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Convince me on Obama
I've been leaning Clinton for many years, but I see Obama as inevitable now.
So I'm looking for people to convinve me that he'd make a great President. I'm not seeing it yet, I'm not feeling it like many of you obviously are.
Anyone care to win me over?
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Comments (68)
First, what are the doubts you have about him? Let's start there.
March 11, 2008 12:20 PM | Reply | Permalink
Good question, and a promising topic for the regulars here. May I respectfully make a suggestion to my fellow posters? Can we demonstrate that it's possible to answer the question directly, without either slamming Clinton or her supporters? Likewise, should HRC supporters decide to jump in, can the focus be on Obama's strengths and weaknesses and not O' supporters?
When addressing a truly undecided voter the potential for quickly alienating the voter is very high, considering the tone of the discussion around here. IMO, the best way to bring an undecided voter to one side or the other is through respect and honesty.
Thanks for keeping an open mind...
To echo Scientific, Tony, where do you have concerns about Obama? Have you read about his proposals on barackobama.com?
March 11, 2008 12:28 PM | Reply | Permalink
Sorry, I might have responded to this with some light Clinton criticism before I saw you post. please forgive me. :(
March 11, 2008 12:46 PM | Reply | Permalink
GMan, I'm voting for you for TPM Reader Blogs' Obama Supporters Goodwill Ambassador.
I was trying to follow your example, but I got frustrated and told workerbee she was acting like an asshole and undermining our efforts to encourage, not alienate potential Democratic voters.
So I'm disqualified.
March 11, 2008 2:07 PM | Reply | Permalink
I second that nomination.
March 11, 2008 2:19 PM | Reply | Permalink
And while we debate, Democrats in states like Texas are asking for help. My daughter-in-law sent me a copy of an email that is going around in Houston, distorting the differences in taxes under the Bush administration compared to the Clinton administration and looking for help refuting it. For those of us who haven't voted in a primary yet, it makes sense to compare our candidates. But those of us who have voted already, should get on to confounding the Republicans instead of one another. Generally speaking that is.
March 11, 2008 10:59 PM | Reply | Permalink
Have you read his issue statement from his website? It's a lengthy read, but worthwhile. I'd love to convince you, but if you're anything like most of us, you need to be convinced yourself.
March 11, 2008 12:32 PM | Reply | Permalink
nope.
either you cant or wont see it for yourself.
so, no one need bother.
March 11, 2008 12:35 PM | Reply | Permalink
Gee, jadez, that's certainly warm and welcoming.
March 11, 2008 9:01 PM | Reply | Permalink
People who looked at Clinton and saw a "great President" probably are never going to see Obama as a "great President." And vice versa. They're very different.
Clinton is a Hawk. I can understand that some people think that a great President must be hawkish, and look at Clinton's votes for the Iraq war and Kyl-Lieberman, and her (pre-campaign) rhetoric about the war on terror, etc., and are reassured. If you think that such a strongly hawkish leaning is a good thing in a President, you aren't going to like Obama. He's not a pacifist, he's not opposed to all wars, but he's not a hawk in anything like the way Hillary is a hawk.
Clinton actually has little relevant experience, and what she has she exaggerates. The teapot story in Ireland is a prime example. She doesn't make the claim outright, and most of her supporters don't either, but implicit in a lot of her arguments is that what she brings to the table is Bill. If getting Bill Clinton into the White House is what appeals to a Hillary supporter, then Obama doesn't have that to offer.
Clinton's style of politics is down and dirty. A lot of her supporters see her endorsing McCain, exaggerating her own experience, equivocating on whether Obama is Muslim, running a fear-mongering commercial like the 3AM ad, talking about "turning" pledged candidates, talking about winning the nomination by getting super-dels to override the primary voters and caucus goers, etc., etc., etc., etc., and they don't see these things as negatives. They see her willingness to stoop to these levels as a big positive. They see politics in purely polarized terms, and so a polarizing candidate is what they want. They don't see the moderate/indpendent voters as relevant, it's all either loyal Democrats or wingnuts who are irrational and unreachable. And so they want someone who will fight dirty. They aren't likely to see that in Obama.
A person who thinks that Hillary is likely to be a "good President" obviously doesn't put much weight on organization skills, or planning. Hillary's campaign has been characterized by poor planning. Getting caught flat footed when she didn't win decisively early on. Not even having looked ahead far enough to know how some of the complicated primary/caucus rules worked. Making claims about her experience, without being prepared to cite any specifics at all. Obama has run a much more disciplined, prepared and well-planned campaign. To me that's significant, but someone who doesn't see Hillary's poor campaign planning as a flaw isn't likely to see Obama's organization and planning skills as a big plus, either.
You might look at both candidates and see the policy similarities, which far outnumber the policy differences, and on that basis think that either would be okay. But other than that, if you look at the reasons that enthusiastic Hillary supporters cite for supporting Hillary, and the Hillary weaknesses that don't bother enthusiastic Hillary supporters, you're not going to find the kind of reasoning that would easily transfer to enthusiastic support for Obama.
March 11, 2008 12:39 PM | Reply | Permalink
Score 1 for the anti-HRC approach. Tony asked: "I see Obama as inevitable now. So I'm looking for people to convinve me that he'd make a great President."
How does reviewing the antki-Hillary talking points address the question?
Way to reach out to an HRC supporter on behalf of Obama, rabbit... :- /
March 11, 2008 12:49 PM | Reply | Permalink
I concur with Scientific's question. My focus/expertise/interests tend to skew more towards foreign policy where I think he is stronger, so if you want me to give you info on that (or more than I provide here, at least), let me know. I mentioned some of his positions in my newest blog: http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/2008/03/how-the-obama-is-muslim-smear.php
I've generally felt that Clinton's foreign policy posturing has been overwhelmingly statist and has failed to address (or at least, if she has positions on it, has failed to share them) the urgent need we have for a public diplomacy initiative that can act as a reparative for our bungled foreign policy of late. Obama's advocacy of his America's Voice Initiative and his focus on creating transparency with our foreign policy both at home and abroad is a positive action towards fixing relationships with communities abroad. It could go a long way towards negating those who wish us harm (like radical Islamists). Clinton's on the other hand, seems similar to Bush's (God forbid it's similar to the first Clinton's, which played intergovernmental organizations off of each other and stood by while some of the worst genocides in history happened back to back) or McCain's, that perpetuates America's diplomatic exceptionalism and doesn't seem to realize how much other countries' perceptions of us affect our future national interests.
That help?
March 11, 2008 12:45 PM | Reply | Permalink
Read the current issue of Rollingstone Magazine. It has good articles on both Obama and Clinton. But you have to do your own homework. Get off your azz and research the issues. hint, you're on the right site to start with.
March 11, 2008 12:45 PM | Reply | Permalink
For me, it came down to foreign policy. I believe Obama is more likely to embrace a non-traditional, less militarist foreign policy, promoting the use of soft-power and diplomacy, using intelligence and long-term approaches (such as reining in loose nukes) than the out-moded, Scoop Jackson-Joe Lieberman 'we're tuff too!' approach that I see in Hillary Clinton, that I believe is equal parts political calculation and conviction.
Also, if you look at the state-by-state polls, I think Obama has a better chance of beating McCain.
March 11, 2008 12:47 PM | Reply | Permalink
I will tell you why I chose Obama and why I think he would make a great President.
I do so as a life-long Democrat so I have some biases in that direction that may not appeal to an independent, or (gasp) a Republican.
1. First of all, Obama has committed to the 50-state strategy for the Democratic Party. This means Democrats will not concede states at the Presidential, Congressional, Gubernatorial, legislative, or local level. Our party was increasingly becoming a two-coast party - Northeast and West Coast with a sprinkling of Northern industrial midwest states. A party must be strong nationally and in all areas possible. We were letting Presidential campaign strategies - gain 12-15 states for the electoral vote needed - drive our strategy at all levels. Obama will have coattails in many of these states that will help democrats downticket and he will support the 50-state strategy. Clinton will not. The 50 state strategy is in fact a direct rebuke to the Clinton policies that they took the party in, including under the leadership of McAulliffe and Clinton's campaign approach makes clear they still believe in a 12 state strategy.
2. Bringing new voters and reducing cynicism. Obama has invigorated the next generation and brough back in voters who were jaded and tired of the process. We have had declining turnout for decades and increasing cynicism about politics. No, he is not a savior but he recognizes our future as a democracy depends on an invigorated populace. How can you fight special interests, bureaucracy if the citizens cede their role? I have seen no such committment from the CLinton campaign.
3. His campaign and legislation speaks to the candidate most committed to transparency in government and public life. He released his tax returns, he would not accept donations from registered lobbyists, he gathered more than 1 million donors, he successfully sponsored ethics reform in the Senate, he successfully sponsored e-government law to allow internet access to USG contracting. Our government has been increasingly secretive and dismissive of citizens' right to know what their government is doing while at same time allowing lobbyists to write laws for them. He is the candidate that speaks to me on this issue with his words and actions.
4. Policies - he has sound and thoughtful policies, grounded in reality. I want universal healthcare, I want a clean environment, I want taxes to be fair, etc. While it has been said he and Hillary do not disagree on much in policy, I think he adopts the more practical approach. There is no evidence the country is ready for a mandated health coverage plan, for instance. And anyways how would you get this through - by getting a larger majority in Congress (see 50-state strategy above).
5. Electability. Obama is more electable in my opinion. Hillary has entrenched negatives at 47-49% which gives her little margin for error. She energizes the base of the other party. She and McCain come out of the same old school political approach and in many ways speak the same language (not on policy of course). Obama will be distinct from McCain. Obama has experience that is relevant and saleable - 20 years of experience - what Bill Clinton had and more than GWBush had.
6. Leadership - what is a President. I pondered what I want in a President and decided I want a leader not an administrator. I want a president who can mobilize the population, ask us as citizens to get involved, and who can develop a strategy and bring along the population and congress. I see him as this person. Clinton has an administrative approach to the presidency - she is going through a "job interview" as she has said. But I for one do not think it is an administrative job - it is a leadership post of the greatest nation on earth. If that is your style, then Obama is not for you.
March 11, 2008 12:51 PM | Reply | Permalink
Good succinct review of areas for consideration, MMW! To add a couple of notes to line up your answers with Tony’s approach (i.e., assuming HRC will not be on the ticket in November, and why to support Obama over McCain or Nader)...
Point 2 – I think it’s a testament to Obama’s leadership skills that he’s crafted a campaign that has successfully appealed to new voters, independents, and even disaffected Republicans. One could suggest it’s indicative of Obama’s ability to appeal to both sides of the aisle in Congress, where McCain will have more difficulty. I agree with those who feel Obama has leadership abilities we haven’t seen since Reagan. We really need to heal the wounds from years of partisan warfare, and I believe Obama is much better prepared to do that than McCain.
Point 4 – I agree with the view that Obama’s leadership style will help him garner support to deliver bi-partisan solutions, and will have an excellent chance to overhaul health care access. Personally, I don’t think one can rule out the use of mandates as part of a plan devised under President Obama. When in office, I’m confident Obama will combine the best elements of various proposals and work to craft a negotiated solution among Dem and Repub legislators. I am hopeful, based on Obama’s record in the Illinois legislature, that he can focus the effort on effectively solving the problems with health care rather than accepting a bill that appeases business or political interests first.
Point 5 – Viewing the prospects for the GE, I do believe Obama can pick up substantial support from HRC’s supporters, especially women, and that he’ll not only do very well in blue states, but will have a strong chance to pick up some red states based on bringing in more new voters than McCain.
March 11, 2008 1:38 PM | Reply | Permalink
As to 2, 3, and 4:
Emphasis supplied.
February 3, 2008 NYT
Nuclear Leaks and Response Tested Obama in Senate
By MIKE McINTIRE
When residents in Illinois voiced outrage two years ago upon learning that the Exelon Corporation had not disclosed radioactive leaks at one of its nuclear plants, the state’s freshman senator, Barack Obama, took up their cause.
Mr. Obama scolded Exelon and federal regulators for inaction and introduced a bill to require all plant owners to notify state and local authorities immediately of even small leaks. He has boasted of it on the campaign trail, telling a crowd in Iowa in December that it was “the only nuclear legislation that I’ve passed.”
“I just did that last year,” he said, to murmurs of approval.
A close look at the path his legislation took tells a very different story. While he initially fought to advance his bill, even holding up a presidential nomination to try to force a hearing on it, Mr. Obama eventually rewrote it to reflect changes sought by Senate Republicans, Exelon and nuclear regulators. The new bill removed language mandating prompt reporting and simply offered guidance to regulators, whom it charged with addressing the issue of unreported leaks.
Those revisions propelled the bill through a crucial committee. But, contrary to Mr. Obama’s comments in Iowa, it ultimately died amid parliamentary wrangling in the full Senate.
“Senator Obama’s staff was sending us copies of the bill to review, and we could see it weakening with each successive draft,” said Joe Cosgrove, a park district director in Will County, Ill., where low-level radioactive runoff had turned up in groundwater. “The teeth were just taken out of it.”
The history of the bill shows Mr. Obama navigating a home-state controversy that pitted two important constituencies against each other and tested his skills as a legislative infighter. On one side were neighbors of several nuclear plants upset that low-level radioactive leaks had gone unreported for years; on the other was Exelon, the country’s largest nuclear plant operator and one of Mr. Obama’s largest sources of campaign money.
Snip
In addition, Mr. Obama’s chief political strategist, David Axelrod, has worked as a consultant to Exelon. A spokeswoman for Exelon said Mr. Axelrod’s company had helped an Exelon subsidiary, Commonwealth Edison, with communications strategy periodically since 2002, but had no involvement in the leak controversy or other nuclear issues.
The Obama campaign said in written responses to questions that Mr. Obama “never discussed this issue or this bill” with Mr. Axelrod. The campaign acknowledged that Exelon executives had met with Mr. Obama’s staff about the bill, as had concerned residents, environmentalists and regulators. It said the revisions resulted not from any influence by Exelon, but as a necessary response to a legislative roadblock put up by Republicans, who controlled the Senate at the time.
“If Senator Obama had listened to industry demands, he wouldn’t have repeatedly criticized Exelon in the press, introduced the bill and then fought for months to get action on it,” the campaign said. “Since he has over a decade of legislative experience, Senator Obama knows that it’s very difficult to pass a perfect bill.”
Asked why Mr. Obama had cited it as an accomplishment while campaigning for president, the campaign noted that after the senator introduced his bill, nuclear plants started making such reports on a voluntary basis. The campaign did not directly address the question of why Mr. Obama had told Iowa voters that the legislation had passed.
Nuclear safety advocates are divided on whether Mr. Obama’s efforts yielded any lasting benefits.
Others say that turning the whole matter over to the Nuclear Regulatory Commission, as Mr. Obama’s revised bill would have done, played into the hands of the nuclear power industry, which they say has little to fear from the regulators. Mr. Obama seemed to share those concerns when he told a New Hampshire newspaper last year that the commission “is a moribund agency that needs to be revamped and has become a captive of the industry it regulates.”
Snip
But eventually, Mr. Obama agreed to rewrite the bill, and when the environment committee approved it in September 2006, he and his co-sponsors hailed it as a victory.
In interviews over the past two weeks, Obama aides insisted that the revisions did not substantively alter the bill. In fact, it was left drastically different.
In place of the straightforward reporting requirements was new language giving the nuclear commission two years to come up with its own regulations. The bill said that the commission “shall consider” — not require — immediate public notification, and also take into account the findings of a task force it set up to study the tritium leaks.
By then, the task force had already concluded that “existing reporting requirements for abnormal spills and leaks are at a level that is risk-informed and appropriate.”
The rewritten bill also contained the new wording sought by Exelon making it clear that state and local authorities would have no regulatory oversight of nuclear power plants.
Snip.
The revised bill was never taken up in the full Senate, where partisan parliamentary maneuvering resulted in a number of bills being shelved before the 2006 session ended.
Still, the legislation has come in handy on the campaign trail. Last May, in response to questions about his ties to Exelon, Mr. Obama wrote a letter to a Nevada newspaper citing the bill as evidence that he stands up to powerful interests.
“When I learned that radioactive tritium had leaked out of an Exelon nuclear plant in Illinois,” he wrote, “I led an effort in the Senate to require utilities to notify the public of any unplanned release of radioactive substances.”
Last October, Mr. Obama reintroduced the bill, in its rewritten form.
March 11, 2008 2:19 PM | Reply | Permalink
So, AJM, care to provide some personal insight into what the article represents with respect to the poster's question? I'm assuming that Tony can navigate the MSM to find stories about the candidates. A simple link here would have sufficed, but more important, some of your own reasons for suggesting that Obama will or won't make a great leader would be responsive to the question posed.
March 11, 2008 2:31 PM | Reply | Permalink
He folds and he lies and can't be relied on for the environment.
I thought the evidence would be more persuasive and that most at TPM would be capable of drawing their own conclusions.
March 11, 2008 3:31 PM | Reply | Permalink
First, even if one took as indisputable this one rendition of the events, I think it's unwarranted to assume that the candidate's overall mode of operation can be discerned from this one example. As an undecided voter, I would ask for more examples. I don't think it's persuasive to label a candidate a "liar" or to say that revising legislation (the background of which we can't fully know) proves that "they fold". In the end, Obama's record has overwhelmingly been one of fairness, honesty and integrity. Given the record, I suggest he be given the benefit of the doubt on this.
And the story is not as clear-cut as you might want to believe. While admitting that the source I'm linking is biased, it does quote a number of objective reports on the legislation in question, including its unanimous passage in the Environment and Public Works Committee: http://factcheck.barackobama.com/factcheck/2008/02/14/response_to_clintons_random_ti.php.
March 11, 2008 4:15 PM | Reply | Permalink
Strange... link didn't work. Here's another: http://factcheck.barackobama.com/factcheck2/2008/02/
Scroll down the Feb 14 item, called "Response to Hillary Clinton's Attack Today".
Hopefully that will work.
March 11, 2008 5:57 PM | Reply | Permalink
OK, LETS COMPARE RECORDS NOW Mar 1, 2008 Hillary has a personal wealth of about 40 million dollars and WILL NOT release her tax returns AND she WILL NOT release her first lady records. She takes money from lobbyists and is running a mean and vicious campaign.
PLEASE get educated and join Barack for REAL change.
The truth is that Barack Obama has MORE substantive legislative experience than Hillary Clinton has.
This is not an attack. These are facts. Please read. Thank you.
Senator Clinton, who has served only one full term - 6yrs. - and another year campaigning, has managed to author and pass into law - 20 - twenty pieces of legislation in her first six years.
These bills can be found on the website of the Library of Congress www.thomas.loc.gov, but to save you trouble, I'll post them here for you.
1. Establish the Kate Mullany National Historic Site.
2. Support the goals and ideals of Better Hearing and Speech Month.
3. Recognize the Ellis Island Medal of Honor.
4. Name courthouse after Thurgood Marshall.
5. Name courthouse after James L. Watson.
6. Name post office after Jonn A. O'Shea.
7. Designate Aug. 7, 2003, as National Purple Heart Recognition Day.
8. Support the goals and ideals of National Purple Heart Recognition Day.
9. Honor the life and legacy of Alexander Hamilton on the bicentennial of his death.
10. Congratulate the Syracuse Univ. Orange Men's Lacrosse Team on winning the championship.
11. Congratulate the Le Moyne College Dolphins Men's Lacrosse Team on winning the championship.
12. Establish the 225th Anniversary of the American Revolution Commemorative Program.
13. Name post office after Sergeant Riayan A. Tejeda.
14. Honor Shirley Chisholm for her service to the nation and express condolences on her death.
15. Honor John J. Downing, Brian Fahey, and Harry Ford, firefighters who lost their lives on duty. Only five of Clinton's bills are, more substantive. 16. Extend period of unemployment assistance to victims of 9/11.
17. Pay for city projects in response to 9/11 18. Assist landmine victims in other countries.
19. Assist family caregivers in accessing affordable respite care.
20. Designate part of the National Forest System in Puerto Rico as protected in the wilderness preservation system.
There you have it, the fact's straight from the Senate Record.
Now, I would post those of Obama's, but the list is too substantive, so I'll mainly categorize.
During the first - 8 - eight years of his elected service in the Illinois legislature he sponsored over 820 bills. He introduced:
233 regarding healthcare reform,
125 on poverty and public assistance,
112 crime fighting bills,
97 economic bills,
60 human rights and anti-discrimination bills,
21 ethics reform bills,
15 gun control,
6 veterans affairs and many others.
His first year in the U.S. Senate, he authored 152 bills and co-sponsored another 427. These include:
** The Coburn-Obama Government Transparency Act of 2006 - became law
**The Lugar-Obama Nuclear Non-proliferation and Conventional Weapons Threat Reduction Act - became law
**The Comprehensive Immigration Reform Act, passed the Senate,
**The 2007 Government Ethics Bill, - became law,
**The Protection Against Excessive Executive Compensation Bill, In committee
Barack Obama is responsible for this web site that let's you check government spending:
http://www.USASpending.Gov
-------------------------------------------------------------
Voting Records: Hillary vs. Barack Mar 1, 2008 "Senator Clinton has sponsored 354 bills since Jan 22, 2001, of which 307 haven't made it out of committee (Extremely Poor)"
Click to VIEW
Useful comparison as noted in SantaCruzen's Blog
March 11, 2008 1:28 PM | Reply | Permalink
Couldn't help yourself, could you? The question of this post is NOT about HRC v. Obama. It is assumed that Obama is the inevitable candidate. So why frame an answer by looking back and criticizing Clinton? Your approach undermines the basis of your support for Obama by demonstrating that you're more interested in bashing Clinton than talking up Obama. As I said to rabbitsmorg, what would make you think HRC bashing would appeal to someone who is an acknowledged HRC supporter, but is looking to go into the voting booth in November with substantial reasons to believe they are making the best vote, based on Obama's demonstrated ability to do great things? That's basic Politicking 101, Bionic. Don't alienate your potential convert.
March 11, 2008 1:47 PM | Reply | Permalink
Excellent research BionicSoy! With all due respect to Hillary, I do find it insulting that she would say the only thing Obama has brought to the table thus far is one good speech compared to the experience both she and McCain bring......
Khan Hussein Khan
March 11, 2008 8:05 PM | Reply | Permalink
Please stop posting that bullshit list of Clinton's. It just gives the other side an easy strawman to knock down. Obama's record stands up just fine against the real Clinton record as well.
March 11, 2008 8:46 PM | Reply | Permalink
SOMEONE ASKED WHY VOTE FOR OBAMA? EIGHTTEEN QUICK REASONS
1.Obama, all-tolled, has even more legislative experience than Hillary. (10 years vs 6 years)
2.Obama opposed the war, Hillary authorized it. (Now 70 percent of Americans want the war ended.)
3.He opposed NAFTA, she supported it. The aftermath of which was 3 MILLION American manufacturing jobs lost.
4.He is respected and endorsed by senior Democratic Congressmen who have worked both with Hillary and Obama (Kennedy, Dodd, Kerry) and have clearly chosen to endorse him over her.
5.Obama is far more authentic than Hillary, who seems, at times, disingenuous. (she will shake hands one day, attack the next)
6.Hillary is beholdened to Lobbyists and Special Interest groups. She takes more money than ANY other candidate in the race, Rep. or Dem. And this indicates who's interests she will prioritize and serve while in office.
7.Hillary has a lot of baggage, including allowing corruption to reign in her own marriage and her shady and questionable involvement in Whitewater. How will her government be immune from corruption? It won't.
8.Hillary has more pork, Earmarks, in her budget (360 MILLION DOLLARS) than almost any other congressperson.
9.Hillary, unfortunately, will have Bill Clinton as her de facto VP.
10.Obama does NOT engage in smear campaign tactics (even when attacked) that serve to reduce and divide the entire party, as Hillary has, does and is doing. Many of these belittling and spurious attacks shed more light on Hillary, than they do her opponent. Just imagine if Hillary was the man, and Obama the woman. People would be in an UPROAR.
11.Obama is even tempered, Hillary, unfortunately, is not. She is prone to outbursts.
12.Obama has run a far more efficient campaign, Hillary's has been a financial disaster. Hillary started with 170 MILLION DOLLARS, and went broke.
13.Obama inspires people with optimism ("From the bottom up; activate the American populace") ", Hillary motivates people out of fear. (3AM advertisements for egs)
14.Obama is inclusive of the American people and their aspirations (yes WE CAN) , Hillary tends to be divisive and exclusive. ("Well those states just don't matter")
15.Obama can work with Republicans (who happen to despise Hillary) The result of which? Obama can get legislation PASSED!
16. In almost every major poll, Obama beats McCain time and time again, while Hillary gets defeated time and time again.
17. Obama won the last debate according to a survey taken by MSNBC on their website. (60 percent Obama, 20 percent Clinton, rest undecided) And really, Obama has won the last THREE debates.
18 Hillary Clinton, according to Rollingstone Magazine, takes more money from drug companies than any other member in Congress.
March 11, 2008 1:32 PM | Reply | Permalink
It's not just according to Rolling Stone, it's according the Center for Responsive Politics:
http://opensecrets.org/pres08/sectors.asp?sec=H
March 11, 2008 9:45 PM | Reply | Permalink
I don't know whether Obama will be a great president. It looks like he will. But IMO this is so much more than about Obama. It is about taking the country back. It is about taking the Democratic Party back.
March 11, 2008 1:33 PM | Reply | Permalink
TonyC,
Thanks for asking. GMan's a fair and nice guy. I think he has the right idea.
Everybody here has already chosen up "sides" and you're in danger of getting a lot of biased pro-Obama or even anti-Hillary comments.
Like GMan, I suggest you check out barackobama.com first. And, to borrow from Bionic Soy, you might also check out published insight and opinion about Obama. Like he said, you might appreciate the endorsement and campaign coverage article in The Rolling Stone.
http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/story/19106551/a_new_hope
Or, you might value the numerous articles and editorials in The Nation.
http://www.thenation.com/directory/presidential_election_2008
To read about other Obama endorsements, refer to this list:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Barack_Obama_presidential_campaign_endorsements#Academics
March 11, 2008 1:47 PM | Reply | Permalink
I agree with much that has been said here. I am pretty passionate about the fifty state strategy and about growing the party from the bottom up. I love the idea of someone steeped in that bottom up approach(community organizing, state legislature) becoming president. I love watching the fifty state strategy being implemented by the Obama campaign, a natural and intelligent outgrowth of learning from the 2006 elections. I am very impressed with Obama's learning curve about this and find myself reassured about his learning curve capacity in general.
There are also two arguments that I haven't seen mentioned yet.
I think there is a chance, realizable only if we all continue to work hard as citizens to keep making it happen, that an Obama presidency opens a longer term avenue for solid movement towards restoring Constitutional balance. Obama does not believe in the unitary presidency and he is a Constitutional scholar by training. Many months ago he contacted a conservative colleague at the University of Chicago and asked to have an informal debate about this, in order to sharpen his position and get the deepest arguments. That kind of intellectual honesty is something both that colleague (which is why he wrote about it) and I admire greatly. I personally need checks and balances and the rule of law to reemerge. Now, immediately. I trust Obama on this based on his history and on testimony of those who know him, but you can bet I will also be mobilizing constantly during his presidency to keep giving him cover for it.
Also, we have had years and years of presidents working out their personal demons and taking the country with them. I am in the field of mental health and find myself very attracted to have a president who seems like a grounded human being with a moral compass, particularly of course when that goes with a compelling array of talents and an orientation to use power wisely. I think this qualification isn't a centerpiece for most voters in the country, but to me it is worth mentioning.
There. I haven't mentioned anything negative about Hillary here. I do want to say, however, that while my positive Obama focus came before my own negative Hillary focus (I am an Edwards supporter who did a new candidate search when I needed to), I do understand how the negatives against Hillary get so strongly aligned with political passions for the positive and thus are hard to weed out. It happened to me, someone not at all predisposed to that way of approaching things. These are extraordinary times and like nothing I have experienced in 63 years on this planet.
March 11, 2008 2:01 PM | Reply | Permalink
As to Obama's foreign policy (leaving aside Obama's glowing endousement of Lieberman in the CT primary) here's neocon Robert Kagan's take on that:
Robert Kagan is enthusiastic about "Obama the Interventionist".
America must "lead the world in battling immediate evils and promoting the ultimate good." With those words, Barack Obama put an end to the idea that the alleged overexuberant idealism and America-centric hubris of the past six years is about to give way to a new realism, a more limited and modest view of American interests, capabilities and responsibilities.(...)To Obama, everything and everyone everywhere is of strategic concern to the United States. "We cannot hope to shape a world where opportunity outweighs danger unless we ensure that every child, everywhere, is taught to build and not to destroy." The "security of the American people is inextricably linked to the security of all people." Realists, call your doctors. Okay, you say, but at least Obama is proposing all this Peace Corps-like activity as a substitute for military power. Surely he intends to cut or at least cap a defense budget soaring over $500 billion a year. Surely he understands there is no military answer to terrorism. Actually, Obama wants to increase defense spending. He wants to add 65,000 troops to the Army and recruit 27,000 more Marines. Why? To fight terrorism. He wants the American military to "stay on the offense, from Djibouti to Kandahar," and he believes that "the ability to put boots on the ground will be critical in eliminating the shadowy terrorist networks we now face." He wants to ensure that we continue to have "the strongest, best-equipped military in the world." Obama never once says that military force should be used only as a last resort. Rather, he insists that "no president should ever hesitate to use force -- unilaterally if necessary," not only "to protect ourselves . . . when we are attacked," but also to protect "our vital interests" when they are "imminently threatened." That's known as preemptive military action. It won't reassure those around the world who worry about letting an American president decide what a "vital interest" is and when it is "imminently threatened." Nor will they be comforted to hear that "when we use force in situations other than self-defense, we should make every effort to garner the clear support and participation of others." Make every effort? Conspicuously absent from Obama's discussion of the use of force are four words: United Nations Security Council.
As to who would win most easily in the GE: Clinton keeps almost all the traditional Democratic voters, Obama does not -- about 1 in 5 Clinton voters would rather vote for McCain. The Obama voters have been saying that they are less committed to him -- I had assumed that this meant they were more willing to vote for Hillary but it may mean that more of Obama's voter are independents and Republicans with less loyalty to their choice and hence more of a risk to depend on in the GE. (courtesy of David Seaton)
March 11, 2008 2:06 PM | Reply | Permalink
As to Obama's foreign policy (leaving aside Obama's glowing endousement of Lieberman in the CT primary)
Please. Nobody did more for Joe Lieberman, before and after the primary, than the Clintons.
March 11, 2008 2:15 PM | Reply | Permalink
Kagan is a neocon who is just trying to cause mischief in the Democratic primary and save his own reputation by claiming that liberals who would ever intervene anywhere (like Bill in Bosnia) are the same as neocons. Please.
March 12, 2008 12:53 AM | Reply | Permalink
What the hell are you talking about, AJM? Which parts of this are from Kagan, which from you? Either way, I think Kagan is not exactly the best source to base your assessment of well, anything, on.
If you like, I can quote any number of left-wing people who think Clinton will be exactly like Bush?
Here is Obama's essay in Foreign Affairs. It pretty much completely contradicts Kagan (or you, I am still not clear who is talking.)
March 11, 2008 9:49 PM | Reply | Permalink
Most of them just can't help but bash Hillary as a reason to vote for Obama. Sad.
March 11, 2008 2:08 PM | Reply | Permalink
Judge Obama by his laws.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/01/03/AR2008010303303.html
He works in a bi-partisan manner, and yet, doesn't water down his bills!
Frankly, I see great potential in Obama. He really has an opportunity to change the political landscape for the better.
Don't let militant Obama supporters scare you off... look at his website, read "Dreams From my Father", and decide for yourself.
March 11, 2008 2:33 PM | Reply | Permalink
Hey SCMadden, can you elaborate on Obama's book(s)? I haven't read them and I'm curious about what they convey about his character and whether the impression they convey in that respect is consistent with how he's performed in the Senate and conducted his campaign. Would appreciate the insights if you have the time...
March 11, 2008 2:40 PM | Reply | Permalink
yes, read dreams for my father, written years before he started to run for president and I think that one gets a decent sense of who this guy is. I was an edwards supporter before E got out and I switched immediately to Obama. my brother, a Richardson donor switched to Obama when R left.
March 11, 2008 5:40 PM | Reply | Permalink
Wow.
Thanks all (well, the vast majority).
(and thanks GMan08 for moderating :) )
Doubts? I've had a few. Maybe I had 8 years to get used to the idea of Hillary running in 08, but only one year for Barack.
I'm worried that Obama will turn the country more protectionist. Maybe I'm one of the few here that thought of NAFTA as a good thing overall, not a 5 letter curse word.
I can see his electability but I worry how he'll cover the "inexperienced" attacks when it comes from the Republicans. For real this time, not the relatively weak broadside that Team Clinton has thrown.
I'm worried about the thickness of the skin of the campaign in general. Yes, Clinton's just as thin skinned, but it doesn't bode well.
Thanks for the info above folks, there's some stuff in there I hadn't seen before (and yes, I have read through all of the issue statements over the last few months). I'll digest it all tonight.
Thanks once again.
March 11, 2008 3:11 PM | Reply | Permalink
You have to realize that both candidates were saying things about NAFTA that were meant to pander to an electorate that has already decided that NAFTA cost them their jobs. You can't get up on the stump try to explain the intricacies of international trade and globalism to Joe Sixpack. He wants his job back, he's already decided why he lost it and he wants to hear the candidates say that they'll get it back.
And they both did.
Here's a tip: If you want to know where candidates stand on policy, read about their policy positions. The stump is not the place to learn about an issue platform.
March 11, 2008 9:44 PM | Reply | Permalink
TonyC,
No one knows if Obama will he a great president, a horrible president or something in-between.
I find that rather funny since my concern is that Obama is a free trade fundie despite protestations. Nearly all Americans have been inculcated with a false doctrine throughout their schooling.
In the first place there is no such thing as free trade anymore than there are unicorns.
American prosperity was built on high trade barriers and is being destroyed by predatory foreign competition. One can make a cogent argument that the Civil War was mainly between the free trade South and protectionist North with slavery being part and parcel of the free trade argument. There is a parallel today in the exploitation of child and slave labor by our trading partners. We even indulge ourselves in prison labor to compete.
My only point, TonyC, is that we see issues differently. In order to agree on a candidate's qualifications on issues, we first have to have agreement on what those issues are.
Then there are the intangibles like character that are in the eye of the beholder.
Damn the race issue. Most Americans have no concept of what race is. Not one person has bothered to defend the claim that Obama is black anymore than that he is white. It is just a matter of Divine Truth given us by the like of Chris Matthews and worse.
Good luck with your effort.
Best, Terry
March 12, 2008 12:11 AM | Reply | Permalink
Okay, here's why I'm voting for Obama. Part of the reason I think this primary has turned into such a protracted war of attrition between the Clinton and Obama camps is because, despite being fundamentally similar on a lot of policies, the two ultimately represent two different directions for the future of America. You can tell it from their campaign platforms. Clinton represents pedigree, familiarity, and, I think she would hope, a certain reliability. People know Hillary and they know Bill. The two of them have been in the White House before and know their way around Washington. Their assertion, I think, is that in the wake of this disastrous Bush presidency, with the country is so much trouble in between the war and the economy, that you need some familiar faces who can guarantee improvements. That's what this whole "experience" platform is about--changes (from the current situation, mind you) that you can, in theory, count on.
But Obama's campaign ideology is broader and more ambitious, but also more exciting and dynamic. Obama's whole point is that it wasn't just Bush who got us into our current mess, it was the whole rotten state of Old Washington politics; the partisan divisiveness, the lobbyists, the corporate glad-handing and special interests. The Clintons, for better or worse, are very much part of this Washington, and while they might bring about change that will improve the immediate situation, they won't bring about a more tectonic ideological shift that will really alter the whole political terrain. It is a tall order in one way, but I, for one, don't think it's impossible, and I think it is a message that really resonates among many Americans.
We're entering a new century with a lot of uncertainty, even danger. But what we need is vision. I think it's important to take a chance on a candidate who offers the best chance of doing things a little differently. Sitting down with our enemies with no preconditions and no expectations, despite being lampooned as naive, I think is important. I like the notion that Obama wants to staff his administration with independents, because it shows a willingness and interest in post-partisan points of view.
I'm sure this all sounds like empty talking points, so let me give up something more concrete: healthcare. That's one fundamental difference between Clinton and Obama, and I think it's a critical one. Clinton has stumped on providing universal health care, but that's a distortion. The truth is, she wants to enforce a mandate that makes everyone buy it (at an undisclosed rate and coverage), and will penalize you if you don't. Providing universal healthcare and making everyone buy health care are two different things. I don't like this plan because I think it's very much in line with Hillary's corporate interests. I had to ask myself: who is really benefitting from this plan? The American people? Well, maybe, but if you're making everyone buy healthcare at an undisclosed rate, the only people who are sure to profit big time are the healthcare companies. I don't want to be negative here, but I really have to say that when Hillary defiantly asserted she would be taking lobbyist money because, "whether you like it or not, lobbyists are Americans, too," I was immediately turned off. Obama's plan, however, is less pro-corporate. He won't make healthcare universal, but he promises to make it more affordable. That means antagonizing healthcare companies rather than working in concert with them.
Again, and this is a talking point, but it's also valid: Obama does have good judgement. Attack him for just "speaking" against the Iraq War, but he knew from the beginning that it was a bad idea, and he went after it on the courage of his conviction. Furthermore, look at what he said about Pakistan and going in to get terrorists: we did just that a few months ago. I think Obama has real "chops," as they say. I believe he's got the insight and the thoughtfulness to be a good leader, to approach every crisis that comes his way with an intelligence and good judgement that I really have faith in.
Alternatively--and I don't mean to go negative, but I do think it's important to note the difference--for all Hillary's experience, she hasn't shown herself to be an exceptional leader. Iraq was a fishy decision, but even beyond that, I can't get over the glaring fact that the only time she was actually responsible for directing something (Healthcare back in the 90s), she blew it. She blew it by being secretive, insular, and pandering to corporate interests. I think decisions and results speak more to your leadership abilities than an extensive resume. Obama's, granted, are admittedly scant, but from the little he has he shows a levelheadedness and strong conviction that I truly have faith in. I can't say the same for Hillary. I think she might be a capable woman, but I really don't think she has what it takes to really lead the country. This purported "Commander-in-Chief" threshold I've been hearing so much about shouldn't be about how many countries you've visited, but how you can operate under pressure, how you can inspire the people around you, and how you can, well, judge situations. Obama has continually shown cool under the kitchen sink, he has really ignited in me an interest and concern in politics and this country that I haven't really felt for any politician before, and again, his decisions have always been thoughtful and, well, right. I think he has the makings of a fantastic leader. He really does embody that whole JFK message of "ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country." By saying "Yes we can," he makes me feel that I can work towards something better, with the help of my country(wo)men and with Obama at the helm, I feel like I matter, that I can make a change. Hillary's retort sounds more like "No, you can't, and the people who voted for you can't, but I can." Well, no one is going to bring about change on their own. But if they can inspire people to bring the same passion into change as they do, then maybe, just maybe we can get things done. And that is a hope, and a vision, for the future that I can really get behind.
Gobama.
March 12, 2008 7:20 AM | Reply | Permalink
Here are my Obama-focused reasons for supporting him.
Foreign policy 1: His presence as president will bring a cooling energy to the aggravated Middle East. His color and name will have an instant effect on the "white crusader" identity the U.S. is currently labeled with, and he will back that up with an air of goodwill & reparations through speeches and policy.
Foreign Policy 2: He will bring a much-needed diplomatic edge to Iraq, and at the same time draw down forces there quickly and rationally.
Foreign Policy 3: He hints at it without saying it (which is smart), but he will slow down and even reverse the growth of the military industrial complex over an 8-year presidency.
Domestic Policy 1: He is a charismatic personality and inspiring speaker that will continue galvanize many people to patriotism and active civic involvement. The more people involved in government, the less it is an "us vs. them" battle for policy.
Domestic 2: He will do what he can to slow down and even reverse the strength of lobbyist power in Washington. A second term would have the potential for real campaign finance reform.
Domestic 3: He will support and open civil dialogues on energy & healthcare, and it is our responsibility to convince him away from Nuclear, Clean Coal, and any medical system that isn't single-payer.
Domestic four: his policy will redistribute wealth to the middle class and bring funding to scientific research and education that will end the trends of the last 7 years.
General: He's a smart, clean (not corrupt), little-guy-oriented, visionary, natural leader. He has the capacity to show real strength and real compassion. He comes from a modest, community activist background. He is a model for the modern , socially conscious American citizen. He has a genuine, improvisational character that is refreshing to see in the "image" business. He seems to be able to remain very calm and cool under pressure.
Good luck in your decision-making.
March 11, 2008 6:18 PM | Reply | Permalink
First of all, Obama has been one of the busiest Democratic legislators in Congress. His work on lobbyist reform is paramount to me. This is the biggest issue I see in all election years. The lobbyist are the biggest hurdle for ALL legislation that goes thru Congress and the Presidents desk. The more we curtail lobbyist influence, the more money stays in our pocket. Can you imagine the BILLIONS of dollars that could be saved just by curtailing lobbyist influence. Not just the porkbarrel legislation, but ALL legislation where money flows from the federal government. This includes DUMB wars, as well. Don't tell me that this influence is here to stay and we just have to live with it. I want a responsible government that functions of the people, by the people, for the people.
Obama can be that guy whom is transformational in how American politics are done. One case in point: look at the huge amounts of money his campaign has raised! And raised from the PUBLIC! Not from the corporations. He didn't start this type of fundraising, but he is now leading a sea change in how Presidential(or more) politics are being funded. Look at the immense amount of dollars that Hillary is now raising thru small donations from regular people, now that she realized she didn't have to hit up the corporations as much to fund her campaign. I wish I could be a fly on the wall as her face changes while realizing that her new bosses are now the average citizen instead of the pharmaceutical and military lobby, for example.
Do you understand how monumental this example is?
Not a government that is of the corporations, by the corporations, for the corporations.
I want a President whom is honest and trustworthy. The measure of a man/woman is not what he/she does in the open, but what happens behind closed doors. I want a President whom is a role model for kids even behind closed doors. One you can point to that your kids could emulate, at every step. Even thru honest mistakes. No smoke filled shady back room deals.
I want a President whom can inspire the positives in people. One that can get the electorate to get their butts out and vote. And when that happens it makes other legislators take notice that they are being watched by the electorate. It is easier to make the right political moves when watched closely by your voters whom are inspired and fired up.
I want a President that is not afraid to come out and say what needs to be said. One that is a brutal realist in practicality and morals. All of these things are not exclusive to Obama, but resonate and flourish in his candidacy.
I feel that our Constitution has been on the attack. We need to safeguard it, even thru trying times of terrorism. Obama truly loves and reveres the Constitution and will return our federal government to accountability to this great document.
I think our foreign policy is one that should look to revere our own history and continue those positive patterns. Obama understands, respects, and wants to return to some of the great ways our country has dealt with the prospects of wars, and the peace processes. Obama seems to want to govern our foreign policy first with moral fiber. And with honesty and long term responsibility. Do I think Obama should be the one to jump and answer that 3am call? You bet I do.
I could keep going and pardon the yelling caps and long post, but I can only understate that the Obama Presidency can mean so much in such a trying time for this country.
March 11, 2008 7:17 PM | Reply | Permalink
I had a very favorable view of the entire Dem. field when this thing started.
Clinton was a tenacious health care advocate who had been treated so very unfairly by the right-wing machine. Edwards positioned himself as the populist hero and brought poverty front and center in the debates. Obama was the inspiring up-and-comer who showed real political courage and who was bringing new dems into the fold.
In the end, I was drawn to Obama for many lesser reasons (which I won't get into here), all of which seemed to inform a single powerful argument:
Obama is the vessel through which Dems. can achieve a significant majority to affect REAL change.
Republicans have thrived on obstructionism and subverting the issues. Right now they are demoralized (and, well, they should be). Obama is someone who has and will continue to show many independents and conservatives how they've been misled; that so called 'liberal' issues actually make sense. Sadly, many of these people have been poisoned against Hillary Clinton (often enough through no fault of her own). And she represents, fairly or unfairly, a lifeline for republicans this November and beyond.
Two months ago I thought Obama and only Obama offered the prospect of a filibuster-proof Senate majority in 2010. I still put it at better than 50/50 if he gets the nod. I just don't see that ever happening if Clinton wins, even discounting the fact that, at this point, she'd probably have to cripple the party to get the nomination.
March 11, 2008 7:46 PM | Reply | Permalink
Just keeping visiting this site until you understand:
http://barackobamaisyournewbicycle.com/
March 11, 2008 8:17 PM | Reply | Permalink
On the other hand: http://godhatesobama.com/
March 11, 2008 11:19 PM | Reply | Permalink
Looking over these comments and the ones on the similar thread, "convince me on Clinton," as well as what I know about each candidate led me to speculate how different the responses would be if the question was convince me on Gravel or Nader or a dozen other people. Their resumes are so slim, their accomplishments so few and so minor that its hard to make a serious case that either should be president. That we have ended up with a choice between these two is a sad commentary on the state of our democracy.
March 11, 2008 8:34 PM | Reply | Permalink
No, you're a sad commentary on the state of the electorate.
March 11, 2008 8:47 PM | Reply | Permalink
First reason, for anyone with sense, to support the Democratic candidate, whether Obama or Clinton, is John McCain (notwithstanding David Seaton's mania).
But specifying Obama implies the contrast with Clinton. Can't be otherwise, so not-Hillary issues are positive reasons to support the other.
How about this simple positive point---Obama threw volunteers into a race against Denny Hastert's successor, and it went Democratic. Obama will deliver.
March 11, 2008 8:38 PM | Reply | Permalink
I've been leaning Clinton for many years, but I see Obama as inevitable now.
I fail to see the problem (other than a little cognitive dissonance - but that too shall soon pass). If you've been leaning Clinton for many years, you obviously understand the attractions of inevitability. Just need to transfer those attractions to the newly inevitable candidate. Folks here can help, but mostly it's just about doing a little homework on your own time.
March 11, 2008 8:45 PM | Reply | Permalink
I find it best to decide for yourself from the man himself.
Two things will convince you -
Read his books:
Audacity of Hope and Dreams of my Father
Read the article he wrote for Foreign Affairs Magazine:
http://www.foreignaffairs.org/20070701faessay86401/barack-obama/renewing-american-leadership.html
March 11, 2008 8:50 PM | Reply | Permalink
Before you interview a candidate, decide what you need and what you want and where your requirements lie on the spectrum of the candidates' positions. Do you think the world is a dangerous, hostile place that requires an agressive leader to promote America's interests above all others, forcing them down the throats of anyone who resists? Or do you think we've been missing out on critical and lucrative opportunities to exploit radical and rapid changes in the world's financial markets, political fluidity, and information flow?
Read Obama's website; his positions are right out there. On paper they're extremely similar to Clinton's. The differences are subtle, and mostly ones of tone and strategy. Health care? Start with children, which congress can agree on easily. Move to cost controls so you can then set up affordable plans. Clinton claims she can require insurance for everyone right away. It looks like Obama's plan, but the strategy is literally incredible. The pattern holds for most of their positions.
Most of us have gotten so emotionally entangled with our candidates that we can't even express anymore why we love them so. But, in case you're interested, here's my core belief:
I hate fear. I fear fear. I've lived in fear ever since Reagan was elected and he held the bomb over our head for eight years. And noone can think clearly when they're afraid. In my view, Obama isn't about some abstract hope. He's about poast-boomer, post-cold war, post-racist, post-feminist, even post-liberal hope. He wants to redefine America in ways that just seem to make sense, making alliances in Asia, the Middle East, and (oh by the way) Europe that'll make Al Qaeda irrelevant. IMHO, if we don't redefine America, America will soon be defined out of its position as a leader. Obama's about sacrificing ourselves for future peace and prosperity. Clinton seems to be about hanging on to the past glories for dear life. Clinton keeps reminding me of fear, and I won't go there anymore.
March 11, 2008 9:34 PM | Reply | Permalink
"Forget it. If they don't have the courage to do it on their own, I'm bloody well not gonna lead 'em on by the hand."
- Joe Strummer
March 11, 2008 10:37 PM | Reply | Permalink
Obama actually thinks that a person should be judged on their own merit rather than trying to cast dispersion upon someone else to gain the advantage.
I also think he shuns failure by default i.e. through the lack of trying. What America change? We can see by the obstacles that have sprung up, that change will not come easy. Although there is no guarantee of success, at least Obama is willing to try.
March 11, 2008 11:23 PM | Reply | Permalink
I think that there have been quite a few well reasoned posts on this issue so I won't belabor them.
But I think that the most fundamental reason why I am an ardent supporter of Barak Obama can be found in his Wisconsin victory speech when Obama stated the following:
"The change we seek is still months and miles away, and we need the good people of Texas to help us get there.
We will need you to fight for every delegate it takes to win this nomination. And if we win the nomination, if we are blessed and honored to win the nomination, then we're going to need your help to win the election in November.
And if we win that election in November, then we are going to need your help and your time, your energy, your enthusiasm, your mobilization, your organization, and your voices to help us change America over the next four years.
Because understand this, Houston: As wonderful as this gathering is, as exciting as these enormous crowds and this enormous energy may be, what we're trying to do here is not easy, and it will not happen overnight.
It is going to take more than big rallies. It's going to require more than rousing speeches. It will also require more than policy papers and positions and Web sites. It is going to require something more, because the problem that we face in America today is not the lack of good ideas. It's that Washington has become a place where good ideas go to die...
... because lobbyists crush them with their money and their influence, because politicians spend too much time trying to score political points and not enough time trying to bridge their differences so we can get something done.
The problem is that we haven't had leaders who can inspire the American people to rally behind a common purpose and a higher purpose. And this is what we need to change today. This is what's hard, and we know this."
This is an manifesto as profound as any given or made in the American body politic in the last 48 years. Obama is calling for the American people to take back their government, to be involved, engaged and active participants, to be "We the People."
March 11, 2008 11:46 PM | Reply | Permalink
Why Obama?
(1) start with reading the Oct 2002 speech
It is not just anti Iraq war - it is prescient in what was going to happen
(2) Sr thesis at Columbia on the dangers of nuclear non proliferation and a dogged path to try and tie up loose nukes. This culminated in the Obama-Lugar Non proliferation bill passed in Congress last year
(3) As an Illinois State Senator led the effort to reform the death penalty which led to a moratorium on the Death Penalty in Illinois - where the Innocense Project originates from (following a year when 7 or 8 later proved innocent men were killed by the state)
(4) Bringing new people into the system. As the mother of a teenager - who will be voting for the first time in NOv 2008; I watched my daughter and her friends so disgusted and turned off by politics as they watched their parents fight with friends, arguments about the war, George Bush etc
Suddenly there is a Barack Obama - don't tell me Hope isn't appealing. Suddenly my daughter and her friends see government as part of their lives and their responsbility. Unlike my generation who had to be involved because of Viet Nam and the draft - until Obama the majority of this generation was "sitting it out" - not interested in government and its divisiveness
My daughter and friends went to SCarolina and canvassed and worked for Obama - they met and spoke to people their own age who they never would have had the opportunity to talk to --all joined by the common goal to support Barack Obama.
(5) Growing up in NY I was a "kid for Kennedy" too young to vote but worked for Bobby Kennedy as he ran for Senate. And waited 10 hours in line as his body laid in state at Saint Patricks Cathedral. I still view this as one of the most defining moments in my life.
Barack Obama has the magic Bobby Kennedy had to lead and inspire. To want you to do better. To care for others. To speak plainly and simply and stir your soul.
---
I can give more reasons -- but these are five pretty compelling ones to me
March 12, 2008 12:29 AM | Reply | Permalink
Why Support Obama?
I'd have to admit that for me, a big part of what makes Obama compelling is a Generation X sensibility that simply resonates with me as the future.
In part it consists in a genuinely post-racial, post- identity politics vision (that goes beyond the liberal but race-conscious 60s generation like the Clintons); also a civil libertarian ethos of individual freedom and responsibility (i.e. bottom-up political power only works when citizens take personal responsibility) where in contrast I think Hillary Clinton retains more of a top-down vision of government power.
I think David Brooks, in his op-ed on March 4th, accurately distills something of the Gen X sensibility in the movement for Obama:
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/04/opinion/04brooks.html?_r=1&oref=slogin
March 12, 2008 1:17 AM | Reply | Permalink
Here's one I don't think anyone has covered.
From what I can tell, Obama is staying true to his endorsement of merit pay for teachers. Taking such a position would have once been considered political suicide for a Democrat. So I was really impressed when Obama ignored the obvious costs and took a stand (note: it's cost him BIG. The NEA endorsed Clinton, and has spent a lot of $$ against him).
Mind you--I'm not even sure I totally support the position. My point is that he's not scared to take on politically unpopular ideas (on the Dem side) and talk about them openly, and attempt to find common ground. It's a kind of guts that are not too common in politics, especially during primary season.
March 12, 2008 1:29 AM | Reply | Permalink
JHJ,
I am totally against merit pay for teachers because of the way it is most assuredly going to be administered. It will not be the best teachers but the best politicians that do well.
Nevertheless I appreciate those willing to take unpopular stands that cost them dollars and votes.
Thank you for your opinion.
Best, Terry
March 12, 2008 8:36 AM | Reply | Permalink
With all due respect to this subject. I had high school teachers who were inspiring and involved. I also had high school teachers who gave the class the assignment in the first 5 mins, then spent the rest of the time reading the paper. It is nearly impossible for a teacher to be fired for underperformance. Really, the only way a teacher can be fired is if they do something pretty heinious. Not many of us can say that about our jobs.
The teachers unions guarantee the same pay for all no matter how well they do (or not do). For the inspiring teachers out there, they quickly become disenchanted and disillusioned. Looking at it statistically, you can see this divide breaking between newer teachers with enthusiasm and the tenured teachers who have been beaten down over the years.
Merit pay is a great idea. It will provide the motivation for all teachers, not just the ideological few. It is great that Obama doesn't just follow the crowd and throws money at a problem indiscriminately, but sees how that money will be best spent for the good of all students.
March 12, 2008 11:02 AM | Reply | Permalink
There is nothing anyone can say to convince me to vote for Barack Obama not even Barack himself. This man is not resdy to be our next President period. I think it's been pretty evident in the debates and in not sharing with us his plans to get this country back on track and the greatness we once had. He has shared no solutions. He is charming and coning us period. He has absolutly no foriegn policy experience and will not be able to save us from recession and this poor economy because he is not experienced enough period. He is also not being honest with us. He was raised muslim and conviently changed over to christianty 20 yrs ago when he got into politics. He also flip flops on NAFTA and Iraq vote. He can charm us all he wants and tell us I will change how politics is done in this country but lets be real that will never happen. I guess if you want John Mccain to be our next President and another 4 years of Bush policy nominate Barack Obama if you want experience and proven record of were this country can be and respect of our allies back then vote for Hillary.
March 12, 2008 8:26 AM | Reply | Permalink
Carey, hopefully one day you will be "resdy" to do some fact checking before you spew recycled lies.
March 12, 2008 9:18 AM | Reply | Permalink
I saw this post and I had to laugh, if these are the Obama talking points I dont know what is. I had to address this:
SOMEONE ASKED WHY VOTE FOR OBAMA? EIGHTTEEN QUICK REASONS
1.Obama, all-tolled, has even more legislative experience than Hillary. (10 years vs 6 years)
LOL, well so does Leiberman but I think you would be hard pressed to say he is the person to represent the party in a general election.
2.Obama opposed the war, Hillary authorized it. (Now 70 percent of Americans want the war ended.)
At the time he opposed it he didnt have the full weight of the responsibility of the vote on his shoulders. Funny thing how a bit of responsibility and accountability can change one. Obama has sine coming to the senate vote the exact same way as Hillary Clinton on the war.
3.He opposed NAFTA, she supported it. The aftermath of which was 3 MILLION American manufacturing jobs lost.
He opposed nafta but supported Peru becoming a member of it. Another Go Figure moment.
4.He is respected and endorsed by senior Democratic Congressmen who have worked both with Hillary and Obama (Kennedy, Dodd, Kerry) and have clearly chosen to endorse him over her.
Ok this is not saying much to me given the fact kennedy owed his re-election the clintons helped him in his state when he was being challenged by Romney and Romney was winning. John Kerry? LOL I know you didnt GO THERE! this man wouldnt stand for the party in 04...he simply folded!
5.Obama is far more authentic than Hillary, who seems, at times, disingenuous. (she will shake hands one day, attack the next)
Spin. Yes he was very authentic when he said he would not have lobbyists working in high positions in his campaign. I guess he was right there is a big difference between a "state" lobbyist and a "federal" lobbyist.
6.Hillary is beholdened to Lobbyists and Special Interest groups. She takes more money than ANY other candidate in the race, Rep. or Dem. And this indicates who's interests she will prioritize and serve while in office.
ROTFL Obama is taking the same money only he takes it from individuals who WORK for the Lobby group so he can say with a straight face I dont take money from lobbyist. Oh did I mention he is good at taking it from their 3 yr olds as well.
7.Hillary has a lot of baggage, including allowing corruption to reign in her own marriage and her shady and questionable involvement in Whitewater. How will her government be immune from corruption? It won't.
Is this not a republican talking point or what? if this were the case she would not be a twice elected Senator.
8.Hillary has more pork, Earmarks, in her budget (360 MILLION DOLLARS) than almost any other congressperson.
OMG...Hmmmm shame on her New york would be a shamed their senator bringing money back to them. By the way Mccain received even less that mean you are voting for him?
9.Hillary, unfortunately, will have Bill Clinton as her de facto VP.
Hmmm is that a bad thing? 22 million new jobs, peace and Prosperity....Lord why would we ever want that again?
10.Obama does NOT engage in smear campaign tactics (even when attacked) that serve to reduce and divide the entire party, as Hillary has, does and is doing. Many of these belittling and spurious attacks shed more light on Hillary, than they do her opponent. Just imagine if Hillary was the man, and Obama the woman. People would be in an UPROAR.
OMG I really had to laugh at this one. When you say someone is sneaky and cant be trusted that is a smear campaign. not to mention that mess you sent out in Ohio which thank goodness was uncovered and made Obama look weak and petty.
11.Obama is even tempered, Hillary, unfortunately, is not. She is prone to outbursts.
I dont think anyone can say what anyone is unless we live with them. i did like how he cracked when he got a little press in the lead up to Ohio. Who isnt prone to outburst?
12.Obama has run a far more efficient campaign, Hillary's has been a financial disaster. Hillary started with 170 MILLION DOLLARS, and went broke.
Oh please given she has less to work with and is less than 200 delegates behind is a testament to how good of a campaign she has run.
13.Obama inspires people with optimism ("From the bottom up; activate the American populace") ", Hillary motivates people out of fear. (3AM advertisements for egs)
Hitler, Jim Jones, Charles Manson and Marilyn Mason inspired people as well, i dont think I would care to vote for them.
14.Obama is inclusive of the American people and their aspirations (yes WE CAN) , Hillary tends to be divisive and exclusive. ("Well those states just don't matter")
LOL Apparently not if he has a problem getting Reagan Dems, women and Hispanics to come out for him in battle ground states.
15.Obama can work with Republicans (who happen to despise Hillary) The result of which? Obama can get legislation PASSED!
Based on what? There is nothing in his voting record that pops out saying he is willing to cross the aisle. Hillary on the other hand has been called a Neo Con for it. Go Figure.
16. In almost every major poll, Obama beats McCain time and time again, while Hillary gets defeated time and time again.
What state does a major poll vote in? A national poll might be good for predicting the over all popular vote but surely you know the electoral college is what determines who will be president.
17. Obama won the last debate according to a survey taken by MSNBC on their website. (60 percent Obama, 20 percent Clinton, rest undecided) And really, Obama has won the last THREE debates.
LOL More OPINION! MSNBC has become the Generic version Fox News of media. i wouldnt believe a single thing they had to say.
18 Hillary Clinton, according to Rollingstone Magazine, takes more money from drug companies than any other member in Congress.
As i said before you can take money from indivduals in a lobbying firm and claim with a straight face that you dont take money from lobby GROUPS. By the way i went to open secrets the difference in money Hillary received vs Obama 12,473 bucks ....ROTFL Wow i dont think i need to say more.
March 12, 2008 9:28 AM | Reply | Permalink
He's not Clinton or McCain.
March 12, 2008 11:36 AM | Reply | Permalink
I began this primary as an Edwards supporter. I saw Obama as the perfect VP for Edwards. Obama seemed too green to me.
That was before I witnessed a complete transformation and metamorphosis of Obama. Yes, he made mistakes. Yes, he continues to make mistakes. But, he learns, adjusts and adapts instantly.
I read that Obama was crappy public speaker not too long ago; he was a smart guy who gave wonky speeches. But, he figured out that he had to inspire people if he wanted them to listen to him. So, he practiced and improved.
Now, he is being criticized for what I consider to be a HUGE accomplishment. He fills stadiums! For political rallies! Who does that?
He also made it clear that he was going to rely on 'the people' to fund his campaign. He took that gamble because he believed in everyday people. Hillary did not take that gamble. Not initially. She heavily relied on connections and big donors. She's currently benefiting from Obama's leadership in that area.
But, that's not all. Obama has consistently been in front of Hillary. Obama has exhibited TRUE leadership skills. He plans. He asks his supporters to plan. He doesn't rely on tricks to win; he relies on ground support and organization and PLANNING to win. Those are traits of true leaders.
Obama is not the same man he was just 1 year ago. Again, he learns, adjusts and adapts instantly. Hillary tries to brag about her 35 years of experience, but Obama has surpassed her in fewer than 6 months.
How is that he, the newbie, could navigate the primaries so much better than a seasoned politician with numerous connections?
The answer: 1) He trusts his own judgment, 2) He stands by his convictions, 3) He trusts his supporters, 4) He PLANS, 5) He encourages his supporters to plan, 5) He exhibits true leadership, 6) He means what he says, and he says what he means.
Why do I support him beyond the aforementioned?
1) I live in a multi-cultural family, 2) I believe 'real-life' experience trumps 'bubble' experience, 3) Obama came from nothing and made something out of his life, 4) He has a variety of cultural, religious, socio-economic, racial and geographic experiences.
These are traits/experiences I find invaluable, not only in my own family, but in the leader of our country.
Lastly, and this is a biggie, Obama is not an idiot. He KNOWS that if he wins the Presidency, he will have a huge burden on his shoulders. I know he's going to work his butt off making sure he fulfills his promises made in all of his 'fancy' speeches. Because he IS more than speeches. Much more. He believes in what he's saying. All he has done is rearrange the words and add eloquent flourishes so that WE'd believe in what he was saying, too.
Anyway, I hope this helps you feel better (even good) about supporting Obama.
March 12, 2008 11:49 AM | Reply | Permalink
I would think Americans have had enough of being perceived by other countries as being bullied and lied to by their President. Hillary just offers more of the same.
Obama is a gentleman and a diplomat. His wisdom and judgement pervades!
March 12, 2008 11:57 AM | Reply | Permalink
First I would like to commend the post by RainyDay. Second the question that prompts this thread was terrific because I had to stop and think about how, as an Obama supporter, I would respond. For context I am 79 and cast my first Dem. vote for JFK after 2 votes for Ike and growing up in a Republican family. I've been a "liberal Dem" ever since.
As to Obama: Clearly the contest is between two "liberal Democrats" with very similar policy proposals. If you assume that either will be preferred by the general voting public over a bigger war-monger than Bush even, then the primary season choice must come down to differences in character, personality, temperament, and judgment. For all of Hillary's gifts and experience, I believe Obama wins the "leadership" contest hands down.
I think that his "core experience" as a community organizer is at the heart of his leadership style. He campaigns that way and I expect he will govern with that style in mind. He obviously can inspire and god knows we need some inspiration to begin making right the many messes we have on our hands now.
Finally, I think it is important to take Obama for who and what he is and not overinflate his potential. Someone has pointed out his quick learning curve which is highly significant. He will make mistakes but he will learn and adjust. He is almost certain to bring highly competent, thoughtful, knowledgeable people into his administration and listen to their advice. He will not be a "savior" but he will be the kind of leader you want to listen to and work for, as a citizen or whatever. In short, he does literally offer the most significant "correction" needed in the direction this country has been going, which is overwhelmingly felt by the public to be the "wrong direction". There isn't unanimity on the "right direction" but Obama is more likely to find the way and bring the American public along with him.
I hate to see the nasty infighting that is going on between the two Dems, but I am not nearly as pessimistic as the pundits about the damage this will do to the nominee in the general election. When the decks are cleared and Barack is nominated and all the focus is on McCain and the sorry administration he wants to perpetuate, Obama will make the case and win the election. Any other outcome is too painful to even contemplate.
I hope these are helpful thoughts.
March 12, 2008 12:13 PM | Reply | Permalink
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