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(Don't) Legalize It! Decriminalize it.
Without a doubt marijuana isn't nearly as a bad as cigarettes or alcohol. But with the question of legalization, I think we should ask 'what would be the sum of the benefits and harms that would accompany legalization?' I believe in a paternalistic state, if the state is reducing human suffering by being paternalistic. So I wouldn't just accept it as an inviolable principle that the state should 'treat us like adults' and value choice over overall happiness. There has to be a measurable net positive effect from legalizing marijuana.
I think if marijuana were legalized, sold everywhere, and advertised, then we would end up with millions and millions more problem pot smokers. I'm no stranger to pot, and I know it isn't physically addicting, but it can make you forget that life can be enjoyable without it. It's not just a stereotype that pot can make you dreary and unmotivated. People can get hooked on it, and while its effects are not nearly as bad as alcoholism, the effects are serious nonetheless.
So I think if it were legalized we would have millions of people who would experience less overall achievement and personal fulfillment. Heck, if I could buy it at the 7-11 I'd probably be on the couch watching Seinfeld while eating everything in sight. So in my mind, legalization is a bad idea.
But criminalization is an even worse idea. Despite all I said in the above paragraph, pot is relatively harmless, especially for occasional users. The process of arresting and slapping a criminal record on a pot user is just cruel. At least legalization has the huge tax revenue in its favor.
So, I think decriminalization is the way to go. Make sure pot stays somewhat below the surface, but keep the punishment to a slap on the wrist.
I think if marijuana were legalized, sold everywhere, and advertised, then we would end up with millions and millions more problem pot smokers. I'm no stranger to pot, and I know it isn't physically addicting, but it can make you forget that life can be enjoyable without it. It's not just a stereotype that pot can make you dreary and unmotivated. People can get hooked on it, and while its effects are not nearly as bad as alcoholism, the effects are serious nonetheless.
So I think if it were legalized we would have millions of people who would experience less overall achievement and personal fulfillment. Heck, if I could buy it at the 7-11 I'd probably be on the couch watching Seinfeld while eating everything in sight. So in my mind, legalization is a bad idea.
But criminalization is an even worse idea. Despite all I said in the above paragraph, pot is relatively harmless, especially for occasional users. The process of arresting and slapping a criminal record on a pot user is just cruel. At least legalization has the huge tax revenue in its favor.
So, I think decriminalization is the way to go. Make sure pot stays somewhat below the surface, but keep the punishment to a slap on the wrist.
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I don't think it will ever be decriminalized, but it could well be legalized one day. That day will be when there is no longer any profit in selling cigarettes, then the cigarette companies will get pot legalized so they can package and market it and tinker with it to make it more addictive, like you say.
Decriminalized pot would put growth and distribution into the hands of the individual. There would be no taxes to be made from it. And it would cut into the profits of other legal addictives. Therefore, it will never be truly decriminalized.
June 25, 2009 1:53 PM | Reply | Permalink
Most people will buy their marijuana from a reputable dealer as growing and cultivating high-quality cannabis would be a huge pain in the ass. Marijuana will be no different from the place that alcohol has in our society, except it will be considerably less destructive on an individual level.
June 25, 2009 4:14 PM | Reply | Permalink
I aaplaud your willingness to discuss the issue of marijuana legalisation/decriminalizatio. Our nation is long overdue for honest and respectful debate on this topic.
I have been researching this topic for some time now, and I must admit my views are not totally selfless. I have enjoyed marijuana in the past, though I do not use it now. I also used to drink heavily, and I am heavilly addicted to nicotine. If i had my choice of the three, it would be marijuana. I have never missed a day of work because of it, never been in a fight while under the influence of it, and found that I could quit using it at any time without any consequence.
Mr. Bentham, I invite you to discuss the issue of legalization in greater detail. I feel that simply decriminalizing marijuana is a poor choice for our nation. It will not address the issues of criminal gangs and cartels selling drugs in our communities. It will not stop the tresspassing on public lands by people intent on growing massive marijuana gardens to supply a profitable black market. It will not reduce marijuana use among minors. Decriminalization will not solve our current problems, but rather just make our citizenry feel a bit better because we are not locking up our friends, neighbors, and family.
Legalization, on the other hand, opens the door to regulation and control, both of which put us on the path to sensible, sustainable public policy. We could redirect the DEA resources to our borders and public lands to combat the criminals who realize huge, untaxed revenues. Our nation could generate tax revenues that could be direxted to health care and substance abuse (including all substance abuse, legal or not). The arguement has been made that revenues will not cover the ills associated with legal marijuana, but I submit that marijuana is very popular today, and we recover zero revenue now, so how could it be worse if we were to take in billions of dollars through regulation and control? Some is better than none, and better the money be used to the benefit of America than the criminal element in control now.
Marijuana is in our communities today, and will be redardless of legislation. It is time to realize that our nation's marijuana policy is an embarassing and shameful failure. It is time to legalize marijuana.
Thank you once again for your discussion.
Free2choose, an American citizen and voter
June 25, 2009 2:58 PM | Reply | Permalink
The fact that legalizing would end the violent drug smuggling trade is something I haven't thought about. I'll have to think about that. What if the government decriminalized growing for personal use, though? Inevitably it would make its way onto the street, and we'd get fewer marijuana from south of the border. Keep in mind that in 13+ states marijuana is already decriminalized. If you get caught smoking a joint directly in front of a cop, he cannot arrest you for that reason, only give you a ticket and confiscate the marijuana.
June 25, 2009 3:52 PM | Reply | Permalink
Dear Mr. Bentham,
Yes, I am aware of decriminalization in some states, and feel that those laws are somewhat responsible for us being able to have a civilized discussion here today. Just a few years ago this topic was mostly taboo in the mainstream media, so decriminalization has not totally been without merit.
I agree that people should be allowed to grow marijuana for their own personal use, but the argument has been made here already that many won't. It is perfectly legal to grow vegetables in this coubtry, but look at the choices at your local supermarket. Vegetables are legally available for sale because many can not, or will not grow there own. We have a legitimate, regulated market to meet our vegetable demands, and I feel the same would be needed to supply the demand for marijuana. Whether that be through state regulated merchants, or through a "per plant tax, os some form of annual tax stamp for growers, a legitimate and safe market must be established. Ther must be some source of official income to cover the costs of legalization, or we will continue with the harshly punitive laws that govern us today.
My greatest concern continues to be the criminal element controlling the marijuana market today. Legalization will not totally eliminate that presence, but I am confident that marijuana buyers would be much more likely to support a local gower in their community, or a large national distributor over the systen we have now. Marijuana users do not want to perpetuate the crime and violence that governs the black market. Marijuana users want to be free to make their own choice to safely purchase and consume marijuana for medication and recreation. If they can do so within the law, I am sure the violence on our streets and borders will subside.
The point needs to be made that decriminalization still allows a criminal element to supply a product that is in high demand. Legalize marijuana, and eliminate the profits criminals depend upon to buy guns and ammunition, bribe police and politicians, and used to fund killings of anyone who gets in the way of their enterprises.
It is time to stop this sensless war on otherwise law abiding Americans, and start using our valuable resources to combat those who would do us harm
Thank you once again for your consideration, I hope we can have more positive and civil discussion on this timely topic.
Good day to you.
June 25, 2009 5:36 PM | Reply | Permalink
Agree with all of the above. Great argument for why we need to put forth a lot more fact to counter all the propaganda we have been fed for nearly a hundred years now.
June 25, 2009 5:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
Perhaps we should criminalize 7-11 or Seinfeld instead?
What about criminalizing Krispy Kremes, Will Ferrell movies, trashy romance novels, or Windows' Solitaire?
Just because overindulgence in a product can result in a 'loss of fulfillment' (who sets that standard, by the by?) should that require legislation against said product?
Whether it results in a slap on the wrist or a felony, the fact that humans lack self control shouldn't be a motivating factor in how we view marijuana legislation. Does marijuana classify as a Schedule I substance, yes or no? If no, then it needs to be rescheduled or unrestricted.
June 25, 2009 3:17 PM | Reply | Permalink
Your comment indicates that you value choice over overall happiness. By your logic, we should legalize opium and heroine. If you want Xanax or morphine without a prescription, it's your choice and you should be able to get it. If this isn't what you really think, then you believe there is some element to these drugs that makes it worthwhile to restrict them. Legalizing these drugs would harm society, and it is in our interest to restrict them.
My argument is that this element of justified restriction also exists in marijuana. So a blanket statement about personal choice doesn't convince me. To many, marijuana is a drag on personal achievement, and this effect would be amplified if it were made legal.
I realize this leaves me open to criticism that I believe in a nanny state, that should outlaw fast food. But we have to ask ourselves, what would be the tangible effects of banning fast food? I think if government were to summarily ban some harmful things, the backlash would outweigh the health benefits. It would incite a very severe resentment toward the government, much more than banning a drug ever would. In short, if the government were to suddenly shut down an enormous industry, and put hundreds of thousands if not millions of people out of work, that would create fear and bad will towards the government. It would give the government precedent for even greater regulations. More harm than good will have occurred.
Besides, why outlaw fast food when more gentle reforms can be implemented, like requiring restaurants to list the calorie count.
So anyway, the bottom line is this: unless you're a radical libertarian, you probably agree with me that there are some things that infringe on personal achievement (e.g. heroine) that ought to be banned. We just disagree on whether marijuana is one of them.
June 25, 2009 3:48 PM | Reply | Permalink
We do we criminalize corn then? There is no public good that comes from it being used in just about everything the average American eats, yet we allow it to continue being sold.
There is no common sense reason why would pursue policies that wreck the food system. Why ban drugs when we can put warnings on the label of all the possible side effects? How do nutritional labels keep people from gorging on corn-fed beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions on a sesame seed bun? They don't and we are one of the fattest and least healthy countries in the western world.
For that matter, is there any reason to keep cigarettes and alcohol legal? There are no real public goods outweighing the negatives there either. Simple fact of the matter is that should pot be legalized, there is no proof that it would dramatically increase in usage over the long-haul, despite any initial gains. So, all you have is speculation.
Same with the idea that habitual pot use would make you a slacker burn-out with no future. I think TV and high-fructose corn syrup are more likely than marijuana to cause that effect. Again, my own personal experience flies in the face of that assumption. I know more than a few highly motivated and successful people that use marijuana on a daily basis. This includes attorneys, high-power executives, at least one Congressman and a doctor. When I was a carpenter, I knew dozens of guys on each union job who smoked all day long, many as treatment for PTSD that was never diagnosed from 'Nam. None every so much as got a splinter in the four years I was a working carpenter.
So, I don't agree that anything can impinge upon my personal achievement more than all the stuff that is currently perfectly acceptable to our society. I say legalize everything, regulate as necessitated by common sense and then offer treatment to anyone who can't handle being an adult.
Then the rest of us can get on with our lives without all the parental guidance you seem to think we need.
June 25, 2009 4:11 PM | Reply | Permalink
PS: Sorry if that was a little overly abrupt. I didn't mean for it to be.
June 25, 2009 4:19 PM | Reply | Permalink
Why use a hammer when we have a chisel? Why summarily declare that all be legalized, when we have this wonderful apparatus called the government, in which we can precisely pick and choose what would serve society the best to ban altogether?
It's not the most conceptually tidy solution, but it would be the only solution whose aspiration is to maximize the general welfare.
Remember, I'm writing this article because I believe marijuana should be decriminalized. No one should be arrested for smoking pot. But I do believe that if it were introduced to the public legally the number of chronic users would skyrocket and we would have a severe societal problem. You're right that it's all speculation, and there are daily pot smokers who are successful and motivated.
I think we can agree, though, that we should appeal to empirical evidence to decide if legalizing marijuana leads to significant levels of abuse and under-performance. (I wouldn't consider the Netherlands a fair comparison due to culture). Let's not waste our time speculating that it has no bearing on performance or a debilitating impact on performance. Let's hope that someone comes out with a reliable study on marijuana and abuse.
June 25, 2009 4:31 PM | Reply | Permalink
I just know way more actual people who put a lie to that claim than prove it out, so I think it is an important fact to consider when making public policy.
When I say "legalize" everything that doesn't mean we become a Mexican pharmacy. It means we regulate items based on the actual hazard they represent. Marijuana becomes like beer. Heroin needs a prescription. Good luck getting a legitimate prescription. But in no case should possession of a controlled substance result in jail time.
I guess my main problem is that we have never had a successful ban of anything in this country. For certain people, the more you tell them no, the more they want it. The perverse nature of being human I suppose. All banning anything does is create a black market and its attendant ills.
Plenty of societies throughout human history have been very successful without vice laws on the books.
June 25, 2009 5:40 PM | Reply | Permalink
if you go here you will find reliable info
http://www.drugpolicy.org/marijuana/factsmyths/
June 26, 2009 8:21 AM | Reply | Permalink
This is it, yes. I mainly took issue with the subjectiveness of saying it had an effect on happiness, achievement, or personal fulfillment. But, as you say in a subsequent comment,
so I suppose the real difference of opinion here is the amount of empirical evidence we have.
Society has a tendency to focus on the burnouts because they are the easiest users to spot. It's pure self-selection bias. Consider that in addition to the guy who spends his weekends glued to Spongebob Squarepants, users have included the past 3 presidents, great thinkers like Carl Sagan, world-famous artists of every imaginable discipline, and so on -- and those are just the people with the freedom to admit to current or previous use.
June 25, 2009 5:43 PM | Reply | Permalink
Will Ferrel movies should be illegal.
June 26, 2009 8:05 AM | Reply | Permalink
Dear Mr. Bentham,
I would like to address your concerns about skyroceting use of marijuana should it be decriminalized. I agree we would see some potetial rise in use, but do to the low incidnce of physical addiction, I forsee a mostly "take it or leave it" attitude for many users. You mentioned the Netherlands as an example, and they have a lower user rate for their citizenry than we do here. Their example is not perfect, but does provide evidence that tolerance and regulation do not lead to escalating rates of use.
I fail to see how our culture differs so much from that of the netherlands, could you elaborate on that briefly? Are those in the Netherlands stronger willed than Americans, or are they just more tolerant of personal freedom? I would be interested to hear your reply.
Thank you again for your discussion. Though we may not agree on the legalization/decriminalization issue, I am confident we both agree that prohibition has not, and will not be a workable solution to this issue. Prohibition has been a failure ever since God prohibited Adam and Eve from eating of the tree in the garden.
Thanks oce again for the discussion,
Free2choose
June 25, 2009 5:53 PM | Reply | Permalink
I think we need to clearly define what the words "legalization" and "decriminalization" actually mean.
Legalization does not mean drug dealers and cartels would become legal and kids could legally smoke in public libraries. Legalization means undercutting illegal dealers with prices too low for them to match, stripping them of their customers and driving them out of our neighborhoods and schools. Legalization means eliminating the easy access children have to marijuana and ending the 17 or so cartel murders that are committed every single day.
Decriminalization cannot achieve this because, like prohibition, it doesn't give us a tool to underprice the illegal producers and sellers of marijuana. This is crucial, this is the key to the success of any marijuana-control policy, and only legalization can make it available.
The cartels are without question the Al Capone's of the marijuana prohibition, we must learn from the past and strip them of their customers before they establish themselves properly in our country and kill our citizens instead of foreigners.
June 25, 2009 6:45 PM | Reply | Permalink
I agree with you that decriminalization does nothing to shift the control of marijuana away from cartels and drug dealers. But do you really think it would be harder for teenagers to get a hold of pot if it were legalized? All they would have to do is ask their brother or an older friend to buy some for them, instead of contacting a dealer. Most of my friends in high school did not know pot dealers and getting pot for them was often a disappointing venture. It would have been no problem if it were available in stores.
June 29, 2009 10:02 AM | Reply | Permalink