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Right on Joe!
"Ladies and gentlemen, your kitchen table is like mine. You sit there at night before you put the kids -- after you put the kids to bed and you talk, you talk about what you need. You talk about how much you are worried about being able to pay the bills. Well, ladies and gentlemen, that's not a worry John McCain has to worry about. It's a pretty hard experience. He'll have to figure out which of the seven kitchen tables to sit at."
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Hmmm... and Joe Biden (D - MBNA), who re-engineered our bankruptcy laws in favor of preadtory lenders is the one who is going to help them? It's laughable. And Reed, what were you posting about Biden at TPM back during the bankruptcy debate. It's amazing that this guy has been given such a pass around here.
August 23, 2008 8:00 PM | Reply | Permalink
What an idiot.
Let's gather up all the Bankruptcy Bill Litmus Test folks and all 6 of you can have a big party
August 23, 2008 9:56 PM | Reply | Permalink
Yeah, I guess some of us care about the legislation that is proposed and passed by our reps and the rest are, I dunno... you?
You're likely right that most people won't pay this issue any mind. But that just makes you part of the problem. Have fun, kiddo.
August 23, 2008 10:36 PM | Reply | Permalink
Destor,
sad to say, there are too many DLCers in the party. The Bankruptcy Bill sucked, but until the Liberals take the party back we're stuck with the DLC and their influence.
At the meoment here's our choice:
Republicans and trickle down economics
or
DLC and trickle down government.
August 24, 2008 2:36 PM | Reply | Permalink
Let's see if Obama comes out strong for reform of the Bankruptcy Law to give relief to working men and women, or at least to make it workable.
It is the single worst piece of legislation ever passed of which I am familiar. Don't believe me ask any bankruptcy judge or lawyer.
August 24, 2008 8:44 AM | Reply | Permalink
The bankruptcy bill ain't a litmus test in my mind but it's still a big strike against Biden. Destor, what kind of wine do you like? If you don't mind, I'm coming to your party . . .
August 24, 2008 7:20 PM | Reply | Permalink
Yeah, I couldn't help but chortle when Biden was talking about bills. Seeing as how Plastic Joe Biden (D-MBNA):
1. Championed the Bankruptcy Bill of 2006
2. Fought AGAINST keeping limits on excessive interest rates charged by Credit Card Cos.,
3. Fought AGAINST revoking the Universal Default rate (where, if you pay your heating bill late, your credit card interest rate can go sky-high, which is astonishing),
4. Fought AGAINST making exceptions for soldiers called up for duty
How in the HELL can Biden expect to be taken seriously by saying he understands what Americans are going through at the kitchen table?
Richardson would have been the better choice. Biden is an absolutely terrible choice for the so-called agent of change.
August 23, 2008 9:23 PM | Reply | Permalink
Remember which state Holy Joe is from. Delaware kowtows to corporations; would Joe do any less? Obama/Biden, a match made inside The Beltway!
August 24, 2008 12:25 PM | Reply | Permalink
Oh, I'm sorry! I thought that Senators who claim to fight for "The Little Guy" have a fineprint reading (*Unless Little Guy is getting anally raped by Delaware corporations)...
MY MISTAKE!
August 24, 2008 6:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
to be fair (and lord knows I am no Biden fan), the bankruptcy bill was Tom carper's baby (http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d109:SN00256:@@@P, hope the link works).
Biden supported the bill and was responsible for some shitty stuff, but this one was cooked up by Tom Carper and Charles Grassley.
August 25, 2008 3:51 PM | Reply | Permalink
Couldn't have made a better choice.
For the nitpickers and self righteous look on the bright side
All those votes you don't like?
Work your butts off to elect Obama-Biden
August 23, 2008 9:54 PM | Reply | Permalink
Great quote from HuffPo:
Obama/Biden: Two houses, two spouses.
August 23, 2008 10:08 PM | Reply | Permalink
This is a silly strategy. Why not point out that John McCain pays almost no taxes, has absolutely no mortgage payment, owns no cars and on 12 million dollars worth of housing available to him paid a total of 10,000.00 in property taxes. McCain is paid for his senate job and also holds a job as an employee of his wife's company.
Americans don't care if people are rich, but they do care if someone else is getting big tax breaks that the average guy doesn't get.
August 23, 2008 11:31 PM | Reply | Permalink
Almost no taxes? On $405k of income, he paid $188k of tax for a real rate of 40%. I'd wager that's more in taxes than you made last year and at least double the tax rate.
I wouldn't vote for McCain, but I really hate it when people substitute ignorance for virtue. He gets EXACTLY the same tax system the average guy gets.
The next time you are tempted to put up some unfounded nonsense look for documentation. If you can't find any, consider the Twain adage... It's better to keep quiet and thought a fool than speak and remove all doubt.
August 24, 2008 2:50 PM | Reply | Permalink
You including state and local taxes? According to CBS News, in 2007, McCain paid only $84,460 in federal taxes on income of $405,409. That's a federal tax rate of just 21%. Of course, Cindy McCain's tax returns have not been fully released. She did release a partial form for 2006 that showed about $1.7 million in federal taxes on an income of about $6.1 million--a tax rate of roughly 27%. These aren't particularly high tax rates, but then according to McCain, you're not wealthy unless you make more than $5 million, so apparently Cindy is barely out of the middle class and John nearly qualifies for welfare.
August 24, 2008 7:37 PM | Reply | Permalink
Purple,
lets not forget, McCain's also has a $100 million expense account :-)
August 25, 2008 9:08 AM | Reply | Permalink
Look at his tax returns for 2006 and 2007 and then I'll wait for your apology.
August 25, 2008 5:08 PM | Reply | Permalink
Excuse me? You're expecting an apology for saying McCain gets special tax breaks, when it's demonstrably not true? Dream on lady, you get no rewards for being wrong.
Nor for being lazy. I provided a cite and you didn't. So in order to check your assertion I've discovered three different reportings of McCains tax returns. Of the three this looks best, and reinforces my aversion to the Clinton News Network.
Perhaps you should reread the Twain adage I provided, obviously it didn't take the first time.
August 26, 2008 5:55 AM | Reply | Permalink
Agreed Destor.
But JohnMcCSF's choice is Obama, and Obama is better than McCain. Offensivetoyou—a far superior intellect than JohnMc—might be someone we try to debate with. You and I know Biden as an inside-the-beltway sellout on the Bankrupcy Bill. Clinton was a sell out on Welfare Reform. And so it goes.
We are awash in sellouts.
If you are not a sellout, you are lucky if you have a job in this town. Any job.
I do agree that here in the confines of the Cafe we don't need infantile worshipping of "the One".
I suggest that John Mc deploy himself at election central or at Huffington Post or other cheerleading sites.
August 23, 2008 11:52 PM | Reply | Permalink
Huffington Post is definitely not a pro-McCain site. Far from it! They are pro-Obama and have been for as long as I can remember.
August 24, 2008 12:41 PM | Reply | Permalink
I never implied that Huff Post is a McCain site. What gave you that idea?
I said that it is a cheerleading site.
I might be wrong but I think TPM cafe is a little above cheerleading.
August 24, 2008 10:50 PM | Reply | Permalink
The credit card issue is a bit irritating. I pay my cards off in full every month yet every so often a payment arrives late and suddenly, for three months anything I charge accrues interest. It is a scam. When I complain, they basically say tough. Have you ever noticed there is no cancel date on the post mark of a credit card bill. How do you know when they sent it. I do not know about Team Obama/Biden. Biden was a safe choice for sure. I think the title of the Daily Gallup says it all: http://www.gallup.com/poll/109783/Biden-Does-Harm-May-Help-Much.aspx
But I do not know what to make of the number at http://www.bop-o-rama.com. If this is the "Biden Bounce" we have a lot to worry about in November.
August 24, 2008 11:42 AM | Reply | Permalink
First of all, the 72% who say it will not affect their vote are people who have already made up their minds, like me for instance. And the 7% who say that it makes them NOT want to vote for Obama most likely had their minds made up as well. How could a VP choice change minds that were already made up? If 14% say it makes them want to vote for Obama, I say, "Welcome to the party!"
And don't forget the huge voting base that only have cell phones. None of them is in this polling "n" out there. How many republicans don't have land lines? Anwer: I don't know, but there are more Obama voters who have only cells; I am sure of that.
PS: The other maddening thing about credit cards is that for those who don't pay the balance every month, the minimum payment is WAY too small. That encourages overwhelming debt among people who don't manage their finances well. My advice to you is to check your balances online and pay online as well. I love the fact that I get a free loan every month from VISA & Mastercard and they still send me new offers at least twice a week!
August 24, 2008 12:53 PM | Reply | Permalink
Not with Bank of America. They charge a "minimum finance chage" of $1.50 even if the balance is paid in full every month.
The 1.5-3 percent of EVER TRANSACTION that they get, and the substantial interest that they get from their favorite customers (balance-carriers) IS NOT ENOUGH for these leeches.
August 24, 2008 2:08 PM | Reply | Permalink
I can't believe the stuff I read on political sites. Not just here or on Free Republic but everywhere. It's just so low.
Am I supposed to believe that Ted Kennedy had to worry about paying his bills? Or John Kerry? or Al Gore? or JFK? or FDR?
Clinton and Reagan came from humble beginnings. Did that make them better representatives of the lower classes than any of those I first named?
The level of discourse these days is pathetic. I remember a much higher level during JFK's Presidency...but I suspect it was an illusion which overwhelmed me because I was young and inexperienced.
August 24, 2008 9:11 PM | Reply | Permalink
Those are good points, OTY.
These two candidates are already Senators. So they're already more exposed to corporate executives and their lobbyists than to average people. As you say, Clinton and Reagan came from humble origins. By the time they were in the White House both had been governors and governors don't live the lives of average folk.
I guess it's a bit much to expect that people at the highest levels of government have much in common with us. I think that you and I disagree about whether or not that's a good thing (or maybe we only disagree about how bad a thing it is) but at least we both know that whether it's "arugula at Whole Foods" or "My wife's taxes," that these guys are just not living lives that resemble the average.
August 24, 2008 11:10 PM | Reply | Permalink
What's all this about a rugula at Whole Foods?
Zabar's! You have to go to Zabar's.
August 25, 2008 12:13 AM | Reply | Permalink
You're from my town, hypnotic eye!
August 25, 2008 1:38 AM | Reply | Permalink
@ Ellen, Destor23
I want that rugelach! To hell with the poor! Let them eat...whatever it is they eat. And there you have it, Destor. Politics and economics in less than a paragraph.
August 25, 2008 4:37 AM | Reply | Permalink
@ Ellen, Destor23
How Obama Reconciles Dueling Views on Economy
This is the most intelligent, comprehensive, clear explanation of the problems facing the economy and the choices each candidate must make. It's also made me think seriously about voting for Obama, instead of not voting.
This guy Leonhardt, along with Noriel Roubini, Robert Rubin, Robert Reich, and Warren Buffett should be debating the issues on TPMCafe. Not that would be a debate worth following.
August 25, 2008 10:46 AM | Reply | Permalink
Oh give me a break, you whiner. The level of discourse is where the Republicans put it. You don't like it, go complain to them.
August 26, 2008 8:36 PM | Reply | Permalink
@ BGValdron
Aww, poor baby. Those mean old Republicans have all the fun...and you can't do anything about it. Maybe mommy can help.
August 26, 2008 9:06 PM | Reply | Permalink
Biden is not running on his issues. He is running to support the policies of Barrack Obama. Biden is the pit bull who smack down all the nonsense coming from the Right wingnuts suffering from Cerebral Posterior Insertion!!
August 26, 2008 3:44 AM | Reply | Permalink