The people I get to know and like is irrespective of their political ideology—with a caveat. The caveat is that there are selection pressures. There are venues that are more liberal friendly and venues that are more conservative friendly. Work environments that tend to attract liberals, and work environments that tent to attract conservatives. So, although I do have conservative friends, they are in the minority. As for my family, they're about 50/50, with most of my dad's family being conservatives and most of my mother's family being liberals.

Such a good question.

They would not. I know my family would not. The difficulty is overcoming their perception of you as black sheep (a.k.a. burden). Sometimes the facial expressions of disapproval, bewilderment, and impatience make me want to strangle them.

We speak a different language. We are like cancers to their culture -- a counter culture within a family. On the other hand, if they cannot open up and attempt to understand, they lack their own center. Oftentimes, the black sheep have a balanced center that the others cannot, and will not attain.

Accepting their closed mindedness and the pain with which they deal with in consequence is key. My parents will never enjoy my successes, it only reminds them of their shortcomings. But instead of regretting our families for that disposition, I think we have to focus on the sadness of that situation (beyond all faultlines).

Our responsibility as black sheep is to stay true to ourselves and not react to the world's/family's insanity. Being a part of events is not giving sanction to their culture. I have no leg to stand on here, but we have to attempt to understand all cultures -- as painful as it may be to see positives in one that causes you such grief.

Hey LisB,

One of my best friends, who called me family, rescinded all of that from me recently.

She and I do differ in our politics (she's a self-described extreme right-wing libertarian, and a scientologist) but honestly, I think she left because we weren't getting along on a lot of different non-political subjects - most of which were related to the way we treated eachother.

Even though I know I was right about most of the things I argued with her about, I wish now that I hadn't asserted so much will in the fights we had.

Don't get me wrong. She can be stubborn, selfish, insulting, and unsympathetic. In short, on some days she's a fight waiting to happen.

That unique attitude seemed to inspire my pugnacity, and I don't like to back down in the face of recalcitrant unfairness or ignorance. (One of the severe fights was over her calling me "Cheapskate" when I balked at a high price, and not being willing to apologize for it, when she was in the hole with me for hundreds of dollars at the time...and she still is)

I'm guessing (she's not talking to me, so I can't confirm) that I argued a little too long and too hard over things like this with her - long after my point had been made - because she refused to concede. I'm guessing she'd even conceded to me in her heart, sometimes, but just wouldn't come out and say so to me for the sake of her pride.

I'm guessing that, to her perception, my assertiveness bordered on superiority and preachiness. She would hint that she was done arguing about something by saying "OK! I feel bad about it, ok?" I should've figured out earlier that this was as close to an apology she was willing to come after a fight.

I'm guessing that, eventually, she got tired of me making her "feel bad." I wish I'd explained more firmly that good people don't debate or argue to make eachother feel bad.

So I'm telling you this cautionary tale because she was one of my closest friends who thought of me like family, and she left me over a few too many disagreements. I wish I'd been more compromising to her attitudes, and more dismissive of my righteousness.

So I tell myself, "Some people react very negatively when you try too hard to change their minds. Even if you use patience, reasonable words and respectful tone of voice. And even if you're right."

But then, I tell myself that if she took it seriously when she called me her best friend, and called me family, she'd be reasonable enough to at least communicate.

As for my real family, I doubt they'd ever do something like this to me. My mom is a devout Catholic and has voted Republican for as long as I've been alive. My dad is agnostic and only a little to the left of my mom. The only way they'd disown me is if I turned gay and became a drug addict or something.

My bro & sis would never dissociate with me. The older generation (aunts & uncles) of my extended family might follow my parents' lead if they publicly disowned me on reasonable moral grounds, but I think the younger generation of my cousins would not.

I should explain that my family is Chinese-American, with the older generation I mentioned being the first generation to immigrate to America. There is large Christian, especially Catholic, representation among the older women in the family.

If you weren't a member of your family, why SHOULD they give you a second glance?

The other half of your family is wrong.

Blacksheep '08

Interesting discussion. I have two young daughters.
My husband and I have sometimes had amused discussions where we've agreed that, once they've grown up, we could forgive them anything... anything except turning out to be right-wing.

(We comfort ourselves that kids mostly get their politics from their parents and so hope we never have to confront the unthinkable)

Not such a dream if you share your tears, and your thoughts.

With them. Not just with us.

Okay, this is what gets me.

This is what eats at my craw.

My family screws everybody over when it suits them to do so, and I have too, but, I am the only one wanting unity and peace and love and hugs and understanding.

The rest of my family ignores me.

I get to the point where I wonder, if they can't love me, how can anyone? I get to the point where I want love from someone who will never ever know my family.

My family deserves its own circus tent. It's own parade. Hatred March Disguised As Love And Understanding. Fuck your love and understanding, when I'm talked over at every meal. When my sister's phone calls take precedence over my being there with my mom and my sister lives a block away.

Fuck family, then. My family is HERE, at TPM, where I can disclose my darkest secrets and get more love and understanding than I can from a bunch of Bush/McCain automatons.

Thank you....for listening. You do more than my own family does.

Peace, out,

LisB

What would Thanksgiving, Christmas, Passover, and a Fourth of July family barbecue be like if we couldn't argue with our nutty relatives to the left and right of us. That's what mishpucha is all about Lis. And Lis, have we not become mishpucha here, to the delight of course to those who run this place? :)

Have a meaningful Independence Day Lis, and I look forward to meeting you and others at the Obama fundraiser here in New Yawk, Brooklyn to be precise, on the 19th, and hopefully introducing members of my blood-line mishpucha who actually like our candidate. :)

Why is this on a recommended list? Aren't there family therapy sites or something where this type of conversation could occur?

I went through quickly, so apologies to anybody else who made the connection:
Peter: Well, he's my dad. And I just want him to love me.

Francis: Peter, how could you say such a thing? I love you with all me heart.

[Sentimental music playing]

Peter: You do?

Francis: Of course. I just don't like you. I don't like anything about you!