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   <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/destor23//315</id>
   <updated>		2009-11-23T01:53:15Z	2009-11-23T01:53:15Z	2009-11-23T01:51:37Z		2009-11-23T01:49:18Z	2009-11-23T01:49:18Z	2009-11-23T01:48:40Z	2009-11-23T01:48:40Z	2009-11-23T01:47:45Z	2009-11-23T01:45:19Z	2009-11-23T01:40:19Z	2009-11-23T01:39:44Z	2009-11-23T01:35:33Z		2009-11-23T01:33:03Z	2009-11-23T01:31:57Z	2009-11-23T01:29:44Z		2009-11-23T01:20:22Z			2009-11-23T01:16:58Z	2009-11-23T01:16:22Z</updated>
   
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            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/destor23//315.303507-comment:3679912</id>
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		    <title>destor23 Commented on Health Care 5 Years From Now by destor23</title>
		        
			<published>2009-11-23T01:53:15Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-11-23T01:53:15Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>And thank you, as always, for brining clarity and evidence to the discussion.</p>]]>
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            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009://14.303446-comment:3679910</id>
		    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/11/22/man_everybody_is_disappinted_in_obama/#c3679910" />
		
		    <title>destor23 Commented on Is Everybody Disappointed In Obama? by M.J. Rosenberg</title>
		        
			<published>2009-11-23T01:49:18Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-11-23T01:49:18Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>Good point, as always.</p>]]>
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            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009://14.303446-comment:3679825</id>
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		    <title>destor23 Commented on Is Everybody Disappointed In Obama? by M.J. Rosenberg</title>
		        
			<published>2009-11-22T23:54:18Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-11-22T23:54:18Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>Our pop culture rocks, ptroub!</p>

<p>To be fair, a lot of Democrats were worried during the primaries that Obama was too conciliatory and we were told not to worry, this guy was from the rough and tumble world of Chicago politics and would kick some ass. We helped get him elected by a huge margin, by recent standards.</p>

<p>Honestly, I blame the "centrists" who take our party name in congress for most of Obama's problems but his critics from the left are well meaning, have a great point and deserve kinder treatment from you.</p>]]>
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            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009://14.303446-comment:3679812</id>
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		    <title>destor23 Commented on Is Everybody Disappointed In Obama? by M.J. Rosenberg</title>
		        
			<published>2009-11-22T23:41:43Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-11-22T23:41:43Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>Interest rates have plummeted since Clinton left so anything refinanced wouldn't have been done at a higher level.  Remember also that not issuing 30 years saved us money, the longer the duration the greater the expense.</p>

<p>Yes, some government spending is off the balance sheet.  Some of it, like Medicare and Social Security is off because it's not real spending, it's a projection. The current expenditures, the checks written, are in the budget.</p>

<p>The big off balance sheet expenditure of the Bush years was Iraq (now on the balance sheet) but you're quite fair in pointing out that GWB is as big a spender as anyone.</p>

<p>I feel for you, Bulldog.  You're a principled conservative (and quite thoughtful and friendly) but you've been let down by both parties.</p>]]>
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            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/stillidealistic//3710.303542-comment:3679782</id>
		    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/stillidealistic/2009/11/how-long-do-you-think-well-be.php#c3679782" />
		
		    <title><![CDATA[destor23 Commented on How Long Do You Think We&apos;ll Be Able To Keep Deluding Ourselves? by stillidealistic]]></title>
		        
			<published>2009-11-22T22:41:56Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-11-22T22:41:56Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>Hey there Stilli, great post.  One thing, about that sacrifice we need to make.  In many cases, it might not be a sacrifice for most people.  Higher taxes could be offset, for example, by not paying fees to for profit companies that we rely on for services.  Health care comes to mind, of course but all manner of public service has been outsourced to the private sector lately.  It's amazing to me that people who pay out money to private companies, year after year, somehow think that's different than paying a tax to the government.  Say the government took over electricity generation and delivery.  If it cost me more than I now pay to Con-Ed, I guess I'd mind. If it cost me less, I wouldn't.  But that's not how we debate the issue.  Instead some one would say "Would you pay higher taxes to have the government take over Con-Ed's business?" Naturally, no!  But if you asked "Would you pay higher taxes but no monthly utility bill?" I'd say, "Show me the math!"</p>

<p>I'm amazed that we're completely obsessed with what's a tax and what isn't but that we never look at the amounts at hand.</p>]]>
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	<title><![CDATA[destor23 recommended How Long Do You Think We&apos;ll Be Able To Keep Deluding Ourselves? by stillidealistic]]></title>
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   <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/stillidealistic//3710.303542</id>
  <published>2009-11-23T01:05:07Z</published>
   <updated>2009-11-23T01:46:48Z</updated>
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            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009://14.303439-comment:3679731</id>
		    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/11/22/intel_inside_prove_it/#c3679731" />
		
		    <title>destor23 Commented on Intel Inside? Prove It.  by Bernard Avishai</title>
		        
			<published>2009-11-22T21:42:45Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-11-22T21:42:45Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>But is the idea of Israel compatible with the idea of democracy?</p>]]>
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            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/dedelste//1519.303394-comment:3679722</id>
		    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/dedelste/2009/11/picking-up-the-ball.php#c3679722" />
		
		    <title>destor23 Commented on Picking up the ball by dedelste</title>
		        
			<published>2009-11-22T21:29:52Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-11-22T21:29:52Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>I guess it depends on what you mean by public option.  The one described by Robert Reich, open to at most 6 million people and likely just to 4 million, isn't public option enough to really matter.  The public option is supposed to be competition to private insurance. If it's too small to compete, I'm not sure it matters. What I see so far is too small.</p>]]>
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	<title>destor23 recommended Picking up the ball by dedelste</title>
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   <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/dedelste//1519.303394</id>
  <published>2009-11-22T00:06:29Z</published>
   <updated>2009-11-22T00:22:59Z</updated>
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            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/aunt_sam//2777.303673-comment:3679720</id>
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		    <title>destor23 Commented on THE $100 QUERY! by Aunt Sam</title>
		        
			<published>2009-11-22T21:25:18Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-11-22T21:25:18Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>C or D. I'll be buying a Christmas present for a needy child this year, through a neat program that my employer offers.</p>

<p>I don't give money to political candidates and prefer to support them (or not) through my writing, speaking and voting. I just don't find that most of them really need my money and I don't believe my money will be particularly well spent if I give it to them.</p>

<p>I'd also suggest donating to a non-profits arts or culture organization.  During hard times like these a lot of people feel like donating to theatre groups and the like is frivolous, but I think they're important.</p>]]>
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            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009://14.303446-comment:3679718</id>
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		    <title>destor23 Commented on Is Everybody Disappointed In Obama? by M.J. Rosenberg</title>
		        
			<published>2009-11-22T21:22:00Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-11-22T21:22:00Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>Hey TCB, this is all outstanding Treasury debt including interest payments, right? Because there's no doubt that the total public debt has increased every year.  It's also true that Clinton generated one annual budget surplus -- that doesn't mean the surplus was enough to cut the total public debt and interest payments, only that a surplus was created for one budget year.</p>

<p>Now we know he did this because the Treasury was, for a short time, able to stop issuing 30 year Treasury bonds, the most expense type of debt to raise and we know that even George Bush agreed that Clinton had created one annual surplus, which he argued should be returned to the people.</p>

<p>You're absolutely right, though -- it didn't bring down our total debt. To do that, the surplus would have had to have been either used to pay down existing debt (buy out bondholders on the open market) or invested in order to buy out bonds when they mature.</p>

<p>It's a comlicated issue but, for what it's worth, I think you make a good point but that people who point out that Clinton created one annual budget surplus (no easy feat) are also correct and how that did or didn't alleviate our long-term debt issue is another matter and one we can certainly debate.</p>

<p>-Mike</p>]]>
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            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/destor23//315.303507-comment:3679712</id>
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		    <title>destor23 Commented on Health Care 5 Years From Now by destor23</title>
		        
			<published>2009-11-22T21:12:12Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-11-22T21:12:12Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>It might even be easier for incremental to work when you're trying to decrease regulations.  You relax a rule here and a rule there at the agency level and you don't even need to change the laws. If you want to create a new government service you have to do the real heavy lifting of getting a bill through congress and signed.</p>]]>
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	<title>destor23 recommended THE EXPERT AS THE DANGEROUS WHORE by dickday</title>
    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/dikkday48yahoocom/2009/11/the-expert-as-the-dangerous-wh.php" />
   <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/dikkday48yahoocom//5214.303443</id>
  <published>2009-11-23T02:35:39Z</published>
   <updated>2009-11-22T20:26:56Z</updated>
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	<title><![CDATA[destor23 recommended AULD LANG SYNE TPM?!? (Updated with TPM Al&apos;s nice reply!) by Aunt Sam]]></title>
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   <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/aunt_sam//2777.303546</id>
  <published>2009-11-23T01:39:15Z</published>
   <updated>2009-11-22T22:35:07Z</updated>
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            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/coonsey//1805.303391-comment:3679588</id>
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		    <title><![CDATA[destor23 Commented on Clinton Not Attending Health Care Event Because it&apos;s Politicized? by coonsey]]></title>
		        
			<published>2009-11-22T18:39:55Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-11-22T18:39:55Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>Ordinarily I'd agree with you that the excuse seems lame, especially for somebody who has never backed away from a "political" event before. But remember that Bill's in a weird spot. His wife's in the administration, he's still an unofficial party leader -- he does answer to a lot of interests and no, he's not going to help us push the party from the left, he's the original DLC centrist.</p>]]>
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	<title>destor23 recommended Time to contact the FCC by Bwakfat</title>
    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/no_one_really/2009/11/time-to-contact-the-fcc.php" />
   <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/no_one_really//3718.303488</id>
  <published>2009-11-22T19:03:38Z</published>
   <updated>2009-11-22T22:48:18Z</updated>
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	<title>destor23 recommended Health Care 5 Years From Now by destor23</title>
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   <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/destor23//315.303507</id>
  <published>2009-11-22T18:00:18Z</published>
   <updated>2009-11-22T18:27:06Z</updated>
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	<title>destor23 recommended Get blogging by Bwakfat</title>
    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/no_one_really/2009/11/get-blogging.php" />
   <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/no_one_really//3718.303478</id>
  <published>2009-11-22T19:50:19Z</published>
   <updated>2009-11-22T22:41:00Z</updated>
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            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/barefoot//3518.303422-comment:3679535</id>
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		    <title>destor23 Commented on I Call Bullshit. by barefooted</title>
		        
			<published>2009-11-22T17:54:31Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-11-22T17:54:31Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>Yeah, you'll see odd posts pimping stocks and products and in a lower volume environment like we have now where 1-3 recs or even no recs can land you on the most rec'd list, the spam winds up there too.</p>]]>
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	<title>destor23 recommended I Call Bullshit. by barefooted</title>
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   <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/barefoot//3518.303422</id>
  <published>2009-11-22T06:16:20Z</published>
   <updated>2009-11-22T06:17:37Z</updated>
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            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009://14.303439-comment:3679515</id>
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		    <title>destor23 Commented on Intel Inside? Prove It.  by Bernard Avishai</title>
		        
			<published>2009-11-22T17:27:06Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-11-22T17:27:06Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>It seems like the rea tension there isn't between Intel and Israel but between Israelis. One thing America's founders knew that Israel's did not is that having a religious government is incompatible with having a democratic republic. Sorry but this is one of our first principles. You just can't have an American style democracy if you ignore it.  I doubt you can have any acceptable level of democracy without it.</p>

<p>You can't count on the secular majority to overpower the stridently religious because the secular majority is almost by definition less passionate about these issues and more willing to look the other way so long as they're not forced into anything. Imagine you're a secular Jewish employee of Intel in this case.  What are you fighting against, exactly? A day off?</p>

<p>That's why it's essential to have something that says the government is religiously neutral.  Then you can easily answer the extremists: I know you'd like us to do X but we're forbidden. That principle also gives the secularists something to rally around and something to push back with. In the U.S. many secular forces want to serve a higher power -- the constitution.</p>]]>
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	<entry>
		
	<title>destor23 recommended Is Everybody Disappointed In Obama? by M.J. Rosenberg</title>
    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/11/22/man_everybody_is_disappinted_in_obama/" />
   <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009://14.303446</id>
  <published>2009-11-22T15:45:36Z</published>
   <updated>2009-11-22T17:18:26Z</updated>
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			<entry>
            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009://14.303446-comment:3679490</id>
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		    <title>destor23 Commented on Is Everybody Disappointed In Obama? by M.J. Rosenberg</title>
		        
			<published>2009-11-22T16:56:00Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-11-22T16:56:00Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>It's a tough situation because a lot of people I know are also really tired of "Blame Bush" talk, even though Obama isn't passed his first year and has already done some good.</p>

<p>It's not that Bush isn't really still to blame, either. The financial crisis is his.  And how can Obama be "dithering" about Afghanistan when the previou administration should have had the problem well solved before a new president took office (did anyone think Afghanistan was going to be an 8-year plus occupation?)</p>

<p>Problem is, there's a lot of appetite on both the left and right to forget Bush entirely.  Psychologically, we are repulsed by failure.  We don't like to dwell on it.  There's also a bias, both on the left and the right for Obama to "own" his presidency.</p>

<p>Obama is also not the type to blame the last guy.  It doesn't suit Obama's character. He doesn't like to do it. He's definitely an alpha male.</p>

<p>He's also a snob in the best sense of the term.  He won't get into a public argument with people he seems unworthy.  This means the Sarah Palins of the world can take a lot of free shots because Obama doesn't see much point in debating them.</p>

<p>I still have some problems with the big guy.  I hate the health care legislation and I find it hard to muster support for it. I think the stimulus was a bit botched, relying on a trickle down effect while people are the top of the economy are just hoarding the money. I don't want to send more troops to Afghanistan. So some of my enthusiasm is waning just because he's not doing what I would have him do.</p>]]>
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            <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009://14.303400-comment:3679191</id>
		    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/11/21/establishment_reality/#c3679191" />
		
		    <title>destor23 Commented on Establishment Reality by Jon Taplin</title>
		        
			<published>2009-11-22T04:47:44Z</published>
			   <updated>2009-11-22T04:47:44Z</updated>
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		        <![CDATA[<p>I'm surprised by easily the establishment is threated.  The big part of the Paul/Grayson legislation is that it gives the Congress some oversight over the Fed, but after the fact.  The Fed remains remarkably independent is just has to explain itself.  Why this is even an issue is totally beyond me.</p>

<p>Unfortunately, Paul isn't credible on this issue.  Remember, the guy wants a precious metal standard for monetary policy and would prefer to abolish the Fed entirely.  That doesn't mean the legislation he's pushing now isn't good, it's just a reminder that our ally on this issue might be one we have to push back against later.</p>]]>
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	<entry>
		
	<title>destor23 recommended What a mess!  (Updated) by TheraP</title>
    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/therap/2009/11/what-a-mess.php" />
   <id>tag:tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com,2009:/talk/blogs/therap//1622.303286</id>
  <published>2009-11-20T22:55:29Z</published>
   <updated>2009-11-21T23:20:47Z</updated>
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