Not to mention the pollution.

you was at the 1938 Olympics ???

that musta been some hell of a show

the 1936 Olympics was in Berlin, and the 1940 Olympics was canceled

where was those "1938 Olympics held again ???

you could at least look up the fucking date the next time you decide to create some false memories

makes ya look a little more credible

never try to bullshit a bullshitter

That wasn't the point,Did you or did you not see our appeaser President? This was better than the 1936 Olympics because they don't have to go to war with us to take our country. Nixon started the Mortgage procedure and Bush was their to hand over the keys. The Chinese were so grateful they gave the world this spectacular party.

Dear China,

Do whatever the heck you want.

Love,
The World

PS One reason Bhutan is great is that Bhutan doesn't even want the trouble of ever hosting the Olympics. New York City is similar in that regard. Mayor Bloomberg really wanted to host some games. But nobody who lived here wanted the hassle. Since we have the most byzantine zoning, real estate and event planning laws around it was easy to stop him.

....try polling 1.3 billion Chinese and ask them what they think....

I've never been there. All I know is what I read on the Intertubes. Looks like a classic colonial/settler process of making indigenous cultures disappear, in this case by absorption and attrition rather than by extermination.

C.V. has posted no counter-argument, but has posted links which include following:

* "Despite reports of police shootings and arrests at a protest demanding Uighur independence on March23, the world has paid little notice. . .Such repression ranges from vetting imams and closing mosques to executions and the detention of thousands of people every year, it claims."

Comment: People wanting independence from their country better be prepared to fight and die for it, because they will be given the opportunity. Is there any recollection of Yankee aggression against the Southern states when they demanded independence and seceded? Of the people and cultures of the South being destroyed? As for executions and imprisonment, the U.S. leads the world. It has more people in prison than China, which has four times the US's population. And executions are a forte of the U.S. -- remember how Clinton okayed the execution of a mentally impaired man to enhance his tough-on-crime creds, and Bush has taken delight in executions.

* "The number one grievance, however, has been China’s occupation of Tibet and the oppression of its local inhabitants."

Comment: Tibet is recognized by the US to be a part of China, which Tibetans are protesting in spite of the Dalai Lama's non-approval. Good luck.

* ". . .human rights abuses directly related to these Games, including the forced eviction of Chinese citizens from their homes to make way for new Olympic venues, the exploitation of migrant workers who built these venues, and the jailing of activists who courageously denounced such abuses."

Comment: Come on, ever heard of eminent domain? It's alive and well in the U.S., too, and if you protest the city's taking of your home for a new freeway or shopping center then prepare to see some blue uniforms.

Bottom line-- there is no basis for the statement: "Peoples and cultures in Western China are being destroyed," which is why C.A. had no counter on this point.

Don,
Northern aggression? Please..... Guess you never heard of "Border Ruffians" trying to convert new states to slave states.

I think what we're trying to get at is cultural changes which are real and do occur whether by creep of by force. It does happen and is happening all the time. Many Tibetans desire independence, as do some other regions in China, but I hardly see anything new here. I also don't see any reason to deny these feelings are real. There is a basis for the statement, even if the concepts are vague. Are the destruction of these cultures being actively pursued? I doubt it is in any conscious manner. But cultures do loose their cultural identities.
(I used to live in Shang Hai)

Ahhhh...time for the Olympics again. Every 4 years the world gets together for athletic competition. In the past the Olympic spirit was one where amateur athletes got together to compete for no other reason than to see who is the best. All are welcome equally to compete no matter where they called home, the color of their skin, their ethnicity or their religion.

But alas that spirit is dead. Professional athletes are now being used (Jim Thorpe was stripped of his medals for a semi pro baseball stint) and the Olympic Rings represent nothing more than a corporate marketing logo. And now countries want to host it not as much out of national pride but more so the money that can be made off of these athletes. Does China 'deserve' this economic opportunity? Do they believe in the equality supposedly embodied by the 'Olympic Spirit'? They are making progress but they probably are not deserving at this point in time. But neither was Nazi Germany when Berlin hosted the games in 1936 or the USSR when Moscow hosted the games in 1980. Then again this is coming from a citizen of a country that is trying to conclude an unprovoked war of aggression we are currently involved in. But I guess in this new world of the global marketplace where freedom is measured by earning capacity, making money trumps human rights.

So let the games...errrrrrr...advertisements begin, in a joyous celebration of the world coming together in order to see who is the best...ummmmm I mean...how much profit can be made!!!

People lose their cultural identities when Hollywood, Madison Avenue, and Clear Channel take over their movies, TV, and radio. And when their stores and restaurants are forced to close by Walmart and McDonalds. But we are not allowed to talk/think about that.

Bhutan was known, under the monarchy, as The Land of the Thunder Dragon. Now they will be known as -- The Land of the Happy Dragon? Something was lost.

More from an expert on China: (Did I remember to tell everyone that I have been there?) China is made up of many cultures, to the point where the language spoken in Shanghai isn't the same as that spoken in Xian or Beijing. While I was there earning my expertise, I was told not to worry about mispronouncing the names of the cities, since the pronunciation is different depending on where in China we were. Chinese people can't even emigrate from one area of China to another, without official approval - just like Mexicans can't emigrate here. And, they do it anyway, just as Mexicans do the same.

My next learned lecture will be at this same time tomorrow.

"Intertubes"

hahhahahaha

Peoples and cultures in Western China are being destroyed. Probably with less lethality than that visited upon the indigenous people of the Americas by European colonists.

Hmm... might want to mention that to survivors of the violence in Xinjiang over the weekend. Your comparison may be breathtakingly dated, but I'm sure the thought behind it with will cheer them up.

Face it: China is a powder keg. As has been noted on this thread, it's home to over 50 ethic groups, and, no, they don't always rub elbows amid the blooming flowers of wondrous proletarian harmony.

Another pressure point is its contradictory economic framework; prospects aren't good for a long run. This mix of limited free-market capitalism and backward ideological oppression is less oil and water than gasoline and phosphorous. At some point, inflexibility at the top is going to crunch economic volatility in the middle.

The genie is out of the bottle, and the Chinese, now acquainted with some semblance of free enterprise and open exchanges of ideas, will only want more. All the dormant conflagration will need for ignition is an orthodox Marxist attempt to roll back the political clock. And a Chinese civil war will make the Mideast’s ever-roiling reality look like "Meercat Manor".

Excellent back and forth between BevD, Reece and the late arriving San Fernando Curt.

thanks.

BevD, As someone who has visited China and talked to the Chinese from various cities, I'd say you're far closer to the truth than the naysayers. The country has massive problems, inefficiencies, corruption, the central government battling the provincial governments, it's extremely heterogeneous even though it is perceived as a monolithic, fascistic entity functioning in lock-step by most Americans.

We don't blame Democratic senators for the crimes of Abu Ghraib, for example, yet we lay the blame of anything amiss on a single entity, China, when there have always been different forces struggling within the country, some corrupt and criminal, some nationalistic, belligerent and xenophobic but also reform-minded internationalists whom I feel are in the majority.

There's a lot of propaganda about China, lots of unfounded horror stories, eg. organ-harvesting, not unlike the "babies-snatched-from-incubators" gambit. I don't really blame anyone having a warped view of China, I had the same misconceptions until I visited the country for myself, including Tibet. It's not a perfect society by any means, and I won't want to live there, the Chinese are quite money-minded, but it is far more normal than most of us think.

In order to truly understand the country, you need to visit, as some have posted here, or have an open conversation with some real life Chinese, eg. foreign students who have seen and experienced both sides.