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You Are SOOOO White!!

Here is an interesting Article by Tim Wise direct at those women who refuse to vote for Obama because of their pain from Hillary's loss.. The link is at the end of the text.

"But that day is done, whether you like it or not, and you are now left with two, and only two choices, so consider them carefully: the first is to stand now in solidarity with your black brothers and sisters and welcome the new day, and help to push it in a truly progressive and feminist and antiracist direction, while the second is to team up with white men to try and block the new day from dawning. Feel free to choose the latter. But if you do, please don't insult your own intelligence, or ours, by insisting that you've done so as a radical political act."
Read more... follow the link
http://www.counterpunch.org/wise06072008.html


Comments (38)

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I'm a white man and I'm teaming up to try and block the new day from dawning? Sorry 'fraid not. People who stereotype to make a point are stupid and not worth reading.

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Read the article. Tim Wise is talking about supposedly "feminist" supporters of Clinton who plan to vote for Obama over McCain.

You obviously didn't read past the headline. Way to clown yourself.

Wise is a white man, by the way. I believe he is referring to the specific white men who will block the day from dawning, though it is a little clumsy, but the broader argument is right on.

I'm going to start calling you Mordecai, after a famous three fingered baseball player.

But on another subject, I think the header does disqualify the post from usefulness. As always, you are kind.

Awwwww .... perfect set up and no punch line!

Try this one: You are SOOOO white you get a sunburn standing in front of the TV! :-)

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...you think Obama's a "Black Man".

No I think the framing of this post read like the start of a racial joke.

I tested by just yelling it out exactly like it was written, and low-and-behold folks yelled back punch lines. My post was a sardonic commentary on this fact.

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I got it the 1st time,kgb

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WOW! Don't know how to react. Am printing out and will read again later. It does emote a strong reaction - trying to isolate the primary one.

That was a pretty good article and exactly what I've been saying in meatspace for the past few weeks. The Cynthia McKinney part was especially relevant and puts a lie to those supposed feminist who think "it's a woman's turn".

And yes, it's refreshing to see that not only a white person, but a white man gets why women of color look at white feminist with skepticism.

I am a white guy who agrees with Tim Wise on this. Any of us white folks who grew up in the USA and are able to take an objective look at ourselves know that we absorbed a lot of racist idiocy that was "in the air" all around us. This is true at least of my generation (I'm 50), and generations previous to mine. Even those of us who never consciously bought into the racism find it bubbling up from our sub-conscious minds at times, and have to dismiss it with focused awareness.

It's the human condition - absorbing ignorant (Buddhists would say "unskillful")attitudes from your environment in your formative years, and having to deal with it later. And you do have to deal with those attitudes, if you ever want to be free of them. Otherwise they're like an undiagnosed illness that cripples you a little more with each passing year.

Some of us who claim to be progressive are unable to see this dynamic at work in our consciousness, either because we haven't developed our introspective skills or we just can't believe we could be susceptible to such motivations. But come on, if you previously supported HRC and now find yourself insisting "I'll vote for McCain before I vote for Obama", where is that coming from? If there's not some deeper dynamic at work, any rational person given a bit of time will get beyond the anger and disappointment of having their personal favorite candidate exit the race. After that, however, if you claim to be progressive politically but would choose to vote for the reactionary/authoritarian/militaristic (white male) candidate rather than the progressive (black male) one, that's not a rational expression of feminist solidarity. It's a fear-based expression of racial bias.

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What if you insist that you'll vote for Nader, does that make those voters racists?

Didn't the 2000 election provide a sufficient example of the perils posed by the vote Nader move? If nothing else, enlightened self interest should bring every progressive to at least vote, if not support, Obama.

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You'd think so, wouldn't you? Pique has no place in politics.

Pique has no place in politics.

Nor did it have a place in the minds of the overwhelming majority of those who voted for Nader.

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If you previously supported Clinton on a basis of "sisterhood," and now are holding Obama responsible for "sexism," then in the interests of "sisterhood" you should vote for Cynthia McKinney. NOT McCain. Nader is good on women's issues, so I suppose its okay to vote for him.

The point is that if you supported Clinton because of feminist "sisterhood" but are now supporting McCain, who's voted against all sorts of women's issues and has a 0% from Planned Parenthood, for revenge (?), it may not hurt to go through your reasoning and make sure your issue isn't about race.

I agree wholeheartedly.

Another thing that really bothers me is that some women are speaking out so strongly about having wanted to vote for Hillary but they don't go out and vote for other women for lower level offices.

I live in Northern Virginia and the female candidate in the Democratic primary for the 11th Congressional District, Leslie Byrne, only received 33% of the vote in our primary yesterday in spite of being strongly endorsed by Jim Webb and women's groups and being a very qualified candidate. I am very disappointed. If Democratic women had been unified and voted for Byrne, she would have won. Maybe if more women voted for women who aren't necessarily named Hillary Clinton, they would have more female political choices in the future.

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sorry waldengirl, but leslie byrne was a hack politician going up a competent administrator. she lost because everyone is burnt out on this political cycle, and no one bothered to vote. i got at least 4 mailings from byrne a week for the past month, all attack ads against connolly. they went straight into my already-swelling trash can (thanks Emily's List. it's not like you sent these things on recyclable paper, or that trash bags are free). i got much fewer ads from connolly, but they were all positive pieces about how he'd help virginians. they went straight into the trash as well, but the difference in tone was not missed. after that, nobody in my family bothered to vote.

if leslie byrne had tried harder to increase turnout for herself instead of suppress turnout for connolly, maybe she would have won in an election that saw only 3% voter turnout this tuesday.

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Tim Wise says exactly what I tried to say about Erica Jong and Gloria Steinem and other feminists and 80 and 90 year old women who claim that will never have the chance again to vote for a woman and that it was "stolen" from them by Obama. So they're going to vote for McCain instead.

Wise lays it on the table. Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face.

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I read Gloria Steinem and Erica Jong's essays on this election and I cannot find one single instance where they claim the nomination was stolen from them. Both have said they will enthusiastically support Obama.

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This is a delicate time, a time for Democrats to reconcile.
In all elections, some people get angry and dissapointed when their candidate loses, especially if they feel their candidate has not been treated fairly. It takes time for some people to get over their feelings and see the bigger picture.

It does not help to imply that they are racists. Even if some eventually vote for McCain, it does not mean they are racist. People have voted for the opponents of their favored candidate in the past, when there was no racial difference between the candidates, even when it goes against their ideology and their interests. That's how anger works-- it is often irrational.

It does not help to use the comments of a few to smear "white feminists." Feminists who happen to be white, along with other feminists, have done enormous service to all of humankind, including men, and including people of all races.
You will not win support for Obama's cause by branding people racists when you have no access to their inner thoughts.

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He's not saying they're racist. He's simply saying that, by voting for McCain, they would be standing in the way of anti-racist reform.

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My previous post should have read "People have voted for the opponent of the candidate who defeated their favored candidate in the past..."

The choice is not to team up with white men as though all white men are the enemy and the sole source of our national problems. That goes too far with the hyperbole. Millions of white men are helping to propel the Obama campaign with their time, their money, etc... The enemy is the men and women who continue to align themselves with the reactionary interests of predatory wealth in this country at the expense of all our citizens regardless of any demographic characteristic you wish to name.

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Wise is an ass with the attention span of a circus monkey. There has yet to be an election where the sore losers haven't vowed to vote for the opponent. Barbara Erhenreich voted for Nader because she was pissed that Gore won the nomination. I think that was stupid but I don't think that makes her a racist.

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Um, that would be a good example if Gore were not white. You misapply the theory by interjecting a new subject. If Barbara choice to vote for Nadar and Gore was hispanic or green, then maybe it would be relevent. Choosing between two white guys isn't the point of the op-ed.

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No, that puts your theory swirling around the bowl. It may make these people petulant, it may make them sore losers, but it doesn't make them anymore racist than the ones who chose to sit it out or vote for Nader or Bush in the 2000 election. For many women who claim they are going to stay away from the polls, their complaint seems to be that the choice is between two men, not one black man and one white man.

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Would'nt that make them sexist? Just Sayin.....

Pondering some of the post-primary fallout, I've been cause to reflect a bit on my father. He was pretty moderate politically. Though he probably voted for more Democrats, he definitely vote for some Republicans - including Ronald Reagan. This always puzzled me a bit, but I was most intrigued by the fact that he didn't feel any allegiance to a particular party (wonder where I get it).

So, I always liked talking politics with him. He was a genuine thinker. When 2000 rolled around I was very curious as to how he was going to vote. I was very surprised by his his response. He said that he would vote for Gore, someone that he wasn't crazy about. He didn't have any warm feelings about Bush either, but it was his reasoning that struck me the most. He said that despite other considerations he felt that he absolutely had to vote for Gore because he thought that Bush threatened Roe v. Wade. This was chiefly important to him because of my younger sister.

Nearly eight years and two Supreme Court appointments later (one of which replaced Sandra Day O'Connor) my little sister is all grown up, happily married with kids of her own. It's unlikely that she'll ever have to walk into an abortion clinic. Unfortunately, my dad is also gone. However, if he was still here I have little doubt that he would be thinking about his granddaughter this year.

Having a daughter made it personal for him as a man. It was no longer an academic exercise or even a matter of principle to protect the rights of women. It was about his little girl.

Those who are angry about Hillary Clinton losing right now are just that - angry. Their disappointment is understandable, but I don't take the threats seriously. No feminist will walk into that booth and pull the lever for McCain in November.

Pondering some of the post-primary fallout, I've been cause to reflect a bit on my father.

Had cause even.

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This is all just an excuse to go on a rant against "other people," since no one really has any idea at all about who is or is not going to vote for Obama (or McCain for that matter.) Oh well. It's the american way--smear everybody so that everything that goes wrong is someone else's fault.
Just let it go.

"No feminist will walk into that booth and pull the lever for McCain in November."

This I agree with. I think that most of the angry supporters will have cooled off by November and really think about the issues. Right now they are still raw. Some may even believe the threat of voting for McCain may help the consideration of Hillary for VP.

However, in the end, (and I may be being optimistic) I believe as you do, they will not pull the lever for McCain.

I agree that no feminist will vote for McCain.

It's possible that some of Hillary's older female supporters aren't necessarily steadfast Democrats, let alone feminists. The appeal of having a female president may have been the most significant reason to vote for Hillary for some women. Now that she is out, they may not want to "reward" the Democrat who took away her nomination. However, if they choose to vote for McCain, they probably weren't part of the Democratic base anyway so we aren't going to be hurt by it too much.

I'm sorry, but I don't think that piece was logical or fair. I think race is really an issue for only a very small portion of Clinton's supporters.

Some of Sen. Clinton's supporters are very disappointed and hurt right now, and I believe that, for most of them, the withholding of their support for Obama is their most powerful means of expressing that disappointment. I fully believe the pain will begin to fade for most of them and they will, of course, end up casting their votes according to their self-interests.

Anyway, aren't some of the disappointed women who supported Hillary African American? I'd be willing to bet money there are some.

This very likely has more to do with a lot of women who spent at least the last couple of years being thrilled at the aspect of having our first female President. Think of it: Clinton was considered inevitable for a pretty long time. To now have to adjust to the idea that this won't happen -- at least, not for a while -- well, it's got to be a terrible disappointment.

I think the accusation Wise is making is illogical and unfair. And piling shame on people who are in pain and who very likely don't deserve it -- well, it's dumb.

Why don't we ease up a bit? Let's allow some time for the pain to subside.

Some of Sen. Clinton's supporters are very disappointed and hurt right now, and I believe that, for most of them, the withholding of their support for Obama is their most powerful means of expressing that disappointment.

Is disappointment the word? I was thinking rage might be the better term.

The tone of that Wise piece was condescending to the max.

Gotta agree with you there. That heinous crap about standing "in solidarity with your black brothers and sisters" put my stinky old-turd hippie gag-ometer right into the red. Speaking of one's whiteness showing...

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