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Journey Into the Center of a Right-Leaning, Independent Brain

My youngest grand-nephew is turning one and I’m going to his birthday party this weekend.  One of my sisters is stopping here to get me on her way there and then we’re going to continue driving together for about two hours to get to the party.

We know we’re going to talk politics the whole way up, because when she called me just now to tell me what time she plans to pick me up, we ended up talking politics and determined that we have to continue tonight’s conversation in more depth when we meet up.

I like that.

My sister is a right-leaning Independent, who (like me) grew up a Republican.  I veered off to the left only three years ago, she drifted indie-right several years ago.  So she knows her stuff.  She reads/views news about both sides. 

I like that too.

She admits that there are certain things about Obama that she likes (mainly, his mother), and that some of the things he says make sense.  To me, that’s a start.  To her, it’s a big admission. 

Back in 2000, she and I both voted for McCain in the primary election.  Neither of us regrets it.  We both voted for Bush in the general.   Both of us regret it.  I’ve already written an earlier blog about my switch from Republican to Democrat, so I won’t bore you with the details here.   It’s my sister’s POV I’m sharing tonight, because I find it somewhat fascinating. 

Points she made from her conversation with me tonight on the phone:

- Time magazine leans heavily towards Obama.  As she put it, “There’s all these stories about how great Obama is, in this one issue, and one story about McCain’s cancer.”  And, “That cover with half of Obama’s face and half of Hillary’s is scary.  Really scary.  It reminds me of The Joker.  I have to bury it under all my other magazines because I freak out every time I see it.”  (She hasn’t seen the cover of The New Republic -- yet).

- She doesn’t appreciate being told that we should lose weight and stop buying SUV’s (my sister is slim and drives a small car) and feels that our President should not be telling us how to live our lives.  (I didn’t counterpoint that with a reminder that McCain said that our government should not be bailing people out of their own mistakes when he was against helping people out of the mortgage crisis before he was for it  -- yet).

- She can’t stand Keith Olbermann and still prefers to watch Bill O’Reilly.  She feels that Bill has been pretty fair to Obama, Clinton, and McCain and that the only person Bill seems to hate is Reverend Wright.  She told me that “O’Reilly says that Reverend Wright lives in a very expensive home in an all-white neighborhood.  And that he gets some kind of million-dollar subsidy through his church.  But then again, David Letterman supposedly gets some kind of agricultural subsidy because he lives on what he calls a farm.“  (We both laughed at, and questioned, that, to the point where I don‘t remember if she said that O‘Reilly said that, or she‘d read it somewhere).  She feels that Keith Olbermann is overly-dramatic and somewhat crazy and she can’t watch his show because he drives her nuts.  I admitted that I like Keith but that I haven’t watched Bill’s show in years, except for little snippets on the internet.  (I haven’t introduced her to Rachel Maddow -- yet).

- Conservatives aren’t embracing McCain.  I pointed out that left-leaning indies aren‘t either.  (She doesn’t see this as a concern -- yet).

-  Obama is too far left and too liberal for her liking.  She doesn’t think the government knows what its doing with Social Security and Medicare, so how in the hell can it solve health care.  I pointed out that Obama’s plan is geared more towards lowering the costs of prescription drugs and insurance than it is towards Hillary‘s “universal” health care that comes with mandates.  (She doesn’t have a very good comeback for that one -- yet).

So that’s the inner workings of my sister’s political brain at this moment in time.  She likes Obama more than Hillary, but likes McCain more than Obama.  (I haven’t been able to change her mind -- yet).

What is truly the most fascinating thing about our ongoing political discussion, though, is the fact that it’s happening at all.  Or, as my roommate Billy put it, after I hung up with my sister and huffed to him, “My sister is still leaning too far to the right!” -- as Billy put it, “Yeah but at least she’s talking with you about it.”

Yes.

She and I are talking about it, with knowledge, facts, open minds, candor, respect and -- friendliness.  We’re keeping it friendly. 

I like that.

 


Comments (29)

I think these one-on-one talks with people who trust us and respect our knowledge are exactly our best weapon against McCain. Let the truth be our weaponry!

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Let the truth be our weaponry!

That's a great idea. Jesse Jackson won SC in 84 and 88. I always wondered why the Obama supporters had such a problem with that truth.

You are going to have an interesting debate. One point and one debate suggestion:

You have to admit that Olbermann is way over the top. I don't really mind, because he's OUR whackjob, and THEY have so many.

A suggestion when you talk about healthcare, SS, etc...: There are certain functions within a society that will not, or at least should not be profitable (road maintenance, police, fire, military). These things should be the purview of government, and only government. Healthcare could probably fall into this category as well. Look up that overhead costs of medicare vs. private insurers. The stats I've seen (but can' put my finger on right now - sorry) end the argument over the inefficiency of government as compared to private sector.

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You are correct. Back in the day fire deparments were run as businesses. If your neighbors house was on fire and he didn't have the same fire department contract company as you did, you were out of luck until your house caught on fire.

Finally the government decided that it was in the publics best interest to make it a function of the government and definately is more efficient now then it was back then.

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Hate to break it to you, but in most of country the FD is the local Volunteer FD, and they have a much better reputation than the big city "professional" fire departments with their union rules, etc.

Can you state any reason why road maintenance, or road construction, should not be profitable? I want my tax dollars spent efficiently, and in my experience for profit operations are more efficient than either not for profit or government, and that is first hand experience having worked for all three types.

Can't say I've heard volunteer fire departments are better than paid departments, especially in terms of training and response. If volunteer fire departments were that much better, there wouldn't be any paid departments. Maybe you're in a different part of the country where that's the case, though.

As for privatization of roads; it's my opinion that if there is a free market solution with acceptable accountability and efficiency, go for it. It's not always the best approach if you already employ those services in the city or county, though. Contracting out doesn't always save money because you have to consider indirect administrative costs. If you already have these administrative costs within the government it would cost more to have to pay someone else's administrative costs to do the job you are capable of completing. However, if you don't have those costs to worry about, it's an efficient way to go, but you sacrifice accountability. Private entities are not always the most effcient source of services, but many times they are. You must realize that you have less control over actions, labor, and quality. If you have to monitor for these things, your costs rise. These are only issues that skim the surface of what must be considered. Cost analysis will reveal the true costs of going that route and allow each government to make a decision that best suits their needs.

If you're coming from the view that just because an employee works for a private firm they are more efficient, you'd be wrong. Private firms claim efficiency through less accountability and as a consequence, red tape. But there has never been any evidence to suggest private firms employ more effective and efficient employees.

Loved this. Reminds me an email thread with family members right after 9/11. My immediate family is fairly far left (or, as my dad likes to say, "socially liberal and fiscally conservative"), but my dad's two brothers are solidly Republican.

So in late 2001, when the Bush government was requesting all sorts of leeway, we somehow ended up in a family-wide debate. It was one of the most intelligent and respectful political discussions I've ever been involved in. And, eventually, what we realized, was that my Republican uncles felt a much stronger sense of trust in the government than the rest of us did.

I couldn't help but wonder how differently I would have felt had the administration in question been more liberal-minded.... that is, to take it out of the political spectrum for a moment, how I would have felt had the President at the time been closer to my own value system. It was kind of a scary thought.

Thank you all for the kind comments and recs. MassDem and Ben, I appreciate your good points and will use them. CaliPage, you bring up a very intersting point about Republicans trusting their government. What I find really, really wacky is that the government they trust is taking away their freedoms and they don't even see it.

My sister likes "non-big government". She prefers state programs versus federal programs. I can agree with her on that, but what I can't agree with is her failure to see that Bush's "non-big government" has become Bush's "very-big intrusion" (intrusion on our privacy, intrusion on our rights, and intrusion into other countries). I just feel like waving a great big flag in her face that says, "Hello???".

But I won't do that -- yet.

;-)

Is her preference for state over federal programs simply ideological or does she have some specific gripe? How does she feel about No Child Left Behind?

What does she attribute the economic trajectory of the last 8 years to? I find when people say the government doesn't know what it is doing with Social Security and Medicare it is either because they had a bitter experience with the disability system or they are not yet getting benefits. If the American public understood how amazingly well the employees of Social Security performed during hurricane Katrina they might for a second them them as the are and not through ideological blinders.

I guess the question you might want to pursue is does she think the country is on the right track? and why or why not? and then in what ways does she imagine McCain would put us/keep us on the right track?

If you are really trying to change her mind I think you are going to have to find a way to contrast John McCain in 2000 with John McCain in 2008.

Good idea. It's what Barack is doing too.

sounds like a great time to use one of my father's favorite quotes: "Conservative government is an exercise in hypocrisy." I can never remember who to attribute it to, seems to me it was a british author?

I have always taken it to mean that if you think government can't do anything right and you end up in charge, you can completely foul it up, then step back and say "see, I told you". as a sad example see the last 8 years...

Ooh, that's good.

That quote sounds like it could've come from Mark Twain, instead of a British author, by the way.

A point you might want to bring up is Bush has presided over the largest expansion of government since the New Deal.

Clinton actually shrank it.

Go figger.

Have a good ride, and Best Birthday wishes to the grand-nephew. One is a big b-day!

:)

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HC is an important issue, something like 45 million Americans do not have insurance under the current private system. I just saw a study by HFMA showing universal coverage is attainable with process efficiencies (e.g. billing- 15% of the HC dollar, 2% for retail, streamline this and half your problem is solved) without increased cost or decreased care. So my argument for HC is that which system is broken, then one leaving out 15-20% of America, or the one working for the rest of the world, the one which wouldnt cost any more money? Did you catch the PBS series where Taiwan studied all the world's models and adopted non of the US model- we dont have a model, we have a market. Obama has a model where your sister's HC wouldnt change, whereas the uninsured would have a government issued choice, so if the govt does screw it up, her HC wouldnt be affected; the only "loser" would be the the one who didnt have access in the first place.

Further, though its sane to say govt screws up SS, hows it doing with police? Should we privatize firemen? Schools? Utilities? My point is, there are industries run by the govt where we have accepted them as competent, necessary, and capable enough to accept their flaws. Each other country has decided HC is one of them. Why not us? Well, most argue its not losing care, we can build a system that still allows for technology and service to and choice be superior.

Why is it sane to say government screws up Social Security? Virtually everyone gets the the right check at the right time? and they spend only about 1% on administration (and most of that is in the administration of the disability system, which admittedly has vast problems)

How much more would it cost you in the private market to buy an inflation protected annuity that pays survivors and dependents/spouses benefits.

If you think of SS as an investment/savings account it may not look so good. If you look at it like an insurance policy, that protects you against the risk of outliving your assets, inflation eating away your income, losing your spouses economic support, and losing the ability to work through disability good luck finding something of equivalent value in the private market.

Great post. My sister-in-law is a libertarian who voted for Bush in the last two elections. (I can forgive 2000, but I have a hard, hard time forgiving 2004.)

But anyway, she's for Obama this time around. She's gotten sick of theocracy.

I plan to spend most of the ride up there with my sister discussing Bush and McCain. My sister dislikes Bush, this I know, but I'm not sure she dislikes him for the same reasons I do. Don't forget she sees me as being very liberal -- too liberal. So rather than concentrate on our differences, it's my plan to start out with the "What made us like McCain in 2000, what makes us dislike Bush now, and what do we think McCain will be like over the next 4 to 8 years if he's elected?" discussion, and take it from there.

If I try too hard to push Obama on her, she'll resist. Best to start with a discussion about the GOP for now, and then move it over towards Obama perhaps on the ride home.

Wish me luck!


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Eight years ago you voted for McCain in the primary, and then Bush. And you want us to listen to you discuss the brain.

Brains evolve, OttoF. At least, most do. Perhaps yours will too when you grow up.

Otto, it's been a few hours since I wrote my first reply to your comment, and I've gotten out of my "defensive" mode, so I'd like to retract that first response, and give you a more clear-headed second one, instead.

I would just like to point out to you, OttoF, that my post has received several recommendations, enough to push it to the Recommended section (a fact of which I am proud of, and pleased by) and it has with the exception of yours, received nothing but positive and helpful and very intelligent comments.

That's what I wish I had written at 3:44 PM EST today.

However, if you come back in here and comment again in the manner that you commented before, I shall have no choice but to consider you my personal troll and I will have to retract this second response and revert back to my first one, just on principal.

Thank you for providing me with some amusement, today. I just love dark comedies.

Hmm. I thought your first reply to Otto was perfect.

I think it's more that her experience with state health care for her daughter has left her feeling good about it, and she'd hate to see it get taken over by a federal plan.

Oops. This was supposed to be a response to Economides' previous post. The reply didn't land in the right spot.

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Does you sister read? If so, send her a copy of David Cay Johnston's newest book, "Free Lunch". Have her read the chapters
on the rise of HMOs, for starters. She'll see that what government has been most effective at is subsidizing private sector sharks who
have grown mega-wealthy largely off of taxpayers, and that sham "free market" myth the Cons love to talk about.

Send her the book...

Thanks for the tip!!

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Point out to your sister that the "problem" in social security is because Reagan started raiding the very trust fund that he set up - a good idea at the time, sold to the public and Congress as a means of guaranteeing social security's long term survival - in order to mask the size of deficits created by his horrendous tax cuts. A trust fund, established by a series of taxes on the working class by Reagan! And don't let your sister get away with the privatization argument, though I don't know if that's in her bag.

I think I understand exactly how you feel. I have an older brother who is conservative but open-minded enough to converse with me about politics and candidates. We respect and like each other, so real communication is possible between us. I enjoy talking politics with him and secretly hope I am making him think about things a little differently. ;-)

Thanks for sharing your story. I hope you have a great weekend!

Thanks, Laura. You have a good weekend too, okay?

We'll probably see each other in here over it though, anyway, heh heh.

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