter of behavior is controlled by the law becomes itself an extension of the law.
In Yoo's case he read what the law said and considered that to be just words that he could interpret as he wished. That, in my non-expert opinion, amounts to incompetence in Yoo's application of law and precedent to the events in Bush's executive department.
Such incompetence was why the Bush people used Yoo in the first place. He allowed them to violate the Rule of Law with appearing to do so. But that should be no surprise in the Bush administration. The want the outcome they want, and have no patience for getting there by any particular process that might block them from getting instant gratification.
A more anti-democratic process cannot be found. But that is the nature of authoritarianism. It is monarchism, rule by authority of God, or Cheney's execuitive control of all government functions.
July 26, 2009 8:59 PM | Reply | Permalink
Who would have thought that our democracy could be so fragile, that an ignorant frat boy and an paranoid power monger could have come so close to laying us low, not that they didn't succeed on some level with the warrantless wiretaps, suspension of habeas corpus, extraordinary rendition, enhanced interrogation, et al. F#ck the bozos DD.
July 25, 2009 11:14 PM | Reply | Permalink
Not to mention the economic malpractice and manipulating via deceit the need to go to war, we really have no idea how far their destruction and abuse reaches.
July 25, 2009 11:24 PM | Reply | Permalink
Yeah, I can go along with that Miguel!!!
SOMEBODY SHOULD BE CALLED UPON TO ANSWER THESE QUESTIONS.
July 25, 2009 11:27 PM | Reply | Permalink
DD,
I don't believe this country will make it unless we, as people start to come together and become more active. We must be greater participants which is simply upon us. No invitation needed. We have a right to be at the table but we have show up and sit in the seat.
July 25, 2009 11:26 PM | Reply | Permalink
Yes Sync. THEY will do whatever they think they can get away with.
July 25, 2009 11:32 PM | Reply | Permalink
Dick Cheney was a director of the Council on Foreign Relations.
Think Dick, David Rockefeller, and the other Wall St Masters of the Universe ever discussed eliminating the annoyance of representative democracy?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XOAk-7F1EVU
July 25, 2009 11:35 PM | Reply | Permalink
Maurice "Hank" Greenberg was the head of the CFR at the time Cheney was a director.
Between the two they might have been able to bring about a catalyzing event, like a new Pearl Harbor:
http://theinfounderground.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=5367
July 25, 2009 11:39 PM | Reply | Permalink
Thanks for the links Bill. We just squeaked through some very perilous times. At least I think we made it for now!!!
July 25, 2009 11:51 PM | Reply | Permalink
Thanks for a great post, DD - I have so many problems knowing I voted for Bush/Cheney back when I was so gullible. I didn't use what is left of my brain to reason out things and am so damn grateful that now I can see that pair for what they are...............
July 26, 2009 12:14 AM | Reply | Permalink
Its over now. Besides who knew such goings on were going on? ha!!!!!!!!
A lot of lies. A lot of cover up. A lot of help from the mainstream media
July 26, 2009 12:17 AM | Reply | Permalink
Dick, a big problem I have with Obama is that leaving the door wide, wide open to a future declaration of martial law, is not much different from declaring martial law himself.
It's accessory before the fact, or whatever.
Obama was here during the Bush/Cheney years also, he's a constitutional scholar, and he knows damn well the temptations, past, present and future, for powerful people in America to end whatever is left of our democracy.
He knows it damn well, and any future dictatorship can be blamed in large part on Obama.
Speaking of the WWI veterans, listen to this BBC Radio broadcast on the secret military coup that was planned at that time, which planned to employ those bitter veterans to declare martial law.
Even Prescott Bush seems to be one of the coup plotters!! Go figure!! Nazi funding bastards tried to bring the Third Reich here, and they still are...
http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/history/document/document_20070723.shtml
July 26, 2009 12:37 AM | Reply | Permalink
Oh yes Bill. But good link. Never heard this before.
We had that Father Coughlin (spell) on the radio during the thirties spouting Nazi bullshit until FDR shut him down. There was Lindberg.
And even today, people like Pat Buchanan claim we fought on the wrong side in WWII. Openly make this claim. ha!!!
July 26, 2009 1:00 AM | Reply | Permalink
It could still happen, Obama hasn't seemed to be very interested in reversing Bush policy in these regards.
Did you see this dickday?
http://www.armytimes.com/news/2008/09/army_homeland_090708w/
July 26, 2009 2:20 AM | Reply | Permalink
Hey Dude, now you are scarin the bejeesus out of me.
JESUS H. CHRIST (blesses himself)
I got to go over this link again in the morn.
I cannot figure out WHERE THIS IS TAKING PLACE!!!
Thank you for this link.
July 26, 2009 2:31 AM | Reply | Permalink
A couple brigades aren't going to be enough to declare martial law for a country as big as ours. absent massive cooperation by local law enforcement as well.
If the move is done as part of something the public distrusts, there's no way in hell all our cops and all our military could enforce iron discipline over a nation of 320 million people, many of whom are well armed and trained in battle by the US government, before being kicked to the curb with no benefits. We couldn't even control a country of 28 million with the gloves taken off. How could anyone hope to utilize a military takeover of America that would be any more successful is beyond me.
I suspect this is exactly what it appears to be - active-duty units being used to supplement the national guard for the reasons stated. When I was active-duty Navy, we were pivotal to the success of the Hurricane Andrew relief efforts, along with the Army and Marines. I think it is useful to remember that the military is made up of the sons and daughters of the grassroots.
The idea that they would come down full bore on American citizens is fairly remote.
July 26, 2009 12:26 PM | Reply | Permalink
Jason, thank you for adding to the commentary. I had to digest your comment.
Hopefully, and the sanest conclusion here, is that there are training exercises going on every day. Within our boundaries.
I see a big difference in sending the Army/Air Force into a suburb of Buffalo, NY. THIS IS NUTS.
It never took place. Thank the Good Lord (And I mean that sincerely)
July 26, 2009 5:35 PM | Reply | Permalink
We keep getting all this info about just how debauched the Cheney Administration was. It's all news to us. And we really don't know if what we are being told is " the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but..."
For example, we recently discovered that the CIA had some program that was kept secret from Congress and our new Pres and the present CIA Director. We are then told by Cheney's secret government itself that this program was an effort to establish squads to assassinate Al Qaeda leaders.
First question for me was: "Why in the world would the CIA (and Cheney) deem this to be so controversial as to require that it be held close as a secret operation?"
There is no logical answer. And so the second question I had is: "What is the REAL program they were trying to conceal?"
We do not have the answer to that, and our MSM is busy pursuing the matter solely on the assumption that they have NOW been told the truth; that the story begins and ends with a program concerned with the assassination of Al Qaeda leaders.
We somehow pretend that we know all the awful truths about the Cheney Era. We now know they authorized waterboarding, for example, and the whole discussion about Cheney's culpability for authorizing torture centers around whether or not waterboarding is torture. But in deflecting the attention in this way, Cheney and his secretive friends have eliminated any further media investigation into what other means of torture might have been authorized/used. After all, over 100 detainees died while in custody. How many died from waterboarding? How many died as a result of other torture techniques being used?
I remain concerned that we have barely scratched the surface on what is to be known about this diabolical asshat and his insane policies and actions as our Vice President. At a minimum, we have no basis to think we have even come close to discovering the most egregious acts of Cheney & Co., even though what we know is bad enough.
Rather than continuing to wait for the stories to leak out and then be spun by the CIA and others, it would be far better to get aggressively proactive in determining just how far afield these jackasses went in claiming Constitutional authority to do whatever they damn well pleased. That begins by convening a meaningful Congressional Inquiry or a Commission with subpoena powers to ask questions and get answers.
Relying upon Cheney to get us the truth is like asking a mugger the directions home. You will undoubtedly get a response from each, but neither response will be enlightening or productive. Guaranteed!
July 26, 2009 3:23 AM | Reply | Permalink
"First question for me was: "Why in the world would the CIA (and Cheney) deem this to be so controversial as to require that it be held close as a secret operation?"
I thought the same thing. It gnaws at me. I remember hearing that doug feith had been given an assignment...answer this question: Where is the best place for us to go to war and win? And he came up with a South American country. Of course this was the dumbest fricking person Tommy Thompson ever met. hahahaha
Why would I come to the conclusion that leaders have been killed by this assassination squad? Because the Nixon Administration was so good at this. And they killed people. And this was a continuation of the Nixon Administration.
Besides, the repubs were saying we only waterboarded 3 people. Oh and by the by, 100 people died in captivity. So of course I do not believe three people were 'tortured' and I do not believe that only 100 people died in captivity. hahahahaha
The problem is that the New Administration as well as other Dems seem afraid to open up the entire mess.
Boy Sleepin', my head is whirling right now. Between you and Richardxxx, amazing takes on this. Really...
July 26, 2009 8:56 AM | Reply | Permalink
Dickday, if you wanted to scare the shit out of me, you have succeeded.
I can remember when Nixon was facing impeachment and called for the TV networks to present his speech that night. I expected him to announce that the 101st Airborne was surrounding the Congress and that the Congressman were to be kept out of attending deliberation. Instead he announced his resignation. I still don't know why. It wasn't his "democratic" nature. I mentioned this to a few people I knew, and everyone looked at me strangely.
But Nixon had no Cheney, Addington and Yoo as far as I know. Also the military was then not politicized in the way it is today. Instead it was still led by Generals who looked back to WW II and most of the John birchers and MacArthur types has been retired. Those are long gone now, replaced by many Generals who vaguely remember a politicized version of Vietnam and others who are infected by fundamentalist evangelical christianism (especiallythe Air force.) You convince me that I was correct.
I wonder how many other times we have come this close to total tyranny since the Civil War. It would make a good Master's degree thesis, except that no committee would accept it and it would never be publishable. Anyone who tried to publish it would never be permitted to go on to a Ph.D.
July 26, 2009 6:00 AM | Reply | Permalink
Richard you have covered so many things in your two comments. All of which is consistent with my thoughts.
w's administration was truly a continuation of Nixon's Administration--with brass balls. Cheney was there and said this time, no tapes, this time no documents will be released, this time no one will testify....
cheney and rummy working in concert; truly a wonder to behold.
Thanks for adding much to this discussion.
I have no idea how close we have come to dictatorship.
I know that for almost eight years all of our emails, all of our telephone conversations...they all ended up being analyzed by some computer somewhere.
How much this situation has abated is anybody's guess.
July 26, 2009 9:24 AM | Reply | Permalink
When one day I explain George Bush to my kids, all I'll need is this.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YVynnbx1Xsc
Sums him up pretty well.
Great post, Dick!
July 26, 2009 7:20 AM | Reply | Permalink
That about says it all Obey. Never saw w do that before. AND HE WAS THE MODERATE IN ALL OF THIS!!!!
He looked stupid, he acted stupid, he talked stupid and the American People voted for him. And dont give me that 'he lost by the popular vote' stuff. Any time that many millions vote for an idiot it says something about our country.
See, your video gets me mad on a Sunday when I am supposed to be in church. hahahahahaha
July 26, 2009 9:01 AM | Reply | Permalink
One can see from his hair that was years before he was elected President. It was an immature boy upset someone was telling him what to do, and that never changed, even years later. He did not like Congress or the Constitution teeling him what to do. He really enjoyed that little "one-fingered victory salute" But what did he win?!?
July 27, 2009 2:16 AM | Reply | Permalink
Hey Gregor. It's actually from after his election win in 2000. In the clip he calls it his one-finger 'victory sign'. That's what victory meant to him - 'fuck y'all'.
First saw it in the news overseas. Never got much play in the States, it seems. I mean, who wants to see their president give them the finger? And what responsible media outlet would let people see what their new president thinks of them...?
July 27, 2009 7:47 AM | Reply | Permalink
Thanks for setting me straight. Gawd, wha a disappointment to be represented by a frat boy with no sense of decorum whatsoever and to have a large segment of our population proud of him. It seems like such a long time ago, but yet, not so long I wouldn't want to see him prosecuted along with his cohorts.
July 28, 2009 1:52 AM | Reply | Permalink
When I saw the other day that Cheney was in favor of this I barely raised an eyebrow. He and Bush broke so many laws that the DOJ and congress have decided to ignore there isn't much point in even blogging about it. Except for a short comment in my personal journal I see no point in wasting my time writing about something that everyone knows. Given the loss of life and everything else that is part of this I am informed beyond any doubt we have a criminal enterprise running this country. No sane person could conclude otherwise. We have been witness to the greatest instance of dereliction of duty in history.
July 26, 2009 8:23 AM | Reply | Permalink
The regulators, the Fed, Pentagon procurement....
Everything is rotten in Denmark. There is no clean portion of government.
And I do not know how many fronts can be challenged at one time. Even if Superman were president.
It gets kind of depressing.
July 26, 2009 9:14 AM | Reply | Permalink
Unless they honestly examine this and decide they are going to commit to getting the basics of having a substantially honest government, none of what we are fighting for will ever happen. It is a factually dishonest statement from our lawmakers when they say all the money currently being heaped on their political campaigns doesn't have an influence. It is absurd for them to take that position and is a huge insult to every citizen of this country. This is particularly true when you examine all the polling that says a significant majority of voters want this but so many of our legislators are hedging on their support. This is in your face dishonesty all the way. And the money argument is bullshit when you contrast the healthcare issue with the money they poured into the banking system along with the additional dollars that are potentially committed.
July 26, 2009 10:51 AM | Reply | Permalink
I do not mean to take up too much of your time, but this money issue.......
I get so damn mad everytime I hear it. There is more wealth in this country than is even fairly reported. I would just like a flat tax at the top. No credits, no deductions. HOW MUCH DID YOU MAKE? Well then you owe this.
And I would like to see a value added tax on sales of all stocks, bonds, warrants...whatever. Due upon sale. No exceptions.
We would bring in so much money that people making 100 grand a year would pay nothing.
Never gonna happen.
July 26, 2009 11:40 AM | Reply | Permalink
Dick, if I recall correctly, you are a lawyer, right? Lawyers tend to place a lot of faith in written words, such as our Constitution. In reality, though, those words are written on pieces of paper. When we get a dictator, and history teaches that will always be the eventuality, that dictator will tear up the pieces of paper.
July 26, 2009 9:44 AM | Reply | Permalink
Well Faroff, you are not that far off as far as I am concerned.
I am not an attorney now but I did practice for twenty five years at the lowest of levels. ha
The problem is that words can be construed any damn way these days. John Yoo has proven this. Well it says that the citizens shall not be subject to unreasonable searches but we shall go ahead with unreasonable searches anyway because the searches are not really that unreasonable.....
Read some of Yoo's memos. you will see what I mean. black is white and white is gray...
At any rate, looking at the Roman Model, yeah...it sure looks like we are getting closer and closer to a dictatorship in this country.
July 26, 2009 10:11 AM | Reply | Permalink
Well done, dd! Again, don't forget how they trained pastors to get their flocks to follow the military like sheep!
July 26, 2009 12:17 PM | Reply | Permalink
That is why I find our ideal of government so fragile TheraP. In a moment a memo is generated and everything is a go!!!
And the pastors will lead their flocks, blindly.
July 26, 2009 12:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
I came across a quote this morning that I found very helpful. In terms of where I'm at and in terms of what needs to "ground" our discussions of politics. I won't go into the roundabout way I ran across the quote:
To withstand the winds of tyranny, justice needs deep roots and a rich soil in which to sink them.
This refers to more than the Constitution. It refers to ethics and personal depth as well as philosophical/spiritual depth.
It was related to a discussion of suffering and the search to comprehend and bear suffering, the search for justice in the face of suffering. Your blog bears on this. And it's helped me understand where I'm at currently. Since I was writing so much that bore on torture and injustice and suffering - and that ultimately leads to a need to focus on that deeper grounding. So that's where I am. And it's the right place for me at the moment. (Maybe in some way my own inner work here benefits the whole.)
Ok, back to the current reading I'm doing - seeking the depths. Very helpful sometimes to gain an insight like the one I learned today!
Peace be with you, buddy! :-)
July 26, 2009 3:06 PM | Reply | Permalink
Great Post DD!!
History has so much to teach us again and again(with a good press industry we would only have to learn lessons like these once). History and facts should be the primary tools in any journalist's tool box.
Thanks for stepping in to reclaim and reseed the vast chasms of ignorance found throughout the Death Valley of our nation's newspapers and TV news desks.
Please keep it up!!
July 26, 2009 12:39 PM | Reply | Permalink
If you were not praising me Biker I would give you line of the day!!! hahahaahah
Really makes my day to receive kudos like this. I used to watch Leno do the gig on the street and people did not know who their vice president was--the guy running the damn country!!!
As soon as I saw 'Posse' in the NYT article I was off and running.
If there were just a tad of 10th grade history mixed in with the news..........
July 26, 2009 12:50 PM | Reply | Permalink
Dear Mr. Day:
I don't recall seeing you on these boards before, and if you are a newcomer, welcome! :)
Nice post, and only some technical details (not central to your point) bother me. Though I admit, they bother me a lot and maybe they're from a Wikipedia entry that Bush may control: "Director Robert Mueller along with the then Acting Attorney General James B. Comey offered to resign from office in March 2004 if the White House overruled a Department of Justice ruling which concluded that warrantless domestic wiretapping was unconstitutional."[8]
This is revisionist "spin" to the point of lying. Comey didn't *offer,* he stated he was resigning and when strongly pressed by Bush to just continue for three more weeks to further circumvent the rule of law, Comey said rule of law was paramount, so obviously, *No!* and bye. And by the way, Comey added, Mueller as FBI director was downstairs waiting do resign as well (meanwhile, Ashcroft and up to a dozen others would have contemporaneously resigned as Andy Card knew). This would have been a repudiation of the President on a scale unprecedented in U.S. history, and mostly by his own appointees! So again, "offered" his resignation? What Comey *offered* to the lazy scofflaw was a chance to take a spin at the old impeachment wheel.
And then this propaganda, same source now doubt: "Attorney General John D. Ashcroft refused to intervene in attempts by White House Chief of Staff Andrew Card and then White House Counsel Alberto R. Gonzales to waive this ruling and permit the domestic warrantless eavesdropping program to proceed. Former President George W. Bush ultimately gave his support to making changes to the program on March 12, 2004, thereby defusing a crisis there.[8]"
This last sentence is almost unbelievable. And it is exactly the kind of troubling trend rightly cautioned against by our rational in his blog, http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/rational/2009/07/cheney-v-bush-inc.php?ref=reccafe: Good Bush saves day by fighting bad Cheney, reminding voters what a good egg that handsome Jeff Bush will surely be when *he* comes running for Oval Office.
Here's that last sentence, corrected: "Realizing that his Presidency might be unsustainable after mass Justice and FBI resignations, Bush saw that pressuring the heavily-sedated Ashcroft in his hospital bed had failed, and reluctantly gave in to demands by Ashcroft, Comey, and their top-level Justice supporters, being faced with no real choice." He was what Cheney might have called a "dead-ender." Stop breaking the law or walk the plank.
So did some ex-KGB guy write that last Orwellian disinformation? To wit, "President George W. Bush ultimately gave his support ... thereby defusing a crisis there." Holy smokes, talk about creative writing!
Rational is dead right. We need to be vigilant.
Recommended for its other parts!
July 26, 2009 2:01 PM | Reply | Permalink
hahahahah OT. How in the world could I disagree with your assessment here. I said somewhere else today that there is an on going attempt to somehow demonstrate that w attempted to 'do the right thing'!!
NEVER IN A MILLION FRICKIN YEARS WOULD i BELIEVE THAT DRIVEL.
Nice, nice summary OT. You should add a couple cites when this crap pops up again--which it will and post this comment!!
I still feel Mueller comes out smelling rather nice through all of this, I mean for the head of our KGB and all. hahahaha
July 26, 2009 2:14 PM | Reply | Permalink
No, I totally agree about Miller. Class act, totally. Ditto Comey. *Lots* of people in Justice were saying to Comey, "Look, we don't want you resigning alone and we're not in on it. We want to know so that we go with you." These are heros, and most or all Republicans. Some Republican are true patriots, like the McCain people who wouldn't let Palin speak on election evening ("I can't say that just because somebody might have won an election whatever their birth certificate issue may be that our movement just somehow stops! I'm just not wired that way, and I'm sure there will be a lot of voter challenges, and as far as I am concerned, this is just one day like any other as we move forward and take back America!") Somebody foresaw that correctly and said, "No way. The election is over and this is about bring the country back together, period." Bravo!
Ashcroft may be a weirdo, but he was also absolutely heroic. Hurray! This is all from Woodward's State of Denial (except my Palin rant).
July 26, 2009 2:27 PM | Reply | Permalink
Here's the recently aired CBC documentary on the anthrax attacks, which goes into the public/private partnerships that weaken the security of these biological WMDs:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQw1XMEL6To&feature=related
This is Dr. Philip Zack, the Jewish anthrax scientist who was fired for harassing an Egyptian co-worker, before sneaking back into the anthrax lab that discovered missing anthrax:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philip_Zack
Remember the anthrax letter, "Death to America. Death to Israel. Allah is great."
And GHWB's Carlyle Group was in perfect position to make a giant fortune from the anthrax attack, because it had just invested in companies that help detect and clean anthrax.
July 26, 2009 3:04 PM | Reply | Permalink
Nor do I think the military were as lionized during the post WW I period as they have been since the Reagan administration. Instead the atmosphere was much more anti-war back in the Warren Harding period.
Dick and Richard XX a few comments. The mood was indeed much more anti-military and isolationist in the 2 postwar WW1 decades. Anti-military because the trench warfare of WW1 was pure butchery. Modern weaponry had so far outstripped tactics the returning doughboys had lost faith in the military. Isolationist because the Treaty of Versailles and the divvying up of the world by the victorious imperialist powers, France and England disgusted many in the US and all but guaranteed there'd be further conflicts in the future.
The Bonus Army, composed of unemployed former WW1 soldiers was demanding immediate payment at the height of the depression, of their promised bonuses which weren't due to be payed until 1945. They essentially were telling the lameduck Hoover administration which was on the verge of being voted out of office they needed that stimulus now or people were going to starve to death.
Until Republicans come up with something to offer the electorate besides "government doesn't work", "gays and abortion are icky" and "tax cuts are the answer" the American people aren't likely to let them run our government or let them try bankrupting it again.
July 26, 2009 7:20 PM | Reply | Permalink
LET US PRAY that you are right Mark!!!
Good take on the aftermath of the WAR TO END ALL WARS.
July 26, 2009 7:35 PM | Reply | Permalink
Things sure were different back then Dick. Even Gerry Ford, as a law student at Yale was a dirty hippie isolationist, as was Lucky Lindbergh who even accepted a medal from Hitler, as were the majority of Americans in the late 30s and early 40s.
If Wilson hadn't suffered a debilitating stroke after WW1 we would have had much greater influence over the writing of the Treaty of Versailles and the carving up of the world. Henry Cabot Lodge the Republican leader of the imperialist faction of the Senate successfully kept us out of the League of Nations after Wilson's stroke, even though it was the US president's idea.
Wankers like him, who along with the British and Franch advocated for the harsh penalties that bankrupted Germany after the war guaranteed that animosities would only grow. He objected to the League of Nations because it would require all members to reject aggression and he didn't want anything to hamstring our own empire building. That and it was his arch enemy Wilson's idea and had to opposed on those political grounds alone. He really needed something for the Republicans to run on in 1920. It worked.
July 26, 2009 9:21 PM | Reply | Permalink