Reader Posts
« previous | TPM CAFÉ READER POSTS HOME | next »
President Obama and the To-do List
I was thinking about this last night and wanted to ask the opinion of the Obama supporters.
It seems to me that many support Obama in a very personal and emotional (more so than those who support Clinton). And you support thim less for his plans than for his overall vision and promise of the future, although I could be wrong. So, to clarify this, I have two questions for Obama supporters:
1. What do you specifically expect him to deliver in his first term? Specific actions, laws, programs, etc - I mean practical deliverables for the country, practical change.
2. Obviously, if he delivers you would support him for a second term. Would you still support him if he doesn't deliver?
Thanks











Comments (36)
1) I support his stand on one of the most pressing issues, that of rolling back the overuse of the Bush executive orders specifically the unitary executive orders.
2) There is no "if".
March 21, 2008 10:12 AM | Reply | Permalink
1. Removal of most (but not all) American troops from Iraq.
2. Addition of two divisions, properly equipped, to our military capacity to handle new security difficulties.
3. Noticable steps to reduce the annual deficit, plus an agreed-plan to start paying down the ongoing debt (but not progress by the end of the first term).
4. A substantial step on the uninsured (but not as big or as good a his proposals, because he'll have to negotiate).
5. A major green-jobs program that addresses the recession most of all, but contributes on global warming and de-industrialization.
6. Major backtracking on No Child Left Behind, because it's the only reasonable option when neither the feds nor the states can afford to do anything better than that.
7. Bully-pulpit work that actually changes national discussion and some of what actually happens on a linked set of issues: public education for underprivileged students, math and science education, family roles in children's learning and well-being.
8. Adoption of the military rules for interrogation by non-military personnel.
9. Constitutionally respectable trials for those now held at Guantanamo.
10. Continued eavesdropping, but only by FISA warrant.
11. Paper ballots with computer voting.
March 21, 2008 10:17 AM | Reply | Permalink
- Economy?
- Immigration?
March 21, 2008 10:23 AM | Reply | Permalink
I like this list!
March 21, 2008 11:08 AM | Reply | Permalink
12. Nominate strong, intelligent liberal justices to the Supreme Court to replace Ginsberg and Stevens.
March 21, 2008 12:54 PM | Reply | Permalink
The thing is, Lalo, I can't ignore the twisted things (in disguise) you have been posting.
So I kindly ask that first you openly offer responses to your own questions in reference to the candidate you support, be it Hillary or McCain.
(PS: At the light of your previous posts, you don't ring quite sincere when you say:
"It seems to me that many support Obama in a very personal and emotional (more so than those who support Clinton). And you support thim less for his plans than for his overall vision and promise of the future, although I could be wrong."
You are pointing to Obama supporters as delusional (in nice disguise) in contrast to Clinton's plan-valuing-supporters. As you well say "it seems [to you]" and yes, "[you] could be wrong" and no, you haven't offered any clues to support your claim.)
March 21, 2008 10:23 AM | Reply | Permalink
Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz..............
March 21, 2008 10:42 AM | Reply | Permalink
There are a few things I expect him to do early on:
1) Decisively deal with Iraq - I don't really expect an immediate withdrawal, but decisive and responsible movement in that direction must happen within the first 100 days. Moving more troops into Afghanistan - actually capturing Bin Laden - is a must.
2) Campaign for a much larger majority in Congress - this is even before he gets in office, but I expect him to assist downticket races more than Clinton ever would. But once he's in office, I want to see movement towards the bi-partisan coalition he's promising. I really want to see Republicans brought in as partners in legislation, not just enemies.
3) Undo some of these psycho Bush policies - I don't care which ones, I just want him to jump in and get started!
4) New Orleans - that they are sill living in trailers and only solve 2 out of every 128 murders is UNACCEPTABLE.
5) Education - I want to see a big fat education initiative (with emphasis on paying for college) go through in his first term.
There are other things that I would like to see happen, but realistically no administration can do one or two big things a term. But these 4 lead to the second half of your question - would any kind of failure on these issues make me not want to re-elect him in 2012?
Well, too much of any campaign plan can be derailed by current events. We can't forsee what world or national events could foil his plans, and as a voter I would take that into consideration if his response to those plans was appropriate (I'm thinking of Katrina and other events that aren't forseeable, but where a good reaction and recovery are crucial).
The only thing that could completely turn me off to him for re-election would be if his administration was as confrontational and partisan as the ones before it. I'm really, really, really (really) sick of the "us vs. them" mentality. If his administration baits and fosters it, then I don't think I'd vote for him in 2012.
March 21, 2008 10:26 AM | Reply | Permalink
There's a difference between what I expect him to do in general, and what I really want him to do that I think he'll do (it's a difference of emphasis more than of substance). I'll address the latter rather than the former.
The first thing that I'd expect from either Clinton or Obama would be the repealing of all the stupid "environmental" initiatives put in place by Bush. These include, but are not necessarily limited to: "clear skies" initiative, "healthy forests" initiative, redefining "waterway", easing up on smog regulations.
Secondly, I'd like to see him restore all of our constitutional rights (again, I'd also expect this from Clinton). Admittedly, this is probably of more immediate importance than the first thing, but I'm just letting my environmental bias show. He has a slight advantage here over Clinton in that constitutional law was his specialty. It's only slight since most of these seem to require only a modicum of common sense.
Thirdly, I'd expect him to work with Congress to get sane legislation in place that protect our environment and wildlife, and that creates a pragmatic yet responsible energy policy. His advantage here, IMO, will be his ability to get the country on board.
Fourth, I'd expect him to work with world leaders to help craft a global solution to our global environmental problems.
To answer your other question, although I voted for Bill Clinton in '92, I voted for Dole in '96.
March 21, 2008 10:27 AM | Reply | Permalink
I expect him (or any other Dem President) to:
1. Pass healthcare reform. Not only is this vital for the country, it will give Democrats a permanent voter coalition.
2. Fix economy and re-create the 1990s boom
3. Solution for Iraq, even though this might take more than one term
I don't know if it is realistic to expect anything more, in terms of the specific practical action.
March 21, 2008 10:41 AM | Reply | Permalink
Lalo,
Then, if you answer your #2 question with a "NO," Hillary is already out.
She already didn't deliver your number 1 expectation...
(PS: By the way, if you had answered my previous question, we would now know what your answer to your #2 question is...)
March 21, 2008 11:10 AM | Reply | Permalink
Look, save the keystrokes.
Everything you write in response is exactly what you accuse me of doing. I don't think I'll be reading your comments in the future, sorry.
March 21, 2008 11:24 AM | Reply | Permalink
Lalo,
I haven't accused you of anything; I have simply asked you to answer the questions you ask others.
Of course, you don't have to read my comments. It will "justify" your not answering my questions.
I see that below you have granted your #2 question unimportant in the case of Obama, because there are many "ifs" pending as Hilarym99 points.
There are no "ifs" pending in reference for H. Clinton and Healthcare, though. For that reason, please, feel free to answer it.
In understand that you find my questions annoying. I ask them because I find your agenda "shady"; I was truly hoping that you could prove me wrong on that point...
March 21, 2008 11:44 AM | Reply | Permalink
You do know that part of the 90's boom was due to the stock market bubble, right?
Bill Clinton did very well to manage a number of economic crises well, and did well not to screw things up, but it is wishful thinking that any president can make the 90's come back. It's a much different world. In any case, you should not wish for boom unless you are comfortable with the inevitable bust.
Oh yeah, Lalo35adm (funny, I once had a robot by that name), you might want to ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country. Just so you know I expect a lot from you, too.
March 21, 2008 11:10 AM | Reply | Permalink
The 90s was the 90s. This is 2008. The next President of the United States is going to have a different set of challenges than Bill Clinton faced "on day one," and will be surmounting them using a different set of tools. Setting an expectation of "recreating" anything is unreasonable and unrealistic.
March 21, 2008 11:12 AM | Reply | Permalink
March 21, 2008 11:13 AM | Reply | Permalink
"Bill Clinton did not cause the boom in the 90's, he just had the good fortune to be president during that time"
Sorry, I really hate to be rude "in kind", but this comes directly from Fox News, as a million other things we internalized about the Clintons.
I'd be happy to debate you on this in great detail and with facts, perhaps we can start a different blog?
March 21, 2008 11:20 AM | Reply | Permalink
Well, my answer comes from my economics professors - a whole university department full of them.
Any economist will tell you that the economy moves like a barge with a small rudder. One corrective move takes a long time to manifest in results. One person CANNOT be responsible for an economic boom. To suggest otherwise is stupid. It's not a debatable issue, it's economic principle.
March 21, 2008 11:48 AM | Reply | Permalink
No, it's comes from understanding economics, and that understanding has been around longer than Fox news. Some of us here may actually be economists who don't watch Fox.
If you want to be taken seriously then you should try not to insult people who are trying to correct your perhaps well-intentioned, but ultimately naive mistakes.
As I explained, Bill Clinton's economic management was relatively good for a President (although there surely is a debate between the Rubinites and the Stiglitzeans). He did not create the boom any more than he invented the internet. For that matter Reagan did not create any boom either.
You may remember, while we are talking about what we expect our candidate to do if he/she/it wins, that while Bill campaigned on giving out a middle class tax cut, his first budget dropped that like a hot potato when the seriousness of the budget issue what laid on his desk.
March 21, 2008 11:51 AM | Reply | Permalink
"Fix economy and re-create the 1990s boom" - lalo
"Are you high?" - burnedoutdem
"Lalo35adm (funny, I once had a robot by that name)" - economides
"you should try not to insult people" - economides
Ummmm..... OK
March 21, 2008 12:19 PM | Reply | Permalink
Nice job trying to reframe the issue - fact is, you're asking for pie-in-the-sky economics policies and are embarrassed to hear that not only is it NOT possible for your beloved Hillary to bring back the 90's, it's delusional to even think it MIGHT happen.
Do you have anything else of substance to say about the economy, or are you just going to pull a Clinton and say we're being mean to you so you can duck the question?
March 21, 2008 5:37 PM | Reply | Permalink
Blog started. Link here
March 21, 2008 1:06 PM | Reply | Permalink
Nobody in politics "created" the economy of the 90s and the job boom.
There was this thing that came around called "the Internet." It was kind of a big deal.
It's pretty simple, really. "The Internet" made a lot of people excited, and they chose to put their money and time to work. They bought stuff from other people. They hired people to do stuff. This meant other people had money to buy stuff. And so on.
Bill Clinton didn't do it, he just didn't fuck it up.
That's how I see. Out of curiosity, how do YOU think it happened?
March 21, 2008 12:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
The overall boom happened because of the investment into the stock market (which became the tech bubble).
The stock market happened because of the deficit reduction/interest rates, etc.
The deficit reduction happened because of tax raises and changes in spending.
That happened because of the people who Clinton appointed and because of the Economic Forum in 1992 and the subsequent program, despite the detours etc.
March 21, 2008 1:02 PM | Reply | Permalink
So, jobs are created when people buy more of the common stock of already high-profile corporations, most of which already operate at top efficiency and divert the increased revenue into golden parachutes?
Huh!
And here I thought it was the internet's obliteration of the physical and temporal boundaries of commerce FOR ANYONE, putting money into the hands of young entrepreneurs WHO SPENT IT on goods, services, and personnel for their startups.
You know, as opposed to letting in mold in trust funds for their idiot kids who grow up to be bad presidents.
But wait, if investment in the stock market = AWESOME ECONOMY DUDE, why aren't we reaping the benefits of all of last year's record market highs right now?
March 21, 2008 1:28 PM | Reply | Permalink
I also wonder about the sincerity of posts like this. Sporcupine gave a credible intelligent 11 point list and the response from lalo was what?
I would expect Obama to restore our constitutional rights also. Hillary with her flag burning ban...questionable.
March 21, 2008 10:48 AM | Reply | Permalink
I did a little digging a while back. Crosses are burned in the US at the rate of about 10 per every flag burned.
March 21, 2008 11:05 AM | Reply | Permalink
Great question - kind of.
1. Walk on water.
2. Part the Red Sea.
Obviously I'm joking on those. But this is a good opportunity to address the Kool-Aid claims. I'd be lying if I said that there was no emotional and intuitive component on my ardent support of him as a candidate. The Kool-Aid argument implies that overrides logic and reason, when in reality, for me, it is all of those factors that drove me to support him. Equally. So no, I don't support him "less for his plans than for his overall vision". And that's kind of the same thing anyway - the overall vision is really just the sum of all the parts - or all the plans put together.
So, what I'd like to see out of an Obama presidency. (and a Clinton one, for that matter.)
1. Reform NCLB - the intent of this act is good, the implementation bad. I'd like to see changes in the way that progress is measured, using measures that track individual progress rather than by comparison to other students, and I'd like to alter the focus to broaden the focus that has been narrowly on math and reading.
2. Healthcare - I'd like to see his full plan implemented, but I'm realistic about the politics of it. Specifically, I'd like to see his proposal that up to 25 year olds can stay on their parents' policies, allow portability, and prevent insurance companies from denying coverage because of "pre-existing conditions".
3. Iraq, Afghanistan, and Military Action - I'd like to see our troops out of Iraq, ideally. I know that this is all very tricky. But I think if we increase the use of diplomatic, political, and humanitarian avenues, it's possible. More than anything in this area, I want a President who will be honest with the American public about the need for military action, the real situation on the ground in the Middle East, and the reasons for whatever decision is made. The honesty thing is the biggest thing for me on this.
4. Restore diplomacy - I think that his view on meeting with leaders of countries is the right one for this time in our history, after a Bush presidency which has annihilated the view of the US in the world.
5. Care for our vets - Improve mental health treatment by processing what I consider to be time-sensitive claims of PTSD faster, as well as establishing screening and standards of care for all vets coming back with traumatic brain injury.
6. Restore some trust in the government by increasing transparency in accessible ways.
7. Increase federal funding for scientific innovation - particularly stem-cell research.
8. I would also like to see a serious attempt at moving towards energy independence and "saving the environment". I won't pretend I know the best way to do this, so I really can't give any specific and deliverable proposals on this, but I suspect any Democrat will do more for this than a Republican.
As far as the second question, it's kind of pointless conjecture, no? Will I vote for him if he only gets half of the things on my list? Will I vote for him if he gets 3 out of 5? I think determining who I'm going to vote for in 2012 right now is rather irresponsible. I think we have to wait and see what any President would do in office, what new challenges the country may be facing at that point, before we can determine who we'll be voting for. So will I support him if he does absolutely nothing good in office? No, but I don't really see that as a possibility for either Clinton or Obama. And I don't foresee myself ever voting
Republican, so I'll leave you to draw your own conclusions.
P.S. TPM - Submitting comments is seriously no easy task these days.
March 21, 2008 11:00 AM | Reply | Permalink
Thank you. And agree on 2nd question, wasn't necessary.
March 21, 2008 11:12 AM | Reply | Permalink
I like your list too. #4 is critical for me. We need a President who realizes that we cannot and should not go about addressing global problems in a unilateral, isolationist manner. I'm reminded of Donald Rumsfeld's dismissive "Old Europe" comments here. We need someone with the leadership to realize that countries young and old, big and small, are all stakeholders on the significant challenges of our time. If we want to ask them to participate in initiatives that we as a nation are bringing to the table, we need someone who realizes just what that means: We're ASKING them to join us. That means communicating where we stand on an issue, communicating the stakes, conversing on the challenges that a particular nation might face in joining us, as well as what they can contribute and how it will benefit them. Just this week alone, John McCain has done a lifetime worth of work in convincing me that he ISN'T that person (as though I needed convincing).
I want our next President to be a Leader who understands that communication and dialogue involve a back-and-forth exchange of ideas rather than a cut and dry, "This is our position. Deal with it," attitude. I want to see that type of interaction domestically as well. And I don't want to see President Obama opt for a blanket repudiation of all that has come before as George W. Bush did. If he can find something that Dubya was actually right about, I would expect him to assess that and figure out how to sustain it and build upon it. Hell, if he can find something that Dubya was actually right about, that might merit a second term all on its own...
March 21, 2008 11:24 AM | Reply | Permalink
I was thinking about this last night and wanted to ask the opinion of the Clinton supporters.
It seems to me that many support Clinton in a very personal and emotional (more so than those who support Obama). And you support her less for her plans than for her overall vision and promise of the future, although I could be wrong. So, to clarify this, I have two questions for Clinton supporters:
1. What do you specifically expect her to deliver in her first term? Specific actions, laws, programs, etc - I mean practical deliverables for the country, practical change.
2. Obviously, if she delivers you would support him for a second term. Would you still support her if she doesn't deliver?
Thanks
/snark off
March 21, 2008 11:19 AM | Reply | Permalink
I'm embarrassed that vets weren't on my list. Yes, a giant, long-term step up on doing what's right for those who have serves will also happen.
Actually, I think that one will happen under Obama, Clinton, or McCain, because all three are dramatically more responsible than the current incumbent. McCain isn't up to putting all the pieces together, but he won't miss the one on veterans.
March 21, 2008 11:34 AM | Reply | Permalink
First year: Transparency in the workings of the executive branch increases the confidence and trust of the electorate putting pressure on the legislative branch to pass ethics reform and transparency in government bills.
I think proggressive issues will move forward more quickly in daylight.
After the first year of the next presidency, Iraq will continue to be a heartache no matter who wins the general election.
March 21, 2008 11:49 AM | Reply | Permalink
There are really two things I expected on day one: (1) assignment of lawyers to go through every executive order issued by the current adminstration in every small orifice in the executive branch and changing those that need to be changed to reflect a more sensible and liberal mindset; and (2) convene a Joint Chiefs of Staff meeting for the plans to step us out of Iraq as quickly as possible.
Obama has promised the first; crickets from Hillary. Both have promised the second but I will trust the judgment of Obama over that of Hillary. My reasons? As a boomer, I think the boomers need to move right on into the history books instead of re-fighting the Vietnam era ad nauseum, even if the place names are different. I also think Hillary and Bill will be setting policy a-new and defending Bill a-old--and that's a wasted effort that we won't need with Obama.
Legislation will depend on the make-up in Congress. And I fully expect Obama to have long coattails for down-ticket folks. I want Congress stuffed with Democrats and I think that's more likely with Obama than with Clinton.
I don't have a starry-eyed vision of the general election. I think it's going to be very, very tough and every possible American wanting a real change will have to be out advocating just that--and carrying folks to the polls if need be. It will be tough.
And did I mention I dont' agree with Hillary's 2002 AUMF vote in any way, shape or form?
March 21, 2008 12:04 PM | Reply | Permalink
Here are three things that I believe only a Democrat can accomplish:
1) Social Security reform -- expect a new formula for annual increases, such as blending the inflation rate and the wage increase rate. The inflation rate is inherently lower than the wage increase rate, so blending the two would slow the growth of the annual increases. Alsol, you juice the retunrs by investing in equities; treat the surplus like a pension funds, NOT like Congress' piggy bank. Which leads to . . .
2) balance the budget -- the GOP simply has no credibility. I expect an Obama administration to conserve dollars and prioritize spending, in the fine Yankee tradition. No more splurging on cable after dad loses his job.
3) better international relations -- this will be done as soon as international pariah GWB is gone.
4) expand the military -- we need more soldiers. And guess what? Kucinich's idea for a Department of Peace is also a good idea. That Department would include our newly expanded Peace Corps and peacekeepers.
March 21, 2008 12:17 PM | Reply | Permalink
Once he receives the nomination I expect that he will ask his supporters, through his web site, to begin the process of using his coattails to elect congresspeople who will support his proposals.
Once he has secured the Presidency I hope that he will hurry to restore habeas corpus which he finally committed to yesterday.
Given sufficient congressional support I expect that he will use his bully pulpit and charisma to bring about:
Phased withdrawal from Iraq and transfer of insufficient troops into Afghanistan, possibly culminating in either the capture of Bin Laden or a determination that Bin Laden is dead or dying.
Appointment of working committees from within his administration to develop viable proposals on health care issues, education issues, agriculture issues and environmental/energy issues, probably piecemeal. Those committee members will then work with him and Congress to slowly, and possibly painfully, achieve as much as is politically possible in those areas. What will be politically possible will be directly related to the extent to which he has brought new Democratic blood into the Congress and the extent to which he can still rally the general public around his proposals.
To rally the public I expect he will use new media to keep his supporters informed, as well as keeping the general public informed. Doing this will utterly exhaust him during the first 2 years since it will bring down upon his head a deluge of right-wing media noise and brushfires. With strong congressional support he will survive.
Internationally I expect he will immediately set up a substantive plan for bringing all the nations and peoples concerned with Israeli issues into a conference, and with luck, he will use not only his but other's negotiating skills to moderate the postures of all sides and bring a proposal to the UN for resolution and supervision.
March 21, 2008 12:43 PM | Reply | Permalink
Post a Comment