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That Way Lies Madness

I used to bash Hillary when I thought it was warranted. No more.

From this point forward, I will make no post and recommend no post that airs a past or present grievance against Sen. Clinton. It just doesn't advance any cause I'm interested in.

Am I saying I won't comment? No, but I'm likely to tell you to lay off Hillary if your post is all about "Can you believe Hillary did this?" or "Hillary did that." And if you sound like an anti-Obama troll for McCain, I'll probably let you know in no uncertain terms that you're a doofus in sheep's clothing.

Am I saying Hillary will be such a perfect person that I will never feel aggrieved by her future actions or inactions? No, but I'll keep my grievances to myself. Whatever she does or doesn't do, it will be what it is. No amount of complaining, no precision of logic, no moralizing will have any effect but to further alienate her longtime supporters. And the fact is, they've been through a lot, just as Obama supporters like me have. I can't force unity. But I won't reopen old wounds, either.

That's my pledge. If you agree to these terms and wish to make it your pledge also, please comment in agreement.


Comments (60)

I'm not sure if can stick with such a pledge, but I'll try. One thing that I struggle with is making comparisons between McCain's strategies and Clinton's strategies. I'm afraid that sometimes these comparisons might seem insulting to Clinton supporters.

So, I'll try, but sometimes I'll fall short.

Thanks for signing, Ben. I know you've shown some leadership here in self-restraint, so I'm hoping you'll agree that McCain's strategies can be discussed on their own (lack of) merits.

I can already hear them singing "God damn America!" in the White House...

It's the theme song of party unity!

Or did I forget that Obama denounced Jeremiah Wright after he defended him after they were friends for 20 years?

It makes Obama so much more wonderful that he denounces his friends for doing exactly what they always did!

But who needs loyalty, when you can have bullshit charisma instead?

I think Jefferson first penned that verse...

Thing is, he really does seem to be re-running her ideas and her themes. It's almost like Penn has gone onto his payroll.

Actually, Edwards was always the policy leader among the three candidates, and led the way more often than not in terms of how each candidate approached a given issue.

But Obama's got a much higher learning curve than any of them, so they have quite willingly co-opted some very good ideas from everyone, including Hillary.

Seems like smart politics to me, and framing this very respectable adaptability as political plagairism seems a bit disingenuous.

I'm pretty sure that NCSteve was commenting about McCain aping Clinton's criticisms of Obama, not Obama picking up any policy positions of his fellow party members.

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We'll see how this goes when more of Hillary's comments about Obama show up in nation-wide GOP advertisements.

Well, then... we have a lot more YOUTUBE footage of Romney and Rudy and Paul and "Killer" Huck trashing McCain's flip-flops available, than they have Hillary bashing Obama.

They turned Johnny MCFlounder into a pincushion in those early debates, I think McCain was actually considering dropping out before someone made him a new deal...

A noble pledge, one that Obama has urged his suppoerters to make.

However, as long as Clinton pursues a course of action that complicates Obama's campaign, aren't progressive Democrats derelict in not speaking out against her actions? (We have no cause, however, to speak out against her person, beliefs, accomplishments, etc.)

If, as she says, she'll campaign her heart out for the nominee, then I see little damage she can accomplish that hasn't already been done.

A big if, but let's hope she will do it.

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I kindly disagree. I think it is her 'person' that should be attacked.

However, I would also graciously accept the challenge. That is after today's endorsement, if all goes well.

Can you believe Hillary did that? I mean, really...

Lay off. ;)

Yeah really:

Superdelegate says Clinton pushed divisive tactics against Obama in Jewish community:
http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2008/06/superdelegate_says_clinton_cam.html

Clyburn says Bill used foul language when Clyburn objected to the Clinton's diminishing MLK's role in civil rights.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/06/04/wsj-clinton-used-expletiv_n_105161.html

This has just come out in the last few days.
Sorry but if it is new stuff, it has to be spoken. We have lived 8 years in the dark. Can we here at TPM keep quiet when new insights come to light about our elected DEMOCRATIC officials violating our core values?

We have to hold them accountable if they do not adhere to the Democratic values of inclusively. If an elected democratic pol is trying to cut the ropes of our big tent...sorry I'm going to call her out on it.

This pledge is voluntary. Do what your conscience tell you to do. Allow me to also.

Agreed to your terms. Happily.

Now go make a contribution to the DNC.

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And if it looks like there is serious consideration to putting her on the ticket? I'm not sure I could hold back at that point. (Not that it would do any good, but there has to be some place you can go to utter a primal scream!)

This is going to be hard - like trying to not hate the Yankees, but I'll try. - recommended

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Yes, absolutely.

I resolved the same thing early this morning having just seen Fox talking heads beating up on the Clinton supporters' animosity giving the election to McCain, and describing the viciousness of attacks from the on the internet.

The last thing Democrats need is anyone feeding it.

I can sign on to this. My last two blog posts haven't so much as even mentioned her name.

Our energies are better spent on the Republicans. I'm glad that time has (finally) come, and we can get back to our usual business.

Are you saying not to feed the narcissist?

Pledge? Pish-tosh, I believe I've been on the wagon already for a week now. Unless you count MonicaL. But I don't.

I hope more people will join the peace train. Otherwise a couple of weeks from now the rec list may still look like this:

How We Can Heal the Party: Three Things That Clinton Supporters Need to Admit.

McCain's Doomsday Plan: McCain / Clinton '08?

Building a Permanent Democratic Majority, and the Threat That Chelsea Poses.

Those should all be bolded, of course.

One simple rule: always write your post twice. The first post that you needed to write and the second one is the one you needed to be read.

Sage advice. But venting is so fun!

I've read about 40 of these babies and you cats haven't made it out of one day......I am betting against you.

You cats? What about you?

Another bet, huh? Well, I'm not sure I'd actually want to take this one.

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I have tried to restrain myself. One way that I have done so is to discover more reasons for supporting Obama. I have found new and surprising grounds.

"Obama, Spock, and the New Star Trek Nation"
From MLK's last speech:
http://msa4.wordpress.com/

Warped speed.

Let's see her concession and then I'll get back with you and make the pledge or post another rant depending on what she says.

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In theory I agree. But, this:
http://online.wsj.com:80/article/SB121269958227749853.html?mod=todays_columnists

Is so GREAT, it has to be read by multitudes - it's not really bashing HRC - just factual and to the point....EXCELLENT.

Go ahead, you know you want to read it.

"it's not really bashing HRC - just factual and to the point"

Bullshit. It's Reagan speech writer Peggy Noonan enabling you, a Democrat, to self-destruct.

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I think it's a former Reagan speech-writer who is now a pretty articulate social commentator and that she's simply writing what she thinks of this. She's not a democrat so she doesn't have to go along with this unity thing, so why shouldn't she say what she (and others) are thinking?

She's a pretty fatuous commentator, who, over the years has claimed, e.g., that she knew Anita Hill's backup witnesses were lying because they weren't wearing makeup, while Thomas's were, and that Elian Gonzalez was brought to safety by dolphins sent by God. I couldn't care less about her impressions of Clinton.

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Nope, still here - didn't self-destruct.
Ironically, I too am not a Noonan fan, but can still appreciate a well turned phrase and interesting prose no matter who writes it.
I thought it brought up some points that are factual - in an entertaining, albeit pithy manner. And Ripper, c'mon give us a little smile.

=]

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Recommended for the sentiment and the goal.

And this just the day after my first (and last) visit to Hillaryis44.

In principle, though, I agree, so I'll try to aim high, even though I'll surely fall short sometimes.

But I saw it posted here before: WWOD?

What would Obama do?

He always seems to handle the "bad stuff" a whole lot better than me. ;) But I'll try harder to do the same.

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Amen and pass the mashed potatoes! I'm in. Terry McAuliffe said today that Senator Clinton would campaign for Obama every day if he wanted her to. Obama said he even wants Bill to campaign for him. I think involving them would help them to feel more invested in his winning. Right now, they're democrats and they want the democrat to win. But it seems to be a fact that when you work hard for something, you become invested in it's survival and success. Ask any parent. Anyway, I'll trust Obama with that. And I'll take charge of my big fat mouth . . .er, keyboard.

Thanks for the link, Aunt Sam! I particularly liked this line: "She doesn't have 18 million voters, she got 18 million votes."

It's one of those statements that makes me hit my head like in a V8 commercial. There's sense there!

We'll hear her "concession" speech in eight hours.
If it comes off as advertised, there will be no need for anyone to take any pledge.
If she disappoints us again, there is no way anyone can be held to a pledge they made in anticipation of a new, improved Hillary.
I'll keep my powder dry, thank you.

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"That way lies madness."

In my opinion Hillary represents madness; she is a sociopath. She has been messing with our political system to fulfill her delusions of grandeur. I will stop bashing her when she stops messing.

Now I'll move on and bash Obama, whom I consider the best candidate. He, and Hillary, and the other 533 people in Congress are all complicit in crimes against humanity and complicit in the shredding of our Constitution. I forgive none of them, and I pray that we the citizens can find a way to force them to behave with sense and decency, without getting ourselves sent to Guantanamo.

Mr. Obama signed that pledge 17 months ago. Surely we all can now. We should have done what he did. The Clintonians would have been an order of magnitude less angry. This blog has not been kind to Mrs. Clinton. Fair, maybe, but not kind or respectful a lot of the time.

If our hero can go into her private space and comfort her over her huge loss two days afterwards, surely we can curb our snark.

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Elf, I appeciate your good heart, but I am sick to death of our "leaders" behaving dishonorably and with zero regard for human life and health and happiness. I am in no mood to forgive Hillary or anyone else who wants to sit in the White House and act like an asshole.

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Two things:

1) Are you saying that it would be bad form to point out differences and make opinions known respectfully? Is a statement like, "I believe that Senator Clinton could have been more conciliatory on Tuesday night while still honoring her supporters," under your pledge?

You write:

No amount of complaining, no precision of logic, no moralizing will have any effect but to further alienate her longtime supporters.

2) There must be some people who surf TPM who are trying to decide for whom to vote, or whose support for their candidate is soft (e.g., a Clinton supporter who is considering voting for McCain.)

Might not these people benefit from our collective logic (or illogic!), moralizing, and expressions of emotion?

I live in NY. Hillary is a Senator from NY. I am not able to remain silent about a Senator from my state who has been a warmonger because she thought it would serve her political interests. (How did that turn out for you, Hillary?) Further, I am not able to remain silent about a Senator from my state who has voted in the interests of the big money crowd over the interests of the rest of us. Thank God she won't be the nominee. But that's not enough for me to sign on to a promise not to say negative things about her. Until she shows me that she's not longer a negative force, I cannot pledge to remain silent about her.

By the way, if my pointing out the negative truths about Hillary is sufficient to get her supporters to vote for McCain, that speaks poorly both of her and of her supporters. What kind of progressive would vote for McCain. What sort of adult would be so petulant as to vote for McCain to spite me? Your suggestion that we shut up isn't an acceptable suggestion and it is patronizing of any Hillary supporter who says they will vote for McCain if we don't play nice with them.

Couldn't agree with you more. You are very bright for a little boy!

You are very articulate for a scantily dressed woman.

Wow. I can't even spell "scantily clad" properly.

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This blog, as I understand it, is not here to demonstrate kindness, but to comment on the political scene. Perhaps I'm wrong.

As I mentioned upthread, this pledge is voluntary. No one's telling you to "demonstrate kindness." I am asking that we demonstrate common sense in refraining from inflammatory, half-baked, vicious, ad hominem attacks on Hillary. Can't manage that? Fine.

Global warming is a serious issue. I have committed to stop engaging in flatulence and I think everyone else should too. Oh, and everybody should only buy white tires for their cars because black tires absorb heat and only contribute to the higher temperatures.

What bullshit this post is. Remember McCain? Hillary's yesterday's toast. Move on.

You're not from around these parts are you? Read the comments and you'll see how "yesterday's news" Hillary is. Oh, and thank you from curbing your flatulence. When exactly will that pledge take effect?

We can assume that those who continue to attack EITHER Obama or Clinton here were probably not the loyal Dems they claimed to be all along.

Just a bunch of lousy trolls, bent on disrupting the Democratic Party.

So, I'm makin' my troll list and checkin'
it twice, everyone who says we should be nice to McCain, or anyone who continues shooting the Clinton v. Obama dead horse in the foot goes on that list.

I suspect many former recalcitrants among us who are now contrite and mea culpish, may have just positioned themselves to commit more subterfuge in the future. It should be very easy to spot...

By their fruits ye shall know them.

And don't call me apranoid

You're apranoid! I just know it!

All typo criticism is a sheep shot, but that one even made ME chuckle.. it was one of teh funniest things I read today..

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Whenever you're tempted to take a shot at Hillary, glance out the corner of your eye to see if you don't have Karl Rove perched on your shoulder, whispering in your ear. It is a truism that if the Dems can find a way to lose this election, they will, despite GOP weaknesses, McCain's frightening mediocrity as a candidate, and the newly energized electorate. Despite Hillary's baggage, she'll be a net plus in this campaign, especially if she can focus Bill's exuberance on McCain without his blowing himself up. Don't let any residual resentments take our eye off the ball --- she's gonna be an important player after November, in one role or another.

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