« previous | TPM CAFÉ READER POSTS HOME | next »
Obama's Iran rhetoric something less than progressive
In the August 2007 issue of Foreign Affairs Journal, link to follow, Obama lays out his foreign policy platform. It's a long and enlightening article. I think he is dead on in a lot of respects with regard to foreign policy but some of his rhetoric with regard to Iran could have been taken from a Cheney stump speech. A few choice quotes:
We should expand our ground forces by adding 65,000 soldiers to the army and 27,000 marines.
I will not hesitate to use force, unilaterally if necessary, to protect the American people or our vital interests whenever we are attacked or imminently threatened.
Iran and North Korea could trigger regional arms races, creating dangerous nuclear flashpoints in the Middle East and East Asia. In confronting these threats, I will not take the military option off the table.
Some might consider this kind of rhetoric to be necessary to "win the middle" and secure the presidency. Some might even think this is sound policy. I think this kind of rhetoric helps to feed the problem and projects America into a role that must be opposed by other powers. Just as we cannot abide a non-friendly nuclear neighbor the world cannot fail to oppose the most powerful military force in the world if we maintain that unilateral military action is always on the table.
When Obama becomes president I hope the progressive wing of the party will actively lobby for a change in some his rhetoric. After all that's some change we all deserve.
http://www.foreignaffairs.org/20070701faessay86401-p0/barack-obama/renewing-american-leadership.html







Comments (25)
Respectfully, I disagree somewhat with your stance. I mean, Obama is not Dennis Kucinich. Protecting our interests is still in our interests -- provided we do it the correct way, and not the Bush/Cheney way.
June 2, 2008 7:44 PM | Reply | Permalink
I'm just not sure that that kind of rhetoric actually protects our interests.
Why not use only the rhetoric of extreme diplomacy while maintaining the will and ability to take decisive action in your own defense.
The current administration gives the world no option but to polarize against us.
I think some of the rhetoric in Obama's foreign affairs report might support the kind of polarization that creates a barrier to progressive diplomacy.
June 2, 2008 8:17 PM | Reply | Permalink
"I will not hesitate to use force, unilaterally if necessary, to protect the American people or our vital interests whenever we are attacked or imminently threatened."
every democratic candidate who has ever run in the last 20 years has had to say this. unfortunately, the republicans like to frame internation diplomacy as "asking for permission from the un before you can defend yourself."
this "rhetoric" is nothing new and its certainly nothing to be afraid of. it's just stating the obvious.
And, listen, as far as military options against iran and korea, of course you leave that on the table. but that doesn't mean its the first and only option you exercise. it is a last resort issue. Plus, its leverage against them when you're "negotiating".
June 3, 2008 2:23 AM | Reply | Permalink
Extreme diplomacy? Sometimes, I think that Democrats are deluded into thinking that America really doesn't have any enemies, as if we can never say that force is sometimes necessary, while foolishly clinging to this concept of extreme diplomacy. Come on. We need to be talking to Iran, but I wouldn't want a president to hesitate to use unilateral force to bring people like Osama bin Laden to justice.
Moreoever, please explain this:
"I think some of the rhetoric in Obama's foreign affairs report might support the kind of polarization that creates a barrier to progressive diplomacy."
Why and how? How is the fact that we may need to use unilateral force to protect our vital interests polarizing?
June 3, 2008 12:50 PM | Reply | Permalink
Fair enough. Where, in Iran, are our interests?
June 2, 2008 9:01 PM | Reply | Permalink
First, from reading his books and following his speeches and his political outlook since 2006 I'm positive Obama is a anti-war candidate, a progressive liberal on social issues and a centrist on economics. That's my impression anyway. Again, I hate to slot people into categories because I don't think any category is exclusive or exhaustive.
Anyway, he's a genuine anti-war candidate. On Iran, I think his views are parllel to those of Biden. I don't think he sees Iran as an imminent or urgent threat and the whole discourse of Iran in this campaign will reform and adjust as we move along. If not for political risks, he would have vote against the Kyle-Lieberman bill on Iran and his choice to stay away indicates he doesn't see Iran as an immediate threat.
Iran and North Korea could trigger regional arms races, creating dangerous nuclear flashpoints in the Middle East and East Asia. In confronting these threats, I will not take the military option off the table.
That sounds like a sensible remark, the least he has to claim in this political climate and when running for C-in-C. But I think as he himself stated previously and concurred by the recent NIE reports- (papraphrase) Iran is atleast a decade away from closing in on any nuclear ambitions and the U.S. should use the time in hand for agressive and straightforward diplomacy.
June 2, 2008 7:58 PM | Reply | Permalink
I am a supporter of Senator Obama. I need to be honest and say that his choice on Kyl-Lieberman is embarrassing and upsetting to me no matter what the "Political Risks."
Just sayin', that's all.
June 2, 2008 8:10 PM | Reply | Permalink
I agree. I echoed similar sentiments in another blog. I wish he stood up and said No. I'm willing to give him the benefit of doubt for one reason- Republicans will and already are trying to potray him as a terrorist sympathizer.This whole-black, god damn America, Farrakhan crap is being knitted to build a bigger distortion,
He didn't want to take the burden of "Obama doesn't think Iranian army are terrorist" through the general.
June 2, 2008 8:29 PM | Reply | Permalink
i thought Obama did a wise thing and exercised sound judgment on Kyl-Lieberman.
The last thing we need is more of a reason to start a war in Iran which was the entire purpose of the amendment.
so i dunno what your problem with it is. You think its a good idea to start down a path towards armed conflict in iran?
June 3, 2008 2:27 AM | Reply | Permalink
I thnk it was a good idea to vote NO instead of skipping the vote.
June 3, 2008 12:12 PM | Reply | Permalink
well, he missed the vote. he didn't "skip" it. sometimes when you're running for president you can't make every single vote you want to.
And his opposition is, and was, on the record at the time of the debate.
June 3, 2008 1:22 PM | Reply | Permalink
I'm wondering who made you the judge and jury of what is progressive?
June 2, 2008 8:45 PM | Reply | Permalink
And who made you act like a moron when there is absolutely no need.
I said "that's my impression anyway."
If you don't agree he's progressive, please make your point and I'm willing to lesson. But don't be a dickhead and comment out of your ass to piss people off.
I guess you know the first people you dislike every morning you wake up.
June 2, 2008 8:53 PM | Reply | Permalink
I'm my own judge and as far as a jury goes I'll accept a jury of my peers.
If you take issue with my point then make a counter point or go blog at the LA times.
I'm posting a perspective about a policy statement of my favored candidate, since I'm confidant he will be the nominee, because I'd like to move away from this protracted battle for the nomination and start really trying to develop what the core philosophy of the party will be at the convention and beyond.
June 2, 2008 9:18 PM | Reply | Permalink
Thanks for posting the link, although I think in the article Obama makes it clear that military force would be a last resort.
Still, much of the article did seem pretty generic. One of the most specific parts was when he called to increase the military by 92,0000 (65,000 Army / 27,000 Marines).
Obama compliments Truman & Kennedy but somehow overlooks Korea and Vietnam. Arguably it was Truman who started the effective repeal of Congress's Power to Declare War by sending troops to Korea without ever getting such a declaration. Kennedy increased troops in Vietnam by 20x. Let's not even mention Kennedy's imaginary Missile Gap.
Obama also talks about bringing Pakistan & India together. Noble goal, but how does he plan to do that when Pakistan knows it can look for support from China?
In short, Obama's article frequently comes across as Wouldn't It Be Nice If....
June 2, 2008 9:12 PM | Reply | Permalink
Nice analysis.
I pulled this back up after reading Josh's post on the front page about Obama and McCain holding to the premise that Iran has Nukes even though it has been discredited by a wide number of intelligence sources. (see front page)
One thing to consider is that a year ago when this went to press Obama was around 20 points behind the front runner Hillary, give or take.
While something about politically expedient rhetoric pisses me off I want to believe that Obama would act in a much more diplomatic way when he gains the White House.
But why sit around and cross my fingers.
We need to start discussing what we think about his specific policy doctrine in a critical. That's the only way we'll end up with a platform that represents ideals most of us can buy into.
June 2, 2008 9:38 PM | Reply | Permalink
Insert "way" after critical.
June 2, 2008 9:40 PM | Reply | Permalink
Thanks.
True.
I guess I should have been more clear when I said "generic". I meant to say that I don't really expect any candidate to write an article for Foreign Affairs a year before an election that's a laundry list of concrete policy proposals, or that would turn the diplomatic world upside down.
June 3, 2008 12:33 AM | Reply | Permalink
Indeed, those numbers are quite specific, and unusual enough that it seems unlikely they were pulled out of thin air or some less likable place. Which leads me to believe that Barack has been doing just what I hoped he would -- start getting ready for the really hard part: being the President.
The simple fact is that there are currently people in the world who cannot easily be deterred from doing nasty things without the threat of immediate and overwhelming force.
We can and certainly will work to get beyond the need for brute force, but please don't tell me we can do that with a flip of the Peace switch.
It will take time and infinite care to unravel the Gordian knot -- unless you're planning to use a sword to do so.
June 3, 2008 1:00 AM | Reply | Permalink
Thanks for posting this. I support Obama in the election, too. However, support does not (and should not ever) represent blind allegiance.
June 2, 2008 10:10 PM | Reply | Permalink
How can someone whose policy proposals have been repeatedly called indistinguishable from Clinton's be called progressive?
June 2, 2008 10:14 PM | Reply | Permalink
How could she have voted for our invasion of Iraq?
June 3, 2008 12:38 AM | Reply | Permalink
I have read some excellent articles and interviews on Barack Obama's foreign policies. They are nuanced and filled with intricacies that do not fit into nice talking points. However David Lindorff criticized Obama for referencing leaders in Iran, Syria, Venezuela, Cuba, North Korea as our "enemies." Lindorff's criticism is warranted; they are not our 'enemies.' Calling them such does little to advance talks or change Americans perceptions or thinking. Presumably it is an oversight as campaigning every day hours on end with only 2, 3 or 4 hours of sleep takes its toll.
My take -- I am only guessing -- is Obama may somehow feel he needs to parse his words to lessen being misrepresented. But there is no way to escape it: Pundits and the GOP's penchant for taking a sentence here and there completely distorting what was actually said may be a bigger problem for the electorate. Voters, generally speaking, are not known to be diligent researchers. Paying attention is not enough because the media focuses on the irrelevant; the GOP do not believe in presenting facts; and talk show hosts, radio and TV both, have no compunction about misleading their audiences with utter fabrications.
McCain tries to compartmentalize Obama's message into a generic one-size-fits-all; It's not, but McCain's is. Convincing the public that Obama's knowledge and depth of understanding of foreign policy is limited will not be as easy as he thinks it will be. Obama has a much better grasp on the Middle-East and other challenges that the US is facing than Bush, Cheney, McCain and even Clinton combined. If Obama can find a way to hone his message before McCain cements that perception in the voters minds he will be home-free. It is critical for Obama to begin doing so at this juncture.
Another thing that stands out about Obama is his grasp of history and sincere interest in a vigorous pursuit to negotiate in contrast to Bush and Cheney who demand surrender or suffer the consequences. Had Bush & Cheney provided a safe house (as was done for Idi Amin) for Saddam, as per his request and allowed him to take $1 billion dollars of his own money, Iraq would be a lot different today. But they didn't. As a result Bush and Cheney needlessly spent 4100 American lives, over 1-million Iraqi lives and shy of a Trillion dollars. Obama said from day one attacking Iraq was a terrible idea. He knew it would advance anti-Americanism and most everything else that has transpired since.
Obama does not react; he uses reasoned logic and intellect to distinguish between real and manufactured threats. Therefore we can feel fairly confident in giving him the benefit of the doubt. While I have no doubt in his abilities -- he is a quick learner -- I do trust that he will do what is best for all concerned. Furthermore he has shown infinitely better judgment than his rival McCain in every aspect.
When voters hear Obama's message it resonates. McCain is flawed in his thinking and his judgment, but if he is able to define himself before Obama does herein presents somewhat of a problem. McCain has had far too long an open field and a friendly press portraying himself as a moderate and a maverick, both of which cannot be further from the truth. Fending off attacks from Bill Clinton, HRC and surrogates, McCain, the GOP, Rove and Bush too while simultaneously embroiled in a nomination process Obama proved he can hold his own. McCain's free ride is about to end once Obama secures the nomination on Tuesday.
Getting his message out to the general public will inspire confidence in Obama's understanding of foreign policy. However if Obama intends on changing the public's thinking -- what got us into war in the first place -- he needs to stop referring to other nation's leaders as enemies.
June 3, 2008 2:24 AM | Reply | Permalink
So the consensus is that we're due for a new Decider and now we're wondering what he will Decide. We parse his words and hope that he will Decide better than the last Decider. But why should he? The system is the same and he can't change that. He needs to step out of it, and he hasn't (except rhetorically).
On Iran, the Dems are more hawkish than the Repubs. Obama has bowed and scraped before AIPAC, lied about Iran having nukes, says he needs more troops (why?-- nobody knows), threatened attack and STILL needs an alpha-male makeover a la Al Gore. That's the system and Obama has chosen to be stuck in it. He's playing by Repub rules just like Kerry did, and nobody wants Bush Lite.
What's Obama going to change (that we can believe in)? Does anyone have a clue?
June 3, 2008 5:12 PM | Reply | Permalink
Trollfood should be witheld on this thread.
This is a critical topic and the assumption that it should be viewed through some sort of "progressive" lens narrows the focus.
Everyone will be arguing about whose version of progressivism is the proper one rather than examine contexts and the causes and affects that are working on Obama's FP postions; especially in regards to the ME.
This Obama campfollower since the day after he announced his run is among those with some serious problems with how he has responded to pressure groups. The more I look at the big picture, the more I believe that who has the president's ear is central to what his FP will look like. The amount of attention that has long been and still is being devoted to this topic indicates it's importance among those who would be the gatekeepers.
June 3, 2008 7:30 PM | Reply | Permalink
Post a Comment