The majority of African Americans will vote for the democratic candidate - whomever that be. The lesser of two evils principle. Some feel betrayed by the Clintons and will probably A. Stay home - B. Vote for Nader or C. Vote for McCain. Who knows what goes through every single black person's mind?

As for me? I'm not a Hillary Clinton supporter. Who will I vote for in November if she the's nominee? I don't know.

Billy, you're asking a hypothetical. It isn't going to happen, because the superdelegates aren't really going to reward the candidate who hurt -- hopefully not fatally -- the Democratic Party's November chances, by going relentlessly negative.

It is true that the Obama coalition includes a lot of young and relatively inexperienced voters, including a large number of new Black voters who are voting in such overwhelming numbers for Obama mostly on an identity basis. If Obama went into the convention having won the most elected delegates, and then if he lost the nomination based on superdelegates, it is an understatement to say these voters would feel their candidate was jobbed. It would be a Pyrrhic victory for Clinton, and a disaster for the Party.

Come on, Billy. You have read DT's rabid foamings about deserting the party if Hillary isn't the nominee. In the nightmare scenario you want to make thinkable, do you really think there wouldn't be a lot of Obama supporters who reacted just as strongly and unreasoningly as DT? By the way, there is no reason to think these reactions would be exclusively, or even mostly, confined to Obama's Black supporters.

To a great extent, Obama's success has been built on turning out new and "occasional" voters. These voters would be unlikely to vote for the Republican, even if they were to feel ripped off by the outcome of the Democratic Convention. (I don't really think DT is going to vote the straight GOP ticket either.) However, given your very unlikely scenario, it is entirely likely that the new Obama voters would stay home in droves.

I think that if Obama were the candidate that a lot more African-Americans who normally don't bother to vote at all will bother to get out and vote for him. I think that if Hillary were the candidate, the same number of African-American Democratic voters will go to the polls and vote for her as got out and voted for Kerry. Just reality as I see it. And I think this has already been recognized and studied and factored in by both campaigns in the primary race--example: emphasis on urban returns and turnout in certain states. There's been plenty of articles already that speak of this phenonmenon after a realization set in that Obama could actually win, as previously black candidates were not seen as "having a chance."

The thing is, a high turnout overall cross-race could skew this back to the same percentages.

Some African-Americans won't vote for Hillary Clinton after a campaign they see as race-baiting.

Some Caucasian voters will not vote for Obama because he ran a campaign that they see as race-baiting.

Shouldn't you admonish both groups of voters?

BTW Billy,

By useing the term "Those" ( a plural of "That" which is: the farther away or less immediately under observation or discussion ., Merriam Webster) you catagorize the African Americans as exclusive of the group. Which may show your opinion as such.

By using "The" (as a definite article and function word of the pronoun African American) that would show the group as inclusive of the whole.

Just a note to sort out as we begin the dialouge on race.

Billy, let me break in down for you. On behalf of the millions of Americans voters who happen to be African American, for us Hillary Clinton is toast and Bill Clinton is toast for that matter, also. And it's not a matter of race but because of some undeniable racial things that her campaign did that were an affront to African American voters who more than 50/50 supported her candidacy in the beginning. Include me in that category.

After Willie Horton and the legacy of politicians such as Jesse Helms, there is one strategy that is absolutely unacceptable and extremely repulsive to Black voters and that is race-baiting. After her loss in Iowa, the Clinton Campaign intentionally ramped up a strategy to make Obama the Black candidate, she the White candidate and I'll win this thing with a little help from my Latino friends. Then close ranks after the nomination.

Incidentally Billy, Clinton was given the benefit of doubt in those early days that now seem so distant. But after the affront to Dr. King which also Ted Kennedy interpreted as an insult to the legacy of JFK, the fairy tale crap, Jesse Jackson, Ed Rendell, Geraldine Ferraro, and now innocent until proved guilt BS with Rev. Wright, Hillary has loss the support of a major portion of the Democratic base. Throw in her win at any cost mentality that once was considered unique to the Republican Party and the future doesn't look bright for her.

I have never voted for a Republican for the highest office in the land. And Black people do vote for White candidates. It just doesn't appear to work as well in reverse. Now, like prior bogus poll numbers, it appears that a lot of White voters in particular "so-called blue-collar and older White voters needed a "legitimate reason" to reject Obama. Rev. Wright is a convenience out.

So when we have a candidate saying hey let's change America and eliminate the old divisions and work together for the benefit of Black, White, All Americans, you tend to want to give that people the chance to try. You don't end up with a good feeling inside when their opponent embraces the idiocy of the past with wedge issue political tactics. If Hillary and McCain run against each other in November, it becomes a choice between two Republicans. I will vote for one of the Republicans.

More will stay home.

Fewer will help organize.

One huge thing in elections, is turnout. Obama's campaign has incredible ability to turn out voters, including new voters. It was very apparent in Iowa. We had Obama canvassers every week, I never saw a Hillary supporter walking my neighborhood. And I look for these things; I was precinct chair for the caucus (the person that runs the thing). Obama's turnout was 85% of the total from 2004, in our precinct. Hillary had fewer in 2008 than Kerry in 2004. (Edwards numbers went up about 40% from 2004.)

I bust my ass organizing for the party at the precinct level. These are my fellow PTA members, the people whose houses my kid goes to when he plays at a friends'. They bake the cookies for bake sales, coach the soccer teams, shovel each others' walks and driveways. I do it for them, and for all our kids. But I don't see now what the Clinton campaign offers that I want to do that for them in October.

Why do you need to have something, that is fairly obvious, spelled out?

Why do Democrats believe that the Supreme Court 'stole" the 2000 election?

Why wouldn't African Americans feel that the "powers that be", in this case the Super Delegates, stole the election from Obama?

The average voter isn't interested or knowledgeable about the fine legal or procedural issues involved or their philosophical underpinnings. Their perception is, my guy/gal had the most votes and you guys/gals in this privileged position changed the outcome, so screw you.

The motivation of the Supreme Court (partisan politics) or the Super Delegates (racism) doesn't really matter does it? If you play a game with some one who cheats, would you continue to play the game? I doubt it.

From conversations with my family, most will vote for Hillary if she wins the nomination. I am the odd ball out because I spend much time in blogality.

But this is depending on if she won by having the most pledged delegates and the popular vote. If it seemed to them unfair, then they would probably react like some other Americans and think it is not fair. Half may not vote at all and the other half might still vote for Hillary or McCain. My nephews would probably just vote for Nader. They are young and idealistic, not old and jaded like me.

You see? African Americans are just like everyone else.

If it's a fact, and it is, you better start paying attention to it. There is no way Obama can the GE without the base & so far they haven't shown up for him. When you see a poll that McCain is competative in MA v Obama that's real trouble. Ignore it at your peril.

America is not post-racial we are working towards that aim. If the superdelegates give the election to Hilary it would mean they believe that Obama couldn't win in the General Election.

Now the only logical reason why they believe he couldn't win in the General Elections because he is an African American.

If I as an African American can't be president in my own country because of my race what is the reason for my vote. That is just a reminder that black people remain "second class citizen" in their own country. I can't believe you don't see how black people would be offended by that. I don't think they would vote for McCain but I don't think they vote.

Also you have to question why Hilary Clinton who at the begining of this race had greater name reconition, more money, and a much stronger political machine. Couldn't beat Barack Obama. I mean as one of Hilary supperts said Obama's campaign is "ameture hour."

I gather that what brother crow meant by "base" was what Clinton staffers mean when they distinguish "significant" states from those other, insignificant ones. Given the inconvenient state that Obama wins more voters (in more states), the Clinton campaign is reduced to claiming that the votes/states that *really* count are the ones that go to Clinton.

The former First Lady described her 1996 trip to the base at Tuzla earlier this week in a speech:

I certainly do remember that trip to Bosnia, and as Togo said, there was a saying around the White House that if a place was too small, too poor, or too dangerous, the president couldn't go, so send the First Lady. That’s where we went. I remember landing under sniper fire. There was supposed to be some kind of a greeting ceremony at the airport, but instead we just ran with our heads down to get into the vehicles to get to our base.
______________________________________
Obama made Hillary say that she landed under sniper fire in 1996. She couldn't be telling a falsehood could she?

Somehow cameras missed the gunfire

http://matthewyglesias.theatlantic.com/archives/2008/03/hillary_clinton_in_bosnia.php

African Americans are among the most loyal Democrats there are. They are the bloody base.

In a national poll taken by Pew Research in late February, white Democrats said they were more likely to defect to presumptive Republican nominee Sen. John McCain of Arizona if Obama is the Democratic nominee than if Clinton is.

In the poll, 10 percent of white Democrats said they would cross party lines and support McCain if Clinton is the nominee. But twice as many -- 20 percent -- said they would back McCain if Obama is nominated. White Democrats without a college degree were even more likely to defect if Obama is nominated: 24 percent said so.

African-American Democrats said they were not likely to defect regardless of the nominee. Under either scenario, only 1 percent of black Democrats said they would support McCain.

Article here.