MORE IMPORTANTLY WHAT WOULD JESUS SAY?

After all who better to explain your derangement than him.

(insert howling apostles here)

Mother Jones had an article written last summer about the ultra-rightwinged church group that Hillary Clinton belonged to and how she believes in the fundamentalist belief that personal salvation is more important that community involvement. Yet another reason why Hillary Clinton is not really a Democrat. Democrats need to realize that if she gets the nomination and becomes the president she will become the Democrats GW.

Skeletons anyone.....

Clinton's prayer group was part of the Fellowship (or "the Family"), a network of sex-segregated cells of political, business, and military leaders dedicated to "spiritual war" on behalf of Christ, many of them recruited at the Fellowship's only public event, the annual National Prayer Breakfast. (Aside from the breakfast, the group has "made a fetish of being invisible," former Republican Senator William Armstrong has said.) The Fellowship believes that the elite win power by the will of God, who uses them for his purposes. Its mission is to help the powerful understand their role in God's plan.

http://100reasonsnottovoteforhillaryclinton.blogspot.com/2008/03/1-her-christian-conservative.html

Hillary's default 'spiritual advisor' is Billy Graham:

http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1650798,00.html

The senior of course - it was the junior Graham that said Katrina was just desserts for a gay new orleans lifestyle.

Google Hillary and prayer breakfast. It will blow your mind.

First of all, Hillary had nothing to do with it. That is why the only proof of her connection to this that you can offer is "nod, wink, nudge, nudge". The media was aware of Rev. Wright long ago, and some referred to the story as a time bomb waiting to go off. It went off because Obama decided to run for President.

And who outside of his immediate family was closer to Obama than Wright? Obama chose Wright. Wright let him to Jesus, became his mentor, friend, surrogate father and spiritual guide, baptized his two children, was the source of the title of one of his books, prayed with him immediately before he announced his bid for the presidency, and was a member of his campaign's spiritual advisory council. Therefore, as Obama himself admitted, Wright was a legitimate political topic.

Has Hillary benefited from all this? Absolutely. But that's the great part about it. She had nothing to do with it. She didn't put it out there, as you said. She didn't fan the flames, as you said. Her only remark was that she would have left the church. Who wouldn't have? Maybe you, I don't know. And the remark she made the other day was that Wright's comments were outrageous. But Obama had already said exactly that. So there's your connection to Hillary. Sorry, but that's all you've got. I know you'd like to pin it on her, but you can't. This was all Obama's fault. And how has Hillary benefited from it? Because it raises so many legitimate questions about Obama, from his choice of associates to the degree to which he and Wright think alike. These are all questions voters should ask. And many are.

Now if Wright decides to respond to Obama's comments, you're going to have to write another post blaming that on Hillary. Let's see how creative you can get.

I'll tell you something else: I'm not a registered Democrat. This debacle illustrates exactly why.

My own Independent inclinations stem from the Democratic habit of rolling over for this administration, but this doesn't help.

The day the majority of D's take their responsibilities toward this nation as seriously as Feingold does is the day I'll proudly affiliate.

Feingold! What a mensch! I love that guy.

Last I knew, Senator Clinton was a member at Foundry Methodist. At www.foundryumc.org/pdfs/Statement%20concerning%20Rev.%20Jeremiah%20Wright.pdf
you can read Foundry pastor's March statement in support of Reverend Wright.

Does anyone know if she's actually moved her membership somewhere else? Or if she's stopped worshipping there since she entered the Senate?

laurajordan...Exploiting racial tension was a deal-breaker for me--I decided I won't vote for a Democrat who stoops to it.

I'm really glad that you finally saw through the Obama SC sham to break off black Democrats. Welcome to the light.

And...you do know that JJ did win the SC dem contests in 84 & 88, right? I registered as a dem and voted for him in 88. I still can't figure out why Obama thought I should be ashamed of that vote...you know, that my vote somehow diminished him.

Crazy, don't you think?

and you exemplify the attributes of an ignorant xenophobe - WTF? Key African American attributes? Were you trying to be funny? I find this post really offensive ...

To be honest, I doubt that Hillary actually goes to church

I heard the name "Wright" for the first time about the same time Obama declared he was running for president. I think Wright himself has a lot to do with the longevity of this news story. Hillary Clinton's pastor, whoever he is, seems a bit more discreet.

Dijamo,

So let me get this straight. It was Pat Robertson's endorsement that caused you to lose respect for Giuliani when he was Mayor of NY? That offended you more than the 'open season' season tactics he encouraged his police force to take on black men? Do you recall how he justified the hail of police bullets unleashed on an unarmed young black man coming home from college classes during his tenure? I suppose you identified with his logic in that case, and the many other examples of his 'law and order' methods.

I've seen your posts before and refrained from commenting, but you seem to be suffering from a classic case of Stockholm Syndrome. Being viewed as a 'negative reference group' is indeed traumatic. Over a life time, some people can react in very maladaptive ways. Some will devalue the lives of those who look like them and kill indiscriminately (as with gang bangers). Others like you, develop a twisted identification with people who clearly don't share their interests.

I'm not trying to be mean. But the aggressive way you press your incongruent world view seems a bit hysterical; almost like a cry for help. It is pathological indeed. Please give this some thought and get some counseling!!!

'Ann'

Dijamo,

My observations of you have nothing to do with what Rev. Wright did or did not say. They result from a pattern of your comments and apparent thinking that 'protests to much' and works too hard to disassociate yourself from anything that you believe associates you with an 'African-American perspective'. It's as if you're working so hard to distance yourself from points of view, that while you don't have to agree with them, you don't have to revile them as insane and incomprehensible; as if several centuries of white racism, Jim crow, did not influence this vantage point, and that current white privilege does not exist.

Most reasonable, fair minded African Americans (and many reasonable fair minded European Americans) know and acknowledge this. They don't agree with Wright's most ludicrous statements, but they understand how such distrust of the government and larger society could exist. It's curious that you don't. That you can't seem to handle that nuance, or allow it to inform your judgments on Rev. Wright or the issue of race relations in general. That is maladaptive for any person living in America today. Especially a person of color. It doesn't mean you have to support someone just because they're black. It should mean, however, that your life experiences equip you not to be so didactic or 'black & white' about the issue (no pun intended).

Barrack gets this. And he's so impressive because he understands that opposite impulses can operate in the same person simultaneously. That's way simple characterizations offered by other politicians aren't usually spoken by him. He gets that about Rev Wright, just like he gets that about his Grandmother. Do you have a Grandmother? Have you ever talked to her? Have you ever talked to any people of color about their American experience? Have you tried to really listen (not necessarily agree) with what they shared?

As you mature, hopefully, you'll try this and come to understand these things a bit better. For your sake, I certainly hope so.

Sincerely,

'Ann'

I assume this blog was recommended by readers for its humor value? The Wright story can be traced back to a NYT 3/5/07 article about Obama dis-inviting Wright because he feared Wright's views were too harsh (but Obama said he just found out about Wright's views this last Monday? Hmmmm...). Erik Rush, a conservative columnist, first published a piece on Wright on 2/20/07, and appeared a few days later on Hannity's show.

How on earth Andrew Reilly come up with the idea that Hillary dug all this up?

And has he noticed that the opposition digs up stuff on EVERYONE! Duh! Where'd Watergate come from? Whitewater? Larry Craig's restroom adventure story? Hello! That's what people do out there, Andrew. If your candidate can't stand the heat, well...

And if Hillary Clinton attended a church for 20 years which had a preacher as goofy as Wright, and the guy married her and Bill, baptised Chelsea, was almost a member of the Clinton household, and she titled a book after one of his sermons, then HELL YES the guy would be newsworthy.

Little baby!

"Ann", Woodly1 ...whoever you are?

I suggest you find someone else to analyze becuase your assumptions about my sister are based on nothing. You do not know her background other than she is "African American". I intended to respond to your sorry excuse for an attack on my sister but I know she can handle herself in these situations.

As the older sister my instincts are to defend her but I know you are likely to have your ass handed to you at some point today.

I give my little sis props for continuing to post on all these ProBAAAma sites. I keep telling telling her these people are nuts and they just talk smack all day long. The anonymity of these blogs gives people the courage to do and say whatever they want. She has been insulted, degraded, even stalked and those are the nice Obaama supporters! YEAH UNITY!

Yet, she stands firm and continues to stand up for what she beleives in. She bases her opinions on facts and concedes the point when she is wrong. Your attack on her is unacceptable because you don't know anything about her as a person. You read a few (OK maybe a hundred, it's been a long campaign) posts by her and you want to make this grandiose summation. You are a joke, your post is a joke and you should refrain from making personal attacks.

One of the reasons she used her pictures as her avatar is because she would post and no one ever believed she was "black" and supporting Hillary. The funny thing is even after she posted the pic people still didn't believe her. I don't know you Ann nor do I care to. You could "Brown, Yellow, Puerto Rican or Haitian" for all I know but believe me you are no expert on my sister so stick to posting on what you know...hmmm that would be nothing. Buh-Bye!

Minamo,

I know these discussions are probably difficult for you and your sister. And I suspect no one on this blog has tried to address this issue in response to her comments. They may not know how to. Some of those reading these blogs may look at your sister as an oddity, a few may see her as 'one of the good ones' and wonder why all 'those people' couldn't all think like her. Still others may not know what to say, so they just ignore her, or argue against her political positions (instead of the underlying disconnects they observe, but don’t give voice to). However, I'm not worried about them.

Despite your distain for me (or more accurately, for the ideas I propose, for as you point out, we don't know each other) I'm concerned about young people in general. I'm particularly concerned about young people of color. I can’t ignore the disconnect. It’s really more significant than whatever political posturing she’s engaged in at the time.

The mindset reflected in your sister's comments saddens me more than angers me. It shows so much ignorance of history, and it's influence on the present. It also demonstrates a rigidity of thought that doesn't grasp the complexity of something like race relations, or life in general. That kind of rigidity can mellow over time, and yield to more evolved thinking, or it can break you.

I'm not trying to be cruel or unkind. I know, if you (or your sister) read this, you will likely continue to be defensive and call me names. And that's O.K., cause I know these propositions are tough to consider. It’s my sincere hope, however, that at some point, you'll calm down, relax your rigidity just a bit, and think about it.

Best Regards,

'Ann'

"Ann"

You again...

First of all there there is no discussion to be had about my point of view because it is just that MY POINT OF VIEW. You should be less concerned about my take on politics and more concerned about your own candidate. You truly have no idea of our life experiences. How we grew up? Our ethnic background? Our economic status? You can not just go around making these judgements about people you don't know.

SO STOP!

I shouldn't have to defend my knowledge of "the black experience" on TPM. Because my skin color does not guide my political views.

But, let me point out again your original assessment doesn't hold water. Disconnections with our community, with our people because I don't salivate over potentially voting for the 1st African American president or I don't agree with the asisnie comments made by a radical Revrend. There is no exciuse for his comments. I don't beleive Obama agrees with him but I still can't understand how this man can be your mentor and part of your family.

Even if he was kind of like (Uncle Ray Ray or Cousin Pookie) you know the family members you hide in the attic. The fact that you have now thrown him under the bus for the benefit of saving your election bid...doesn't say much for you as a person or your character.

As for calling you names...I don't need to. You don't matter enough for all that. If your words meant anything then maybe, just maybe I would rattle off a couple of insults. 10 years ago I would have had something not so nice to say but I have learned to pick my battles and I would rather discuss the issues of this campaign than defend the love of my community!

Stick to politics!!!