More on Tiller and the Taliban
Yesterday I posted on the political assassination of Dr. Tiller here at TPM; I also posted the same picture and text at my home blog. The title of my post was: "Dr. Tiller or why search the world for Taliban, when they grow wild at home?".This morning I received the following comment from the lady at the left:
Debra J.M. Smith said...Obama said, "However profound our differences as Americans over difficult issues such as abortion, they cannot be resolved by heinous acts of violence." --If Obama only cared that much about the countless babies who died at the hands of that abortionist...
A family member said, "Today we mourn the loss of our husband, father and grandfather. Today's event is an unspeakable tragedy for all of us and for George's friends and patients. This is particularly heart wrenching because George was shot down in his house of worship, a place of peace." Wow, how about the wombs that all of those babies were in? The womb is supposed to be a safe place of peace for a baby. But that monster would intrude and kill each one of them, with no remorse.
And I do not feel sorry for a family who loved a murderer. And I sure do NOT feel sorry for a church that had no problem allowing a murderer to attend.
Debra J.M. Smith
of
www.InformingChristians.com
If you visit her web page,
you will see that she is no shrinking violet and certainly would
welcome controversy with some satanical lefties. I myself don't feel up
to the job; the best I was able to muster was the following:
I just published Ms. Smith's, murderous, hypocritical and thoroughly disgusting little letter because it proves the point of my post. Why are we fighting Afghanistan's Taliban, when we have our hands full fighting our own?
I'm sure that many of TPMs readers can do much better than that and I encourage them, and any friends they might have on their mailing list to do so.
I doubt that this will put even a dent in Ms. Smith's self-righteousness, but I think she should feel a little heat.













She puts up this prayer after spending so much time on hating Dr. Tiller.
Amazing Grace
He forgave me, and set me free.
He set me free from the bondage of it all,
The bondage of my own and that of my brothers'.
His precious grace for me is clearly seen,
When I extend that grace to others.
Guess she ran out of grace. Did her God?
June 2, 2009 4:19 PM | Reply | Permalink
http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/gregorzap/2009/05/taunting-christians.php
Here is an pold post of mine from weeks ago. It spells out her tactics.
June 2, 2009 4:20 PM | Reply | Permalink
"The womb is supposed to be a safe place of peace for a baby. But that monster would intrude and kill each one of them, with no remorse."
Where is the remorse for the mother whose life would be at risk if she was forced to give birth? Where is the remorse for the baby who would be born with a fatal birth defect, whose only experience of the the world would be connected to a life support machine?
Dr. Tiller was a hero, performing hero's labor under tremendous stress and danger. He saved women's lives.
June 2, 2009 5:59 PM | Reply | Permalink
Just so.
June 2, 2009 7:54 PM | Reply | Permalink
Dear Ms...
I represent Americans for Mandatory Abortions. Our membership has recently shot up to 3 million from 20 overnite. I just sent out circulars quoting all of your hate mail.
We now have a war chest of 70 billion dollars to begin our lobbying efforts.
The government will one day fund all abortions and grant scholarships to ivy league schools for every woman who voluntarily undergoes an abortion.
THe final goal of our organizations is to guarantee that every woman of child bearing age in this country will have one abortion by executive order.
Very truly yours,
Negative Population Growth
June 2, 2009 6:18 PM | Reply | Permalink
I hereby award you the Perfect Irony Award of the month.
I hope you sent it to her -- and I also hope she doesn't know where you live.
June 2, 2009 6:26 PM | Reply | Permalink
hahahha. Oh my god in the midst of such tragedy. I should not laugh. But I aint erasing this. I am an old man in my pj's, if they decide to come after me--well I am ready.
I debated whether to submit this CVille. But what the hell.
This demonization has got to be confronted. From everything I can tell, the decedent was a decent man trying to help women. I have not read anywhere that he had mansions and yachts and 20 million dollar bonuses.
They gunned him down IN CHURCH.
A tragedy of the first order.
June 2, 2009 6:53 PM | Reply | Permalink
Dick, I can't get onto the main page of the readers listings, because someone's posted a spam link to an ad, that automatically kicks you over. Are you having this problem?
June 2, 2009 6:57 PM | Reply | Permalink
No
June 2, 2009 6:59 PM | Reply | Permalink
Are you sure? My listing shows 4 or 5 solid Viagra posts, but whenever I try to go to the main Readers Page, which shows all the readers posts at once, it just kicks me off the page. I can't figure this out.
June 2, 2009 7:21 PM | Reply | Permalink
Fuck, this is a serious problem...the second spam post has embedded JavaScript in a script block that is slipping past whatever checkers are in place:
E-mailing the admin.
June 2, 2009 7:29 PM | Reply | Permalink
(Only posting this here because there is a slim chance the report will make it through an e-mail spam filter :/)
June 2, 2009 7:38 PM | Reply | Permalink
Not for me Q. But in the chat room they say viagra is flowing like gravy at a southern cook out.
no kidding. I am not joking
June 2, 2009 7:50 PM | Reply | Permalink
It's getting RIDICULOUS!
Oy...
June 2, 2009 7:59 PM | Reply | Permalink
(thunk)
Perfect.
June 2, 2009 7:58 PM | Reply | Permalink
Thanks David, for outing this ugly "Christian" American.
It's so hard sometimes to be a Christian and admit to it when there are so many disgraceful people running around proclaiming how Christian they are yet they show such clear signs of inner disturbance, hateful sentiments, pitiless vengefulness and bloodlust.
June 2, 2009 6:55 PM | Reply | Permalink
I don't think they should be able to call themselves christians
They aren't.
June 2, 2009 8:00 PM | Reply | Permalink
If someone believes him/herself to be a christian, that person IS a christian, since it is a belief, no? Maybe the question should be instead: Why would I want to be one?
June 2, 2009 8:24 PM | Reply | Permalink
I dunno
there are some basic tenants. Like turning the other cheek, loving one's neighbor as they would themselves, helping strangers, and not judging (not their job).
I don't see these people even minimally meeting those requirements, so as far as I am concerned they should call themselves something else.
(shrug)
It has nothing to do with belief, C'Ville, it's just logic.
June 2, 2009 8:27 PM | Reply | Permalink
So there are those who call themselves christians, and those who call themselves christians and who decides? Did George Bush turn the other cheek? Did Ronald Reagan?
Should there be a board which decides who is christian enough?
But you say it is logic. Sorry, That totally eludes my brain. How is it logic to say that someone who declares him/herself to be a christian is, or is not? And who applies the logic? Who says what is logical?
George Bush claimed and I have no doubt that he believes himself to be a christian. I would not dispute it. I only dispute that it is a good thing, considering what people of his ilk have done and continue to do.
June 2, 2009 8:58 PM | Reply | Permalink
I am saying there is criteria and listed some.
Just like anything else, C'ville. If you call yourself a female, a dress and stiletto heels won't make it so. You need the equipment. If you call yourself a fireman, you had better have some training. If you call yourself a salesclerk, you had better have done some selling.
I suppose I can call myself a chicken, but anyone looking at me would undoubtably know that isn't exactly true.
This ain't rocket science. Christians follow Jesus Christ and abide (or try to abide) by his teachings. These people do not. Thus, as far as I am concerned they aren't christians.
Who judges? Well I was taught I would know them by their actions, so, I guess I do judge them by that.
Then again, maybe you really think I AM a chicken.
June 2, 2009 10:10 PM | Reply | Permalink
Andrew Sullivan calls them "Christianists."
June 2, 2009 10:20 PM | Reply | Permalink
Did you check into this one today, Bwak?
June 3, 2009 3:08 AM | Reply | Permalink
Never mind. You made the only comment on it.
I forgot.
(slaps own forehead)
June 3, 2009 3:09 AM | Reply | Permalink
Christians believe in christ, right? So the whole thing is based on belief. And there is no DNA test to determine the reality of that belief, since it is completely of the mind. It is amorphous -- impossible to prove or disprove because you cannot know what is in another person's mind.
If you believe you are a chicken, who am I to say that YOU DON"T TRULY BELIEVE IT? (not the same as saying it is true)
If a person believes he/she is better than everyone else in the universe, who is to say that they don't? There is no way to prove what is in their minds. If a person believes that life begins when a sperm and an egg meets, it is what they believe. Who is to say that they don't believe it?
But if we are critical thinkers (WOW! WHAT A CONCEPT!) we might check bwak's dna and -oops! Not a chicken at all, but descended from mayan royalty -- kewl!
And science will tell us that if so many egg-sperm combos are rejected in utero, maybe the big DADDY does not consider that cell combo to be a living, breathing (oops! sorry) person.
So what is your point? that people who believe themselves to be christians aren't because they don't conform to your idea of what a christian is? I invite you to visit thousands of churches to get rid of all those who fall short of your qualifications. Good luck!
June 3, 2009 9:03 PM | Reply | Permalink
There is a series of books called the "Left Behind" series. It is written by a Bible scholar and fiction author. They collaborated, using the information in Revelations as the basis, then weaving it into a fictional account of the end times. The premise is that that the "Rapture" occurs, and all those "true" Christians go to heaven and everyone stays here to live through the end days. Even if you are not a Christian the series is a VERY good read, full of suspense and packed w/ action.
My point in mentioning it is that it addresses those who are "left behind" and those who aren't, with many who "thought" they were Christians, finding themselves still here, then having to deal with the consequences.
God will be the one who decides who is and who isn't.
June 3, 2009 9:23 PM | Reply | Permalink
Just another example of the glee that christianistas have at the very thought of everyone (regardless of morality or lack thereof) going to their unbelievably unimaginative reward.
Question: If you were truly GOD, don't you think you could probably promise something BEYOND a regular person's imagination for eternal reward? Never mind. Have fun with your fantasy of everyone burning in hell (how imaginative) except you.
June 3, 2009 9:52 PM | Reply | Permalink
Jan, I never no how no way ever said anytime that I am going to Heaven and everyone who does not believe the way I believe is going to Hell. Not even in the books I referenced does it say that everyone not Raptured will go to Hell.
You have a problem w/ Christians, I get that. I DON'T have problems w/ non-Christians, or even atheists for that matter. I am not an "in your face" Christian. Whether you believe or not is totally, completely up to you. I make no judgment on your decency, morality, or goodness based on your contempt for Christianity. I do not ever attempt to marginalize you for your beliefs, and quite frankly, I'm amazed that you would respond to me in that way. I have never been anything but supportive of you...
June 3, 2009 10:33 PM | Reply | Permalink
They aren't my qualifications, C'Ville. But, whatev
June 3, 2009 9:28 PM | Reply | Permalink
I agree with you but they do. They are fundamentalists every bit as bad as the most barbaric and misguided Taliban or crazed, ignorant backwoods mullah.
June 2, 2009 11:39 PM | Reply | Permalink
The womb is supposed to be a safe place of peace for a baby. But that monster would intrude and kill each one of them, with no remorse.
I guess God doesn't know that, because He kills babies in the womb.
It's called a miscarriage and you better hope you don't have one in a Catholic Hospital. link
Muslim or Christian David, the Taliban decide which rules and laws they will follow, and which ones they make up that you must follow too, or else.
June 2, 2009 8:48 PM | Reply | Permalink
I am a born again Christian home school mom, turned right wing Christian activist.
Isn't she going against biblical teaching? Didn't Paul tell women to shut up and leave the important church stuff to the men? Let's see what the Great Gazoogle has to say:
1 Corinthians 14:34-35 (King James Version)
34Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also saith the law.
35And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.
Zip it, sister, lest ye be damned to eternal hellfire.
June 2, 2009 8:56 PM | Reply | Permalink
You see, commie, when god wrote the bible he obviously didn't have the foresight to know how people would eventually evolve. I guess the all-knowing schtick didn't include any ability to see into the future, or even a particularly moral view of the world.
Too bad the Big Book couldn't have been something that would actually teach people god behavior instead of betraying little more than the thinking patterns of those who wrote it down at the time.
To bad also that this witch has an army of people behind her who are as morally bereft as she is.
June 3, 2009 12:38 PM | Reply | Permalink
freudian slip! I meant "good" behavior!
June 3, 2009 3:13 PM | Reply | Permalink
Good God!!!
It's ok, I use "Next to Godliness" hand soap from Trader Joe's. Somehow, it hasn't burned the skin off my hands yet.
June 3, 2009 8:41 PM | Reply | Permalink
And it never will, but it might not smell good.
June 3, 2009 8:47 PM | Reply | Permalink
http://evolvefish.com/fish/SinCleanerProducts.html
June 3, 2009 9:30 PM | Reply | Permalink
"Wow, how about the wombs that all of those babies were in? The womb is supposed to be a safe place of peace for a baby. But that monster would intrude and kill each one of them, with no remorse."
I want ignorant losers like Ms. Smith to tell me where the woman is in all this. In her formulation, there is no woman; only a womb.
Does she think that woman have any rights, or only the obligation to be fruitful and multiply? Do they have any right to happiness, other than the happiness they might find in raising and bearing children?
And finally, I want Ms. Smith the explain to me why abortion is wrong in the following situation:
"In 1994 my wife and I found out that she was pregnant. The pregnancy was difficult and unusually uncomfortable but her doctor repeatedly told her things were fine. Sometime early in the 8th month my wife, an RN who at the time was working in an infertility clinic asked the Dr. she was working for what he thought of her discomfort. He examined her and said that he couldn’t be certain but thought that she might be having twins. We were thrilled and couldn’t wait to get a new sonogram that hopefully would confirm his thoughts. Two days later our joy was turned to unspeakable sadness when the new sonogram showed conjoined twins. Conjoined twins alone is not what was so difficult but the way they were joined meant that at best only one child would survive the surgery to separate them and the survivor would more than likely live a brief and painful life filled with surgery and organ transplants. We were advised that our options were to deliver into the world a child who’s life would be filled with horrible pain and suffering or fly out to Wichita Kansas and to terminate the pregnancy under the direction of Dr. George Tiller.
We made an informed decision to go to Kansas. One can only imagine the pain borne by a woman who happily carries a child for 8 months only to find out near the end of term that the children were not to be and that she had to make the decision to terminate the pregnancy and go against everything she had been taught to believe was right. This was what my wife had to do. Dr. Tiller is a true American hero. The nightmare of our decision and the aftermath was only made bearable by the warmth and compassion of Dr. Tiller and his remarkable staff. Dr. Tiller understood that this decision was the most difficult thing that a woman could ever decide and he took the time to educate us and guide us along with the other two couples who at the time were being forced to make the same decision after discovering that they too were carrying children impacted by horrible fetal anomalies. I could describe in great detail the procedures and the pain and suffering that everyone is subjected to in these situations. However, that is not the point of the post. We can all imagine that this is not something that we would wish on anyone. The point is that the pain and suffering were only mitigated by the compassion and competence of Dr. George Tiller and his staff."
Should this woman have risked her own life in order to give birth to a severely deformed child? And, if so, is there any instance in which a woman would be justified in terminating a pregnancy?
In my opinion, only a monster would completely subordinate women to the dictates of their womb. You are such a monster, Ms. Smith. Your definition of "life" inevitably leads only to more suffering and death.
June 2, 2009 11:53 PM | Reply | Permalink
In the case of actual miscarriage, similar lack of concern for the Mom.
"When there's a heartbeat: miscarriage management in Catholic-owned hospitals." Am J Public Health
Catholic-owned hospital ethics committees denied approval of uterine evacuation while fetal heart tones were still present, forcing physicians to delay care or transport miscarrying patients to non-Catholic-owned facilities. Some physicians intentionally violated protocol because they felt patient safety was compromised. Although Catholic doctrine officially deems abortion permissible to preserve the life of the woman, Catholic-owned hospital ethics committees differ in their interpretation of how much health risk constitutes a threat to a woman's life.
June 3, 2009 12:07 AM | Reply | Permalink