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Israeli or American? It's Anyone's Guess.
The practice of carrying two passports from two different nations is something that I really can’t wrap my mind around. While I’m sure that it could be convenient to have two different passports in the event you may want to visit a nation that has bad relations with the US, or in case one of your passports is seized or lost, having two different citizenships in two different nations could be a problem. This would be a problem especially if you happened to work for one of the governments of which you hold dual citizenship.
Let’s presume that you work for the United States government, and let’s go a step further and presume that you hold a top-secret security clearance. This could pose a significant risk if you held citizenship in a country that had a significant interest in something that the US was doing or someone or something that the US was investigating. Where would your loyalties lie? If we take this a step even further and imagine that the US was going to deliberately withhold information from your “other” country or even worse, somehow double-cross that country, what would you do? Where would your loyalty to the United States end and the loyalty to that other country begin?
We can even take this further. Let’s say that the “other” country in which you hold citizenship in was not only a country that represented your brethren, people that had your same culture and language, but lets say that this other country you belong to also was based on your religion? Now that’s a whole new ballgame. When you take an oath to your government to get a federal job, you must pledge to support and defend the Constitution of the United States, so help you God. Now that’s a dilemma that nobody would want to face if the other nation you belong to happens to represent your religion too. The question would probably be answered by how religious you are or aren’t. Those that put God first and their country second would have a real moral dilemma.
You are probably wondering where I’m going with this. Well the facts are that we have a host of people that work or have worked with this administration that hold dual citizenship in both the US and Israel. The problem with this is that the Middle-East is the area that the US is currently concerned the most with. Israel of course, also has legitimate security concerns with the area. In fact, some information that crosses American official’s desks could possibly decide whether Israel continues to exist. This is a position that I wouldn’t want to find myself in if I were a citizen of both nations. Believe it or not, this country and Israel aren’t exactly joined at the hip, even though it may seem like that at times. That is no wonder, look at the people that hold this dual citizenship;
Michael Chertoff; Attorney General on 9/11, Director of Homeland Security
Ari Fliescher; Former Press Secretary to President Bush
Jack Abramoff: Jailed Lobbyist (supposedly entertained Mohammed Atta on his Yacht Days before 9/11)
Mark Grossman: Under Secretary for political affairs (Met with General Mahmoud Amhoud, head of Pakistani ISI on or about 9/11 the supposed financier of the hijackers.
Douglas Fein: Undersecretary of War and former member of PNAC (Project for a new American Century)
Paul Wolfowitz: Fein’s Boss, Former PNAC member, investigated for spying for Israel, resigned in World Bank scandal.
Dov Zakheim: Pentagon Comptroller when 2.3 Trillion Dollars went missing, former CFR member.
Elliot Abrams; Member of PNAC, NSA lied about Iran-Contra scandal plead guilty.
Lewis “Scooter” Libby: Former PNAC member, guilty of lying about outing of Valerie Plame, studied under Paul Wolfowitz.
Henry Kissinger: Sat on War Policy Board under Perle, first chosen to lead 9/11 Commission
William Kristol; PNAC Co-founder, strong advocate of Iraq War.
Phillip Zelkow: Advisor to Bush in 2000 campaign, led 9/11 Commission
Larry Silverstien: Owned WTC Complex, made several million dollars off 9/11.
That’s quite a list, is it not? Where do these men’s loyalties lie? Don’t you believe that it is in US interests to bar people with dual citizenship from working at the highest levels of the US government? Do you believe that the cozy relationship we have with Israel could have been fostered by any of these men? I wonder how many decisions made were a direct result of their input. Maybe the time is right to stop the practice of dual-citizenship.
That’s the way I see it.
Comments (20)
Each and every day, I come to terms that this once great nation has turned herself into a WHORE.
April 5, 2008 1:46 PM | Reply | Permalink
Timothy,
I knew about Chertoff and may have known about some of the others, but do you have links that confirm your information, a primary source?
Thanks.
April 5, 2008 2:17 PM | Reply | Permalink
This is all well known, and sources are scattered in articles all over. Do a google search.
The only thing Tim is doing differently is talking about it in regards to divided loyalities.
If you didn't know about all of this, you should open your eyes to the extent of the over-representation of Israel apologists in this administration, and the last. It's a serious problem that needs to be examined.
April 6, 2008 7:07 AM | Reply | Permalink
I don't care about particular names, political parties, or countries. Very simply, in my personal opinion, anybody working on behalf a foreign government as a lobbyist and anyone holding dual-citizenship should be absolutely disqualified from public office and from holding any level of security clearance.
Matthew
http://www.TheProblemWithObama.com
April 5, 2008 3:54 PM | Reply | Permalink
Because the happenstances of birth resulting in a sole citizenship is some guarantee of qualifications for those positions?
Yeah. Brilliant.
April 5, 2008 4:02 PM | Reply | Permalink
This is just stupid. It's sort of like telling someone they're incapable of loyalty, because they love both their mother AND father.
April 5, 2008 4:01 PM | Reply | Permalink
If you want to go with your stupid analogy, then fine, but first bitterly divorce the mother and father, and tell the son he has to choose who to live with.
If the son is caught in dad's desk looking at dad's ledger for mom, dad may just decide to smack the son and send him to live permanently with mom, who already gets too much of dad's paycheck, even though dad doesn't have to pay alimony anymore.
How's that? I think it's a much better analogy now.
April 6, 2008 8:32 AM | Reply | Permalink
Give me a beak Blacknell.I couldn't have described the situation clear enough. You can't be in the middle when two parties see things differently. Whether they are countries, or your father and mother.
April 5, 2008 4:25 PM | Reply | Permalink
what's this stuff? lots of countries allow dual-citizenship. i live in Sweden, and many Americans here have both Swedish & US passports.
this is no way implies anything sinister.
the real problems in USA are caused by people who have only the US passport, such as Cheney, Bush, et al. -they're the ones turning the USA into a rotten-banana republic, and now even the economy is going down the drain....
April 5, 2008 6:16 PM | Reply | Permalink
I'm pretty certain all of these claims, as to these persons holding dual citizenship are false. Don't use this site to circulate lies and anti-semitic slanders.
April 5, 2008 6:38 PM | Reply | Permalink
None of this is a "lie" or inaccurate at all. Where is your proof?
Further, by knowingly using a false charge of antisemitism, you yourself dishonor the memory of all six million Jews who died and gave that charge the weight it deserves. That is a far more antisemitic act than what you are wrongfully alleging. YOU are the antisemite. Nice job!
April 6, 2008 8:35 AM | Reply | Permalink
Josh,
Ah, delete it then, I say.
April 5, 2008 8:06 PM | Reply | Permalink
I hope that Mr. Gatto doesn't think that he's the first person to spread anti-Semitic attacks on loyalties. The French, of course, tried to do it masterly a century ago with the Dreyfuss Affair, the Soviets notoriously used the term "internationalist" to attack Jews, and for nearly two millennia "disloyalty" has been a common refrain. Mr. Gatto could at least get people's names and alleged offenses right. One could certainly add to this list of sociopaths a vast number of non-Jewish sociopaths, starting and by no means ending with Ronald Reagan and George W. Bush. (Dick Cheney, Donald Rumsfeld. and Condaleeza Rice are Jewish??)
Mr. Gatto perhaps needs to be reminded that over 110,000 Japanese and Japanese-Americans were interned during WW II for no good reason, other than the type of garbage he has spewed.
April 5, 2008 9:24 PM | Reply | Permalink
Your words are a gross distortion of history, and uses extremes to extinguish legitimate discussions of issues that affect all our lives as Americans.
The question of loyalty is certainly one of the Bush Administration, but unfortunately it's a question of loyalty to Bush, not America.
Here, Tim is talking about how divided loyalties can alter and reverse policies of the government, which is a very serious, and possibly illegal, possibility that needs to be discussed openly.
False claims of antisemitism are common when Israel's name is invoked by any American not aligned with the Likud party interests. This is a false charge that is far more heinous in its antisemitism than anything you were trying to malign before. Why are you being antisemitic?
April 6, 2008 7:04 AM | Reply | Permalink
I wasn't being anti Israeli or Jewish.I will say however that most of the men mentioned on that list are not what I would call "trustworthy". Frankly, the idea that someone can hold dual citizenship from ANY nation and work at the policy making levels of government makes me nervous. I was in the Army for almost 21 years and held a clearance to work with sensitive items. In the Army it would be impossible to hold a top secret clearance and hold dual citizenship. I wonder why the government allows this, especially when the area of their duties could have caused a definite conflict of interest. I would ask the same questions of say people holding a German passport while negotiating on European affairs. Its a legitimate question that has nothing to do with prejudice or antisemitism.
April 6, 2008 12:19 AM | Reply | Permalink
I have checked out the bios of the people on Gatto's list. They are not Israeli. They were not born in Israel, are not married to Israelis, and as far as I can tell, have never lived there. Many of them are too old to have had parents born in Israel (e.g., born before 1948).
Kissinger was born in Germany and came to the US directly. Fliescher, born in NJ, hopped directly from high school to college to political nuttery without interruption. Perle, born in US, HS in California, college in US and Denmark, then full time career as a wingnut.
Keep in mind that while any jew can move to Israel and become a citizen, they have to do military service. You can't just apply for the citizenship by mail!
Mr. Gatto, show me some evidence that these men are Israeli. And nothing from one of the antisemitic nazi or klan websites. Your post is decietful and hateful--just a regurgitation of the Nazi (and later, Stalinist) propaganda that jews are untrustworty, money grubbing, stateless people who will try to do us in.
Josh, please remove this bullshit from your website!
April 6, 2008 4:57 AM | Reply | Permalink
This isn't bullshit, it is fact. You are attempting to stifle legitimate discussion and I now ask Josh to delete your post and ban your account.
Josh, please delete karsten's account. He is violating your Terms of Service and is being disruptive. This goes for the other posters above who call for this entirely reasonable article to be pulled.
Further, I ask you to look at what IP addresses these posts come from, because many may come from paid PR departments of various organizations, which is also a violation of your Terms of Service.
April 6, 2008 6:32 AM | Reply | Permalink
Tim, take heart.
There is nothing even remotely antisemitic or anti-Israel about your post. All of these "people" who are trying to say negative things talk exactly like paid workers for places with initials like AIPAC, ADL, and AJC. They bring up the same old tired canards, and it is best just to ignore them.
Furthermore, your information is completely accurate. All of these posters know it. All the men you cite were granted Israeli citizenship and it most certainly does not require military service if the Israeli government waives it, which it does frequently.
Kudos to you for having the guts to take on the cowardly Israel Lobby with this post. The entire US will no longer be intimidated into silence, and we will discuss the Israel Lobby, Israel, and our relationship to her wherever and whenever we want. It is patriotic to do so, and anti-American and antisemitic to stifle that conversation with false claims of antisemitism.
I implore you to read an excellent blog written by a prominent academic who discusses these issues on a daily basis, Philip Weiss.
www.philipweiss.org
Please keep writing, and if you feel like writing about this subject again, do it, and don't hesitate or suffer these shills.
April 6, 2008 6:29 AM | Reply | Permalink
I'm SURE that there are an equal number of Senior Government Officials who hold dual American and Swiss citizenship.
Aren't there?
Uh....
It isn't "anti-Semitic" if this is factual.
Having top officials who hold dual allegiance is perilous.
Let me ask those who are calling for this to be censored -
IF the President held dual American-Isreali (or -Swiss!) citizenship...would you be so sanguine about it?
Come January 2009, I wonder how many of these rapacious thugs will split for their "other" home?
April 6, 2008 1:26 PM | Reply | Permalink
Josh,
I think you were a bit quick brandishing the antisemitism cudgel.
Fact is, this is a rational discussion, mostly by rational people, discussing a troubling coincidence of a specific type of dual-loyalties.
Whom are these people faithful to, when there is a difference of objctives between a religious state that passes itself off as a democracy, and a weak, compromised democracy such as the USA.
Americans have the right to know whom their ruling elites are beholden to.
Sure, Josh, this is your site. Please respect your readership as well, as this is who you owe your success to.
April 6, 2008 3:27 PM | Reply | Permalink
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