Wright, McClurkin, Warren and a Pattern...
A lot of religious people have problems with homosexuality, especially with the idea of same sex marriage. But I can't believe that Barack Obama can't find a supporter of same sex marriage rights to give the invocation at his inaugural. Rich Warren? Really? Why?
I'm sorry but I don't understand Barack Obama's tolerance for intolerance from men of the cloth. Jeremiah Wright supported Prop 8. Donnie McClurkin thinks homosexuality is a curable condition. Every time something like this happens, social liberals such as myself get loud about it and are told to chill out.
Now there is one reason to chill: I'm absolutely sure that Obama is smart enough to know that the government has an obligation to treat same sex couples equally under the law and that Obama is way too smart to be a homphobe or anything like that.
I have no such faith in Warren, Wright of McClurkin though and I have to wonder why Obama just never seems to think this issue is serious enough that he'd actually do something about it. Wright's view on Prop 8 is far more offensive than anything he might have said after 9/11 but you wouldn't see Obama leaving Trinity over something like Prop 8. McClurkin only appeared with the campaign once but Obama didn't think the man's insulting views about homosexuals were worth too much worry. Now this with Warren? What gives?
Can Obama really not find a pastor who is an actual social progressive to deliver the invocation?
This is a truly lame choice and Obama's behavior on this matter is starting to suggest a very annoying pattern. It's not one of homphobia, either. It's one of damnable tolerance for the last acceptable form of bigotry in the United States.
I'm sorry but I don't understand Barack Obama's tolerance for intolerance from men of the cloth. Jeremiah Wright supported Prop 8. Donnie McClurkin thinks homosexuality is a curable condition. Every time something like this happens, social liberals such as myself get loud about it and are told to chill out.
Now there is one reason to chill: I'm absolutely sure that Obama is smart enough to know that the government has an obligation to treat same sex couples equally under the law and that Obama is way too smart to be a homphobe or anything like that.
I have no such faith in Warren, Wright of McClurkin though and I have to wonder why Obama just never seems to think this issue is serious enough that he'd actually do something about it. Wright's view on Prop 8 is far more offensive than anything he might have said after 9/11 but you wouldn't see Obama leaving Trinity over something like Prop 8. McClurkin only appeared with the campaign once but Obama didn't think the man's insulting views about homosexuals were worth too much worry. Now this with Warren? What gives?
Can Obama really not find a pastor who is an actual social progressive to deliver the invocation?
This is a truly lame choice and Obama's behavior on this matter is starting to suggest a very annoying pattern. It's not one of homphobia, either. It's one of damnable tolerance for the last acceptable form of bigotry in the United States.
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He does no such thing. He's on record with his views......
Obama's letter opposing same-sex marriage ban
The text of Illinois Sen. Barack Obama's letter to the Alice B. Toklas LGBT Democratic Club in San Francisco:
Dear Friends,
Thank you for the opportunity to welcome everyone to the Alice B. Toklas LGBT Democratic Club's Pride Breakfast and to congratulate you on continuing a legacy of success, stretching back thirty-six years. As one of the oldest and most influential LGBT organizations in the country, you have continually rallied to support Democratic candidates and causes, and have fought tirelessly to secure equal rights and opportunities for LGBT Americans in California and throughout the country.
As the Democratic nominee for President, I am proud to join with and support the LGBT community in an effort to set our nation on a course that recognizes LGBT Americans with full equality under the law. That is why I support extending fully equal rights and benefits to same sex couples under both state and federal law. That is why I support repealing the Defense of Marriage Act and the "Don't Ask Don't Tell" policy, and the passage of laws to protect LGBT Americans from hate crimes and employment discrimination. And that is why I oppose the divisive and discriminatory efforts to amend the California Constitution, and similar efforts to amend the U.S. Constitution or those of other states.
For too long. issues of LGBT rights have been exploited by those seeking to divide us. It's time to move beyond polarization and live up to our founding promise of equality by treating all our citizens with dignity and respect. This is no less than a core issue about who we are as Democrats and as Americans.
Finally, I want to congratulate all of you who have shown your love for each other by getting married these last few weeks. My thanks again to the Alice B. Toklas LGBT Democratic Club for allowing me to be a part of today's celebration. I look forward to working with you in the coming months and years, and I wish you all continued success.
Sincerely,
Barack Obama
December 17, 2008 7:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
DORN! I went way out of my way to point out that Obama isn't a bigot and that I don't think he means that particular oppressed minority any harm. While I appreciate you posting Obama's letter here, it kind of misses the point.
There's no doubt in my mind that Obama is smart enough to know what's right.
My problem is that if you switched "gay" for "black" in the views of Wright, McClurkin or Warren, Obama would have nothing at all to do with them.
If Warren believed the things about blacks that he believes about gays, he'd be marginalized as the radical cleric that he is.
December 17, 2008 7:50 PM | Reply | Permalink
Great blog. Well stated.
What is so hard to understand? It puzzles me that so many are so ready to hand excuses to Obama.
December 17, 2008 10:32 PM | Reply | Permalink
You might be right about that.
It is just hard for many people to equate civil rights and gay rights. This country still has alot to learn about acceptance, tolerance and understanding, I totally agree with you.
December 18, 2008 12:25 PM | Reply | Permalink
I don't understand Barack Obama's tolerance for intolerance
Teach it, Nature Boy.
I have been consoling myself in re: some shitty appointments on the basis of "he's looking right and going left--Prez has the head fakes..."
Alas, that rationale falls apart on this issue.
BTW What is the deal with het african american men and their gay brothers.
What part of "more pussy for us" don't they understand.
Every time some asshole stands on the corner of Castro and Market and tries to send a horde of buffed out, manicured, sensitive gay guys over to my neighborhood (on some humbug rehab trip) to sniff around after my girlfriends I want to throttle him.
December 18, 2008 1:29 AM | Reply | Permalink
I really don't get this, jollyroger. Why on Earth is the first African American president tolerating views on marriage that, were they applied to any ethnicity on Earth, be dismissed immediately as crank bigotry?
I've been annoyed with some cabinet appointments, sure. But I can live with that. This is different. This is the acceptance of the unacceptable. And any progressive who says, "a lot of good people don't believe in the right to same sex unions" really has to think about the definition of "good people"
December 18, 2008 1:51 AM | Reply | Permalink
think about the definition of "good people"
Ouch.
How old will Kucinich be in '16 again?
December 18, 2008 2:02 AM | Reply | Permalink
The "pattern," or whatever you want to call it, was clearly stated in Obama's June 2006 speech to the Call to Renewal conference sponsored by Sojourner's:
I recall a lot of the liberal blogosphere was very upset by that speech, based on a few sentences of it. That was back when many were John Edwards' supporters. But most seemed to eventually loose those thoughts and became Obama fans, forgot all about it. (Heh, for example, I recall that when Obama wouldn't renounce and reject McClurkin, that TPMCafe member cscs did a post along the lines of "that's the last straw, Obama's really lost me now, no way will I vote for him.")
Obama didn't forget about it, it's a very important part of his whole approach to politics.
Recommend rereading the whole speech again. He wasn't "pandering," he believes what he said. He doesn't pander, rather, he studies movements and groups beforehand and he picks out the ones where he sees potential for forming majorities on certain issues. He ignores issues that only appeal to a minority.
I am actually surprised at how remarkably consistent he has been with what he said in his books and what he said back in the days of being just a Senator. He really believes in this post-partisan, new majority stuff and really believes that you can't accomplish anything in two of the branches of government that the majority doesn't want. He's clearly a student of the constitution who believes that minorities and special interests should seek redress in the courts, and that the other two branches should do what they can with what the majority is willing to do.
He has said it over and over again in many ways. Get used to it, he's not going to fight for minority groups or special interests. That's not what he sees his role as. He's only going to push "progressive" goals when he thinks he will see a majority behind them, because he believes that's the way this country is set up. Gays who want marriage via support of the executive branch or Congress will have to get a majority of the populace behind them. Obama doesn't see it as his role to be advocating for marriage for them, because he doesn't see any movement towards the majority wanting that yet. He does see movement of religious conservatives twoards other more liberal views, and that's what he's going to pursue.
I think anyone who thinks Obama is going to be different from Bill Clinton as far as paying a lot of attention to polls on issues is in for a surprise. I think Obama believes in following the polls on issues moreso, he does it on principle.
If he has any ideological bent at all, it is about majority rule as to the government (ya know "of for and by the people?") I suspect thinks cultural change cannot be forced by government (not our government, at least, not the way it is designed) that it must come from other sources, i.e. MLK Jr. first, followed by cultural changes, then government, assist from the judiciary branch if civil rights of minorities are being egregiously violated. And the whole of Jim Crow was not outlawed by the judiciary in a single day or week.
By the way, I think those who think he was "pandering" with his speech to AIPAC while he was still running against Hillary are going to be just as surprised. He simply decided ahead of time that everything he said in that speech was supported by a majority of the American people, so he could say it.
He's made his stance on this pretty clear to me long ago, and where he thinks the public is at on it. He chastises in speeches, like to fellow black church parishioners, about lack of tolerance and even love of gays. But he won't be an advocate for marriage for them, because he doesn't see the majority ready able and willing to do that yet. He's basically saying they have more work to do on that front, not the executive or legislative government, that those branches can't force it. And a glance at the tug of war in many state governments, back and forth as to gay marriage, shows this to be an accurate reading.
I want to make it clear that I'm not defending him on this. I merely pointing out he is turning out exactly as he has always presented himself, and I think a good number of liberals who voted for him really blocked out what he was consistently saying about himself. I think there is a major difference in the definition of "progressive" as used by Obama, and that as used by many liberals, at least judging from what I have seen in the blogosphere.
December 18, 2008 2:53 AM | Reply | Permalink
Obama's really lost me now
O shit, I think I co-signed that one at the time...oh well...
December 18, 2008 3:10 AM | Reply | Permalink
he does it on principle.
On your larger point, I think you are correct, and thanks for providing a *"context" within which his behaviors as described are not to be held against him (ie. as betrayals of some projected expectations of ours that, as you say, he never really claimed for himself.)
*(as TheraP would say)
December 18, 2008 3:19 AM | Reply | Permalink
I think your take is entirely right, aa. I guess it is a little hard to accept that at some level our first african american president just isn't a civil rights leader, though he will undoubtedly get credit for being one.
December 18, 2008 7:48 AM | Reply | Permalink
Well, I think everyone should check out the whole thing to get the complete picture he is trying to paint. I don't think it's that simple. Especially check out the Benedicton minister and the poet.
Inauguration Line-up "based on requests from the President-elect and the Vice President-elect":
Music by the U.S. Marine Band
Music by the San Francisco boys and girls choirs
followed by
Music by Aretha Franklin,
Oath of Office by Biden
Music by Itzhak Perlman, Yo-Yo Ma, Gabriela Montero, Anthony McGill
Oath of Office by Obama
Inaugural Address
followed by
December 18, 2008 1:19 PM | Reply | Permalink
Thank you for showing this, Lowery does encourage the black community to recognize gay rights as a civil rights issue, which puts a nice coda on the whole thing and takes (a little!) bit of the sting out re: the Warren choice.
Having said that, I am very glad and very proud that so many people have raised their voices about the Warren choice and said it stinks. No matter whether you think it's a dealbreaker for supporting Obama or not, it is good to make it clear that gays and lesbians aren't going to be relegated to second class citizenship and just take the crumbs we're thrown and not complain about being used or taken for granted. If we wanted that, we would be Log Cabin Republicans....
December 18, 2008 2:11 PM | Reply | Permalink
I am way beyond "dealbreaker" moments. I just feel an obligation to be angry about things like this. Obama wants us to disagree without being disagreeable. I must be disagreeable with bigots though because, like spoiled tuna, they do not agree with me.
December 18, 2008 2:56 PM | Reply | Permalink
I'll be honest with you destor, I have an entirely different perspective. I hate celebrity preachers. I also hate popular secular motivational speakers, all that stuff. I have also always hated the use of Billy Graham by so many past presidents. There is something really creepy about celebrity preachers and motivational speakers to me, demogogue creepy, even when their cause is good. I think clergy's place should be the "humble man of the cloth" thing, in all realms, but especially if they are working in the political realm.
I have nothing against people wanting a prayer leader at a political event or a football game for that matter, I don't have anything against politicians going to prayer breakfasts (actually I think I just think preachers should be "humble men of the cloth." I don't see the celebrity preacher as the kind of spirituality I admire in some believers. I also think mixing the community side of politics with religious hurts the religion much more than the politics, at least it does in my eyes.
But I am realistic in seeing this is the culture we are currently dealing with and have been for a long time. (And it's not pecularily American--see Sistani, al Sadr, for quick examples, there are many more worldwide.)
And one thing that always bothered me about Obama is that he really gets and plays the celebrity thing. I didn't like the "yes we can" rallies with the young people screaming early in the primary, they really bothered me, they were that creepy motivational speaker with fans crap to me.
I'd also have preferred a type of candidate who didn't pick out his first church in his new town in Chicago for its political potential.
But then a candidate I would prefer, one that would not invite celebrity preachers to the White House but have the Secret Service escort him quietly to the church of his choice and his non-celebrity pastor, or escort that non-celebrity pastor in for consolation when needed, would probably not win the election in this day and age. You gotta understand and play celebrity.
If they were all "humble men of the cloth," you wouldn't care what their political views are nor even what political agitation they work on in their spare time as missions of charity or prozeletizing or whatever, or whether they were for or against gay marriage. But because they are celebrities with fans, we end up having to care. Bleh.
I would have been pleasantly surprised if he had picked non-celebrity preachers for his inauguration. But he didn't, and in that, too, he seems to have been very consistent. I'll have to live with it, it's no different than what most other polticians in many countries do these days.
December 18, 2008 5:15 PM | Reply | Permalink
If we were to throw Lieberman into the pattern and look beyond the issue of gay rights, we would find the pattern of a politician and of a leader who consistently reaches out to those who are sometimes capable of unsavory contributions to our discourse, and he does so to such an extent that he is even capable of forgiving and reaching out to those who direct their negative discourse at him himself.
December 18, 2008 4:14 PM | Reply | Permalink
Jeremiah Wright supported Prop 8.
Is that true, do you have a cite? Wright is usually described as a gay rights supporter.
December 18, 2008 4:54 PM | Reply | Permalink
You know, I had one yesterday when I wrote this. Or... thought I did. But now that I look into it further I think I might be freaking wrong.
Which kind of happens a lot.
December 18, 2008 5:09 PM | Reply | Permalink
OK, just checking. I just wanted to pick at that because one of the main reasons I was so annoyed at the anti-Wright uproar was that it felt not even so much like an attack on Obama as it was an attack on liberal pastors. If I'm not mistaken Trinity UCC even performs gay marriages...
December 18, 2008 5:15 PM | Reply | Permalink