Praying At J Street
I don't know what did it.
Sure Jeremy Ben Ami worked for two years to get to this moment, and then assembled a terrific team. Obama helped. So did the disastrous Gaza war and its ugly aftermath. And then the haters piled on, only causing hundreds of people to sign up for the conference at the last minute. (I stood on line to get my credentials behind a mob that didn't sign up in advance at all).
One woman said, "We're from New York and don't do 'conferences.' But then we saw that e-mail from that settler who condemned J Street for accepting a contribution from an Arab-American girl and had to come."
There are many more people in attendance than J Street expected. All the last-minute folks have made it impossible to get into the sessions unless you push your way in early. I heard that Ben Ami expected a thousand but it's looking more like 1700-2000.
I gave my seat in one session to one very old man. He grabbed my hand. "These are the Jews I've been waiting for since 1967. Actually, I feel like I've been waiting for them since the Balfour Declaration. I feel like saying a sheheceyanu." That is the prayer thanking God for letting us live to see the day.
And, although I am not a praying man, I said, "let's say it." And we did Quietly.
"Baruch ata adonai elohenu melech ha olam, shehecheyanu, v'kiyimanu, v'higiyanu laz'man hazeh.
Blessed are You Adonai our God, Ruler of the Universe who has given us life, sustained us, and allowed us to live to see this day."
Amen.
Thank you for sharing this important and also personal moment.
October 26, 2009 2:07 PM | Reply | Permalink
It is a great moment. But I have a lot more faith in MJ's motives than Obama's.
Let's hope it helps create a real movement toward peace.
October 26, 2009 3:44 PM | Reply | Permalink
Last I heard Obama enjoyed a favorable opinion among 4% of Israelis.
No kidding, 4%.
We have schooled people over decades, of course, that the more that Israelis may disenfranchise others, the more we will giddilly applaud. So we must only blame ourselves if we have sown misunderstanding and delusion.
October 26, 2009 5:02 PM | Reply | Permalink
And Amen..
October 26, 2009 2:13 PM | Reply | Permalink
Sitting here in Jerusalem, overlooking the Temple Mount, I am watching the proceedings of the J Street Conference (10-26-09). It is a combination of shock and awe that I watch these assimilated middle-aged Jews in their "deep concern" for Israel. The ignorance and audacity of these people is best summarized by the article by M.J. Rosenberg. Here Rosenberg suggests that we make a bracha l-vatalla-a blessing a vain. Cleverly he uses the blessing "shehecheyanu"-He who has kept us alive to witness this moment. What moment are we witnessing? Female "rabbis" telling the world that Israel is "occupying" its own country! No thanks, M.J., we don't need your false blessings!
October 26, 2009 3:34 PM | Reply | Permalink
Were you a Christian before you converted to Judaism?
October 26, 2009 5:39 PM | Reply | Permalink
As long as he wasn't a Catholic.....
October 26, 2009 5:46 PM | Reply | Permalink
Hi lally-I was not involved in religion before Judaism. You must have read that on my site. Either that or you have special powers!
October 27, 2009 12:57 AM | Reply | Permalink
I didn't detect any of the tie-ins to Christian doctrine in your belief system. Someone who was involved in organized Christianity (of whatever stripe) and who had converted for purely ideological reasons would be likely to draw parallels.
BTW, perhaps you should adapt your mission from purging bad Jews to improving kosher food. Your recipe for Moroccan Meatballs was intriquing and much appreciated for the illustration of flavor combinations. (FOUR onions? surely they must be of the mild/sweet variety...and wouldn't ground lamb be the optimal/traditional protein? I do realize that hamburger may be more acceptable to American/European palates..... )
October 27, 2009 3:05 PM | Reply | Permalink
lally, I appreciate your comments.
1. I was actually more likely to be on the side of Israel making concessions before I got involved in Judaism. It is only my connection to Torah that makes me pro-settlements.
2. I am seriously considering, over time, expanding the site to include kashrut as well. If you have suggestions, post them on my site (eathummus.com)
3. The Moroccan Meatballs dish is something that is tasty for everyone. Lamb is more expensive, but your point is well taken. If you make it that way, tell me how it goes.
4. I am just following the recipe I got from an Ashkenaz family from Maryland. I haven't made it in years and I miss it. I love onions and try me anyway you whip it up it'll be delicious-try it yourselves! I plan to post photos of each dish-if you have a nice photos of the meatballs please send me the jpeg!
Thanks for following eathummus.com--->Justin
October 28, 2009 11:14 AM | Reply | Permalink
Horrors! Not female rabbis! What is this world coming to? And what next? A black President of the United States, G-d forbid?
See, we Jews have our Taliban as well. Thanks for checking in, Mullah Justin.
October 26, 2009 9:33 PM | Reply | Permalink
No problem! But admit one thing: those "Rabbis" will, in one or two generations be Christians. You and I both know that in inevitable. Why don't you use your wit to solve your assimilation problems?
October 28, 2009 11:15 PM | Reply | Permalink
I too thank you for sharing this moment. May we all live in peace.
Allahu Akbar.
October 26, 2009 3:35 PM | Reply | Permalink
MJ, sometimes I see a side of you that shines on through. Yasher Koach.
October 26, 2009 3:43 PM | Reply | Permalink
Hey, theres Bruce. I haven't seen you here in ages.
MJ's columns are still as controversial as ever, and it seems like the driving force is often the settlements.
October 28, 2009 8:20 AM | Reply | Permalink
It is a sad thing to see Jews talk about the "occupation" of their own country!
The Anti-Self Defamation League
www.asdl.biz
October 26, 2009 5:05 PM | Reply | Permalink
justin, where should the third temple be built? should it build where the al aqsa mosque stands now or should it be built to the left, right, front, or behind the al aqsa mosque?
October 26, 2009 5:13 PM | Reply | Permalink
Think of the mental gynastics Justin had to go through to write this sentence: "It is a sad thing to see Jews talk about the "occupation" of their own country!"
Implicit in Justin's sadness is the belief that Palestinians are trespassers because it can't be "their" country too, can it?
October 26, 2009 5:43 PM | Reply | Permalink
In Israel most Jews see the Palestinians as people that are a kind of squatters that should move to other Arab countries. Sad.
October 26, 2009 6:39 PM | Reply | Permalink
Ironically, in most real democracies such thoughts are considered racist.
October 26, 2009 6:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
>The Anti-Self Defamation League
Is "anti-self" like "What's the Matter With Kansas?" anti-self, or is it more like an "Anti-Christ" anti-self?
And is your "Defamation League" intent on defaming all other religions, or just certain ones?
Of course, the original "anti-self" league was the Buddhist sangha, and to this day they still annihilate more self in a minute than you could do in a kalpa.
There, do I get to join the "Defamation League"?
October 27, 2009 12:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
gate gate paragate parasamgate bodhi svaha
October 27, 2009 12:52 PM | Reply | Permalink
揭諦揭諦，波羅揭諦，波羅僧揭諦，菩提薩婆訶。
(Praying together in Sanskrit and Chinese -- seems like a reasonable response to the original piece)
October 27, 2009 1:48 PM | Reply | Permalink
"the disastrous Gaza war"
That depends entirely on your perspective. To the residents of Sderot and other parts of Israel that have been subjected to years of rocket attacks on their children (they were aimed at schools), which were and are illegal under international law, it certainly wasn't disastrous at all. On the contrary. It very effectively stopped the rockets, and thus not only helped the Israelis, but allowed the Palestinians to go on with their lives with some assurance that Hamas' actions would not cause their own children to be attacked in Israel's acts of self-defense. But MJ appears to be only concerned with attacking Jews, not with reducing the violence and the lives of people on both sides. The fact that the Israelis have repeatedly attempted non-violent solutions to ending Hamas' attacks and that these have failed doesn't seem to matter to him.
October 26, 2009 5:17 PM | Reply | Permalink
So if it's stopped the attacks, then why are the border crossings closed? Why is concrete not being allowed into Gaza?
Thanks, dim bulb. You have proven that Israel is not protecting itself, but engaging in illegal collective punishment.
As you said, the rocket attacks have stopped....
October 26, 2009 5:45 PM | Reply | Permalink
Is this some sick joke: "Israelis have repeatedly attempted non-violent solutions to ending Hamas' attacks"?
They aren't even attempting to SLOW DOWN the land grab by their terrorist-settlers on the West Bank.
As for the bloodbath of hundreds of Gazan children "stopping" Arab attacks: That was said after the last 30-40 wars, invasions, and "operations" by Israel. The difference is that the likes of Moshe Dayan were not cry baby cowards who could only function by having their stooges interfere incessantly and underhandedly in the US political process. Those Israelis WERE under actual threat and dealt with it skillfully, successfully and bravely. And then USED their military success not to expand settlements for lunatics in the West Bank but to negotiate lasting peace deals with Egypt and Jordan, 15 YEARS AGO TODAY! THAT is the Israel that J Street and America and the world want BACK. Israeli settlers can join their Hamas terrorist allies jointly promoting perpetual war in the hell that awaits them. The rest of us need to move on. Thanks to J Street there is hope.
October 26, 2009 5:51 PM | Reply | Permalink
"with some assurance that Hamas' actions would not cause their own children to be attacked in Israel's acts of self-defense."
Thanks for admitting that Israel targets Gazan children. That was very brave of you, but I'm glad honesty won the day.
October 27, 2009 1:50 PM | Reply | Permalink
More and more, I see the hard right of Israel behave like Scientologists - or any cult for that matter - when their practices are being challenged. The legitimacy of the challenge is of no consequence: their goal seems to be the silencing of dissent - or even simple questions - through intimidation, terror, smearing, lies - they're not even worried about suggesting Obama would be happy with another Holocaust. That is how far these people have strayed from reason. Anything goes, apparently.
Bibi's recent comments in the Washington Post really blew my mind - he's going the way of Dick Cheney: simply pretending that history never happened, makes up his own which of course fits his agenda like a glove, and acts surprised when the entire world looks at him in puzzlement.
When will the world begin to realize that by and large, those who are critical of Israel's behavior and policies are not the antisemitic ones - very much to the contrary.
Rather it's the hard right(fanatically supported by America's evangelical hard right, who consider Jews to be lesser beings & only alive to be caretakers of Israel in preparation for the rapture, end times and all that - certainly they have no interest in Mid East peace), whose sole purpose in life seems to be weaponry, aggression and racism against Arabs and Persians.
To the contrary of many of Israel's vocal right wing supporters - even when thousands of innocent civilians - including hundreds of children are killed, with no independent reporter being allowed to investigate, we are told that the ITF can & does do no wrong, and anyone who criticizes Israel's behavior in Gaza is simply antisemitic and wants her to fail.
Of course such offensive and cult-like behavior is what is doing the most damage to that great young nation's future.
Their current behavior is losing friends fast - and they must remember that Obama has a LOT of patching up to do after 8 devastating years of threats and fear-based diplomacy. Israel cannot expect to have America as her sole supporter and expect to do anything they want, in any country they want, to whomever they want, all in the name of preventing a second holocaust. It's a lie, and it should be offensive to every reasonable-minded Jew - not to mention the rest of the world.
The cult-like behavior of Israel's right wing desperately needs to be challenged from within.
Because to those of us who really do love peace, and really do want to see a pluralistic society: what we see is a nation being controlled by a fanatical cult, who viciously attack even the most ordinary of questions. And such behavior is usually reserved for cult leaders - not leaders of nations.
Though the Cheney/Bush regime was another exception to that rule.
October 26, 2009 5:32 PM | Reply | Permalink
"I see the hard right of Israel behave like Scientologists -"
No, the Scientologists in France were just convicted of fraud, not murder, let alone war crimes.
October 27, 2009 10:45 AM | Reply | Permalink
Great MJ. A lot of us have been waiting a long time for this. And you have been working at it harder than most, so in addition to blessings, thanks are also due.
The big question now that you have got things reading and raring to go: what are you going to do?
We'll be "staying tuned" and looking forward to your continued fine and important efforts.
October 26, 2009 5:57 PM | Reply | Permalink
Here's one Christian who joins you in obedience to our Creator's admonition to pray for the peace of Jerusalem (Psalm 122):
"Pray for the peace of Jerusalam:
'May they proper who love you. May peace be within your walls.'"
Furthermore, I am so happy to see that you, MJ, are a man who is willing to pray.
Baruch ata adonai elohenu.
October 26, 2009 6:12 PM | Reply | Permalink
On two of the most pressing issues facing Israel and the Jewish community -- Goldstone and Iran sanctions -- J Street is unable or unwilling to articulate a position. J Street seems to be walking on egg shells, acutely aware that some of its positions are well outside the Jewish mainstream and that, given recent controversy, it can no longer afford to be perceived as outside the mainstream. Which explains why Ben-Ami tacked decidedly to the right in that interview with Goldberg -- but that interview caused considerable consternation among the J Street rank and file today (more on that in a post later today).
Rabbi Eric Yoffie, the president of the Union of Reform Judaism and one of the most prominent doves in the country, blasted J Street earlier this year for "drawing a moral equivalence between Hamas and Israel." Yoffie spoke at the J Street conference today and was booed by the audience for criticizing Goldstone. J Street is trying to find the space between its hard left, anti-Zionist base and the larger community of liberal, pro-Israel Jews. It's not clear they'll succeed.
http://www.weeklystandard.com/weblogs/TWSFP/2009/10/the_space_between_proisrael_an.asp
October 26, 2009 6:15 PM | Reply | Permalink
Thanks for providing the fair and balanced neo-con source, AnnaA.
But I have to ask? Isn't it always a value judgment as to whether a speaker is "heckled by" versus "booed by" an audience?
"To boo" implies the majority disapproves of the speaker; "to heckle" impies a few disapprove. Big difference. One word ratifies, the other just describes.
A good propagandist--like a writer at the Weary Standard, for instance--would intentionally invert these words.
Did you notice?
October 26, 2009 6:37 PM | Reply | Permalink
Let me suggest, mythbuster that your views are not views of the larger community of liberal, pro-Israel Jews.
October 26, 2009 6:57 PM | Reply | Permalink
Since I'm a pro-Palestinian, ring-kissing Papist, you are certainly--and finally--right.
October 26, 2009 7:36 PM | Reply | Permalink
Anna, that is simply disgusting.
Are you really trying to suggest that 'liberal' is now 'hard right' in Israel?
What a bastardization of reality.
The filth that is the Weekly Standard is a specialist at turning the meaning of words on their head - and you seem to have fallen into that trap.
What horror and terror Palestinians must feel - to be living under conditions that the victims of Nazi Germany did - and for you lot to trivialize the issue into a sad, childish, circular blame game, while they're dying all around wealthy, powerful Israel - but hey: blame it on the dead and dying - even let them all die off. That about sums up the message the world is getting from Israel, who used to get a hell of a lot of respect from the world for it's positions on human rights and behavior during conflict. Now, it's the opposite - and you've bought into their cult-like philosophy that everyone should be blamed but those that are behaving like racist animals culling a population that cannot defend itself, cannot even feed itself.
If you actually cared about those human beings, you'd not be behaving this way, nor disseminating their bigoted, fascist propaganda - to masquerade such horrifying script as 'liberal' is terrifying in itself.
October 26, 2009 8:20 PM | Reply | Permalink
October 26, 2009 8:56 PM | Reply | Permalink
Anna,
you seem to feel you have an exclusive view on what 'mainstream Jews' think.
Apart from the safety and security of Israel I didn't know there was a mainstream mindset among Jews.
Jews constantly argue over how to resolve the Israeli/Palestinian issue, and also the overall political philosophy here in the USA, which, for sake of argument, I'll reduce to liberal vs conservative.
October 28, 2009 8:46 AM | Reply | Permalink
That is the most PREDICTABLE thing coming from the middle east right now: if I disagree with how Israel is handling the Palestinian issue: I AM A JEW HATER.
That's it folks: I'm not horrified about how children are being killed and starving to death in squalor, nor how schools were targeted recently.
The fact is, I HATE JEWS.
Really, really simple.
So very simple.
Who needs to argue anymore?
Self righteous racists like Anna have it pegged! No argument needed! How DARE I compare the poverty and death that Gazans live under to be anything LIKE how Jews were treated by the Nazis? After all: 6 million Jews were killed - and only thousand of children are dying in Gaza - NO COMPARISON!
hOW WRONG i AM, AND HOW DID I NOT SEE SUCH A SIMPLE SOLUTION: i am a jew hater! i see the light!anyone who disagrees with us: YOU ARE JEW HATERS TOO!
AAARRRGGGHHHH!!!!!
October 28, 2009 4:37 PM | Reply | Permalink
Do you have children, Anna? Would you be happy to see them used as human shields and then mercilessly killed by Israel's army: to have their bodies broken and smashed: to have their blood running in the streets: to have their sightless eyes look at you AND ASK WHY? Why do you endorse the killing of children? Why do you absorb and disseminate political propaganda? Why do you still live and 320 children lie mouldering in the earth? These questions are not rhetorical. The blood of nine hundred non-Jewish human beings lies on your hands and those of your soldiers. Those who kill children and innocent civilians under the pretext of self-defense, will not sleep at night. No more than any other who takes life. You will never sleep the sleep of the just but the wakefulness of the damned. These were children, Anna, just like yours, and those of your brother and sister. And of your own mother.
October 26, 2009 8:45 PM | Reply | Permalink
Do you have children, bluecanary ? Would you be happy to see them used as human shields and then mercilessly killed by US's army: to have their bodies broken and smashed: to have their blood running in the streets: to have their sightless eyes look at you AND ASK WHY? Why do you endorse the killing of children? Why do you absorb and disseminate political propaganda? Why do you still live and ten thousands children lie mouldering in the earth? These questions are not rhetorical. The blood of ten thousands non American human beings lies on your hands and those of your soldiers. Those who kill children and innocent civilians without even the pretext of self-defense, will not sleep at night. No more than any other who takes life. You will never sleep the sleep of the just but the wakefulness of the damned. These were children, bluecanary , just like yours, and those of your brother and sister. And of your own mother.
October 26, 2009 8:59 PM | Reply | Permalink
BluePearl-Your sarcastic remark is not connected to what I said. The Torah defines the Land of Israel as belonging to the Jews. Even when Jews are in exile, the Land is our "possession." Your cynical allusion to Messianism shows a lack of understanding.
mythbuster-Arabs can live here but they have to recognize who the true owners are. Should we pretend that Israel is co-run by Arabs just like USA is "co-run" by American Indians? Look in your own backyard!
The Anti-Self Defamation League
www.asdl.biz
October 26, 2009 11:13 PM | Reply | Permalink
Justin, you are on an American website. A little respect would be appropriate, even if Americans visiting Israel insult you regularly (which I rather doubt). You see, two wrongs don't make a right whatever you think your strange interpretation of your Torah tells you.
And while we are on the US-Israel comparison:
When your weird chapter of the Anti-Defamation League that acts defacto as a West Bank Settler Fanatic Propaganda League manages to breed an Israeli population 50 times that of the Palestinians, and to herd them onto reservations WITHOUT continually lying and cheating to corrupt the government of a larger FOREIGN country to act as your sugar daddy, THEN you can compare yourself to the United States of 150 years ago. Until then, you are invited to take disgraceful cowardly land-grabbing propaganda elsewhere.
This page is about AMERICANS, especially but not only Jewish Americans, working to reclaim their moral compass (in addition to control of their own national legislature) and rude interruptions from sectors that have long been busy corrupting that compass are not particularly appreciated.
October 26, 2009 11:43 PM | Reply | Permalink
PTroub-There is no such thing as an "American website!" This is the global village, buddy. I am a convert to Judaism from Virginia and right now in Jerusalem. I can make whatever comparison I'd like to. Jews have waiting long enough and been mimicked by too many other religions to abandon their own faith now. Do you have a better interpretation? Do you know Hebrew?
Supporting the Jewish claim to the Land of Israel doesn't necessarily mean only the territories-it means all of Israel. Your comments represent your own "propaganda." That "Sugar Daddy" has been weened on Jewish scriptures from the get-go, don't you remember? Who has the upper hand? Israel is not grabbing anyone's land but it's own. If you want to blame someone, blame Rome for having taken Jews away from their homeland. What's the matter? Is your compass broken?
The Anti-Self Defamation League
www.asdl.biz
October 27, 2009 12:52 AM | Reply | Permalink
So Mr. White, reader of ancient curly cue texts, you are a fan of the global village. So also are terrorists of many stripes who come to blow themselves up in cafes in your beloved Israel. How about some civilization and rule of law to accompany anything-goes open borders? How about human rights, how about the United Nations?
Apparently "your God" tells you that it is his sacred will that Israelis move outside of their internationally recognized border to steal land from Palestinians, bulldoze their villages and decimate their olive groves. Supposing "my God" considers them hypocrites and murderers who will burn in hell for their sins. Is this severe disagreement amongst the Gods a Big Deal?
Not in America. Fortunately, the founding fathers, who included some Virginians of greater foresight and intelligence than many more recent residents of that state, planned for this contingency. Under the 1st Amendment, you can listen to your god, I to mine, and Tom Cruise to his, if he has one (and he is allowed not to) and the government will not take sides. And if you don't like such separation of Church and State you may join some more theocratic arrangement abroad. No doubt, there are any number of frightfully ugly cement bunker settlements in Judea and Samaria quite eager for your fervent misinterpretation of old texts.
This website is run by Americans, so of course it is an "American website." And if those organizers want to open up the comment pages to foreigners, or to nominal Americans who are actually loyal to barbaric foreign places but too afraid to move there, they can do that as well.
Indeed we can see on this very page the wisdom of such a liberal policy. J Street has taken the somewhat difficult position that it will work simultaneously on behalf of both Americans and Israelis, but actually our two peoples DO share many interests, e.g. being better shielded from each others' lunatic fringes. America's government is disrupted by West Bank settler-maniac fronts such as AIPAC. Israel suffers the influx of messianic Americans who greet Moslems at prayer in their mosques with assault rifles. With J Street civilized people of good will may be assisted in defending their societies against religious extremism, and this page illustrates the need for such efforts.
October 27, 2009 5:51 AM | Reply | Permalink
You and mist bloggers here are lunatic fringes
October 27, 2009 9:58 AM | Reply | Permalink
Commenters are not bloggers you sad little racist twit.
By the way: I'm a Jew, and I hate what the right wing of Israel & the IDF are doing to the country. As do most liberal Jews.
You're not a liberal Jew: you're one of the most hateful, racist, self hating people I've come across in quite some time.
For anyone to be so lazy, and so simple minded to dare calling anyone who disagrees with the right wing of Israel Jew haters, is either 8 years old whose parents are brainwashed by Bibi's thugs, or you simply have no brain and are choosing, like so many racist, extreme right wingers, to be as abusive as possible whilst pretending the Weekly Standard is LIBERAL(for f*cks sake), despite being one of the most war mongering rags on the planet short of the Al-Qaida Times.
Your hate is palpable, therefore my hate for you is too. People like you are better off with a gun, on the front line, doing what you feel is right - and not wimping out and getting other people's children to do it.
You're so proud of Arab kids being murdered: if you're an adult: go do it yourself instead of supporting the ordering of others to do it.
October 28, 2009 4:45 PM | Reply | Permalink
you are a fan of the global village
I accept reality. You dubbed me a "fan."
your beloved Israel
Israel is beloved my America. All Muslims and Christians have to admit that they love Israel because without us, they wouldn't have any material, right?
and rule of law
The Nations have considered Judaism the rule of thumb for thousands of years. Roughly a billion people on earth worship a Jew! All of sudden we are lawless?
How about human rights, how about the United Nations?
Where were human rights all the thousands of years that Jews were taking an beating from you all (before you morphed into happy-fun passivists). When do the Nations unite? To jealously harm the Nation Of Israel!
your God
That is the war of the Jews-to show you He is your God too.
to steal land from Palestinians,
Jews were exiled by force from Israel nearly 2,000 years ago. Jews have never forgot this-daily prayers talk about the return of Jews to Israel. Jews paid an enormous price to come back to their Land after so long. It was Rome who called Judea and Sameria "Palestine" in order to destroy the Jewish character of the Land of Israel. In fact the word "Palestine" was stolen from Jewish scriptures (Plishtim). Why don't you return that stolen word?
Not in America.
How about Manifest Destiny, cowboy? How about bringing millions of slaves from Africa and subjugating them for hundreds of years? America is a great nation, but your convenient memory lapse is not going to go unnoticed. The founding fathers also had slaves-I studied at UVA and part of the original campus was slave quarters.
frightfully ugly cement bunker settlements
Have you ever been to Judea or Samaria? It's far from a bunker. It is unpolluted beautiful hills with the only truely free Jewish children in the world. Is that what you hate so much?
nominal Americans who are actually loyal to barbaric foreign places
What about Viet Nam? What about Japanese concentration camps? My father was a U.S. officer in Nam and my grandfather was a veteran of WWII. I live now in Jerusalem. I am looking at the Temple Mount right now! Jews have never been barbaric. Most Americans believe in a "version" of Judaism-another fact you conveniently forgot. You are whining about things you know nothing about.
J Street
J Street? Is that Jesus Street? Jihad Street? Lost Jew Street?
West Bank settler-maniac fronts
Again-what about Manifest Destiny? The great Western Expansion. If you want to go on the attack don't complain when I "go on the defense."
Israel suffers the influx of messianic Americans
If those Americans didn't come to Israel they would end up being Christians-is that why you are complaining? American citizens here add a lot to Israel-including Nobel Prizes.
who greet Moslems at prayer
Islam is not innocent and not a religion of "peace." You are not fooling anyone, PTroub.
against religious extremism,
Many of the atrocities of the past 500 years-including slavery and the Holocaust were committed by secular, "enlightened" regimes, would you like to explain that one?
October 27, 2009 12:25 PM | Reply | Permalink
Take your delusions to the West Bank. See how your settler friends brutalize their Palestinian neighbors. Then come back in shame to America, maybe even to J Street, but leave your delusions behind. Or stay in Israel and find your way to the good Israelis there who are not bent on hating Arabs and stealing from them.
Jews took over Palestine from Egyptians or Assyrians who took over from Homo Erectus, Native Americans took over North American from the wholly mammoths and sabre tooth tigers, and the Romans took over from the Etruscans who took over from the Celts who took over from the Neanderthals, give or take a few tribes and a few dozen or hundreds of millennia.
Two wrongs, a million wrongs, do not make a right, and your fixation on Judea and Samaria is not anything that any American need tolerate. Go where you belong and leave us alone, including our Congress.
October 27, 2009 4:10 PM | Reply | Permalink
PTroub-Are you having a nice big John Wayne steak when you write these? Ironically when I'm here I end up defending America-particularly gentile America. However, it's hard to do so when you insist on having an ignorance-based tantrum.
bent on hating Arabs and stealing from them.
You are involved in two wars with Arabs countries this moment, right steak? Who hates Arabs? Furthermore,the Land of Israel belongs to the Jews-ask your boyfriend Jesus!
who took over from the...
So let's all watch some football and everything will be alright? Not so fast-you cannot roughshod over history so quickly. At least half of the population of the earth believe in a religion that is connected to Judaism and the Torah says that the Land of Israel is the inheritance of the Jews. You can connive and dodge as much as you want but it wont change that-doesn't matter what country Justin happens to be in.
your fixation on Judea and Samaria Why did you hijack Jewish scriptures for 2,000 years? Why do you all worship a Jew? Your statements are idiotic. Jews have been in exile for 2,000 and had to tolerate people like you. What do you expect? If you took away land from U.S.A. Americans would be raising a riot, right?
October 27, 2009 7:22 PM | Reply | Permalink
JW:
Jews are 1/200 of the world's population. Christians, though it is a stretch to call the "connected" to Judaism, are about 1/3.
1/200 + 1/3 does not = 1/2
Even if you were able to do 4th grade arithmetic (fractions), and Jews, or Jews and Christians, or perhaps Jews + Christians + Moslems ALL together somehow did amount to y of the world (though this is a much bigger stretch to effectively claim that 99/200 of 199/200 of the world's population that are non-Jews and the 1/200 that are Jews are all "connected to Judaism) SO WHAT?
At some sentimental level a huge percentage of the world believes in Santa Claus. Does that mean if some maniac dresses up in a red suit, that we have to give him Greenland and Northern Canada?
Jews have NOT been "in exile" for 2000 years except symbolically. Most of them have been able to move to Israel for the last 15 years and have chosen not to. The idea of even moving to the Palestine was only invented in the late 1800s. For most of the prior 1900 years a minority of Jews had any great interest in going to the Mideast. It is true that they have very often been mistreated, sometimes very badly, in quite a number of other places, but -how many times do I have to say this (is there some part of the Torah that contradicts it? Tell me, please what?):
TWO WRONGS DO NOT MAKE A RIGHT.
At any rate none of this fantasy history justifies your settler terrorist buddies perverting America's Congress. Go out of the civilized part of Israel and over to those barbarian religious lunatics in the West Bank hell holes where you also belong. And keep your dirty hands OFF of America's Congress, and its Treasury.
I am not talking about the right of Jews to live in the internationally recognized state of Israel. I am talking about (against) the lunatic fringe that wants Palestinians to have NO state, and will stop at no lie or crime to act out their paranoid extremism, and insists of corrupting domestic politics in the US.
October 28, 2009 2:00 PM | Reply | Permalink
Jews are 1/200 of the world's population.
It is influence that matters-not size. California, for example, has a larger economy than many countries in the world. You are dodging the issue-there are billions of people who "use" Jewish prophets as part of their religious scheme, but don't respect Israel's ancient claim to its Land-which is a contradiction.
Santa Claus
That's all you, man.
Jews have NOT been "in exile" for 2000 years...(is there some part of the Torah that contradicts it? Tell me, please what?)...
The current exile began when the Second Temple was destroyed (70 C.E.) and continues until this moment. It will continue until the Third Temple is built and the Messiah comes. This is basic stuff, buddy, and it's not my fault that you don't know that. Your statement is ridiculous.
fantasy history
Do you deny the Holocaust, too?
barbarian religious lunatics...America's Congress, and its Treasury.
Listen, steak, we had this discussion. Jews were never barbarians. Europeans were basically white apes 1,000 years ago whether you want to admit it or not. Don't play innocent either. U.S.A. has no right to tell Israel what to do with it's Land, especially when we are surrounded by hostile Arabs who hate your concept of "democracy." Stop pretending that you are the only one allowed to have influence in this world.
internationally recognized state of Israel
The Nations do not have a right to recognize or delegitimize the Jewish claim to the Land of Israel. The Arabs aren't so easily pacified. Once they achieve A) they move onto B). You are too caught up with your steak, cars, and Hannah Montana to realize that.
The Anti-Self Defamation League
www.asdl.biz
October 28, 2009 8:31 PM | Reply | Permalink
Folks, that is your brain on ziocaine. Ziocaine is a self-produced drug which causes alternating periods of grandiosity and kvetching paranoia, and long term abuse can cause a complete collapse of the ethical and moral facilities.
For God's sake, don't let your kids get started on it. I mean, what else do you need to see?
October 27, 2009 10:56 AM | Reply | Permalink
Is that Martillo talking fancy there? Does Ziocaine make someone speak Yiddish in order to torture the rest of us? Does long-term use prevent Jews from becoming Christians? For God's sake please stop pretending you are doing things for God! You are simply avoiding God and hiding behind "Yiddish!"
October 27, 2009 8:01 PM | Reply | Permalink
Apologies to any members of the ADL, an apparently still somewhat respectable and pro-human-rights organization, for my confusing it with the similarly named "Anti-Self Defamation League" hyped here.
October 27, 2009 6:05 AM | Reply | Permalink
is that your blog, asdl.biz? please tell me what are the "core Jewish values".
October 26, 2009 11:55 PM | Reply | Permalink
who is your brother? who is your neighbor? where is your heart?
is there someone who is not your brother? is there someone who is not your neighbor? is it possible for the almighty to love one and not another? in the spirit is there another, is there a you?
October 27, 2009 12:10 AM | Reply | Permalink
Who is your brother? who is your neighbor? where is your heart? is there someone who is not your brother? is there someone who is not your neighbor? is it possible for the almighty to love one and not another? in the spirit is there another, is there a you? Why are you are not helping your neighbors and brothers south of the Wall of separation to come here and enjoy education, health care and affordable housing?
October 27, 2009 12:19 AM | Reply | Permalink
If you are interested in Judaism, why not go to a synagogue/seminary? I am not a missionary for Judaism.
October 27, 2009 1:21 AM | Reply | Permalink
I am not a missionary for Judaism
i certainly hope not! phonyness follows you wherever you go. you were a phony before your conversion and you're an holier-than-thou phony jew now.
October 27, 2009 8:21 AM | Reply | Permalink
What do we find behind blue eyes? Someone who doesn't have a command of the issues at hand-someone who out of fear, ignorance, and jealously is desperate to label the unknown.
October 27, 2009 12:47 PM | Reply | Permalink
how can you speak of the unknown when you are so full of yourself?
October 27, 2009 12:56 PM | Reply | Permalink
Why don't you answer your own question? It seems more appropriate for you.
October 27, 2009 1:35 PM | Reply | Permalink
Thank you for clearly delineating the difference beyween being a ziocaine addict and being a Jew.
October 27, 2009 10:53 AM | Reply | Permalink
"The Torah defines the Land of Israel as belonging to the Jews"
Yeah, and this Jew-boy pooted an entire chorus of Hatikvah
October 27, 2009 10:52 AM | Reply | Permalink
hey M(L)oser-can I borrow 20 sheckles?
October 27, 2009 12:56 PM | Reply | Permalink
Justin says:
try telling Courts or Governments around the world that the Jews have a right to the Land of Israel because the Torah says so.
Claiming ownership of something because the Bible, Torah, Koran, the teachings of Buddha, or the Chronicles of Narnia say its so will get you nowhere.
October 28, 2009 5:53 PM | Reply | Permalink
International law exists only in textbooks on international law. If it weren't for their adherence to their religion, Jews would have been erased by time, just like all of the other peoples described in the "Bible." In time, people like you will also be erased, but Israel will continue.
The Anti-Self Defamation League
www.asdl.biz
October 28, 2009 8:01 PM | Reply | Permalink
Jason,
apart from my not having been erased yet, you didn't address my point.
October 29, 2009 12:20 PM | Reply | Permalink
Amen.
Great article, M.J. and thanks for sharing your story and excitement over the J. Street conference. Today I watched the "Middle East Peace Process" and "Israel and the American Left" panels on C-SPAN.
Both panels were interesting and informative.
As member of J Street I too am very excited about J Street and pray for their success in helping to bring about peace between Israel and the Palestinian and their neighbors.
October 27, 2009 1:14 AM | Reply | Permalink
Clearly no one on J Street read the Hamas or even Fatah Covenants. No one on J Street comprehends the meaning of "True Believers", for in their projected perception, everyone is logical, self-interested and reasonable. There is complete blindness to Islamicist's absolute conviction that Zionism is the world's worst scourge and their need to eradicate it at any and all costs including life, abject poverty and deprivation.
This is non-negotiable and J Street knows it not.
J Street has no theological or philosophical source in Jewish texts, other than the ones that they themselves compose. They represent only those who claim a birth relationship to Jews. A great many Christians also claiming Jewish roots call themselves 'Ethnic Jews'. None of them represent Jews or Judasim: only a liberal, pro-Palestinian lobby with a "Jewish" mask.
They have no definition of 'peace' that fits reality, yet they call for it. The fiction of peace in the Mid-East for them is like a drug on which they are hooked. Reality be damned. Indeed.
October 28, 2009 11:58 AM | Reply | Permalink
In other words: you're a one sided, ignorant bigot who pretends he knows what he's talking about - yet hasn't bothered to even find out what reality is before pretending to be an expert - like all war mongering anti-Arab right wingers.
You're always wrong, yet all you Cheney clones claim you know exactly the solution for everything.
October 28, 2009 4:47 PM | Reply | Permalink
Cinesimon-I am afraid you are the closed minded bigot. Anyone who doesn't enlist in your leftist academy in going to be vilified. How multicultural are you? You don't realize, in your crazed passion, that you are the same bully you label others as being. You are an ignorant peace-monger. No one in Israel cares about Cheney-get over it!
October 28, 2009 11:12 PM | Reply | Permalink
Where has framing this conflict as property rights as interpreted from 3000 year old texts gotten anyone? Its important to understand the historical context - but if anyone on this board expects resolution of the conflict by Arabs accepting the Torah or Jews accepting the Koran the region is DOOMED.
For a long time here in America Christians defended slavery under a similar sub-text - and guess what apparently we collectively decided that God was wrong about it being good to own slaves.
There is a reason there is passionate debate in Israel about how to solve the conflict - and that is many Israeli's are tired of the hard core military stance. There is a reason that only hardcore terrorist groups can gain control of Palestinian politics.
I hate to tell you this folks, but this is a David and Goliath battle - Israel has a right to defend itself. But it also has a RESPONSIBILITY to use its tremendous upper hand to the benefit of all people.
October 28, 2009 1:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
Jews are 1/200 of the world's population.
It is influence that matters-not size. California, for example, has a larger economy than many countries in the world. You are dodging the issue-there are billions of people who "use" Jewish prophets as part of their religious scheme, but don't respect Israel's ancient claim to its Land-which is a contradiction.
Santa Claus
That's all you, man.
Jews have NOT been "in exile" for 2000 years...(is there some part of the Torah that contradicts it? Tell me, please what?)...
The current exile began when the Second Temple was destroyed (70 C.E.) and continues until this moment. It will continue until the Third Temple is built and the Messiah comes. This is basic stuff, buddy, and it's not my fault that you don't know that. Your statement is ridiculous.
fantasy history
Do you deny the Holocaust, too?
barbarian religious lunatics...America's Congress, and its Treasury.
Listen, steak, we had this discussion. Jews were never barbarians. Europeans were basically white apes 1,000 years ago whether you want to admit it or not. Don't play innocent either. U.S.A. has no right to tell Israel what to do with it's Land, especially when we are surrounded by hostile Arabs who hate your concept of "democracy." Stop pretending that you are the only one allowed to have influence in this world.
internationally recognized state of Israel
The Nations do not have a right to recognize or delegitimize the Jewish claim to the Land of Israel. The Arabs aren't so easily pacified. Once they achieve A) they move onto B). You are too caught up with your steak, cars, and Hannah Montana to realize that.
The Anti-Self Defamation League
www.asdl.biz
October 28, 2009 8:27 PM | Reply | Permalink
Pay no heed to Internet Warrior Justin White. He is not only divorced for the Torah of light, but he's probably got his share of masculinity issues.
Not ad-hominem, just an observation.
For those sane voices devoted to the Mesora of the Jews - ethical behavior as commanded by the Holy One - and have not been corrupted by the two-hundred year old human idea of nationalism: Ken yirbu.
November 12, 2009 11:56 PM | Reply | Permalink
Gee, are we supposed to pay heed to Barnaby Yeh, a false "convert" (but true stalker) to Judianity who worships Tikun Olam Paganism? Does that "light" that you are talking about include gay marriage and other ridiculous things that the "conservative" movement supports? Does ethical behavior not include jealous tirades?
November 15, 2009 8:32 AM | Reply | Permalink