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The Conservatives' Conundrum -- and Ours

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What has gotten into George Packer? In Blood of the Liberals he undertook a wrenching examination of American liberalism's agonies and ironies; and in The Assassin's Gate and his play Betrayed, he bore searing, humbling witness to the ordeals of Americans and Iraqis who wouldn't have written for themselves.

Yet Packer's New Yorker account of "The Fall of Conservatism" gives us only voices of people who make their livings making phrases that describe and influence that vast majority of Americans who don't make their livings that way.

Since I, too, turn phrases for money and political deliverance, I count it a gift of the gods. But I was always under the impression that writers in a democracy should help non-writing people to speak for themselves, not just have them spoken about.

That should be so even in the New Yorker, which exists to present the American people to bemused collectors of unearned income and Steuben glass and to the intelligent recent college graduate who for some reason wants to be like them and is therefore seeking "the most comfortable and least compromising attitude he can assume toward capitalist society without being forced into actual conflict," as the critic Robert Warshow once wrote about the typical reader of... yes, the New Yorker.

I don't see how anyone can assess conservatism's travails without confronting readers seriously with some of the new twists in capitalism, but Packer manages it by talking mainly to members of the chattering classes. They would be the last to tell us that conservatives can't reconcile their demands for ordered, civic-republican liberty with their impotence amid riptides of laissez faire capitalism that distort and disrupt every tradition they cherish.

There is plenty of unpaid, unpublished testimony about this out there, yet Packer talks to virtually no one who is actually trying to hold American conservatism together in a church basement, polling station, think-tank boiler room or even executive suite.
Instead, we hear Pat Buchanan, David Frum, David Brooks, George Will, David Brooks, Sam Tanenhaus, David Brooks, Ross Douthat, and Reihan Salam, an editor, with Douthat, at The Atlantic who once worked for David Brooks. (As you may have guessed, Packer quotes Brooks far more often than anyone else.)

There are also quotations from the work of advocacy historians Rick Perlstein and Sean Wilentz and from conservative politicians, living and dead. But I find only the equivalent of a photo op (politicians call it a "drop in") with actual non-writing conservatives -- in Martin County, Kentucky, where Packer was watching John McCain give a speech.

Packer makes some interesting observations about conservative politicos' talent for displacing people's pains into resentments of others, but he seems especially keen to reopen polite (or not-so-polite) liberal society to Brooks. That highly intelligent and peculiarly serpentine writer has charmed and misled many good people I know, and Packer lets him slide sinuously away from much of what he has written in the Times and in conservative publications for nearly two decades.

It can be interesting and even admirable to follow a sea-change in one's own or someone else's thinking, but when Packer wrote that "Brooks left movement journalism and, in 2003, became a moderately conservative columnist for the Times," I sensed immediately that on reading further I would be assisting at the embarrassing, wrenching political makeover and public repositioning which Brooks has been attempting for two years now from his pew in the bare, ruined choir that is the paper's op ed page.

"I feel estranged" from conservatism; "I don't feel it's true, fundamentally true," Brooks tells Packer, who catches the pass, explaining, for Brooks, that "In the eighties, when he was a young movement journalist," conservatives' "attacks on regulation and the Soviet Union seemed 'true'. Now most conservatives.... are stuck in the past, in the dogma of limited government. Perhaps for that reason," Packer advises us, Brooks, the endearingly passionate truth-seeker, has moved on.

But has he? Or is he just pirouetting? Soon after joining the Times in 2003 Brooks gave a long, ingratiating interview to George Gurley of The New York Observer, replete with his typically stagey self-deprecations and stand-up comic lines about being a pitiable conservative idealist, marooned at snarky liberal dinner parties in Washington and New York.

Brooks told Gurley that as a liberal student he'd been crushed by Milton Friedman in a debate and had realized then that there were other ways of looking at the world. Gurley asked Brooks if he could "ever become a leftist again."

"Sometimes I do think that," he said. "If I was with the Nation left, I'd be depressed. If I was with the centrist-Joe Lieberman left, I'd be happy." With that, the interview ended, to be continued by George Packer five years later.

I myself had some hopes for Lieberman as Al Gore's running mate back in 2000, but Brooks wasn't casting any shy, admiring glances then at that "centrist Joe-Lieberman left." He was busy being a movement journalist for George Bush and his running mate, Dick Cheney.

As late as last year, our supposed apostate from conservative journalism was still busy defending Karl Rove and Scooter Libby. It was Lieberman who had moved Brooks' way after 9/11, when both became early advocates of war with Iraq. But Lieberman is no longer received in polite New Yorker society. So why is Brooks?

Because he is more thoughtful than political, in Packer's estimation. Packer reports his expectation that only after conservatives "big defeat" this November will they undertake any serious re-thinking: "I have not yet seen the major think tanks reorient themselves.... You go to Capitol Hill - Republican senators know they're fucked.... But they don't know what to do. There's a hunger for new policy ideas."

That may be true, but what, really, are Brooks' new ideas? He'll tell you that he's more a "comic sociologist" or "cultural anthropologist" than a policy analyst; and that's true, too. But what does that portend for Packer's subject? Might Brooks abandon the idea-less John McCain? In 2004, he worked mightily to re-elect the idea-less and dangerous Bush, lampooning the long lines of Volvo-driving liberal consultants queuing up to shape John Kerry's "brain of sculpted marshmallow."

In an unforgettable Washington Monthly essay in June of that year, Nicholas Confessore detailed Brooks' maddening habit of oscillating between hard-nosed journalism and conservative-movement hackery. In the first kind of column, Confessore noted, Brooks will do some serious reporting or chin-stroking, sounding for all the world like a disinterested public savant. In the next, he'll gyrate and propagandize shamelessly for movement conservatives, the Bush administration, or both.

I've done a little research on this myself. In 2004, Brooks complained that from the start of the Iraq War, "Chicken Littles like Ted Kennedy... were ranting that Iraq is another Vietnam," and "Pundits and sages were spinning a whole series of mutually exclusive disaster scenarios: Civil war! A nationwide rebellion!" Brooks urged Americans to "get a grip" and trust the warmakers, not their critics.

Yet two years later, Brooks revealed the opposite -- that while "Everybody denigrates pundits and armchair generals, the smartest of them recognized as early as 2004 that the US was ... in the first days of a guerrilla war" and that "it was time to shelve the rosy scenarios." Brooks excoriated not the Chicken Littles this time but Donald Rumsfeld and Tommy Franks and other butt-covering insiders for seeing nothing fundamentally wrong in 2004 and for refusing to heed the critics.

Yet Brooks himself had been denigrating those same critics at that time on behalf of the insiders, calling Kennedy "to the left of [Syria's] Bashr Al Assad" for doubting progress in Iraq. This year, he wrote, in the portentous manner he reserves for his highest hypocrisies, that Kennedy "has served [the Senate] with more distinction than anyone else now living." Brooks didn't explain why -- or even that -- he'd changed his mind.

Like a weather vane snapping back and forth in a storm, Brooks produced wildly varied columns throughout the 2006 campaigns. One touted Barack Obama's deliberative mind and Periclean prospects. Another defended right-wing pro-life zealot Rick Santorum as a philosopher king whose "discussion of the philosopher Alasdair MacIntyre... is as sophisticated as anything in Barack Obama's recent book."

In another 2006 column Brooks heralded the end of ideology and piously urged a new civility in public discourse, while yet another column demonstrated his mastery of such discourse by characterizing Ned Lamont's "vicious," "Sunni-Shiite style of politics," whose "flamers... tell themselves their enemies are so vicious they have to be vicious, too." In an election post-mortem, Brooks crowed that Lieberman had "defeated the scion of the Daily Kos net roots, Ned Lamont."

All this variety isn't intelligent complexity, much less comity. It's sophistry, driven by an odd desperation which Packer airbrushes away.

To his credit, Brooks was rattled deeply by conservatives' incompetence and cynicism in the wake of Hurricane Katrina, and the Republican Party's bottomless corruption, not least in Iraq, demoralized him. But Packer says nothing about this. He doesn't ask Brooks to account for his constant backing and forthing.

Reading on in his article, I couldn't help thinking of Packer and Brooks as monkeys grooming each another in a corner of the Chattering Classes' Zoo. An endearing image, no doubt, but why would anyone rely on monkeys who are grooming each other for insights into what has become of the conservative movement?

Perhaps Packer means to signal that this is what has become of it, all this stroking and stoking of emotions with phrase-turning instead of policymaking, a pattern that goes back, he tells us, to Buchanan's shrewd political advice to Richard Nixon. Even New Yorker readers deserve better, though, and with more due diligence, Packer wouldn't have given Brooks the floor without making him account more truly for his thinking as well as his movement's.

Doing that might have yielded some insights into the conflict between civic-republican conviction and escapist corporate-consumption that is raging not only within conservatism but also within liberalism and, indeed, within the American soul. Pending a deeper reckoning, most of our writers will remain in the default position sketched well in Robert Warshow's observation, in 1947:

"The New Yorker has always dealt with experience not by trying to understand it but by prescribing the attitude to be adopted toward it. This makes it possible to feel intelligent without thinking, and it is a way of making everything tolerable, for the assumption of a suitable attitude toward experience can give one the illusion of having dealt with it adequately. The gracelessness of capitalism becomes an entirely external phenomenon, a spectacle that one can observe without being touched - above all, without feeling really threatened."


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Yet Packer's New Yorker account of "The Fall of Conservatism" gives us only voices of people who make their livings making phrases that describe and influence that vast majority of Americans who don't make their livings that way.
Since I, too, turn phrases for money and political salvation, I count it a labor of the gods. But I was always under the impression that writers in a democracy should help non-writing people to speak for themselves, not just have them spoken about.

OK, you're both pundits. Way to belabor two grafs for nothing. Followed by umpteen further grafs of navel spelunking.

Sleeper's gift is to make Bob Novak seem an original thinker, Tom Friedman seem exacting and factual, and both are positively laconic by comparison.

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btw, I'm neither a doctor nor Bill Frist, but I have to wonder if Sleeper's thyroid has been medically checked out recently.

In all sincerity, he reminds me of another writer. The simplest discussion with him was guaranteed to be endlessly and needlessly filigreed and obscure, like his writing. Aesop's Fables could have been intercut with them and nobody would have noticed. His mind still worked, he loved language, but he just rambling and was unfocused.

He spoke slowly and even his laugh went "ha (pause) haha (pause) ahem" with breaths in between. It drove people around him, including his family, absolutely bonkers.

Then, his thyroid condition was diagnosed and he began medication. Bang. Overnight a changed person. Easily took 20 years off his perceived age.

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The next ideas are easy to find.

1) True social libertarianism. You can do anything you want so long as you're a consenting adult and are not directly harming somebody who doesn't or can't dissent. This means the legalization of all victimless crimes.

2) Economic justice. The government doesn't let people suffer at the whims of uncaring markets, ever.

That's it. The two new ideas that both liberals and conservatives need to really move things forward.

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These seem like deeply incompatible impulses to me destor23. When people are free to do whatever they want so long as they are not directly hurting others, what they end up doing are a lot of things that accumulate to generate very significant indirect harms. Included among these behaviors are patterns and systems of production and exchange that are those very uncaring, whimsical markets of which you speak.

That unregulated activity naturally leads to high levels of variegation and inequality among human beings. Social and economic equality are not the natural conditions of human beings left to their own devices, anymore than well-ordered arrangements of flowers and hedges of equal height and health are the natural result of untended and unmanaged plant growth.

There are some large social purposes and achievements, and kinds of individual human excellence and flourishing, that can't be expected to just emerge from the weakly regulated hubbub of individual human being pursuing their own individual whims. To achieve these purposes, human activity needs to be rationally ordered toward deliberately chosen ends, and it needs to be regulated and governed since people don't stick to large and complex plans when they are left to follow their whims and individual interests without any measure of coercion. To cultivate and achieve the highest levels of existence of which human beings are capable, you need social arrangements in which people don't always get to do what they want to do, even if they would not be directly hurting others by doing those things.

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Right. Those are the problems, and there are plenty others.

Destor suggests "true social libertarianism." Well he's libertarian leaning. But what does that mean? Who knows? It's truly hollow sloganeering. People's liberties can't be so easily disentangled. some like Ron Paul, most think he's goofy.

There's no bumper sticker solution to today's complex and interwoven problems.

We truly are heading into a "post ideological" era where issues must be hashed out and dealt with practically, rather than as part of grand ideological movements of intellectually laziness.

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Don't agree that we're in a "post idealogical" era. But even saying so seems like the very "hollow sloganeering" that you're accusing me of.

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Actually, what I just said is we're heading into a post ideological era i.e. we're not entirely there. But, generally, yes, we're moving past some of the ideological divides that dominated the 20th century where a single word, such as libertarianism, capitalism, socialism, etc was automatically the answer to all problems for various advocacy groups.

You say that's also just a slogan, which is pretty obtuse, and seems to indicate you don't know what the term means.

Post ideological essentially means pragmatic. Pragmatism is a means of analysis, not a cookie cutter solution the way ideologies such as "laissez faire" or "marxism" are.

In fact, most of the developed world is far more post ideological and pragmatic, having both more developed social programs where appropriate, and more vigorous market competition where appropriate. Such as Europe's various healthcare plans, while also more vigorously prosecuting anti-trust such as cases against Microsoft, while also subsidizing industries in the national interest while heavily regulating them, such as French nuclear power generation and regional organic farming.

Personal favorite examples of pragmatism are South Korean deployment of broadband, or European wireless standardization. Both leap frogged US networks via of combination of standardization, rapid deployment with subsidies to initially nurture the grwoth of a self sustaining profitable industry generating tax revenue and with robust competition to maintain long term competativness and innovation. European cellular and S Korean broadband leapfrogged us with such smart polices.

That's a great example of post ideological solutions which bring various elements together towards a common goal, finding enormous optimizations in the details. As a metaphor, ideologically we're moving from the bronze age (where everything was bronze) to the alloys and composites age where you invent the material for the job if need be.

The problem with that Kozmik is that FIRST you have to identify what the problem is and in order to do that you have to look at the world through some, even if feeble, ideological/moral lens.

You seem to believe that there is some obvious ( to you) way things should be and it is only because all these navel gazers (as you call them) detract from the obvious and introduce complexity where there is none, that things just don't get done.

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No, I don't agree with that. In fact I think it's compeltely backwards.

Basic goals are rather obvious. The work is almost entirely in getting there.

At the founding of the US there were many obvious and shared goals. However, there was also a great deal of disagreement. Only by hashing out matters were they eventually able to proclaim they were unified in support of "liberty, justice, equality" and define those terms. Prior to that, they were empty phrases just as easily claimed by the British.

And the definition of "liberty, justice, equality" are continually changing so that each generation may buy in to them.

Our most fundamental goal as a democracy remains to do whatever a majority of people consider good, after factoring in debate, consensus, common interest, long term and secondary implications, etc. One has to look at issues on an individual basis and deal with complexity FIRST.

Injecting the language of ideology, such as "libertarianism" tends to reduce issues to slogans, often doing more harm than good. Often producing policies counterproductive to stated goals, having failed in due diligence. It's a form of intellectual laziness.

For example, libertarianism and laissez faire ideologically endorses "free markets" supposedly for the promotion of liberty. In fact, wholly "free" and deregulated markets promote concentration of power and wealth, undermining liberty immensely with centers of capital power soon becoming coercive oligarchies. NAFTA for example has resulted in a concentration of wealth and undermined the bargaining power of labor, and hence undermined quality of life issues like economic security and education, which are ultimately vital to securing democracy and liberty.

The mirror image being the ideology of communism, supposed to promote equality by sharing everything. In reality of course it also quickly becomes coercive and produces totalitarianism.

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As I was saying earlier, various ideologies are a bit like the stone age or iron age. Pragmatic solutions to problems are more like polymers and alloys. We can't simply recommend stone or iron for all projects, especially not when we have the capability to tailor make alloys and polymers to fit the job.

Only disingenuous purveyors of iron and stone would recommend them as solutions to all problems, seeking to short circuit the process.

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To cultivate and achieve the highest levels of existence of which human beings are capable, you need social arrangements in which people don't always get to do what they want to do, even if they would not be directly hurting others by doing those things.

Though, that's getting rather out there, beyond the stratosphere, into the rarefied air which Jim Sleeper inhabits.

I don't think seat belts, or environmental dumping and degradation, or regulating accounting practices to prevent ENRON, are really all that hard to grok. Regulating trade so countries like China aren't allowed to wage economic war upon us by dumping large quantities of goods at cut prices to undermine our economy, while US companies sell us out, it's not that hard to understand.

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I'm not sure what you mean. I thought the ideas I was expressing were fairly commonplace, so if they seem too "out there" I must not have expressed them clearly enough.

Here is the central claim, re-expressed:

It is possible for a group of people to live in such a way that, though no individual in the group ever directly harms another individual, the sum total of their activity nevertheless (i) produces significant social harms or evils affecting many people, and (ii) fails to produce some very significant social and individual goods that could otherwise have been produced had the behavior of the members of the group been more highly regulated and directed.

Thus, in order to achieve the best society we can reasonably hope to achieve, it is not enough to follow the libertarian prescription of prohibiting only those activities in which some people directly harm some other people. There are some important goods that can only be achieved, end evils that can only be avoided, through human coordination and cooperation on a scale that requires rational long-term planning and organization, and some measure of coercive government.

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Right, i got your point. I'm just saying that we shouldn't get to "out there" talking about optimizing society in highbrow theoretical talk.

Most of this stuff is actually pretty common sense. If anything we've let sophistic ideological debates muddy the waters too much, producing enormous log jams. Issues are tough enough without dragging ideological baggage into them.

For example, South Korea wanted, and got, a top notch broadband internet deployment fulfilling these goals:

1) privately owned and operated so it's not government's headache

2) thriving and fair market competition so as to promote innovation and consumer choice

3) promoting egalitarianism via widespread deployment and availability at affordable rates.

4) generating tax revenue, stimulating growth, and promoting quality of life.

5) to leapfrog competitors.

6) long term sustainability and promoting innovation.


All of those goals, pretty much no brainers. Socialists might debate #1, and there are some economic arguments for natural monopolies, but a clear majority would probably not have it be the governments job, at least not while it's such an innovative industry relying on bottom>up intellectual ferment. The rest, really not debated amongst the vast majority of folks.

If you look at how SKorea accomplished those goals, that's the interesting part.

They did so with a rather beautiful and elegant combination of policies from a post ideological tool box. Some regulatory and subsidy measures borrowed the benefits of a command economy. The innovation and competition of markets was fully tapped and any anti-competitive efforts squashed. National interest goals, both social and economic, overlapped and were jointly accomplished for the long term prosperity.

Frankly, it's a truly beautiful and elegant solution they chose. That's the sort of policies we need. And that's what we used to be capable of, taking the space program for example.

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Dan, I of course agree with you that social and economic inequality aren't natural states. But I don't think that an ideal of social freedom and economic equality are necessarily at odds.

I'm talking about truly letting people do what they want sexually, artistically, aesthetically and then just making sure that people have access to the country's wealth and resources.

Seems like you could legalize all victimless crimes and make the tax code more progressive and be mostly there.

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I'm talking about truly letting people do what they want sexually ...

Does that include having babies with whomever they want, and under any circumstances they want?

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Yeah, I'm fine with people having babies (or not having babies) with whomever they want so long as they're consenting adults.

Destor
That's "Old Left" thinking in my opinion.

Obama gave a Father's Day speech in which he pretty forcefully stated that having babies any fool can do. What is required is being a father and bringing up those babies to become productive and responsible human beings.


We--whose inclinations are progressive--need to abandon the notion that total individual liberty can and should coexist with a just society. Unfortunately human nature has a dark side that needs to be kept in check.

So I'm saying that we should be aiming at maximizing the better angels in our nature and discouraging the demons. It is an essential task civilization. If you want total freedom for the individual you have to go all the way and be an anarchist.

It is a matter of balance. Where to strike it is the trick.

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I wouldn't even call it "old left" so much as just good ole intellectual laziness, and rather ideological unthinking.

Destor
That's "Old Left" (re. our time) thinking in my opinion.

Obama gave a Father's Day speech in which he pretty forcefully stated that having babies any fool can do. What is required is being a father and bringing up those babies to become productive and responsible human beings.


We--whose inclinations are progressive--need to abandon the notion that total individual liberty can and should coexist with a just society. Unfortunately human nature has a dark side that needs to be kept in check.

So I'm saying that we should be aiming at maximizing the better angels in our nature and discouraging the demons. It is an essential task of civilization. If you want total freedom for the individual you have to go all the way and be an anarchist.

It is a matter of balance. Where to strike it is the trick.

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There are some large social purposes and achievements, and kinds of individual human excellence and flourishing, that can't be expected to just emerge from the weakly regulated hubbub of individual human being pursuing their own individual whims. To achieve these purposes, human activity needs to be rationally ordered toward deliberately chosen ends, and it needs to be regulated and governed since people don't stick to large and complex plans when they are left to follow their whims and individual interests without any measure of coercion.

I have followed your comments for several years now and had no idea you were such an authoritarian or such a visionary. Large social purposes? Rationally-ordered human activity? Coercion to follow large and complex plans? Shades of Stalin, Mao and Pol Pot! So 20th century.

The problem with grand plans and pruning people to achieve them is that social dominators, people who think they know best, end up deciding what to achieve and how people should be. Frankly, the track record of this sort of governing is not very good.

I acknowledge that I tend more libertarian (note the small l) than any other point on the political compass but that is because its opposite pole is authoritarian. I am definitely anti-authoritarian because I realized long ago that under any really strict authoritarian system, I would be one of the first ones on a train or in a killing field and all authoritarian systems end up being strict ones. Maybe that is why your comments alarmed me.

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I forgot to add that big-L Libertarians are not any more appealing. They may not bother to kill you but are perfectly willing to let you die if you can't keep up.

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Shades of Stalin, Mao and Pol Pot! So 20th century.

Oh come on. I'm not talking about totalitarian schemes for total human perfection. I'm not proposing gulags, purges of enemies of the state, re-education camps or fully planned economies. I'm not calling for any dictatorships of the proletariat, or revolutionary committees or vanguards. And I'm not calling for the absolute collectivization of everything. This is the sort of hysterical, paranoid anti-government fanaticism one expects from the radical right and followers of Ayn Rand.

But I do believe, along with most of what was traditionally called the "left", that a lot of important achievements in this world require vigorous activist government, and some measure of rational planning and organization. I also believe that the maintenance of a moral order, regulated reciprocity and cultivated standards or behavior is responsible for the fruits of what we call "civilization". I am not part of that post-Reagan, post-Clinton neoliberal generation that is enamored of the magical power of free markets. I don't think everything good in this world simply emerges from the random, radically de-centralized, self-interested pleasure seeking of individuals looking out for number one. And I'm no libertarian or anarchist (or "libertarian socialist" or anarcho-syndicalist") who believes law and coercion are unalloyed evils, and that if we somehow ended coercive government, everyone would naturally fall into natural, cooperative patters of harmonious voluntarism.

The capture of the left by libertarianism thinking, with its inordinate fixations on private sphere freedoms and sexual liberties, is in my view responsible for the historical neutralization and defeat of the left, and several decades of right-wing ascendancy, social atomization and rising inequality. If you want to preserve an inegalitarian society, there is no better way to do it than to get people to ignore everything pertaining to social cohesion, community interaction, disciplined long-term social plans and collective projects, and get them to focus entirely on what drugs they are free to take, what toys they are free to buy and what bodies they are free to screw.

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Yeah. Saying any sort of social common agenda is akin to Maoism, that's just goofy.

A great example of why I dislike ideological simpletons on both sides. They're mirror images.

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Well, I don't think everyone I disagree with is a simpleton.

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Neither do I, nor did I say that. Some certainly are though.

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Dan...

As I said, I have followed your posts and comments here at the Cafe for several years and more often than not agree with your views. I thought at first to simply ask you for illustrations but the part of your comment I quoted did disturb me, not least because I thought maybe I had misjudged you previously. Thanks for the clarification.

I am hardly anti-government since I continue to believe, perhaps, naively, that we, the people are the government, that as citizens, we have duties and obligations as well as rights and that we should choose our representatives with more care than we've been doing for the past half-century.

I am not against activist government as long as it is competent but prefer persuasion to coercion and a broad consensus for major programs or new laws. A broad consensus usually provides all the coercion that is needed to maintain moral order and standards of behavior. The hard part is accomodating rational and respectful challenges.

It is really a shame that radical free marketeers have arrogated the libertarian label to themselves. They have discredited the name much like the overly pc left and the social libertarians you describe have discredited the liberal brand.

Berkely Breathed ("Bloom County", "Opus") was asked about his politics and said this: "If you'll read the subtext for many of those old strips, you'll find the heart of an old-fashioned Libertarian. And I'd be a Libertarian, if they weren't all a bunch of tax-dodging professional whiners."

I agree with Berkely.

There seems to be change in perspective among some of the younger libertarians recently. A few days ago Will Wilkerson was pointing out that Hayek was in favor of a guaranteed minimum income and not nearly as anti-government as he is generally portrayed. Several others including Megan McArdle formerly known as Jane Galt have recognized the possibility of useful government programs. And it was a recent guest here, Brink Lindsay, who wrote about Liberaltarianism in TNR 12/06. I think I remember your telling Brink exactly what you thought of his philosophy but I don't think you knew he had been rethinking it.

I think we may have to accept that Randian libertarianism is very appealing to twenty somethings. Fortunately most of the brighter ones grow out of it.

I have followed your comments for several years now and had no idea you were such an authoritarian

Everybody except for the anarchist is an authoritarian to some degree or another. All governments are intrinsically coercive. The issue is to what end?

Life does not come with an instruction manual on how to live it so we have to decide for ourselves.

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"Everybody except for the anarchist is an authoritarian to some degree or another."

Of course they are. The line from anarchy to totalitarianism is a continuum. That is why I said "such an authoritarian". My own inclinations fall just slightly off center tilting more toward the anarchy pole than the totalitarian.

I am all for insisting on mutual cooperation to provide all members of society with basic survival and security needs up to and including national service obligations. Beyond that, I think people should be persuaded or inspired to accomplish any grand plans, not coerced.

Yes, my comments to Dan were hyperbolic -- intentionally. I wanted him to notice that his own words could be interpreted in ways he may not have intended.


Sleeper’s piece is fascinating take on the thoughts of a self examining journalist; something we can do with more in my opinion.

Rarely do journalist examine themselves. Sleeper does it once removed second person. His target: David Brooks.

I read Brooks here and there but mostly avoid him.

So I'm going to agree on the parochial observation that what is distasteful in Brooks is his lack of fidelity to any enduring modus operandi. That is clearly a character flaw in Brooks. He seems to be a person not very well anchored in any enduring ideology.

But I want to put my two cents in as to why such aimlessness is more likely to occur on the conservative side than on the left.

As far as I understand it, Conservativism is not so much an ideology as a strategy for coping in this world. Left movement people on the other hand possess a solid ideology rooted in the Enlightment and the belief in the perfectibility (or at least improvement) of mankind.

I disagree slightly with Sleeper that conservatives are stuck on "smaller government" alone. Let's not forget that conservatives are all for selective government intervention in people's lives as long as it is not economic intervention. The worship at the altar of “Small Government” ueber alles is the specialty of Libertarians.

The tragic side of conservatism is that going through life with merely a strategy for coping leaves you pretty empty as far as a reason to exist. Merely maintaining (some type of) status quo is thin gruel indeed. This might also explain the fervent religiosity as a way to give “meaning” to one’s existence.

It is apt to give you a permanent case of pessimism.

Left wing people are usually chomping at the bit to get somewhere. To "change", to "move forward". to implement "moral ideals" to fully express “the inner self” and sometimes in doing so they get themselves in trouble--at which point conservatives can say "I told you so".

My suspicion is that it is a matter of temperament as to where you wind up: Conservative or Left leaning, although there is considerable crossover.

Why does Brooks meander back and forth? Probably because he has observed that going the way of the political winds keeps him employed, but that's just a guess.

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Sleeper’s piece is fascinating take on the thoughts of a self examining journalist; something we can do with more in my opinion. Rarely do journalist examine themselves.

lol. Oh, the hilarity.

Yes, narcissism is a rare and precious gift among pundits, both left and right, and should be cherished like water in the desert.

Strat must be a Freeper. How else to explain it? Does anyone know a "Liberal Democrat" like this guy? Who applauds pundits for more navel gazing? Get real.

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It's kozmik, The Fierce Bad Rabbit, defending the cave of the Liberal Democrats.

Who's got the Holy Hand Grenade?

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Leave Strat alone, Koz.

You're supposed to be my troll.

Merely maintaining (some type of) status quo is thin gruel indeed. This might also explain the fervent religiosity as a way to give “meaning” to one’s existence.
I think this is a particularly good insight.

One of the astounding paradoxes of the (recent) Reign of Conservatism is that when they had all the power, they did not act at all as they profess. The corruption scandals, the sexual indiscretions, the economic ineptitude, were astounding. It became more and more absurd hearing them pontificate on their so-called "moral superiority". The magnitude of their failure to live up to their own so-called ideals shows clearly that they never really were guided by those ideals in the first place. It was always a pretentious show. A masquerade aimed at endearing themselves to the naive so as to get their hands on the levers of power for cheap profit. So as I say, conservatism (stripped of its Burkean pretentions) is not an ideology but a theory about how to get by in life: how to "make friends and win influence": how to make a buck.

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Jim makes a number of good points here, especially the one about the obtuse, incoherent embrace by self-styled "conservatives" of social traditionalism and authoritative moral order, on the one hand, along with the laissez faire economic arrangements which ceaselessly destroy those traditional forms of life and moral order, on the other hand.

But it is a bit awkward of him to criticize Packer for penning an extended account of the musings of the Manhattan and Washington chatterati, when almost all of his own posts consist of the very same thing.

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Exactly. I find Sleeper's posts to be incredibly long winded, and once you boil them down to useful content, not a lot there and not even slightly insightful.

Jim Sleeper's Pontifications for Non-Dummies:

Sleeper insinuates, self consciously, he's speaking up for the people by criticizing his fellow pundit. Bizarre? Yes.

A book written on the downfall of movement conservatism, or more precisely movement Republicanism, interviews movement figures. Shocking? No.

Brooks triangulates his column to maintain a "moderate" readership and his PBS gig, so as to better poison the well when the time comes. And? We all know that, and it's been said many times better and more compellingly than Sleeper has. Nothing new.

Republicans use wedge issues to herd socially conservative voters away from pocketbook issues. Again, news to anyone? Anyone who would actually read that incredibly long rambling piece by Sleeper?

I challenge anyone to point out what Sleeper has said here that's insightful and wasn't merely ruminating through the obvious, as usual.

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(Moral) Sense and Sensibility

I'm going to take issue with Andrew Strat's assertion that Brook's "lack of fidelity to any enduring modus operandi . . . is clearly a character flaw."

With overlaps, the world is divided between true believers and skeptics.

Brook's overriding sensibility is skepticism, and while he finds more to be skeptical of on the left which tends to have bigger (and more grandiose?) plans for human improvement, he, if much less frequently, finds the right wanting, too. At bottom, Brooks is an amateur cultural anthropologist and to ask him to be always in lockstep with a particular political philosophy would be to ask him to be untrue to his emotional nature -- to his sensibility.


Ellen:

You open up a can of worms with that interpretation of what I (and I think Sleeper) was trying to get at.

You make the assumption that David Brooks is some sort of conflicted person (between Elinor's sense and Marianne's emotionalism (sensibility)) but--unless I'm wrong, I think Mr. Sleeper is trying to get at something a lot more simple, namely that Mr. Brooks exhibits an inordinate amount of opportunism.

He was riding high in the exuberant heydays of the Bush Administration. Now amidst an almost total collapse of the conservative movement and a palpable shift of sensibilities towards the left by the American public, Brooks is doing his best (as Sleeper puts it) to pirouette towards the new reality: to ingratiate himself to what seems an almost certain emergence of a new vox populi.

If you mean to be an interlocutor for Brooks that's another matter. But I think Sleeper is not presenting a picture of a conflicted person so much as a person who is disingenuous.

On the other hand Ellen if you were indirectly referring to me, you are right: I do carry with me both strains of (moral)sense/sensibility, as I suspect most thinking persons do.

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Dear Jim,

I think Brooks' oscillations can probably be explained by two points: 1) Once he was on the left, and some impulses remain. Liberalism made sense to him at one point, and it probably still does at some level.

2) Events have proved his convictions wrong. You know, had supply side economics worked... Had the Iraq invasion gone as planned... Then I think he--and many others, BTW--would be singing a different tune.

Chiat, I believe, had a very perceptive article a while back about how liberals are pragmatists while conservatives tend to stick to their principles regardless of how events turn out. So that, if it were shown that liberalism's ideas didn't produce the results they were intended to produce, e.g., equality, justice, liberals would abandon them.

Whereas, conservatives don't have that sort of pragmatic test for their ideas. Their ideas, or ideals, are not to be confirmed or disproven by experience, they are intended to inform, to guide, experience. So, I guess, by this measure, Brooks is not a conservative, but some sort of hybrid.

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Let me suggest a third and it's a guess on my part. My guess is that he doesn't have a very broad life experience. The ivory tower stuff is all swell but if your own life doesn't give you enough real world experience to attach some passion to ideology it's easy enough to blow with the wind and fall in with whatever group is socially and politically correct. All too many of the pundit class share that problem with Brooks these days.

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Brooks is, imo, a very bright but intellectually lazy and cowardly person. He's a rather tragic figure really.

Brooks is like a child forever going from one foster home to another, always seeking to ingratiate himself, but never quite at home nor brave enough to strike out alone. I doubt he'll ever build something enduring of his own, though it would be a nice surprise.

From what I understand of his background, he was socially awkward when young (and perhaps still) and additionally felt alienated by the (perceived?) liberal excesses of his family and probably those of hipsters generally. At a young age he was taken under the wing of conservatives like Buckley who became his foster family, intellectually and emotionally. Occasionally he bucks his surrogate family, challenges their beliefs, but most of the time he's content to snuggle in. Even worse, he's exploited his ability ingratiate himself as a useful tool for movement conservatism.

Again, a bright guy, but rather hollow and pathetic really. No real courage or independence, and a continual need to whore and ingratiate himself.

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Notice the six comments above by "Koznik," all responding to a post which he insists said nothing and wasn't worth reading.

The effect of responses like his is to discourage and ultimately stop what others are trying to do in joining an interesting "pick-up game" of discussion and making it fruiful and encouraging. The best response to Koznik is to keep posting more constructive observations, including disagreements that are substantive.

One price we have already paid for persistent interventions like Koznik's is that some people who have messaged me privately with rich and informative reflections -- including more information that confirms my arguments and some that takes issue with them -- become disinclined to post their thoughts on a string full of acrimony and insult.

Others here could ask Koznik why he has interrupted a pick-up game six times to insist that it isn't worth playing, when he could easily find another game to join that would be more worth his time.

I won't take the liberty of posting the substantive comments I've received privately, but here is a letter which Todd Gitlin sent to the New York Times in December, 2005 about David Brooks. It was never published, although Todd tells me he did post it here in TPM awhile back and is glad to air it again:

To the Editor:

Re: "Multiple Reality Syndrome" by David Brooks(Dec. 4):

Mr. Brooks writes that earlier in the Iraq War, "Sometimes I'd come way from off-the-record conversations and background briefings [with administration officials] feeling my intelligence had been insulted, because, even in private, officials would ignore realities that were on newspapers' front pages.

I have just reread Mr. Brooks' dozens of columns on Iraq. He wrote that "senior members of his administration are capable of looking honestly at their mistakes (Dec. 9, 2003). He described the Bush administration as "drunk on truth serum," practicing "honesty and candor" (Dec. 13, 2003.) He proclaimed that Mr. Bush has "exceptional moral qualities" (November 23, 2004) and that "two years from now.... Bush's [inaugural speech, which is being derided from vagueness and from its detachment from the concrete realities, will still be practical and present in the world, yielding consequences every day. (January 22, 2005).

But he never informed his readers that Bush and his team insulted his intelligence. Thanks to Mr. Brooks, 27 months into his column, for finally getting around to telling us."

Todd Gitlin

I have received a number of thoughtful and telling messages about Packer and his New Yorker piece which the writers wouldn't want to post anywhere, so I'll forbear and simply urge others to keep elevating the strings of comment at TPM, thereby swamping the trolls. Thanks to Dan K, Andrew Strat, and others for doing just that.

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Thanks for stepping in as ref, Professor Sleeper.

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Hi All,

As TPM Cafe editor I'll be getting more and more into the reader threads-- and I'd like to throw my support behind Jim here. Koznik-- it's one thing to post a comment critiquing a post, it's another to post 6 times and be a jerk about it. The point of these comment threads is to have a constructive conversation, if anyone isn't behind that goal, and repeatedly makes that clear, I'll be banning them. Now, community, continue on with the great work!

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That's fair enough.

The issues at hand are not whether or not we should standardize cell phones or what not. The issues are about social JUSTICE. What does pragmatism have to say about that? Zilch. It is no accident that Pragmatism is not known as a great moral philosophy. Ideological issues are issues of MORAL VALUE and there pragmatism will not help you.

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nonsense. Morality and consequently ethics evolved, biologically and socially, from practical needs, and continues to. Educated people debating that in the 21st century is too sophomoric.

The practical needs and opportunities afforded to an intelligent social species like humanity, or even some of our higher primate relatives, are very different from the needs of a wolf pack or alligator. Consequently thier moral strategies are very different.

Debating morality outside practical outcomes is utterly futile intellectual masturbation.

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Lila,

What Jim Sleeper said, please take this to heart:

One price we have already paid for persistent interventions like Koznik's is that some people who have messaged me privately with rich and informative reflections -- including more information that confirms my arguments and some that takes issue with them -- become disinclined to post their thoughts on a string full of acrimony and insult.

I know this to be very common and I think it is such an important point to maintaining some sort of quality level here. The main thing I learned from a stint as a moderator elsewhere is that allowing personal insult culture to flourish under the ruse of "free speech" simply discourages many very fine minds from contributing to discusssions. It' not fear so often as people might think, much more common in my experience is people who have extraordinary discipline, they can see there's adolescent or psychological or ego games going on, and they don't want to get dragged into that distraction, so they simply keep their thoughts private and lurk, or share them only with the poster by email or private message.

The main thing that really really works in my experience is a rule against insulting other members, i.e., attack the argument, not the other commenter. There is such a great deal of difference in effect between "you're an idiot" and "that's an idiotic statement."

Allowing verbal abuse accomplishes nothing and drags the quality of the participation level way down. Most people are not masochists, they do not enjoy verbal abouse. To get them to participate in something, it has to have a chance of being a pleasant experience. If there's a chance it will be productive, busy people with important things to say will take the time to do so publicly.

There's always been the complaint here that contributors don't participate in comments enough. Step one: stop with the personal insults of contributors, and once again, that's doesn't mean stopping criticism of the argument in their post, as that is usually welcomed by most writers as helpful input.

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Lila,

read this background.

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I agree with you about Brooks and have said so myself many times. My main criticism of you is that your writing style is incredibly meandering, you post very little original thought, and you substantiate your very poorly, regardless of whether I may ultimately agree with your sentiment.

For example, in Sleeper's above post, he has very sparse and short excerpts of Brooks. It seems obvious to condemn someone as a weather vane and weasel, as Brooks certainly is, let his own words condemn him. Instead, Sleeper has paragraph after paragraph of rather lengthy exposition, actually saying very little factually while exploring a rather unoriginal thought.

Common advice to prosecutors goes: If you have the evidence bang on it, otherwise bang on the table. There is copious evidence against Brooks, and yet Sleeper stretches out across and then takes a nap on the table.

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Notice the six comments above by "Koznik," all responding to a post which he insists said nothing and wasn't worth reading.

The effect of responses like his is to discourage and ultimately stop what others are trying to do in joining an interesting "pick-up game" of discussion and making it fruiful and encouraging.

I would have to call that another self indulgent but unsubstantiated and ultimatly false theory.

Actually, I have to point out that most comments aren't referencing Sleeper's post at all, which has generated very little discussion.

I see to be facilitating "an interesting "pick-up game" of discussion" far more than Sleeper is as the total word count of my posts are probably less than Sleepers, but have generated more discussion on a wider range of issues.

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btw, Sleeper is also factually incorrect in asserting I made "six" posts in response to his initial post.

Only my top two posts were responses to Sleeper's initial post, one as a critique of his writing style and originality or lack thereof, the other more satirical.

The rest of the posts in this thread, some of which I've responded to, don't refer to details of Sleeper's post much at all. I suspect Sleeper could have laid out his thesis in a hundred words or less, and ended with "discuss" and generated the same or better response.

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Thanks for taking him on, very precisely for this reason:

One price we have already paid for persistent interventions like Koznik's is that some people who have messaged me privately with rich and informative reflections -- including more information that confirms my arguments and some that takes issue with them -- become disinclined to post their thoughts on a string full of acrimony and insult

I know this happens a lot from personal experience, that public forums are deprived of good input because of a few posters who like to use insults along with adverserial debate. I've mentioned it here on management threads in the past, that I also think it makes it hard for the editor to get contributors, and contributors leave because the feedback eventually turns worthless as good commenters leave. And quite a few people just refused to believe this.

So I really appreciate you saying it. It seems so clueless not to be able to see that, some are so ingrained in commenting culture that they can't see the other side?

People, just put yourself on the other side, why would anyone continue to contribute here to be subject to a thread mostly containing verbal abuse? If you want quality contributors, think of what kind of criticism you yourself as a busy contributor with other jobs would find stimulating, and what kind of criticism would make you say "I don't need this shit, what a waste of my time."

If you don't have anything constructive and stimulating for the contributor, don't say anything at all. THE REASON: A lousy author is not the only one reading your insults, other potential authors are! Many will check out a site and refuse a request to contribute based on what they see happening to other contibutors.

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P.S. Insult lovers who cry "free speech" have no idea how many people are being "censored" because of such behavior, how their behavior is shooing away much of the more thoughtful world. It's similar to the family dinner culture where the loud and obnoxious father is the only one that always gets to be heard, and the first real family discussion happens at his funeral.

Under David Remnick the New Yorker has become neo-con lite.

Why bother with it anymore?

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Why should anyone bother with the New Yorker?

Sy Hersh for one, as anyone who claims to be familiar with the New Yorker, and opposed to neocons, should know. Otherwise, it's mixed bag and like most publications probably more misses than hits.


We might start a new line of thought and call it "The Myth of Ideological Consistency".

People feel obliged to be ideologically consistent even when in truth their sensibilities do not line up with the dejur politically correct. I think we are all guilty of that.

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Koznik has now posted seven times to say that my piece says nothing and, moreover, that I supply no evidence to substantiate that nothingness. Leaving aside the strangeness of that argument, I’ll note simply that my post cites seven or eight Brooks’ columns that, taken together, show not just inconsistency but intellectual dishonesty and, in response to Koznik earlier, I supplied a letter from Todd Gitlin that identifies several more.

The larger purpose of the column, however, is not to imitate a legal brief or an argument in court, and its burden is not evidentiary, There are other ways of thinking than the lawyer's or prosecutor's or political debater's ways. Some people get this, some people don't. The closing excerpt from Robert Warshow gets at a part of the problem.

My concern is that Brooks, although of limited importance himself, is emblematic and therefore revealing of something we all do need to understand a lot better about what is going so wrong with this country. By indulging him, Packer too reflects a certain weakness -- in himself and The New Yorker and the chattering classes -- that Brooks exploits masterfully, not to any great consequence on his own account, but in ways that should wake people up.

If Brooks wants to evolve intellectually and politically and to break with his 20 years of carrying water for the Republicans and the conservative movement, God bless him, but let him explain himself, not just keep sliding around sophistically as he's been doing while re-electing George Bush and abetting a lot of needless bloodshed and social decay. If Packer wants to treat him as a legitimate witness, he whould demand no less than what I have just proposed.

Andrew Stat is right, I think, to challenge the notion of ideological consistency. I'm arguing not from the "left" or "right" as we generally understand them but from a civic-republican way of thinking that is capable of challenging both capitalism as we know it (namely, corporate, anti-republican capitalism, not the Lockean entrepreneurial kind) and a rights-based liberalism that acknowledges and cultivates no countervailing obligations and discipline.

Liberal states and republics have to rely on certain virtues and beliefs which the government itself cannot nurture, enforce, or even defend. So they have to be nourished and cultivated all the more intensively by civil society. The left and the right each have credible claims on certain truths about how to do this. but neither can do it alone. We have to have trustworthy, public vantage points from which to draw on and synthesize both. Brooks is capable of advancing that discussion, and Packer, too, but neither is doing it in pieces like Packer's or self-serving comments like Brooks'.

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I’ll note simply that my post cites seven or eight Brooks’ columns that, taken together, show not just inconsistency but intellectual dishonesty and, ... I supplied a letter from Todd Gitlin that identifies several more.

Yes, and my point remains, you could have provided far more concrete evidence to substantiate your post to begin with, and could have meandered far less.

That summary is far more concise and contains most of your theory in a small fraction of the space, despite a bit of bloating on "evidentiary burdens" which were also asserted but unsubstantiated.

And again, I would point out what little unique information or content exists in your post, as opposed to the obvious and commonly acknowledged on TPMC, has generated very little discussion. You could have summarized it and ended with "discuss" and generated the same or better response.

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To put a finer point on it, I said before there's something rather disingenuous about a scholar telling people what they already know in the longest possible format and with the greatest sophistry. I compared it to the intellectual equivilent of backdating stock options.

In a nutshell, it seems to me Sleeper is saying:

1) Brooks is a weasel, and there are lots of weaselly pundits generally.

2) ideologues, either the supposedly consistent kind, or the weather vane sort, are false prophets and con artists.

3) we need to move past ideology, past pundit hacks, and towards common ground and pragmatic solutions.

4) mom and apple pie are good.

And? Aside from Brooks specifically, isn't that where the majority of the country is already at? The points above are far too obvious and mundane.

Didn't even GW Bush in 2000 campaign as a "compassionate conservative" and a "uniter not a divider." Haven't all the the major presidential candidates in 2008 been "reformers" and "moderates" or "maverick" whether "triangulating" or "sincere."

Really, what's new or original there?



I'm arguing not from the "left" or "right" as we generally understand them but from a civic-republican way of thinking that is capable of challenging both capitalism as we know it (namely, corporate, anti-republican capitalism, not the Lockean entrepreneurial kind) and a rights-based liberalism that acknowledges and cultivates no countervailing obligations and discipline.

What might require a bit more elaboration is the notion of civic republicanism as it applies to the modern context, given that it is a notion usually applied to the Classic Era of Greece and Rome.

Perhaps we can all agree that the notion is not totally devoid of ideological underpinnings. After all, the very fact that it calls for a civic discourse is distinct from authoritarian systems. It is somehow internally related to the very notion of democracy. So although it transcends the right wing/left wing divide it nevertheless is normative in the sense that it calls for a grand forum of discourse that is to be instrumental in shaping public policy

Locke was rebelling against the Divine Right of Kings and the notion that the people were there to serve the Monarchy and not the other way around. He turned the whole concept upside down. It was for the benefit of the people that government is justified. How could he foresee that his famous twin paradigms-- freedom from undue government interference and the right to property--would eventually lead to the encroachment of a plutocracy on the res publica.

I don't think you can easily disassociate Lockean proto capitalistic doctrine ( you call it entrepreneurial capitalism) from the emergence of the full blown rapacious kind we have today. The progression from one to the other was natural.

You seem to think that what the doctor orders is a good dose of civic minded republicanism. However without an enforcement mechanism, the discourse will remain academic. Witness Rawl's efforts. Has anything come of it? In my lifetime, I have seen little to indicate that Rawls remains more than an academic phenomenon. Instead--at least on economic matters--it is the neoliberal/libertarians such as Nozick that hold sway. Individual (economic) freedom and property rights ueber alles is the reality of the day.

We need to looks seriously at the mechanics of our government. How can a civic minded political class be put in place amidst the powerful pressures from the corporate class?

At the risk of incurring the wrath of Sleeper, I will add a little to my post above.

We need to inquire as to Obama's neoliberal, Chicago School. Milton Friedman, Furman, et al leanings. Is he really going to continue the laissez-faire regimen or is he going to address some of the issues brought up in this discussion here and elsewhere?

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"Liberal states and republics have to rely on certain virtues and beliefs which . . . have to be nourished and cultivated all the more intensively by civil society." Jim Sleeper

Il faut cultiver notre jardin.

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Clearly, Koznik can't stop posting. He even replies to himself. All his posts say the same thing. Really, what's new and original in his tenth post as compared with his first?

Ellen: Please don't feed the trolls... or be a weed in the garden.

Over and out. The real discussion about this piece continues offline among people who have actually read Packer and Brooks and my post.

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Actually, you seem to have a problem finding anything else to post about other than me. Trolling your own thread it's called.

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He even replies to himself.

It's useful partitioning. In fact, nobody else but you on TPMC makes rambling 4 page full width posts.

Really, what's new and original in his tenth post as compared with his first?

So, let me see if I follow your logic. You're saying that what I accused you of, and which you believe you're innocent of, I'm actually guilty of, as I respond to you. Ah yes, the old "rubber and glue" axiom. Impressive.

The real discussion about this piece continues offline among people who have actually read Packer and Brooks and my post.

Yes, well, I'll keep an eye on my seismograph, waiting for the foundations of the world to be shaken.

@ Dan K

Social and economic equality are not the natural conditions of human beings left to their own devices

All human history says otherwise, as do Darwin and Freud. You, of course, believe in alien possession by demons so history is nothing compared to communist ideology.

As for regulation. Please. The regulators are all too human, which means too much government regulation leads to onerous bureaucracy, bribery, nepotism, and unhealthy breeding habits. Which again probably doesn't bother you since you're probably the product of inbreeding.

Disregard the first paragraph of my response. I misread the blockquote.

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btw, Brooks is presently on the News Hour, discussing how Obama has a "macheavellian side" and what Brooks would advise he do *IF* Brooks was a "politcal hack" and had no "conscience."

Gee, Freudian much? It's too pathetic. Brooks is heading for a flameout, that we can all agree on.

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