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DIVIDE AND CONQUER


Yesterday, right before I went to bed, I saw an ominous CNN report that stated that, if the public option was not included in this health care reform package, then "as many as 100" progressive Democrats would not vote for it, and that if the public option WAS included, then as many as 68 conservative Democrats (the so-called Blue Dogs) would vote against it, along with the entire Republican block.

Scary stuff.  If that were true, then clearly we wouldn't get any health care reform at all, which would mean that my daughter and millions of other Americans would still go around with no health insurance at all, even though my daughter--like so many uninsured Americans--works 50 to 60 hours a week.

At three a.m. I woke up, and that was pretty much it for the night.  As I lay there, staring up at the darkened ceiling, I suddenly got this mental image of President Obama, way way up in the circus spotlight, endeavoring a tightrope walk, striving mightily to balance himself with a long pole, but every time that pole dipped toward the right, the audience to the left would scream "TRAITOR! BETRAYOR! LIAR!" and throw old Obama '08 campaign buttons at him; then every time the pole would dip toward the left, the audience to the right would spring to their feet, 9mm firearms strapped to their thighs and AR-15's slung over their shoulders, and shout, "NAZI! HITLER! SOCIALIST! NOT-REALLY-AN-AMERICAN CLOSET TERRORIST PRETENDER! LIAR!"

Below, a phalanx of TV camera crews salivated, close-up lenses focused, waiting breathlessly to see if he would plunge to his death.  Because THAT, of course, would be the real story.

Standing silently in the rain, outside the circus tent, throngs of the uninsured and underinsured, ignored and unseen by the agitated crowds within, held their breaths to see what was to be their fate.  I could see my daughter among them, wet hair plastered to her face, pale from working too hard, as always, and our eyes met, and I knew we could not let her or the rest of them down.

And so, we Americans remain poised in this trembling moment of history, and wonder what is to become of all of us.

I did try to go back to sleep, but I could not get that mental picture out of my mind.  Finally, when there was enough light for me to get up and move around without disturbing my sleeping husband (nothin' keeps that man awake), I turned on the computer and went to work.

It could not be that simple, I determined.  It could not be that either-or, that black or white.  Nothing ever is, no matter how cut-and-dried the news packaging is.

And what I found not only informed me beyond most of what I've seen in coverage of this debate, but actually served to soothe my fears considerably, so naturally, I'm passing it on to you guys.

First of all, the bad news.

One thing I love about TPM Cafe is that most of the participants are very well informed and well educated, so I don't need to reiterate what many of you already know:  that the votes for the public option are not there.

Still, that matter is up for debate--I've seen both sides--so I turned to someone whose voice I learned to trust implicitely during the campaign--Nate Silver over at FiveThirtyEight.com.  His analysis:  Life After the Death of the Public Option, is the single most comprehensive--and enlightening--explanation of what that actually means that I have found anywhere. 

It not only makes sense, but if offers encouragement.

First he breaks down, vote by vote, in the House and the Senate where the problem exists and why it's real.  "It's an unpleasant truth," he states, "But just because it's an unpleasant truth does not mean that it's not the truth."

Then, he explains why health care reform without a public option is still reform:

 

Forget politics for a moment -- what about from a policy standpoint? The fundamental accomplishments of a public option-less bill would be to (1) ensure that no American could be denied coverage because of a pre-existing condition or because they became sick; (2) subsidize health insurance coverage for millions of poor and middle-class Americans.

These are major, major accomplishments. Arguably, they are accomplished at too great a cost. But let's look at it like this. The CBO estimates that the public option would save about $150 billion over the next ten years -- that's roughly $1,100 for every taxpayer. I'm certainly not thrilled to have to pay an additional $1,100 in taxes because some Blue Dog Democrats want to placate their friends in the insurance industry. But I think the good in this health care bill -- the move toward universal-ish coverage, the cost-control provisions -- is worth a heck of a lot more than $1,100.

He then explains why ramming through a public-option bill in the House would still wind up in defeat in the Senate, and why the cost in the long run would be too high--and I'm not talking money-cost.

He also addresses the all-or-nothing stance of the ideologues among us that Dems have to take a stance somewhere and that if not here, then where???

 

But don't progressives need to draw a line in the sand somewhere? I'm sympathetic to this argument from a game-theory standpoint. But (1) lines in the sand won't mean anything if they're washed to sea by a wave-like 2010 election; and (2) I'm not persuaded that the lack of progressive willpower is responsible for compromises on bills like health care, climate, and the stimulus package. The stimulus package passed the House with only 26 more votes than were required for passage and had just one vote to spare in the Senate. The cap-and-trade bill passed with just one extra vote in the House and has yet to pass the Senate (and probably won't). A health care bill, even under somewhat best-case scenarios and even without a public option, is unlikely to gather more than about 230-240 votes in the House and perhaps 62-64 in the Senate.

It doesn't seem to me as though the Democratic leadership (including President Obama) is unnecessarily watering down bills for the sake of achieving a "bipartisan" outcome. It seems, rather, that they're calibrating things relatively well, and squeezing about the most juice they can out of these initiatives given the institutional imperatives of the Congress

 

Of course, we don't have to accept anything as unchangeable when it comes to politics, and Silver takes note of that fact:

 

By all means, try to change those institutional imperatives. Organize primary challenges against Senators and Representatives who are too conservative relative to their districts; these can have somewhat dramatic -- if probably somewhat temporary -- effects on Congressional behavior. Try to build some momentum against the filibuster. Expose Senators and Representatives who are voting against the best interests of their district because of special-interest money. Push Democrats to end the seniority system in its selection of committee chairs and floor leaders. And work on shifting the Overton window where you can. But I don't think the problem is that progressives are disempowered. It's simply that they don't constitute a majority. Non-Blue Dog Democrats make up 47 percent of the House. They probably do make up a majority of the Senate (although this is arbitrary; the Blue Dogs aren't formally active in the upper chamber), but in the Senate, a mere majority isn't good enough -- you need a supermajority

 

Finally, Silver holds out hope that I do not think we should dismiss out of hand just because of our own impatience:

 

Incrementalism seems to be a popular meme these days -- could the public option do better as a standalone provision? While bearing in mind that bargaining is the third stage of grief, this seems to me to be a somewhat realistic hope, especially if Barack Obama is elected to a second term. If a health care reform bill passes, then the government will paying for private insurance coverage for some low-to-middle income individuals. This will tend to give everyone a more direct interest in cost containment: if a low-income family's insurance coverage is costing more than it should because of the absence of competition from a public option, it will be the taxpayers making up the difference. Of course, there would be some people arguing to blow the whole thing up entirely for this reason. But if someone then proposed a public option -- a provision that would spare $150 billion from the public dole and which would give consumers more choices -- it would seem to have a fairly compelling case. Part of the problem the public option faces is that it's a somewhat popular, cost-reducing measure which is mired in a somewhat unpopular, thousand-page, $900 billion bill. When taken as a standalone measure, its cost savings would be more transparent and its opponents would have less ability to confuse the public about its costs and benefits.

 

Now, I know some of you out there already have your blood boiling over this because you think if we don't do EVERYTHING now then we will never get another chance in most of our lifetimes to do it AT ALL.

Hang in there with me.  I know it takes longer than the av-er-age blogpost to read through my stuff, but I promise to make it worth your while.

First, a defense of the Obama administration strategy, which I found in the L.A. Times: "Obama's Health-Care Trade-Off."

The article begins by pointing out that so many aspects of health insurance reform that is included in all versions of the bill, such as not being denied due to pre-existing conditions, is not necessarily set in stone, and that by compromising on something like the public plan, Obama gets far greater leverage to insist on across-the-board reform, particularly with conservative Dems and so-called "centrist" Dems, as well as with a tiny handful of Republicans, (who, in spite of their rhetoric, will not all vote en masse against something that they know could really hurt them in the next election).

 

Centrist Democrats on Monday said they welcomed the new White House flexibility.

Rep. Jason Altmire (D-Pa.), a second-term lawmaker from a swing district, said: "It's going to bring votes." Altmire, who was one of three Democrats to vote against the bill in the House Education and Labor Committee, said that the government plan had "become a flash point."

Families USA Executive Director Ron Pollack, a leading consumer advocate who has been pushing a healthcare overhaul for decades, said his group had been distributing a memo touting the "10 Reasons to Support the Health Care Reform Bills." A government plan was only one of them.

"The health reform bills have many critical factors designed to make healthcare more accessible and more affordable," Pollack said in an interview. He and others noted that the bills working their way through the House and Senate included provisions that would transform the way Americans get health insurance -- even without a government plan.

"The public plan is not the essential element of reform," said Jim Kessler, vice president for policy at Third Way, a centrist Democratic think tank in Washington.

When it comes to strategy, many lawmakers long have seen a concession on the government-run plan as essential to getting any healthcare bill through the Senate, where 60 votes are needed to ensure passage.

All 40 Senate Republicans oppose the public option, as do some Democrats. Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-Nev.) has been working to overcome political obstacles in the Senate, where a small bipartisan group of lawmakers has been trying to reach a compromise.

"While Sen. Reid supports a public option, he also supports bipartisan compromise healthcare reform that cuts cost and provides coverage for all Americans," said Reid spokesman Jim Manley. "There are different proposals on the table that can accomplish that goal."

Which leads of course, to the obvious question, and that is, What about those progressives and liberals who are counting on a public option?

First, the bad news:

 

Obama's willingness to jettison the public option if necessary risks alienating some in his liberal base.

Jed Lewison, a liberal blogger, said that if a healthcare bill passed without a government-run program, grass-roots support for future Obama objectives may be more tepid.

"People's intensity will definitely diminish," Lewison said. "People have been listening to strong arguments for the public option coming from the administration. And they believe those arguments. If it comes down to where people feel like in the last few yards of the field, the rug was pulled out from underneath them, and they may not be as willing to work hard the next time around."

 

Lord knows, that's putting it mildly.  Read a few headlines on progressive blogs or tune in to shows like Rachel Maddow and Ed Schultz and you'll get an earful of rage every bit as scathing as what Obama faces on the right.

But see, this is where you have to think outside the box, shake off that "either-or" mindset, and study a little bit of history while you are at it.

In Newsweek, Jonathan Alter analyzes not just how Obama should sell health care reform, but how this bill compares with a few other pieces of landmark legislation of the past:

 

History suggests that major social policy unfolds on a continuum. The Social Security Act of 1935 disappointed liberal New Dealers because what was called "old-age insurance" covered only about half the adult population. It excluded farmhands, domestics, employees of small businesses, and most blacks. That was because FDR needed the votes of Southern Democrats, the Blue Dogs of their day. (The bill cleared the House Ways and Means Committee with only one Republican vote.) Similarly, the Civil Rights Act of 1957, immortalized in Robert Caro's Master of the Senate, was weak tea. It had to be strengthened by the Civil Rights Act of 1964 and the Voting Rights Act of 1965. In the later bills, Lyndon Johnson betrayed Southerners he had made deals with in 1957. If Nancy Pelosi can't break Rahm Emanuel's promise to Big Pharma's Billy Tauzin this year, she can try to break it in the future. And Tauzin will lobby for more favors as the all-important new regulations are issued. Nothing in Washington is ever set in stone.

The only thing that should be unbreakable in a piece of legislation is the principle behind it. In the case of Social Security, it was the security and peace of mind that came with the knowledge of a guaranteed old-age benefit. (Ronald Reagan and George W. Bush got slam-dunked when they tried to mess with that.) In the civil-rights bills, the principle was no discrimination on the basis of an unavoidable, preexisting "condition" like race.

The core principle behind health-care reform is--or should be--a combination of Social Security insurance and civil rights. Passage would end the shameful era in our nation's history when we discriminated against people for no other reason than that they were sick. A decade from now, we will look back in wonder that we once lived in a country where half of all personal bankruptcies were caused by illness, where Americans lacked the basic security of knowing that if they lost their jobs they wouldn't have to sell the house to pay for the medical treatments to keep them alive. We'll look back in wonder--that is, if we pass the bill.

 

Again, I hear you out there, screeching at me that if we don't do it NOW, we will NEVER do it.

I do not, however, hear any howling about HOW it is to get done.

And that, my friends, is where the divide-and-conquer part comes in.

Today's Huffington Post blog, "The News of Its Death is Greatly Exaggerated," by Mike Lux, author of The Progressive Revolution: How the Best in America Came to Be, is the smartest, savviest, shrewdest thing I've read yet on this subject.

First, he draws a scenario about what will happen if progressive Dems hold their ground, against all odds, to pass the bill as they want it to stand:

 

1. The House will find the votes to pass a comprehensive bill with a public option soon after they get back from August recess. That will be reasonably easy, because Pelosi will be able to peel off a reasonable number of Blue Dogs, many of whom have said they would support a public option, to vote for the bill.

2. The Senate will find the votes to pass a convoluted, tortured, unworkable bill, not only with no public option but so messed up and compromised to be unworkable anyway. This is less certain than number one, but Democrats will probably find a way to pass something.

3. The conference committee will sit for several weeks as Senators like Conrad say we will never pass a public option, House progressives says we will never pass something without a public option, and the White House, Pelosi, Reid, and conference committee members work out details to try to get something passed.

 

At that point, either the bill is dead, which would be an act of suicide for Democrats in both houses, OR, they look for a much smarter, clever way to get it done without having some sort of OK Corrall gunfight.

Lux writes:

 

A. The first is that conservative Senators are given a fig leaf compromise on the public option, so that they can say to people they forced a compromise, and then are brought over with all kinds of other incentives that make them more comfortable with the bigger bill.

B. The second is that the conference committee simply breaks the bill in half, one half being the less controversial part that everyone agrees upon, the other being the public option and the financing, both of which can go through the reconciliation process. Then Obama and Reid muscle the 50 votes they need for support.

 

WHAT was that again?

Break the bill IN HALF???

Lux says, not only yes, but HELL yes:

 

None of this is easy, and none of it is pretty, but having been through a ton of these kinds of issue fights, both from inside the Clinton White House and from the outside, I can tell you that all of this is doable. These kinds of rhetorical logjams happen all the time, where it looks like the House and the Senate are both unalterably dug in, and then magically deals get done. On important bills, effective Presidents and Congressional leaders find some tough-to-thread-the-needle sweet spot, or they use some uncomfortable or inelegant legislative tool, and things that matter can get done. The media and establishment conventional wisdom, which always tends toward the dire and toward the conservative scenarios, is sometimes proven wrong. So ye of little faith, do not give up hope. The worst thing sometimes happens, but not always. Politicians sometimes sell people out, but not always. Keep fighting for the public option.

 

So, again, I think that in many instances of liberal outrage, part of the problem is simply a basic lack of understanding about how the legislative process can work--and I include myself in that group, because I didn't have a clear picture of it myself until I did my homework. 

It does not have to be all-or-nothing, now-or-never.

There are nuances and options of all sorts to accomplish the same basic goals.  In the final analysis, I'm looking up at Obama on that tightrope, right?  And I know that sometimes that pole will dip toward the left, and sometimes it will dip toward the right, but eventually, he will stabilize it into a balanced, horizontal hold that will enable him to get to his destination.

And sure, the media-types will be disappointed, because they were hoping he would fall, since it makes a better B-roll story, and there will be die-hards on both sides who won't be happy no matter HOW he gets across that rope...but when the spotlight fades, and the audience's attention will be held, spellbound, by the next act...listen. 

Listen closely.

You will hear it.

Cheers...wafting in from outside the tent, as all those people standing out in the rain realize that the storm is over, and they can come in out of the cold.

 


34 Comments

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Why does your daughter not have insurance, if she works 50 - 60 hrs per week? I buy my own insurance, and a very good BC/BS policy including prescription drug coverage cost $114 per mo when I was 38. Now at 47 it costs $245. I don't know her age, but guess it's somewhere in between those points, so why can't she afford that?

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I got my son signed up for a $150/mo. BC/BS plan, which is $2500 deductible. There is no way he could handle that deductible, so I would cover it. I mainly wanted hospitalization coverage.

The bigger problem is is people that can't get coverage at all. That is why Medicare was passed in the 60s, when old people could not get a policy after retiring from their employer-based coverage. That was why GM had to offer continuing health coverage to pensioners. It's not just the money.

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theCleverBulldog:

She's an actor, working two part-time jobs in order to be able to audition, etc. In L.A., where she lives, there is a high cost of living in her area, also high costs for things related to her profession. Head-shots alone, which are required, can run $1000. Membership fee for the Screen Actors Guild, should you qualify, which she finally did last year: $2300, plus yearly dues. Acting classes, which often feature visiting casting directors, run $40/class and up. And so on. (That's not counting student loan repayments for her degree.)

After those expenses PLUS rent, bills, car pmt and ins., food, and emergencies (she seldom buys new clothes)--that simply doesn't leave enough for health insurance. Thank God for Planned Parenthood, which enables her to get yearly pap smears on a sliding scale, or she wouldn't be able to do that, either.

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Of course, we don't have to accept anything as unchangeable when it comes to politics, and Silver takes note of that fact:

Me? I would rather have a revolution. But we have to start somewhere.

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I think a false start leads us nowhere. Better to have no bill and redebate this in four years when things are fucking intolerable, than pass a lukewarm bill that only puts off the day of boiling.

Here's the deal. The liberal caucus in the House is bigger than the conservative Blue Dog caucus. 45 Senators have said they support a public option, compared to a handfull who oppose it. We only need 5 more to get a public option out of committee.

However, if we capitulate now, we give cover to those five senators to vote against it. We never force them to make the hard choice of going against the majority of the party. Obama is going to fight for the winning side, whichever side seems most likely to win. If he has to bring the power of his office to bear against one caucus, he will swing his guns around and point them at the weakest side. The weakest side is that side with the fewest numbers (the blue dogs) or the side that signals its willingness to cave. If he cannot get a bill without a public option, he will swing his guns behind getting a public option. What he won't do is side against those who are willing to torpedo the process.

Politics is warfare by other means, right. Well, this is assymetric warfare. We have the numbers, but we lack the guns (media and money), so we have to use other means of pushing our agenda forward. Study your history. No burgeoning insurgency ever survives who negotiates before they have struck a blow. They have to know you'll pull the trigger before they respect your gun.

Enough with the war metaphors. I'll finish with this - playing not to lose rarely results in victory.

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I understand expenses out there are very high, but I think if she looked into what insurance really costs she would find she could afford it. Many just assume they can't, but for someone so young the cost is pretty low, especially for a major medical policy. At worst case I would tell her to ditch the car payment and get a clunker (quick before they are all scrapped!). She should easily be able to afford health insurance with the money saved from no car payment.

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BullDog, your idea for a "clunker" with no car pmt is kinda silly; for one thing, she needs a reliable automobile for the extensive commutes that she has. Altho she's not that far from her work places, she never knows where she'll be going for classes or auditions or whatever.

Her car is very modest, a Yaris, that is only three yrs old, but gets superb gas mileage, which is something else she needs to consider with all the driving that becomes necessary.

The bottom line is that SAG does provide good health ins., but you have to work a certain number of days to qualify for, which is where the auditions come in...

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It's not a silly idea, it's practical. It comes down to choices and priorities. I think a cheap car and health insurance is better than a 12k car and no insurance. She has different priorities, that's fine, but why should the taxpayers pay for her insurance, when clearly she could buy it herself if she wanted to?

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First of all, my daughter pays taxes too. And as little money as she makes, she has said she would gladly pay higher taxes if people could get health care in this country.

Second of all, "CLEARLY" you don't know what you're talking about. For one thing, those "clunkers" you crow about have a distressing habit of breaking down constantly and requiring expensive repairs that put far greater strain on an hourly-wage employee than making $200/mo car payments on a reliable vehicle, which is what her car payments are.

Third, there are millions of creative artists in this country struggling just like my daughter to provide entertainment and inspiration for the rest of us. Most of them work multiple jobs to pay their bills and can barely make their rents each month, much less come up with expensive individual insurance premiums.

Their lives--and livelihoods--are precarious. You have no idea how much courage it takes for them to do what they do. My son fought in a war, and I think my daughter is every bit as brave as he is, just in a different way.

But hey, let's force them all into 9-to-5's where they may, MAY, have health ins benefits provided. That way nobody's taxpayer dollars would have to be affected.

AFter all, if the guy who wrote the Pulitzer Prize and Tony-winning Broadway play, RENT, had had health insurance, he probably wouldn't have died from an aortic tear in a hospital that was the only one they could find that would take an uninsured patient like him.

No more movies. No more television. No more museums. Let's get rid of 'em all! We don't need 'em!

Also, no more tourism, because people would have no desire to visit Broadway without the plays.

Wipe L.A. off the map, since it's a companay town and all those Craft Services employees, and lighting techs, and entertainment lawyers, and writers, and computer graphics artists as well as actors would no longer be employed.

We don't need 'em, because many of them are self-employed and can't afford health insurance and I sure don't want MY taxpayer dollars subsidizing them!

After all, what do I need with movies or television or plays or paintings or sculptures?

Let's all make PRACTICAL choices, shall we???

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First, I find it incredible that you compare serving in the military during a war, and risking your life, with following your 'dream' to become a rich and famous actress. One is self sacrificing (in the extreme), the other totally self serving. She is an actress because she enjoys it, and she wants to be rich and famous, not to serve some higher calling.

Considering she makes almost nothing, I'm not surprised she would be willing to pay higher taxes, since it would amount to diddly squat and she would get more in benefits than she paid in taxes.

Finally, per your own numbers, her car payment would cover her health insurance costs, proving my point that she could have insurance if she made it a priority. And an older car is not automatically unreliable, and since she is paying $2400 per year for the current one it is hard to believe it would cost anywhere near that to maintain. (You could just throw it away and replace it for less than that.)

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CB,

Would you feel differently if the aspiring dream of an individual was to enter another profession?

Sincere query. Thanks.

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It's not about the job one is pursuing, I have nothing against acting or the arts. I have a good friend who is a musician, and she dropped her insurance and it drives me nuts. I just think it is a very short sighted decision. In the case of Deanie's daughter, clearly she made the choice to drive a better car and drop the med insurance. I think that is a bad decision. I don't think people should expect someone else to pay for the things they need but aren't willing to pay for themselves, just so they can use their money to buy things they want. I want things too, and I want to keep my money so I can buy them for myself, not for others.

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Thanks for clarification.

Now, if I may, another query...

Is there any situation you believe we all should support (financially and in society) assisting others in acquiring needed healthcare resources and services they cannot afford?

Again, sincere query because I am interested.

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Yes. I must qualify it though by stating that there is a difference between 'CAN'T AFFORD' and 'CHOOSE NOT TO AFFORD', in this case I don't support using your money to buy things for me that I want or need but am not willing to sacrifice for myself. For the truly destitute, the truly needy, I support providing treatment for them even though they can't pay. That doesn't necessarily mean the same level of treatment, I think they deserve good, effective care, but it might mean less expensive alternatives.

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I'm sorry if I'm being dense, but could you please expand on, 'That doesn't necessarily mean the same level of treatment, I think they deserve good, effective care, but it might mean less expensive alternatives.'

Appreciate.

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Basically there are a number of expensive, cutting edge treatments that were unavailable to anyone a few years ago, so it's not unreasonable to say if they are very expensive then whatever was the standard treatment previously be used instead. And some things are not life saving and hence not required, like joint replacements.

Of course, this is all academic anyway, since Medicaid provides treatment for the indigent currently.

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A masterfully woven bit of tapestry you have here Deanie. You get an A+ on your homework.

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Deanie,

Thanks, as always.

While it's been said time and again, I believe the MSM is largely responsible for all the hysteria (of course, both political parties have members who have contributed greatly to this debacle too).

There is no plan - yet. There is one big mish mash of various elements put forth with little finesse and even less sagacity.

The processes, as many of the participants, are exhausting, frustrating and a bit nutty.

All the noise and chaos is serving only to deflect and negate the goal of providing much needed healthcare resources to all Americans.

We all need to communicate our priorities in this matter to our members of Congress and President respectfully, but assertively. Of course, prior to this we need to put the time and energy to ascertain the facts. Now that's a change I can believe in today and tomorrow!

We do indeed have the government we deserve!

Rec'd.

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Jonnie and Aunt Sam, one word:

THANKS!!!

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Deanie, you say what I've been trying to say for the last week and more. I look at the abuse Obama has to take and I think why would anyone want that job? Why not just trade oil futures and make 100 x the salary?

Because I claim a position on the left I'm more sensitive to the button throwers than those yelling Nazi. And I don't want to go out in the rain, though more than once I've felt that those claiming to own the tent would like to do nothing more than evict me.

So thank you. If I find myself out in the rain and next to you, I'll be happy to hold my umbrella over your head.

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Amike, I'd be overjoyed to share an umbrella with you! Let it rain!

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Most experts on Senate rules doubt that the reconciliation processs is a feasible workaround for any section of healthcare reform that has the critical elements of insurance restructuring, including a public option. I'm not one of those experts, but there's enough of a consensus to make me doubt the optimism of those who see reconciliation as a means of avoiding a filibuster.

On the other hand, the House is likely to pass a bill with a public option, and while the Senate is not, the two will ultimately need to be reconciled (that's a different use of the word) via a conference committee.

At that point, the possibility of a public option surviving would depend on the level of public demand for it. I'm not optimistic, but it's possible. If it survives, it might trigger a filibuster, and then the challenge will be to get 60 votes for cloture. This might be possible if some conservative Democrats can be persuaded to vote to cut off debate with the understanding that they would then vote against the final bill. Since the latter would only need 50 votes, it might pass.

These are long shots, in my view, and I agree with those who assert that the reform proposals would contain much of enormous value, even without a public option, particularly if a strong form of non-profit cooperatives were substituted. On the other hand, a public option would still be optimal, and continued public clamor for it would pressure Congress to include it, or if not, to design a non-profit co-op alternative that is robust enough to achieve many of the same goals. This is sufficient reason to keep up the pressure.

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This is from wikipedia, sourced from Senate.gov


As the Presiding Officer of the Senate may not be fully aware of the parliamentary situation currently facing the Senate, staff from the Senate Parliamentarian's office sit on the Senate dais to advise the Presiding Officer on how to respond to inquiries and motions from Senators. The role of the parliamentary staff is strictly advisory; the Presiding Officer is in no way required to follow their advice, though they almost always do so. The office also refers bills to the appropriate committees on behalf of the Senate's Presiding Officer. If facing the dais, the Parliamentarian is the second from the left.

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I am very doubtful that the compromise solution likely to come out of this will even come close to what is possible on the cost containment side.

Where this really falls short though is how it positions us in the global competition for job creation and competitiveness.

It is difficult to accept the argument of persons who attack labor costs in this country when healthcare is such a major factor in that equation while at the same time having those same persons refuse to adopt measures that would optimally control costs.

We have been faced with and continue to be perplexed by a disingenuos and inconsistent approach to ALL the economic puzzle pieces.

As long as congress remains in its tragically corrupt state and sees inequity as a viable solution we are sure to remain on a downhill slide from which we cannot recover.

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Thanks for tarring those who agree with you as 'idealogues'. Great for dialogue.

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Deanie doesn't do dialogue. She does cheerleading.

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Deanie, your are a peacemaker: writing to keep left and right in dialogue, writing to keep left and left-center in dialogue. We liberals need to be reminded that, while we love to despise conservatives who see the world in black-and-white, we do the same ... and it hurts chances for seeing common ground - not only between right & left, but within the left. It's hard work, but it's a way of keeping our eyes open for those times when a middle path appears out of the fog.

Somewhat off-topic:

TPM is mainstreaming your long-time subject:

ECHOES OF '90S RIGHT-WING VIOLENCE
You have to be pretty warped to see a straight line from Waco through Oklahoma City and 9/11 to ... health care reform.

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Peacemaker! Wow, that's the nicest thing anyone's ever called me, Tom, out of, shall we say, many colorful choices? ;-D

And yeah, absolutely, I don't think you have to be warped at all to see a line running from Waco to OkCity to the health care reform madness (9-11, not so much), but it's the same scary folk who consider the government to be their enemy, and put a black guy at the head of it and geez Louise the hysteria! Southern Poverty Law Center has been tracking a serious uptick in hate groups and websites, and Obama's had more death threats than any other president in our history.

This strapping on of weapons at health care reform rallies is nothing more than a form of intimidation--I asked my gun-nut friend Robby and he agreed (for the record, he does not agree with that by a long shot and thinks it should stop)--and a serious one at that. YOu should be able to attend a political rally and express your opinion in any way you please without fear of getting shot.

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Thanks Tom. Just felt I needed to say that.

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Another good posting, Stilli. You and Deanie Mills are two of the regular posters here that I find myself really respecting, even though neither of you are political "experts" (and don't pretend to be).
Like you I haven't given up on health care reform and realize it includes a lot more than a public option. I do think there's still a chance for including a public option, based on the most recent comments from the administration and congressional dems. I think this is true despite today's poll results, which I think represent the maximum success level that opponents can achieve with their disinformation campaign. I hope. Anyway, I think it is downhill from here for "death panels," etc.

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Oops, I meant "Another good posting, Deanie. You and Stilli are..."
Jeez, it's a bad sign when you have four cups of coffee before 9 a.m. and you still can't keep things straight.

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Hoosier, even if I drank coffee I wouldn't be able to keep things straight...

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I think that it's useful idea to let Medicare payment to docs for end-of-life wishes consultations to be a stand-alone bill. It became a distraction of lies and fear, but it is important to potential cost-containment. If no one knows that I want my plug pulled, perhaps my kids might not wish to make that decision out of guilt. (Yes, I know I can make my wish to extend my life at all costs, too.)

Nate is right about FDR and Social Security, but the the political climate now is different. Obama and the Dems may not have a "later on." It's arguable, but that's what I think, barring a huge pandemic, or some game-changing event.

If we ae mandated to purchase private insurance, and there are imposed rules about accepting those with pre-existing conditions, caps on deductibles, caps on out-of-pocket expenses, no group bargaining on drug prices, how the hell much will the premiums be?? How will it really affect small business owners?

The notion that "nothing in washington is set in stone" sounds reasonable, and may be true in a few select instances. But how often lately has Congress really reversed itself even after some piece of legislation is found to be crappy? Prescription drugs for Seniors cost $500 billion more than Congress was told and left that big Donut Hole in drug coverage; they haven't re-written that law. Wiretapping? No child left behind? The Patriot Act? TARP, for godssake? Plenty of hearings we get, no new laws for oversight.

I swear, every advocate I listen to on the teevee can make their demand for public option, but all have forgotten that its original purpose was that without it THERE WILL BE NO MEANINGFUL ECONOMIC RECOVERY. Obama doesn't even sell it that way any more!

If the incrementalists are right, that really all Obama ever wanted was Universality in health care coverage, so be it. But that washington insiders are already writing obituaries for the public option seems more about their beliefs than what's possible, and what's good for the country.

Uh, and by the way, screw Wall Street, and the Beamers they drove in on! If there is no People's Recovery, they may be eating cake agian one day in the not-too-distant future.

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All or nothing? The "all" already went out the window when single-payer got tossed before the circus ever even got to town. The "nothing" is what we would have if a bill goes down without the public option. The public plan IS the mean between extremes and without it there will be no cost control - the cost of our current health care system happens to be the huge elephant in the ring eating all the peanuts.

The public option death knell is simply a ruse to get us off the backs of certain blue dogs. You're right in saying that nothing is as yet set in stone. Thereofore, we continue the fight for the public option and give no quarter. The public option IS our bottom line.

Instead of controlling cost through a public option, they now want to throw that money into the coffers of the insurance companies by mandating that we all purchase insurance, sibsidizing it with our tax dollars, but doing so without any controls placed on the private insurance companies. That would be the equivalent of the massive bailout of the banks applied to the insurance industry.

Do not fold up your protest signs and go home with your tail between your legs! Get after those blue dogs and keep the presure on! This fight is just beginning to heat up and the tables will turn if we stick with it.


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Deanie Mills

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