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Why the bible MUST be interpreted literally - or not used at all
A VENGEFUL AND ANGRY GOD!
I am going to agree with fundamentalist Evangelical Christians - for the first and hopefully last time in my life. I have been reading many posts from Christian leaders, as well as excerpts from their books and articles they have written in magazines. I have also visited the websites and read through the literature of some of the largest megachurches (Lakewood Church in Houston - Joel Osteen & Saddleback Church in Lake Forest, CA,) in the Nation. I've read some more liberal interpretations of the bible in the Unitarian Universalist Association of Congregations website information. I've read through the articles and blogs on websites such as the 700 Club (our good friend Pat Robertson) and Promise Keepers. I've even forced myself to read the hate filled "end times" garbage on the rapture ready site (I'm banned from posting there after posting my "Christians and Torture" article. Apparently they don't want any conflicting opinions.)
What I've discovered is basically what you might expect. There are a plethora of different interpretations on every single passage of the bible. Each denomination seems to have a different way of interpreting the bible. The Unitarians seem to find a way to twist the bible verses to allow the celebration fo roe v wade - as well as the acceptance of homosexuals and the belief that they should be allowed to marry. The folks at the megachurches are generally about 2/3 on the scale when it comes to interpreting the bible. They don't take a literal interpretation - but will bend the words to make it OK to drive three SUV's, have a giant house in the suburbs where they just don't have to deal with "urban" people or problems. They have small group at the local "Dinner's Ready" franchise and make the weeks meals - and talk about how their husbands all seem to have a problem, no an addiction to pornography. One woman starts sobbing uncontrollably becasuse she caught her husband looking at Maxim at the dentists office. He had it tucked inside the cover of a Spirituality Today magazine. She said it made her feel that he wanted the women in that magazine more than he wanted her. (TIP FROM ME - HE DOES. WHEN YOU COME HOME WEARING "MOM" JEANS AND A SWEATSHIRT - OF COURSE HE'S GOING TO GET A BONE FOR ALYSSA MILANO - DUH!)
And of course the fundamentalist Christian Churches take a literal view of the bible. They view it as the inerrant word of God. There is no interpretation to fit their lives (well - no interpretation that can't be explained by the pastor anyway. It's simple - here is a brief rundown of some of their biblical truths .
But of course the Bible contains both errors and contradictions. Unfortunately - it's clear that each religious group simply bends the bible to fit the way of life they have chosen to live. What's wrong with that - you ask? Well - I think that their hypocrisy should be made clear for the World to see. How dare they try to keep gay people from marrying? How dare they tr to judge me with a doctrine that's clearly just bent to fit whatever way of life they have chosen to live. They ignore certain parts of the bible because they have "interpreted them not to apply to their lives". But they will try to push their way of life onto a woman's right to choose. As my friend kalakitty17 pointed out - many of the women fighting so vehimently against abortion had them themselves as younger women. Many of them found the "Lord" through their struggle to deal with that deeply personal issue. But they want to take that right away from other women - and possibly keep them from finding the "Lord" - or from having another religious experience?
So either the bible is the inerrant word of God, and you are committing heracy or blasphemy by your selfish interpretation, or it's just a book that you can use as a guide to live your life. If you choose the latter - just make sure you don't expect others to make the same choice. There are many things that a civilized society would find abhorrant about a literal interpretation of the Bible. I personally find it comical - and can see it bears no more truth than the Greek Gods of Mount Olympus. Once man believed in these dieties as well. And if it's a literal interpretation we must accept - I'll take Zeus over Jesus any day. At least he knew how to party. Any God who likes to disguise himself as a bull and mate with hot females - well - actually that's kind of sick. Can I change my pick?
What I've discovered is basically what you might expect. There are a plethora of different interpretations on every single passage of the bible. Each denomination seems to have a different way of interpreting the bible. The Unitarians seem to find a way to twist the bible verses to allow the celebration fo roe v wade - as well as the acceptance of homosexuals and the belief that they should be allowed to marry. The folks at the megachurches are generally about 2/3 on the scale when it comes to interpreting the bible. They don't take a literal interpretation - but will bend the words to make it OK to drive three SUV's, have a giant house in the suburbs where they just don't have to deal with "urban" people or problems. They have small group at the local "Dinner's Ready" franchise and make the weeks meals - and talk about how their husbands all seem to have a problem, no an addiction to pornography. One woman starts sobbing uncontrollably becasuse she caught her husband looking at Maxim at the dentists office. He had it tucked inside the cover of a Spirituality Today magazine. She said it made her feel that he wanted the women in that magazine more than he wanted her. (TIP FROM ME - HE DOES. WHEN YOU COME HOME WEARING "MOM" JEANS AND A SWEATSHIRT - OF COURSE HE'S GOING TO GET A BONE FOR ALYSSA MILANO - DUH!)
And of course the fundamentalist Christian Churches take a literal view of the bible. They view it as the inerrant word of God. There is no interpretation to fit their lives (well - no interpretation that can't be explained by the pastor anyway. It's simple - here is a brief rundown of some of their biblical truths .
- God created the Earth and the sky and the Universe about 6000 years ago.
- They were created in six literal days - not time periods - days. Nuff Said
- God flooded the earth and put a 600 year old (literal years, not time periods) man in charge of gathering two of every kind of animal (yes - EVERY ANIMAL ON EARTH - INCLUDING THE DINOSAURS)
- Gays are an abomination. As are ugly lesbians. They are up in the air on the pretty "lipstick" variety - and need to conduct more internet "research". They should not be allowed to marry, adopt children, or get insurance benefits amongts sodomites sharing a domicile.
- Abortion is an abomination and should be labeled a genocide. Anyone supporting the murder of babies should be put in jail.
- All that stuff about shellfish being an abomination, and not working on the sabbath - that's only for the jews to follow. Even though the homosexuality issue was in the same passage - we've chosen that to be the inerrant word of God. The bible contains no errors or contradictions.
But of course the Bible contains both errors and contradictions. Unfortunately - it's clear that each religious group simply bends the bible to fit the way of life they have chosen to live. What's wrong with that - you ask? Well - I think that their hypocrisy should be made clear for the World to see. How dare they try to keep gay people from marrying? How dare they tr to judge me with a doctrine that's clearly just bent to fit whatever way of life they have chosen to live. They ignore certain parts of the bible because they have "interpreted them not to apply to their lives". But they will try to push their way of life onto a woman's right to choose. As my friend kalakitty17 pointed out - many of the women fighting so vehimently against abortion had them themselves as younger women. Many of them found the "Lord" through their struggle to deal with that deeply personal issue. But they want to take that right away from other women - and possibly keep them from finding the "Lord" - or from having another religious experience?
So either the bible is the inerrant word of God, and you are committing heracy or blasphemy by your selfish interpretation, or it's just a book that you can use as a guide to live your life. If you choose the latter - just make sure you don't expect others to make the same choice. There are many things that a civilized society would find abhorrant about a literal interpretation of the Bible. I personally find it comical - and can see it bears no more truth than the Greek Gods of Mount Olympus. Once man believed in these dieties as well. And if it's a literal interpretation we must accept - I'll take Zeus over Jesus any day. At least he knew how to party. Any God who likes to disguise himself as a bull and mate with hot females - well - actually that's kind of sick. Can I change my pick?
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Let us pray.
May 6, 2009 11:15 AM | Reply | Permalink
(Blesses himself)
Wot?!?!
May 6, 2009 2:51 PM | Reply | Permalink
ha Did somebody sneeze?
May 6, 2009 2:59 PM | Reply | Permalink
Who are you and what have you done with the good Reverend?
May 6, 2009 12:29 PM | Reply | Permalink
The reverend is locked carefully away inside my head. He's one of my "alters" - and doesn't come out as often. But I think with the whole gay marriage thing - a visit from the rev is eminent. Especially with JTP weighing in on the issue. JTP is of course the street name for Joe The Plumber. He also goes by the initials TP - for The plumber - but many insist it's just for trailer park
May 6, 2009 3:05 PM | Reply | Permalink
'Nam and eight padres, (feelie-spirit too), thanked us.
May 6, 2009 1:34 PM | Reply | Permalink
Um.
Ruth is not nearly as interesting(hot) when read literally.
(The English translations I'm familiar with, anyway, most of which were, I believe, translated from ancient Greek translations of some other language nearly lost to antiquity.)
May 6, 2009 1:39 PM | Reply | Permalink
How cute and ironic that there is currently a big black and blue cross to the right of the screen, with an advert for an online Christian dating service, LOL.
When I get home tonight I will pore through the notes in my Bible and leave a comment showing you where great chunks of a First Testament chapter are duplicated word for word in another chapter. I love using that in an argument with someone who tells me to take the Bible literally, since it is inspired by God alone, yada yada yada. I always ask whether God suffered hiccups.
May 6, 2009 1:53 PM | Reply | Permalink
Found it:
1 Kings 8:62 The Dedication of the Temple
and
2 Chronicles 6:12 Solomon's Prayer of Dedication
Start at those two verses and continue on for several pages in each chapter and compare them word for word. Now, perhaps duplication was "inspired" but I just find it odd, myself.
If nothing else, it makes for good trivia at a Bible Study gathering.
May 6, 2009 5:21 PM | Reply | Permalink
"Unfortunately - it's clear that each religious group simply bends the bible to fit the way of life they have chosen to live."
I don't think this is at all true.
Many, perhaps even most, Christians do use the Bible to justify the life they've chosen to live. But I know that many who are Christians (I would call them "liberal" Christians) choose to live their life in a way that fits their interpretation of what the Bible teaches and all of it is very positive, very uplifting, and has nothing to do with the fundamentalists you obviously despise.
Critics of moronic fundamentalist Christianity, it's leaders and it's drive-thrus often make the mistake of using the label "Christian" so broadly and indiscriminately that they demonstrate only that they know they don't like fundamentalists, but don't know enough about the wide spectrum of belief to understand how foolish and bigoted they too look in the eyes of those who know this simply isn't true.
I'll never defend a religious bigot or a fundamentalists beliefs or the actions of the charlatans who use the label "Christian" to milk millions out of a fearful ignorant population. But it just isn't right to smear the millions who call themselves Christian, who lead lives much (if not exactly) like yours crazedandconfused and whose beliefs are identical or nearly identical in every other respect. So please, don't use so broad a brush.
PS: The Bible was never intended to be read as "literally true" or as an historic record. No Jewish scholar would ever attempt to characterize the entire Bible as the literal word of God. Likewise for any legitimate, Christian scholar. That is now and has always been an utterly preposterous position.
May 6, 2009 3:21 PM | Reply | Permalink
oleeb:
I agree with you 100% - my goal is only to challenge Christianity to deal with the elements that have hijacked what can be a very peaceful religion. The Republican Party and the fundamentalists have bonded together in an orgy of evil - with Republican leaders on TV denouncing evolution and global warming in the name of their fundamentalist views (it's not even their views - but the views of their ignoramt constituency.
We ask the Muslims to deal with the violent extremism - and I hope very much they have the ability and honest desire to do so. But America must find a way to deal with extremism and balance it with the first Amendment. We will not progress as a species until we promote science and truth over myth and hate.
May 6, 2009 4:47 PM | Reply | Permalink
You state a very different goal here than your more fundamental attack of the Christian faith.
Here you recognize that some outside the Christian faith, or moved by some other force of passion, have "hijacked" that faith in name according to your own subjective judgment.
Then you charge Christians with bringing down the hijackers. Do we charge United, AA or Frontier with doing the same?
Why don't you lend a hand and stop with the prejudices versus millions whose specific views and stories you do not know, and focus on the hijackers and their true source of self-appointed authority.
May 6, 2009 6:11 PM | Reply | Permalink
Okay, I understand. But toward that end I'd just suggest being a bit less general in one's condemnation. After all, Martin Luther King, Jr. was a Christian, yet many Christians (very unlike him in every way) cheered at his murder so the general label is, to say the least, very imprecise. This is the same problem one runs into overgeneralizing about any group of people.
May 6, 2009 6:35 PM | Reply | Permalink
Amen!
May 6, 2009 5:30 PM | Reply | Permalink
How can you expect this post to be accepted as literalism in critique, with this wide-stanced positioning astride the schismatical chasms of Christianity?
At the very least; You MUST Choose:
May 6, 2009 4:30 PM | Reply | Permalink
So you could say something like: Christian denominations = the original "cherry pickers"
May 6, 2009 4:57 PM | Reply | Permalink
Organized religion is a broader issue than Biblical interpretation and the root of the problem. Humans seem programmed to function collectively. Religion is a manifestation of this programming. Everyone wants to play for a team, be a part of something.
Intellectual laziness and/or fear is what keeps people from breaking the chains of religious mentality. I mean this in the personal intellectual honest sense (not trapped by the taliban - fear for your life sense). This recognition is where it has to begin if we are to evolve.
Faith is another matter altogether. Religion and faith are mutually exclusive but conveniently converged to control the so called masses. This leads to factions which can be conveniently used to leverage an agenda. A metaphorical Trojan horse of sorts, e.g. the GOP's embrace of religious fundamentalist.
One of my favorite questions to pose is not who wrote the bible but who put it together? This is followed up with - which version are you referring too? What language was it in? etc.....
May 6, 2009 4:58 PM | Reply | Permalink
Yet you simply stand in place of religion, purporting to tell others how to think about their own motives for being of faith, i.e. they must be intellectually lazy because you say so. Yet this is just an accusation, not a systematic proof that religious persons are intellectually lazy.
May 7, 2009 3:15 AM | Reply | Permalink
I don't use big words (or latin words ) - or those dirty mexican words to try to sound important. The bottom line is that I've made a pretty reasonable critique of use of the Bible to fit whatever Christian group a person fits into - e.g. - everyone believes that THEY are the right ones - and that THEY are the ones that will be most favored. Some are obviously not as extreme - some are totally extreme. There are many who say gay marriage is wrong - because it's an abomination - but eating shellfish is OK because that's only Jewish law. There are hundreds of other examples where that same person will apply the scripture as THEY see fit - or as some reverend or pastor who has about as much education as I do will interpret for them. The bottom line is that if Christianity would stop viewing itself as the superior moral authority - and stop trying to impose it's way on any other human being - I would have absolutely no problem with it except for the fact that I don't believe in an afterlife. But I certainly wouldn't shun a Christian for wanting to believe.
It's pretty easy in my book. I realize this is my opinion - and will piss people off - but I believe we'd be better off if Christians just:
Live your life - don't expect anyone else to live by your rules
Respect a seperation of Church and State in this Country
Don't try to influence science in order to protect your afterlife beliefs
Don't get involved in politics. If you are elected to political office - check your religion at the door.
You can still give to charity or strive to be a good person even if you can't fight to make sure "the gays" don't get married or that women don't get abortions.
Realize right and wrong don't come from the bible - but they are built into each and every one of us. Everyone must conform to society's laws.
May 6, 2009 5:00 PM | Reply | Permalink
Sound similar to Thomas Jefferson's interpretation of natural law.
May 6, 2009 5:05 PM | Reply | Permalink
LOL, the new avatar (the dinosaur on the ark) is my favorite, yet, Crazed!! Nice job!
May 6, 2009 5:27 PM | Reply | Permalink
I don't think anyone, regardless of the flavor of belief, can simply check those beliefs at some metaphorical door. You obviously have some deeply held beliefs that drove what you said above. That's okay. Just don't insist that others who may believe differently than you jettison that same fundamental part of themselves when entering public discourse.
The rest of the "better off" list is just fine with this proud liberal Christian.
May 6, 2009 5:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
The problem with this is that if they weren't fanatics about religion, they'd be fanatical about something else. Religion is just another way to impose our will on someone else.
May 6, 2009 5:43 PM | Reply | Permalink
Precisely, if you can get enough people to believe the program, then they assume anything thereafter must be inclusive an just, even if it doesn't make sense on its own.
May 6, 2009 10:19 PM | Reply | Permalink
Your post presents a false choice based on your own adopted lack of context for your conclusion.
You adopt fundamentalist assertions because like them, you do not care to really do your homework on the Old Testament or the New. If you did, you would see much there with an understanding of Hebrew, Aramaic and Greek literary devices, word choices, and story usage. From there, many may disagree, however, I don't think those disagreements can be characterized as monolithic as you have done, and your intellectual honesty or rigor remain intact.
May 6, 2009 5:58 PM | Reply | Permalink
I have a friend (I really do, I'm not using this in the metaphorical sense) who refers to the parts of the bible as the "New Testicle" and the "Old Testicle". He's male, but his joke makes a freaking huge point.
May 6, 2009 6:03 PM | Reply | Permalink
Oh, great, looks like my last line also is a joke along the same lines. Oh well.
May 6, 2009 6:06 PM | Reply | Permalink
In your bullet points you state some talking points I've seen before here and which have been dealt with in several threads. Most are strawman arguments stacked on top of over-generalizations.
May 6, 2009 6:13 PM | Reply | Permalink
Jesus said:
"But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me." (Luke, 19, 27)
Hush...we should not be talking about doubting Jesus. If we do, Mike Woodson and Resistance may slay us.
"The inquisition...lets begin...the inquisition...look out sin..."
May 6, 2009 10:21 PM | Reply | Permalink
mageduley,
Luke 19:27 occurs within a parable telling the account of the Lord's dining "with a sinner" as the Pharisees saw it: the tax collector Zaccheus. If you recall, the big thing about little Zaccheus was how hated he was for being a tax collector.
A parable is deliberately cryptic. Here, Matthew 13:10-17 says so:
10The disciples came to him and asked, "Why do you speak to the people in parables?"
11He replied, "The knowledge of the secrets of the kingdom of heaven has been given to you, but not to them. 12Whoever has will be given more, and he will have an abundance. Whoever does not have, even what he has will be taken from him. 13This is why I speak to them in parables:
"Though seeing, they do not see;
though hearing, they do not hear or understand. 14In them is fulfilled the prophecy of Isaiah:
" 'You will be ever hearing but never understanding;
you will be ever seeing but never perceiving.
15For this people's heart has become calloused;
they hardly hear with their ears,
and they have closed their eyes.
Otherwise they might see with their eyes,
hear with their ears,
understand with their hearts
and turn, and I would heal them.'[a] 16But blessed are your eyes because they see, and your ears because they hear. 17For I tell you the truth, many prophets and righteous men longed to see what you see but did not see it, and to hear what you hear but did not hear it."
The "money" in the parable is souls, not money. How many souls did the apostles bring to the Lord on His return?
Which disciple / apostle would bring only his own soul to the last judgment but no others? This (his own soul) is thus taken from him and given to others. Who? Those he sold his soul to. Here, the parable seems to use money imagery to suggest what happens when people sell their own souls for money. Having cared for no one else's soul; having abandoned the souls of the people; what money (soul) he has is taken from him. But it was taken because he sold it.
Above the Lord says "understand with their hearts and turn," referring to those He would heal. This indicates deep spiritual change following an understanding from the heart of a person; metanoia, or repentance.
The Lord has been using the parable of the returning king who calls on his servants to bring in the rebellious citizens and slay them to show how things normally work, versus how they worked with the Lord. How do we know this? As Christ is dying on the cross He looks out at the souls of the people casting lots on his clothes and He says, "Forgive them Lord, for they know not what they do."
Also: Rabbinic teaching sometimes used the rhetorical argument "how much more so" illustrating a greater value or truth by comparing and contrasting a lesser case analogy. Here, the king returns and calls for the rebellious citizens' death because of their rebellion, however Christ does not and that goes to one of the main accusations leading to his crucifixion: that he assumed the power to forgive sins.
Back to Luke 19:27: there the lesser case analogy shows a king doing the regular thing ... killing off enemies (eye for an eye). Remember: "Ye have heard it said 'an eye for an eye'"...however, Christ does the exceptional thing and says love your enemies. Those who rebel against Him are His enemies. The earthly king might have them killed, but not Christ when Christ returns. "Forgive them Father, for they do not know what they're doing."
May 7, 2009 2:57 AM | Reply | Permalink
The Besorot and Rabbinic Hermeneutics
The four Besorot were written in four distinct ways that match the traditional Rabbinic teaching methods. The four methods of teaching are Peshat, Remez, Drash, and Sod, and they form the acronym PaRDeS (which means “garden”). These four methods and their interactions in the text of the Besorot are described in the table below.
Here is a synopsis of Rabbinic teaching methods:
http://fourquestions.us/judaism/messianic/besorot.php
See the table with this info in it:
PARDES פְּשָׁט רֶמֶז דְרַשׁ סוֹד
Transliteration 1. Peshat Remez 2. Drash 3. Sod
Definition 1. Simple 2. Hint 3. Explore / Secret
Literary Level Grammatical Allegory Parabolic Mystical
Audience Level Common People Aristocrat, Noble Regal, Kingly Mystic
Hermeneutic Level 7 Laws of Hillel 13 Laws of Ishmael 32 Laws of Ben Gallil 42 Laws of the Zohar
Rabbinic Level Mishnah Gemara Midrash Zohar
Book Mark Luke Mattityahu Yochanan
Presentation Servant of Hashem Son of Man The King Son of G-d
May 7, 2009 3:02 AM | Reply | Permalink
If you're interested in a historical critical discussion of this issue, I recommend: Jesus Interrupted: Revealing the Hidden Contradictions in the Bible (And Why We Don't Know About Them) by Bart Ehrman.
Its also pretty handy if you just want to play mind games with anyone who interprets the bible literally.
(And, yes, if anyone wonders I know about the book only because I saw the author on the Colbert Report.)
May 6, 2009 11:17 PM | Reply | Permalink
Or maybe you have not heard of apparent contradiction, that is, paradox.
May 7, 2009 3:04 AM | Reply | Permalink
Well the part that I like to take literally is where Jesus lays out the Lord's Prayer and tells everyone to pray silently and in private.
May 7, 2009 3:07 AM | Reply | Permalink
Well Mike7 - honestly you have proven my point with your justification and interpretation of Luke 7 something I don't care.
You say I am just misinterpreting it - but you can interpret it anyway you see fit. As with so many other passages.
Bottom line - it's a book of fiction dude - just treat it like literature and everyone wins. Nothing changes - except the Christian and their "we're going to heaven - you're all going to hell" mentality goes away and they can join the real world.
May 7, 2009 3:41 AM | Reply | Permalink
Your argument that everyone can interpret the Bible as an attack on its credibility is like attacking philosophy classes because everyone can have a philosophy, or economics because every economist has an explanation.
The task is working toward finding those interpretations, arguments and explanations that come closest to reality in the areas in which they purport to be concerned. The Bible is concerned about God, meaning in our lives, spirituality, and the good life before and after death. It has had many uses, and abuses, however so has just about everything under the sun. Are all things illegitimate or fiction because of it?
May 7, 2009 8:16 PM | Reply | Permalink