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Attention Clinton Supporters
Just a note to all of the Clinton supporters out there who say they will trot off and vote for McCain in November if Obama is the Dem nominee - John McCain has a 0% rating from Planned Parenthood.
ZERO
ZERO
ZERO from <i>Planned Parenthood</i>.
Please think about what that means.
He wants Roe v Wade overturned.
He wants abstinance only education to continue.
He doesn't think health insurance should cover birth control.
I've never blogged before, just posted comments, so I'm not sure how to get a link in here, but there is an article by Joe Conason at <i>Salon</i> on this subject and a blurb on the blog "Broadsheet" , also at <i>Salon</i>, about the Planned Parenthood rating.












Comments (27)
Excellent point. As an Obama supporter, I sometimes have to drag myself back from falling victim to the us-against-them rhetoric of this primary... which, by the way, I don't blame wholly on the candidates, but also on the pundits and our culture's addiction to competitions (::cough::Super Bowl::cough::). It helps when I know some level-headed Clinton supporters. And I do know some, thank heavens.
Occasionally, in the depths political passion, I want to vow to stay home if Clinton gets the nomination (though only if she did so through unfair means), but eventually common sense returns. FWIW, even in the depths of madness I don't consider voting for McCain, for pity's sake. McCAIN???
So to those from either side who threaten to revenge-vote Republican, I add to DM's post: are you INSANE? Are your feelings so tender that you would help curse the country with another four years of abstinance-only education, and pro-war anti-veteran policies, and Constitutional slice-and-dice? What did the soldiers and clueless teenagers ever do to you?
Also? Consider the Supreme Court, and the likelihood that we'll be replacing justices soon. Seriously.
A rating of ZERO. Good God Gertrude.
April 11, 2008 6:29 AM | Reply | Permalink
I know exactly what you mean. No matter how tense things get sometimes in this primary cycle, I always try and keep my eyes on the prize. Thanks, DM.
Further reminder of the difference between Republicans and Democrats....I sent this story to my husband last week and I am really sorry I don't have the link (only the text) but it shows the problem or catastrophe of abstinence only program in Florida and with a ZERO score from Planned Parenthood, a McCain presidency will continue to support these kinds of programs:
"The state of Florida has a strict policy of abstinence-only sex education. A recent survey, however, shows that this program may be failing, leading teens to believe dangerous myths about pregnancy and and sexually-transmitted diseases:
A recent survey that found some Florida teens believe drinking a cap of bleach will prevent HIV and a shot of Mountain Dew will stop pregnancy has prompted lawmakers to push for an overhaul of sex education in the state.
The survey showed that Florida teens also believe that smoking marijuana will prevent a person from getting pregnant.
On Tuesday, a bill that would “require a more comprehensive approach” to sex education narrowly won approval from a state Senate committee."
April 11, 2008 10:18 AM | Reply | Permalink
I honestly believe that once the nomination is settled and the contrast between the Dem & McCain is evident for all to see; the Dems will come together along with many of the independents and win in a landslide.
Even Pat Buchanan was saying yesterday that he thinks that McCain's chances are so low that he wouldn't be surprised if Bush bombed Iran in October just to give the Republican's a bump. I know that Buchanan is a wacko for sure but he is accepting the reality that the country is against the Republicans this year.
April 11, 2008 9:47 AM | Reply | Permalink
mmmmmmmmm.....
April 11, 2008 12:34 PM | Reply | Permalink
Bra-burner generation response:
♪ crickets ♪
April 11, 2008 12:19 PM | Reply | Permalink
Well, I've never burned a bra, but I haven't worn one since I graduated (my Catholic) high school in 1979. Is that what you're referring to?
B-cup, enough to fill a champagne glass, I'm happy. Bras do suck if your shoulders or neck are sensitive, and mine are. Wonderfully. I've always considered myself lucky that I can get away with it.
DM is quite right. I've had it with pinheads on both sides that get upset about voting for the Dem nominee.
As former Edwards supporter, I'm afraid the "leftovers" aren't quite "left" enough for me. However, I truly feel that if I can hold my nose and cast my vote for the good of the country, then everyone can.
I said before that those that "can't" are the bozos that cut in front of you in line and pretend not to notice, or drive in the left-hand lane at 53 MPH and cause traffic jams. IOW, people who have an inflated (unjustified, mind you) sense of their ownselves as being "better" than the rest of us.
They suck.
Anymore questions?
:)
April 11, 2008 7:12 PM | Reply | Permalink
I would like this better if you said ATTENTION CLINTON AND OBAMA supporters because there's enough "pack up my toys" childishness to go around on both sides.
Seriously, I have two things that really push my buttons because they are so false and that the continue to be accepted as truisms convinces me that you seriously can fool enough of the people all of the time to do serious damage. These two canards are Obama is the real progressive and McCain is moderate. Both are equally false, but let's just deal with McCain.
He runs about 80% with Right to Life, 0 with Planned Parenthood, he's never met a war he didn't like, he wanted to bomb the Soviets during Vietnam !!!! It's pitiful that just believing in simple science makes you a moderate. So he believes in evolution, so what? IT should be a disqualifying fact to not believe in evolution. So he believes in global warming, so what? I believe the sun will rise, does that make me a moderate? The level of stupidity and superstitous twaddle that has invade our political discource is embarrassing. I can't believe that the Republicans are running Dr. Strangelove.
I thought their nomination of Bush in 2000 was a slap in the face, as though they didn't think America deserved a president who was competetent and experienced, but now I am pissed. The party nominated a warmonger - a strangelove, a monster with a friendly face.
So, no, I won't be trotting across the aisle to vote for the death-lover. The extent of my umbrage will be to volunteer less - and not because of Obama, but because, honestly, you all seem like a bunch of people I don't want to spend time with.
April 11, 2008 12:56 PM | Reply | Permalink
Wow - ALL Obama supporters are people you wouldn't want to spend time with? Isn't that a little sweeping?
For example, I totally know I wouldn't want to spend time with someone who makes such a sweeping and mean-spirited generalization about fellow Democrats. But it wouldn't be fair to assume all Hillary's supporters are like you.
April 11, 2008 1:09 PM | Reply | Permalink
Oregon Activist - I'm sorry to hear you're having such a negative experience from some Obama supporters. Like others on this list, I've seen many positive, inclusive people on Obama's side, as surely as I've run into a lot of very negative Clinton supporters, but that doesn't mean our experiences are similar, or need to be.
FWIW, the day when I bonded with several Clinton supporters who have helped me keep balance in my opinions? That was the day of the Texas Senatorial District Conventions, when Hillary supporters had challenged 87 of the less than 200 precincts in our district, then made the motion that instead of taking the hours it would take to resolve said challenges, we simply split the delegates from those challenged precincts down the middle, 50% for Clinton and 50% for Obama. Luckily, that motion didn't pass, and ALL candidates got the delegates they should have.
Luckily, I was able to recognize that a MINORITY of Clinton supporters had pulled those shenanigans. I hope you're able to take note of the positive Obama supporters as well.
April 11, 2008 5:25 PM | Reply | Permalink
I've always thought it odd that Obama thinks it's a positive thing that more Americans believe in angels than believe in evolution. A Face In The Crowd just came to mind. Obama's speech on religion in America is a handbook for his campaign. Almost like someone heard it or read it and said. Hey. We can run for President on these memes.
April 11, 2008 11:55 PM | Reply | Permalink
Scary.
April 12, 2008 12:41 AM | Reply | Permalink
The majority of people at this site
1) don't object to posters calling her a whore or a bitch and many even use those terms themselves
2) make insane allegations with not evidence (see the idiotic post-tax release thread)
3) would throw progressive goals under the bus to score points against her (see recent emergency room threads)
4) have little positive to say in favor of Obama (heck sometimes I offer more positive things about Obama) and seem to be motivated more by Clinton hatred than anything else.
5) tolerate misogyny and abuse, so long as it's targeted at her.
6) don't give a damn about low income and working class concerns - and flaunt your class privilege.
so...yes, in general, you're not the best folks to hang out with. TPM just happens to be the best blog, I don't know what Josh did to get saddled with y'all.
April 11, 2008 2:04 PM | Reply | Permalink
Dear Oregon Activist,
I can't speak for the various blog threads that have appeared on this site, as I'm pretty new to the blogging "community." In fact, I'm basically a neophyte when it comes to political organizing in general. What I do know is that my experiences thus far volunteering for Obama have been thoroughly rewarding, not least because of the thoughtful, enthusiastic, and even impassioned people I was able to meet, who have spanned just about every relevant identity category (class, gender, race, sexuality, age, and even to some extent political party, etc.).
Most of my volunteer work has been in NYC (where I currently live), but I'm from Oregon and the reports I've heard from Ashland largely mirror my own experiences. So please don't draw too many sweeping conclusions based upon those blogging folk who are a bit too rabid and, quite frankly, probably need to get outside a little more.
April 11, 2008 2:35 PM | Reply | Permalink
1) I don't read every post, so I may have missed the language quoted. I do not support those terms.
2) The question on taxes was who paid Bill for what. There would be concern that possible favors were owed.
3) The ER question came on the heels of the Bosnia delusion. The real question of why a woman who had health insurance developed hypertension during her pregnancy and was not followed up adequately by an obstetrician still remains unanswered.
4) Obama built a better organization despite "inexperience". He went from being too cerebral to too charismatic in the minds of hardcore Clinton suporters. Obama supporters view positons on the issues just like Clinton supporters. Hillary voted for the War.
5) If you want to see misogyny and abuse, wait until you see what getsunleashed on Michelle Obama. Hillary got David Shuster suspended for the "pimp" comment. O'Rielly is still employed despite a lych mob comment about Ms Obama.
6) Obama served those poor folks you care so much about when he left law school. One of the major frustrations s that some woring class people don't have the full facts abot Hillary and her support of NAFTA and outsourcing.
April 11, 2008 2:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
Have to agree with you about the TPM posters. Don't look for anything you write again to be recommended.
April 11, 2008 7:29 PM | Reply | Permalink
Posted in the wrong place. (Not be me though) Should be in response to Oregon Activist.
April 11, 2008 7:32 PM | Reply | Permalink
Like it is! Except I'll recommend it. Yours, too. I can't even decide which of the Obama clique I like the least.
April 11, 2008 11:45 PM | Reply | Permalink
Like it is!
April 11, 2008 11:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
Don't even get me started on Josh Marshall.
April 12, 2008 1:26 AM | Reply | Permalink
wow, I thought I was the only one here who felt that way. I 100% agree with you. I also shy away from Obama in part because the supporters I've come in contact with aren't people I want to hang with.
April 12, 2008 5:27 AM | Reply | Permalink
AdAbsurdum, I hope I'm misunderstanding your somewhat cryptic comment. Are you saying that it doesn't matter that McCain opposes reproductive rights, or that only "bra-burners" think women should have access the the information and health care that they need to control whether and when they have children?
Well, it's a big tent ... I know you're an Obama supporter, and so is Casey even though he's anti-choice. And I'm glad Obama has both of your support. So even if you think it's OK for government to take away sex education, and it'd be fine to finish off what's left of our constitutional rights to contraception and abortion -- I'm glad that you & Casey are supporting a candidate who supports reproductive rights, and not McCain, who doesn't. I think control over our own sexuality and reproduction are crucial aspects of everyone's humanity, citizenship and full participation in society.
So if that makes me a "bra-burner" in your book, I'm proud to be one. Even though I'm hardly of that "generation".
April 11, 2008 2:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
P.S. DM - thanks so much for raising this issue. It feels great to read a post and thread that focus on an issue that separates the Dems from McCain, rather than on the illusory "horse-race".
April 11, 2008 2:44 PM | Reply | Permalink
There's no question that the policy differences between Obama and Hillary are pretty small and that either of them would be vastly preferable to McCain. From a policy standpoint. But there's a point at which conduct, strategy, honesty, dare I say CHARACTER matters. I'm not absolutely sure where that point is. There have been a number of times during this campaign where I was pretty sure Hillary had crossed it and that if she'd won, I'd have had to sit out the general. Which is only marginally less bad than a vote for McCain. McCain is a guy I strongly disagree with but pretty much respect (despite his obvious pandering to his party's base this cycle). Hillary is a woman I strongly agree with but have come to pretty much NOT respect AT ALL. If it was two people I respected or two people I didn't respect or a person I respected AND agreed with vs someone I didn't either respect OR agree with, it would be an easy call. But Hillary vs McCain wouldn't have been an easy call. I couldn't have voted for McCain but I'm not sure I could have voted for Hillary either.
Fortunately, its beyond unlikely that I'll have to make that choice now - you can put a fork in her at this point. But it's not ALL about policy and there would be legitimate reasons to either vote against your policy preferences or not vote. Tough to rationalize when you think of it in terms of how many more people would die in Iraq and elsewhere, though, I have to admit.
April 11, 2008 4:07 PM | Reply | Permalink
Oregon, you're right, I should have addressed the post to ALL of the idjits who threaten to support McCain if "their" candidate isn't the nominee, including the ones from the Obama side. I realized that after I posted it, but as you know, once you post you can't edit.
April 11, 2008 5:38 PM | Reply | Permalink
PS Could anybody explain how to embed a link? Pleez!!
April 11, 2008 5:40 PM | Reply | Permalink
Sure indylib,
You just take a browser to the site you want to link to, copy the address from the browser, then paste it into your message.
http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/2008/04/attention-clinton-supporters.php#post-comment
Sometimes the address, like this one, is too long. You can use a service like Tinylink, to convert the long adress to a shorter one.
http://www.digipills.com/tinylink/introsafe.htm
Good luck
April 11, 2008 7:05 PM | Reply | Permalink
thank you for the tinylink link.
April 11, 2008 10:19 PM | Reply | Permalink
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