I am up at 4:45 a.m. because I can't get this horrible situation in Gaza out of my friggin' head. The last thing I want to read is some rude anonymous name-caller who purports to speak on behalf of all of us, perhaps the few of us, who remain sympathetic and supportive of the State of Israel.

Donald J, I admire your cafeful and well-written posts, and for some reason I feel an obligation to apologize that you were treated so rudely.

But you, like many, conflate two fundamentally different issues. First, there are missiles raining down on civilians. Second, there is a need for a long-term solution, which is what you focus on with your usual compelling and convincing style. But the first question, to me, is equally compelling, necessitating immediate attention, and fairly simple at the core.

And speaking of MJ, remember back when I was a disciple of his? He convinced me to buy Mr. Swisher's book, and then Swisher came to the Cafe--a forum that his buddy used on his behalf to sell his wares--and he an absolute fool of himself for refusing to answer questions about his book, in which his principal goal seemed to me to be to destroy Dennis Ross. Poor Zionista, he kept asking Swisher about things that occurred in Taba in January of 2001 that Swisher had omitted from his book (which was supposed to set the record straight (hee)), and Swisher went nuts with the old trolling system, pounding ole' Zionista with zeros and ones! He stonewalled and absolutely refused to answer Zionista's simple questions (basically because Zionista had established like a champ that Swisher's work had omitted material information and was, therefore, fatally and indisputably flawed). It was actually quite comical but, alas, I lost 15 bucks on that monograph.

All this stuff about clandestine neo-cons or reasonable facsimiles thereof working with Obama, even if true, at some point becomes moot. If PE Obama is half the guy even an old cynic like me thinks he is, he's going to have a team that works for him. He's not a delegator like George Bush. I believe he will set the policy and folks will dance to the tunes he plays. And, yes, there will be sidebars, because that's the nature of reality, and Tom will talk with Sally, and she'll refer it to Jane, and the Guardian will report on it, and there will be official denials that direct talks are taking place. And that's the way the process works.

I first read this in the comment thread of Professor Gitlin's bold post, and the first thing I thought was that this should be a post on its own. Nicely done AG. I wait too for an answer to the simple question you pose.

Bruce

Please, I don't agree with much of what SF Curt writes, and I don't agree with his assesement of Mr. Ross, who by the way was listed as one of Obama's advisors way back when when Hillary Clinton was still in the race (so his appointment will be of no surprise to me). In any event, this post, although a bit caustic at the threshold, is well-researched and well-reasoned, and we need to have more of these. If only our regular contributors would uniformly write with such respect for their readers. Sagee, why don't you give it a whirl and put some of that passion you have to pen? But please leave the pus-sucking out of it (Blech!).

Recommended San Fernando Curt.

Bruce

Bruce

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1054008.html

Of course, there are contacts and there are contacts, and I would be suprised that, in the real world, there would be no communication, at least indirectly, with at least some elements of the Hamas hierarchy.

Very well-stated. My sentiments exactly. High hopes and all that yes, but let's not lose sight of reality and all that stuff too.

Happy New Year by the way. You folks were advised of the calendar change by now, eh? ;)

Bruce

What evidence do you have that anybody in the world thinks differently about Israel now than it thought about Israel before Christmas? More specifically, do you know anything about the cardinal whom you quote, and do you think his view of the Jewish State has been altered by the carnage committed in its name over the past two weeks. I don't believe that for a nanosecond. I'm not sure it matters ultimately, but I submit perhaps with as much evidence as you have for what you have submitted, that nothing has changed. In fact, respectfully, the only thing I have seen differently is that Jews worldwide are rallying in support of Israel this time, even in places where the paltry numbers of remaining Jews is a pitiful reminder of the concentration camps referred to by the righteous cardinal. Perhaps this is so because, rightly or wrongly, Jews don't understand--or they understand too well in their own minds--why the world would be so quick to condemn Israel for defending its citizens from continuous missile attacks on civilian targets.

Qualification--I said that the only change I have seen is among Diaspora Jews outside of the U.S. who have rallied to support Israel in a way I have not seen in years. The other change I have seen is in the relatively weak response of so much of the Arab world leadership to the atrocities that have been committed against the civiian population of Gaza.

We digress so often I know. Let me say that I hope folks like us can still join to support PE Obama in pursuing aggressive peace efforts in Israel and in Palestine, and that these efforts will include a tough stand against extremists on both sides of this never-ending conflict. I know we both support a fair and just two-state solution--with Jerusalem as the capital of two sovereign nations--and that, in the end, our differences are not of the kind that, in my world, would be called strike issues.

Bruce

One question for either or both of you is your assertion, which I believe appears to be the consensus, is that support for Hamas will increase in the Palestinian community. While I don't think it's an apples to apples comparison, this assertion would certainly be supported by an analogy to what appears to have been increased and solidified support for Hizbollah after the 2006 war with Israel in Lebanon. But, when the dust settles in the current crisis in Gaza, and hopefully and G-d willing very soon, what makes you both certain that the Palestinian community there, still with many people who had supported Fatah even after Hamas prevailed in the internal conflice between the two groups, that continued allegiance to Hamas by Gazans en masse is a certainty. And, as a corollary and at this point, to what extent is it wishful thinking on the part of those of us in this country who have high hopes for and fully support an aggressive effort by PE Obama to implement a just and lasting two-state solution for Israel and Palestine?

Thank you both once again.

Bruce S. Levine
New York, New York