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Hillary Won...

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...at least in the view of this one humble voter. I thought she  projected more confidence and a higher comfort level than Sen. Obama. I thought she was generally sharper and more concise in her responses than he was. I actually thought (for one of the rare times, frankly) that she was more LIKEABLE and even more genuine than he was. 

To be honest, I'm not  altogether sure this is a good thing. She almost seems to have arrived at that perfect pitch of serenity we are always hearing in concession speeches: ("Why couldn't ______ have talked like this during the campaign?"). Sen. Obama on the other hand maintained the familiar, edgy posture of the slightly harassed striver.

Let me give Sen. Obama credit for one excellent answer, on the Patreus question about military advice on Iraq. His rejoinder that the President (not the generals) sets the mission was exactly right.

I know there has been a lot of critcism of the moderaters and the line of questioning (particularly toward Sen. Obama). Keith Olbermann (normally a decent if somewhat over-stoked commentator, but far too much  an open Obama cheerleader to be further regarded  in any sense as an objective news source) actually speculated darkly  about Sean Hannity's influence, and George Stephanopolos' previous experience in the Clinton White House.

A few points on that:

(1)I think those of you complaining may have something of a point, but you're way late:  This sort of behavior has become the medium of exchange in ALL campaign debates. They  are ALWAYS more about controversy and  theatrical value than they are about a civics-class exploration of "issues". Remember how the whole campaign supposedly turned-around on Sen. Clinton's answer to something about the vital New York state driver's license "issue"?  If Sen. Clinton can put-up with it for 16 years, Sen. Obama should be able to survive it for one night.

(2)One thing I gather for sure from these objections, merited or otherwise: The perception is out there on ALL sides that Sen. Obama "lost", and that seems to require SOME kind of explanation, however labored.

(3)The Bill Ayers questions seem to be the most resented. I do NOT accept that Mr. Ayers and his relationship to Sen. Obama is somehow out-of-bounds, or a breach of some imaginary debate protocol. On the contrary, it seems to me entirely relevant. I fully understand that there are potential mitigating circumstances in every aspect of this matter, but those circumstances should be explored and explained - not ignored. I think voters will sort it out fairly, if given a chance to consider it in full.

All in all, I thought it was  a good night for my candidate.  We should know by this time next week if that is a majority opinion.


Comments (8)

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Hey one- Mostly I agreed with you. Hillary was the most settled of the two. i only found a link to listen about fifteen or twenty minutes in. I thought it was mostly a waste of time and unlikely to change anyones mind. If you were really undecided and didn't know who either of the candidates were than may be you go to Hillary

I don't think that anything is really out of bounds- but some stuff like the Ayers thing is just stupid. As Obama said he was 8 years old. Ayers is an accepted member of his community, a teacher on the board of directors of what ever the organization was. The whole thing was twisted - Hillary talked as if his remarks about not doing enough was in RESPONSE to 9/11 but they had been made previously and just happened to be published on 9/11. i don't think he compares to the criminals in this admin - but thats just my opinion

Also, as Obama pointed out during the debate, Bill actually pardoned two of the Weathermen, so if we're going to do guilt-by-association, I think her association is stronger.

I definitely don't fault Hillary's performance. She did a good job. I fault ABC. Although one_wilson is right that these vapid questions are hardly new, I think the impression of most of us is that ABC took it to a whole new level of stupid, and that wasn't easy.

Yesterday's "debate" yet again showed that if you want your politics replete with cookie cutter answers, Hillary is your candidate. She definitely has her talking points memorized.

Of course for some reason, most people want more than a robotic talking points machine in the White House.

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The ABC debate was more like a debate sponsored by 527s.

I accept the fact that the MSM has been courting controversy. But that's just it. The character attacks, from the flag pin to Wright to Farrakhan was all yesterday's news, talked about incessantly by pundits for months.

If this were the first debate, ABC would be on higher ground to have raised some of these issues.

But after so much national discussion about them, trying to get more out of them than there is in them is lame.

It's also lame to assume this is what voters really care about. The "bitter" thing was something the media told people they should be offended by, not the other way around.

Regarding Rev. Wright: Had Obama not responded to this head on with an historic and bold speech about race, the question might have been warranted.

Just because this national enquirer stuff is what Republicans are going to be talking about doesn't make it more important to voters.

No doubt that Obama lost. I don't know how anyone could walk away from it thinking otherwise. The Ayers question was silly, but it actually allowed Obama to do what he should have done with so many other questions -- turn it around and put egg on the face of Clinton and/or the questioners. He missed a lot of good opportunities, like when Gibson prodded him on this capital gains supply side nonsense.

The stupidest question of all was the flag pin, in my view. It's open season for rightwing dittoheads to fixate on that sort of thing, but I would expect more from these guys (wrongly, I see). Something about how they would actually control healthcare costs, what they would do about the credit crisis -- they could have been appropriately "tough" on Obama with these questions, but instead they went with irrelevant potshots. Very depressing.

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On Halperin's "The Page" is a fascinating little ditty:

"The Obama campaign tells Stephanopoulos that 'prominent Pennsylvania supporters' will switch their support from Clinton to Obama Thursday morning due to Clinton’s negativity."

Link

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Thanks, Ben

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