A copy/paste from my post on this issue (my formatting got messed up too, second the grrr)

I understand that we must not loose this election. I understand that if Obama fought the immunity portion McCain will try to use that to portray him as soft on terror. I'm not going to rail against him and his decision here but I'd like to point out that many who voted for the war did so primarily because they were concerned with being portrayed as soft on terror.

Lets hope this is the last time that argument will work.

E). President Obama with whatever.
E). President Obama with whatever.
E). President Obama with whatever.
E). President Obama with whatever.
E). President Obama with whatever.
E). President Obama with whatever.
E). President Obama with whatever.
E). President Obama with whatever.
E). President Obama with whatever.
E). President Obama with whatever.
E). President Obama with whatever.

Obama promised to ‘change the way things are done in Washington’. He’s in Washington now.

But he's not president yet.

I truly admire your passion. I'll admit, when I first started reading your posts, I thought you were a concern troll for awhile, but I don't doubt your sincerity or your passion any longer. And your relentless idealism brings back fond memories. But when you've lived on this planet as long as I have, you've seen the successes and the failures, and you start to get a feel for what works. And Barack Obama is doing what works. I know it's frustrating and hard to watch. I know it shakes your faith in the guy. But believe me, he's the real deal and he's not going to let you down. You've got to learn (or simply decide) to trust these people. They know what they're doing. And they WILL NOT let you down. When he's elected and he's finally in the White House, he will make you proud as hell. You've got to make yourself believe this. It's a choice. Choose it. Suspend your doubt. Politics is a dirty business. But a politician like Barack Obama comes along once in a lifetime.

A little Buddhist koan for you to consider: In Buddhism, it is forbidden to cause suffering, and it is against Buddhist law to kill any living thing. And yet, Gotama Buddha died a painful death after eating rotten meat. How could that be? In the Diamond Sutra, it is said: "Thus have I heard. Upon a time Buddha sojourned in Anathapindika's Park by Shravasti with a great company of bhikkhus, even twelve hundred and fifty. One day, at the time for breaking fast, the World-honored One (the Buddha) enrobed, and carrying His bowl made His way into the great city of Shravasti to beg for His food. In the midst of the city He begged from door to door according to rule. This done, He returned to His retreat and took His meal. When He had finished He put away His robe and begging bowl, washed His feet, arranged His seat, and sat down."

My teacher, Dajian Hui Neng, lived in exile with a group of hunters for many years. Every evening when the hunters returned from the hunt, he would put his vegetables in the pan with the meat they had killed that day. This is thought of as a minor point by the careless and the inattentive, but it is one of the great teachings of Buddhism.

I'm not comparing Barack Obama in any way to these great teachers. What I am saying is that the greatest of all human virtues is the ability to set oneself aside for the good of all. Set yourself aside. It's not a punishment. It's an opportunity.

TPM - You could really usre a comments editor !!!

Last line of my last comment was meant to read ... I hope you are right hrebendorf, but I think you're wrong.

If you honestly believe that our country is better off with A than B, then why on earth are you working so hard to tell everybody to shut up about FISA?

chophouse, you're a genius! You could have ended the post right there (although the rest of your post is good too).

The answer, from what I've read in the threads, is that people seem to think that disagreeing strongly with Obama is the same as bashing him. I can't say I understand how that's bashing, but it's a recurring theme.

Chophouse - thanks for posting the group URL and signaling that there are a lot of members.

Mailing back empty envelopes to the campaigns those House Members who'd rec'd donations from me before seemed so isolated...

Perhaps I held Obama to too high a standard, hoping against hope that he would say

"I will vote for this bill to avoid problems in getting information prior to my presidency - not because it is a good compromise or fair to the privacy of Americans under our Bill of Rights - but because no other bill seems possible in the face of Republican obstructionism" - and then lay out the Constitutional problems....

Will admit I am torn between views of Hreben-- vs Destor's ... i DO hate to see these valid views about BHO's unfortunately infirm stance on Constitutional rights becoming co-opted by McCain camp persons and repackaged as 'signs of discord' -- in response? mostly my enthusiasm wanes for a bit as realism sets in, I get back to trying to earn the rent and eschew politics for a little while

sigh...