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Rove Confronted With Second Attempted Citizen's Arrest
Karl Rove, allegedly a traitor and complicit with war crimes planning and election fraud, was the target of another citizen's arrest in Iowa. Rove is alleged to have been complicit with Nuremberg-like war crimes planning, illegal retaliation against prosecutors, and illegal domestic propaganda.
In written responses to the House Judiciary Committee, Rove provided incomplete denials to questions about his alleged complicity with illegal prosecutions. Rove's legal counsel are members of the President's domestic military analyst program.
DOJ OLC memos reminded civilian policy makers and advisors they could be subject to war crimes indictments. If convicted of these alleged war crimes, Rove could be sentenced to the death penalty.
In Rife, he Iowa Supreme Court reviewed the applicable Iowa statute:
"Iowa Code section 804.9 governs the arrest of persons by private individuals. . . .A citizen may make an arrest for any public offense if the offense is "committed or attempted in the [citizen's] presence." . . .Earlier, in May 2008, Rove's arrest warrant was referred to as a "Citizen's Arrest Complaint" and specifically mentioned allegations of treason, fraud, and conspiracy. The written complaint had a typographical error, citing the US Code, calling it 19.371, instead of 18 USC 371.
However, if the public offense is a felony, a less stringent standard
is imposed. If the offense constitutes a felony, the citizen must only
possess reasonable grounds to believe the person to be arrested
committed the felony." (Rife v. Corner,641 N.W.2d 761, Iowa Supreme Court, Filed 2002)
Comments (18)
Change "May 2008" to read "March 2008"
July 26, 2008 6:23 PM | Reply | Permalink
We will get him eventually, testing.
Likely on misprision of felony.
We just have to wait until there isn't someone in the WH to pardon him....
"you have to be smart"
July 26, 2008 11:41 PM | Reply | Permalink
Lux Umbra Dei ,
Could President Bush pardon Rove - if he was arrested in a state jurisdiction for breaking a state law ? And should the answer to that be yes - what kind of political election season sh--t storm would be brewed up if say one of Bob Barr's minion's were to arrest Turdblossom in Atlanta next time he is there "on business". This could be a really smart way to make the crimes of gwb43 a current campaign issue. Its interesting to consider that Liberterian Presidential Nominee is polling six to eight percent in many states-and that a strong portion of the liberterian appeal is that this third party unlike Madam Speaker wants the ongoing criminal conspiracy known as gwb43 to be held criminally liable for all of its misdeeds right here , right now-
So I restate the original question can Rove be pardoned by Bush if he is convicted in a state court ?
July 27, 2008 12:06 AM | Reply | Permalink
That's not the real question. The laws potentially/probably broken by Rove are federal laws, so the DOJ and the US Attorney for that region have exclusive subject matter jurisdiction. Unless Bush himself gave the go-ahead for the arrest, it's unlikely that a US Attorney would seek an arrest warrant.
I suppose that Bush could order Rove arrested, just so he could pardon him. But this wouldn't be even necessary - Bush can give pardons even if people haven't yet been charged with a crime. It wouldn't surprise me at all if Bush issued blanket pardons to a large number of cronies in January of next year.
The thing to remember is that pardons aren't effective at the ICC. It would take some fancy footwork to place the Bush acts of these past eight years under ICC jurisdiction, but it is possible. I'm predicting this in 16-20 years.
But hey, justice delayed isn't always justice denied.
July 27, 2008 12:38 AM | Reply | Permalink
Good lord, this is a first. I am recommending one of testing's posts.
July 27, 2008 12:43 AM | Reply | Permalink
His heart is definitely in the right place.
As far as the ICC goes, I agree with you, there's not much hope in the short term. Bush "unsigned" us in May 2002 to the Rome Statute and we also have gotten dozens of third world countries to sign article 98 BIA's. And we have the American Servicemen Protection Act (called by its numerous critics: The Hague Invasion Act) and the infamous Nethercutt Amendment cutting off ESF monies to countries signatory to the Rome statute but not signatories to bilateral immunity agreements. So with few exceptions we have been entirely hostile to the ICC since the bush people got into office. This can all change with the next administration and I hope it does.
July 27, 2008 1:19 AM | Reply | Permalink
But if I read testings post correctly Rove could be arrested for violating Iowa's law against war crimes . I again ask the question , can Bush pardon Rove for violating a state's law ?
We need to make the gwb43 criminal enterprise a general election campaign issue. Arresting Rove on state charges would definately make turdblossom a campaign issue...
July 27, 2008 1:28 AM | Reply | Permalink
You really want to polarize the nation prior to an election that much. Do you understand the implications of such an action? Not only will such a move polarize the electorate and potentially drive out the Republican base, it would also leave a partisan hang over that would prevent substantial legislation from being completed during the next two to four years.
Albie, you need to think before you speak on these issues. Your zest for revenge against the current president puts the nation second. GW will be judged by history and the coming administration. His BS policies and signing statements will be removed and resolved if Obama gets into office. We should work towards that end.
July 27, 2008 8:29 AM | Reply | Permalink
Al,
The president's pardon authority is confined to offenses against the United States, i.e. violations of federal law.
Both state law violations and civil judgements are not subject to the Article II power. However....
I haven't read it, but suspect, on supremacy clause grounds, that convictions under Iowa's law might have definite problems if appealed.
Allsburg?
July 27, 2008 1:49 AM | Reply | Permalink
Rec'd. Looking forward to news of a third attempt.
July 27, 2008 5:21 AM | Reply | Permalink
Oh brother. Be careful what you ask for.
The Clintonistas invented extraordinary rendition (torture), declared war and bombed Iraq, and indulged in domestic wiretapping via Carnivore. Whatever crimes you come up with can likely be followed back to them. Is that what you had in mind?
July 27, 2008 9:35 AM | Reply | Permalink
shooter,
Yes, it doesn't matter in the slightest which administration breaks the law and ignores the constitution. Whether it be democrat or republican, they should be prosecuted.
July 27, 2008 10:46 AM | Reply | Permalink
That's a lovely sentiment and all, but politics is the art of the possible. "Should" is not equivalent to "could." In a fantasy world all the men are handsome, the women strong, and the children, above average. It's nice to fantasize but don't confuse it with reality.
As for "breaks the law," you mean ALLEGEDLY breaks the law. Moreover, since the basis for Bush's alleged wrong doing is Article 2 of said Constitution - you are pretty much out of luck trying to wave the Constitution around as an indictment.
Like it or not, no future President is going to criminalize a prior President for doing what they thought best for the country, no matter whether you agree with it or not. Why? Because it is entirely possible for the future President to find himself in exactly the same position when a new regime steps forward.
July 27, 2008 12:22 PM | Reply | Permalink
Politics is irrelevant, art of the possible or not. It doesn't take politicians to successfully prosecute a malfeasor.
Forget this faux realism you are waving as if it were an all-powerful solvent for the criminal difficulties the administration is in.
Nothing is required of the next administration other than allowing the courts to do their work.
Just sit back and watch what happens.
July 27, 2008 1:07 PM | Reply | Permalink
Tinfoil hats here! Get your tinfoil hats! Guaranteed to keep aliens from controlling you mind! Keeps Rove from reading your thoughts! Get 'em while they last!
What a bunch of nutjobs!
July 27, 2008 4:52 PM | Reply | Permalink
jimmie dean,
maybe what you do not choose to understand is that there actually will not be a polarized GOP base that will spring to the defense of turdblossom in the context of this upcoming general election . There are many ,many former gwb43 supporters who are now openly calling for criminal indictments for the Bushies. Witness the Ron Paul Revolution in the GOP primary - and now see Bob Barr appearing in Congressial Hearings calling out the gwb43 ongoing criminal conspiracy . Liberterian Presidential Nominee Barr is polling consistently in the 8% range for those who are disaffected with gwb43.
This is not about revenge jimmie this is about holding Rover and the rest of the criminals accountable-and yes we can - in the context of the general election . Go google what Bruce Fein has to say about impeaching gwb 43 - there will be no polarized base of the gop to save turdblossom et al ...
jimmie rant away your still stuck at the five & dime soda stool ...
July 27, 2008 7:36 PM | Reply | Permalink
Wow... This post hit the Tollfecta.
Bulldog, your continued persistence here at TPMCafe belies your flippant remark and shows just how serious you and the rest of your Republican gang take this site and its "nutjobs". Must be tough for you to keep coming back. But hey, a job is a job.
I also find it amusing that one would admonish the asking of a legitimate question by basically saying, shush... or you'll wake the sleeping Republican base and sweep McCain into power.
Bull shit... Some of our current and former "Public Servants" should be prosecuted and shown to be the miscreates I believe they are. And now is the time, not later. The greater public knows the distinction between a witch-hunt and true pursuit of justice. Though, I guess, the blurring of the line seems to be the role of some of the local trolls.
The pursuit of Rove and others isn’t about getting the Democratic Party into the White House. (Though that is an end that I will work my best to assists, because I believe in the social, economic and civil government that I think Obama and the Democratic Party BEST represents.)
No, this is about efforts greater than one party or the other. Not to put too fine of a point on it, but it seems that testing’s continued posts are about the rule of law and the Constitution over partisanship.
July 27, 2008 8:09 PM | Reply | Permalink
Dave Kahn ,
You are correct , testing seems to be getting "TROLLVILLE " riled up -especially the one troll that keeps saying don't wake up the scary Republican base ( jimmie dean are you reading this buddy ?) - . I agree with you - Dave - this is about defending the country and its values -we must have accountabilty for this lawlessness , we cannot let war crimes -such as starting illegal wars go unpunished .
Testing -please keep bringing these excellent post -maybe we can arrest turdblossom in some state jurisdiction soon ,,,
July 28, 2008 4:51 AM | Reply | Permalink
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