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Veepstakes Open Thread

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Since it's one of the new conversations, I thought folks might enjoy hashing it out in a thread. So many things to discuss: persuasive Webb backlash, discussion of short-term and long-term trade-offs, a whole series of profiles in the reader blogs.

What are you thinking? And don't just give a name, make a case for a candidate or a criteria for making the decision.


277 Comments

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What I'm mainly thinking is that people are treating the VP decision as far more significant than it actually is. We need to break out of the Cheney model of the VP as major figure and player, assuming more power than he is constitutionally granted, and get back to thinking of the VP as a loyal understudy, who carefully follows administration business in case he or she has to take over, but who otherwise stays out of the news and out of the main political action.

Personally, I'd rather see us go back to the Al Gore model of a VP who has a substantive portfolio and functions that complement those of the POTUS, rather than (a) the dutiful attender of state funerals and scribe of thank-you notes, on the one hand, or (b) the Darth Cheney Puppetmaster model.

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Personally, I'd like to get back to Al Gore as VP. Seriously. I think he'd be a great choice for Obama. Only he has the heft to mobilize the country and world on global warming/energy sustainability, and if given that portfolio I think he'd do it, because he realizes how little time we really have before it is irreversible. In addition, only he has the heft to fend off the Clintons and thier followers. Unlike Hillary, he is enough of a team player not to overshadow Obama. And because he would only have to campaign for 2+ months, I think he would do it.

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Mimi,
Al Gore's already been Vice President. I don't recall hearing a lot from him about climate change until his movie. I think when Clinton dropped the BTU Tax, he shut climate change work down.
Gore -- and we -- are better off with him as an outside influencer.
RFM

Rionn,

You don't recall hearing a lot from him on global warming until his movie because broad public acceptance of global warming as a fact has only existed for about 1-2 years. Media coverage/acknowledgment has been disgustingly minimal. Politicians on both sides of the isle have failed the people of the United States and the World by failing to lead on this issue.

If you look at the record, Al Gore has been championing this issue since before his stint in the White House.

You are right about Clinton and the BTU tax but that has little bearing on weather Gore would be a good addition to the Obama ticket.

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Thanks, Twinkletoes. I was commenting on Al Gore's failure to turn his commitment to climate change into policy when Vice President, not the commitment itself. It's simply a role that didn't work for him.

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I actually think this is an interesting idea. It wouldn't do much to placate (appease? Sorry) the Hillary wing but it would give us gravitas for days. He could actually do very little officially and continue to do his work, and he could step into the main role, so to speak, without further rehearsal.

Let's do it!

Very few people mention Chris Dodd, but he's my number one. He's the only Democrat who had the balls to stand up to the Bush team as they were trying to dismantle the Constitution. He left off campaigning in Iowa, where he'd actually moved his family, to go filibuster in the Senate.

Here are some other reasons:

1. Helps with Catholics (obvious, but Obama's really weak here).

2. Helps with Hispanics (fluent in Spanish, Western Hemisphere Chair in Senate Foreign Relations Committee, Peace Corps Dominican Republic).

3. Helps with Jews (Dad, Tom Dodd, was on Prosecution team at Nuremberg; Univ of Conn hosts "Tom Dodd Center for Holocaust Studies").

4. Age, seniority, thick resume of legislative accomplishment (all contrasts with Obama).

5. Street fighter; most important of all. Smart, fast on his feet; great counterpuncher; all part of what a Veep is supposed to do).

6. Veteran – Air National Guard

i personally like dodd - his was the only campaign i actually contributed to (to show my support for his filibuster pledge) and he was my second choice after edwards. but i think you have to dig a bit to deep into his CV to get any sort of bump with voters.

The downside to this is that Dodd is so valuable in the Senate. His talent for getting things done there would be wasted as VP.

There was some discussion earlier this year of Dodd making a go at Majority Leader next year. Is this realistic do you think?

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Dodd has said he's going to retire in 2010:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christopher_Dodd#cite_ref-14
although that can obviously change. But with two young daughters, he is probably winding down his Senate career. To me, that mitigates against a Majority Leader position, although I think he's the best choice. But it also bodes well for him in a VP slot. See my Doddmania VP post further down in this thread.

Hello Dan,
I must respectfully disagree. The selection of the VP is of crucial importance, as can be seen with unitary executive theory (bad idea!), and as it was before Amendment XII (one of the biggest mistakes in our nation's history). The VP should NOT be a loyal understudy, nor the other side of a wall of plausible deniability (Cheney/GHWB).
He should be a foil for the opposition, providing a check and balance within the executive branch; this was a vital part of our founding father's meticulously crafted framework, foolishly undone in 1804 because of a tie in the Electoral Congress.
As Rodney King and Barack Obama say, "Can't we all just get along?"
It also went so splashingly well back in 1864, after our last little intra-national dustup,
why don't we try it again?
Ya know, there is but one person who brings to mind so vividly the integrity and courage of an American Without Reserve (Daniel Webster), and that man is, without reservation, the man for the job:
Senator Chuck Hagel (R-NE)
Obama/Hagel '08!
Woo woo woo!

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Until recently I might have said Richardson, but I'm starting to like Tim Kaine (VA-Gov). I don't know a lot about him yet; he seems like a pro-life moderate, which is not what I particularly like about him. What I do like is that he's young (by politician-standards :-) and energetic and the governor of a swing state. Choosing the other Virginia contender (Webb) could hurt Dems' strength in the Senate.

And also, perhaps paradoxically, I like that Kaine does not have many years of experience as an elected official. The "lack of experience" theme will continue to be one of the main lines of attack against Obama, and I prefer to counterattack aggressively ("good judgment matters more") rather than to play defense by choosing a candidate like Richardson (who has major experience) or Clark (who has major foreign policy cred). (That said, I still like either of those two guys that I just named).

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THere is simply no way that Obama takes Kaine. Kaine would have to step down as Governor of VA if elected in November and that would place the Lt. Governor (a Republican) in the Governor's mansion (for one year).

Also, Obama is not selecting someone who isn't strongly pro-choice. Especially given that the pro-choice movement has been the base for Hillary Clinton and there is an obvious need to heal that rift.

Kaine is pro-death penalty.

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Perhaps you should go edit wikipedia, which disagrees with you:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tim_Kaine#Death_penalty_stance

Kaine is most certainly not pro-death penalty. He actually put a moratorium on executions in Virginia pending the decision in Baze v. Rees. During the 2005 campaign he promised to uphold the law in VA, despite his own personal opposition to the death penalty. So, once the Court upheld KY's lethal injections, Kaine lifted the moratorium.

That said, I don't think he'd be a good choice for VP. Obama can win VA even without selecting any of the VA politicians (Kaine, Webb, Warner).

No, Kaine is anti-death penalty, making him one of the few Catholic politicians to have positions consistent with what the church says.

The fact that an anti-death penalty guy like Kaine can win in a state like Virginia speaks volumes both about his skills as a political leader AND about the degree to which the conventional wisdom is wrong about the political power of capital punishment these days.

If Richardson were younger I'd want him at VP because I'd like to see him as president but he'll be a bit too old by 2016 to run (yes McCain is running but he's too old for my taste as well). I'd like a VP who can run for president in 2016 so Richardson doesn't fit the bill. Oh, hey, a pun.

Instead, I'd like to see him in a position with greater influence in a normal presidential administration. Bill Richardson for Secretary of State!

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I agree with you on Richardson -- but the criteria of who would succeed Obama after the second term doesn't make any sense. VP is not a reasonable step to the presidency unless by tragedy. Fergedaboudit!

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I've send in several threads that I don't like the idea of a Senator-Senator ticket. Get a Governor. Senators already are easily perceived as elite DC insiders and a Governor can add needed executive experience to a ticket, even if they are lacking in foreign policy experience.

I think Governor's Richardson, Sebelius, and Napolitano would make a lot of sense. They all have strengths and waeknesses but I believe the next VP comes from this group.

A couple of non-Governors to consider:

Edwards: until very recently I didn't think having him on board would do much much for the ticket. But after seeing them on stage together and with Edwards new found populism and talk about poverty in America, I'm much warmer to the idea. I doubt he would take it if offered, but Obama-Edwards might be a very very strong ticket (Edwards now a national figure rather than just a former Senator).

Also, I wouldn't be shocked if talk of Daschle on the ticket becomes strong. He's been an early and strong voice behind the scenes for Obama.

I've always thought there'd be a place for Daschle in an Obama Administration, but somehow, I'd always thought he'd be Chief of Staff. He seems to be in that Leo McGarry position...since everyonne seems all "West Winged" up all of the sudden.

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Yep - that makes sense and would continue his role as the little noticed but knowledgeable key advisor.

and there are those surveyUSA VP match-ups showing obama/edwards as a total ass-kicker (and appalachia equalizer)... even though they're mostly just name-recognition polls, isn't that about all that a VP really brings for the vast majority of voters?

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Yes and the positive name recognition of the VP candidate can't hurt Obama.

But at the same time, all the general election polls at this point are fairly meaningless, expect to be a general starting point for the race. (just as all those polls with Hillary in the lead for months before the actual primaries were just a starting point - not an end point).

if a double-digit lead is the starting point, what a great place to start.

with edwards i would have thought that his name recognition would have been much more of a mixed bag than a clear advantage. i think that's what i find so persuasive.

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Of course, the other thing is that Edwards isn't likely to accept the VP nod. If he really wanted it I think he would have endorsed Obama much earlier and I think he would be a mainstay in the media.

Edwards would be perfect were it not for his Iraq War vote. The apology is not enough, in my opinion, to go on total offense with this issue; especially considering the traditional "attack-dog" role of the VP.

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I think he's done a credible job of apologizing and saying he regrets it. Although I'll admit that it was a major reason I supported Obama over Edwards in the primary.

I like Biden for his temperament as well as his experience, and the VP role would benefit from his talent for debate. He probably would rather not be asked, but I know he'd be clean and articulate.

I'm from Delaware and I like Biden a lot. I'd be proud to have him on the ticket. He has serious foot in mouth disease though. Also, what he brings to the table is foreign policy cred, but Obama has been trying hard to make the case that foreign policy is where he needs help the least. So... I think that leaves Biden with an offer for Secretary of State. I don't know if DE's governor would appoint his replacement or if there would need to be a special election, but DE goes blue in every national election so it wouldn't really matter.

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I'm pro-Phil Bredeson (D-TN). He's not yet committed. He's a state-wide twice-elected Dem from Tennessee with a history in health care management. He's a smart guy, good enough on core issues like choice and labor. Keep him in the souteast and southwest, bring the Obama christian caucus through those states enough and they are in play.

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Oh -- and also he's currently term-limited. Most of the names being tossed around are Senate Dems. We need to keep that majority...Webb and Warner will definitely be needed in the Senate. The folks swarming to elect Warner will give Obama an upballot boost anyway.

Leave Kaine out of it. He'd be good for an spot in the administration, but he's as boring as Sebelius.

Governor Ted Strickland. He would put Ohio in play.
He is very popular, and proved that he could deliver the state to Hillary. It would be an olive branch to the Clinton supporters.

Gov. Strickland was a congressman, before becoming governor, so that gives him a double experience edge. Before entering politics, he was a Christian minister, so that would help Obama to gain some traction in Appalachia.

Bottom line: Winning Ohio is very important.
Strickland gives Obama the best chance to do so.

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I agree. I'm all in favor of Obama's "50 state" strategy, but last time I checked, Ohio was one of those fifty states. And quite frankly, it's an important state where Obama is vulnerable. Strickland gives Obama a much-needed nudge in Ohio.

Why Strickland and not Rendell?

There's video of Rendell praising Farrakhan:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PIF7A_VdYQs

That tape is from 1997, and shows Rendell praising the NOI's traditional family values, not praising Farrakhan personally.

Besides, Rendell is Jewish himself, which I think effectively inoculates him.

In short, not good, but hardly fatal. With Hagee, Parsley, Robertson, Wright, Falwell, Sharpton et al, every politician will have some brush-up with some controversial religious person. Big deal.

* * * * *

As to his supposed reputation for being gaffe-prone, he was pretty deft as a Clinton surrogate in the runup to the PA vote, managing the difficult trick of effectively making her case without pissing off this Obamaphile. He won my grudging admiration.

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Obama has PA sewn up, he doesn't need the help there. He's more vulnerable in Ohio, and is within reach; Florida may be winnable, but I wouldn't count on it.

As someone who lives in Philly, take my word that Rendell is a bad pick. His mouth constantly gets him in trouble, and his performance as Governor has mostly made my life in PA worse.

Rendell is a victim of Hillary. He showed veryvery bad judgment in showing extreme fervor for Hillary. I think those that took such hard sides deserve to be considered last, unless they show an extreme benefit to the ticket. Like the old saying goes"You lay down your money and you take your chance". Rendell picked a loser. Why would we think he could be a winner in the WH?

I just keep seeing Strickland standing on stage behind Hillary nodding his lil' bobblehead as she scolds "Shame on you Barack Obama! Meet me in Ohio."

I like Virginia's Senator Jim Webb. Yeah, he's not a governor, but hasn't Dumbya tarnished the brass of the gubernatorial gambit a bit? Webb is tough, independently minded, popular with independents and some Republicans (he used to be one himself), could probably deliver Virginia for Obama, could counter McSame's supposed National Security credentials, and might just bring in some of those White Working Class voters that Obama has had trouble with. He would/will face some criticism for his past statements women, but any candidate you find will have SOME things that will be criticized and attacked.

One more plus for Webb: Virginia currently has a Democratic governor (Tim Kaine), so Webb's U.S. Senate seat would be replaced by another Democrat.

Temporarily. There will be a special election to fill the remainder of the term. People aren't too crazy about Senators being appointed to a 6-year term.

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Ok - Webb's out too.

No endorsing major Republican candidates within the last 10 years is going to be a new litmus test.

Sorry Joe Lieberman, you're out too.

I think people are going overboard with describing Webb's positives.

A) He barely beat a Republican incumbent in a Democratic year, even after his opponent used a racial epithet that was captured on camera.

B) There's absolutely no idea backing up the claim that independents like him. Yes, he SEEMS like the guy independents WOULD like. But so far, there has been no demonstration of the fact. Check all of the SUSA polling with VP hopefuls added. Yes, he has no name recognition. But that's exactly my point! We don't KNOW that he attracts independents.

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What about Wesley Clark? He opposed the war like Obama, but he's connected to the Clintons and might be a bridge to peace with them. Also, he's from Arkansas and he's liked in the south. He's gotten a lot better on TV by going on Fox (I know, yuck) but he's less threatening to middle-of-the-road folks than a lot of well-known Dems, and he's really pretty liberal.

You might want to re-check his opposition to the war. Also, where is the evidence that he possess any ability to win votes in the South? He won, what... one state in 2004 primary (with 32%)?

I think we need to distinguish between people we FEEL can attract a certain demographic bloc, versus those who actually have.

Clark did publicly oppose the Iraq War.

Clark brings a unity solution to win over the Clinton supporters without involving a Clinton political opportunist. Clark brings unique and unparalleled foreign policy credentials; a hero in Europe, he'll be able to bring our allies back into the fold. Very liberal social positions (health care, gay rights, reproductive rights, etc.) that will pass relatively unnoticed by centrist voters focused on his military credentials.

Does he put a demographic or region in play the way a governor would? Maybe not. But you could argue he would be able to relate to Appalachian America well (is that a new demographic term?). I also like this selection because it doesn't take any of our strong Senators or Governors out of office.

As a big supporter of Hillary Clinton and someone who will happily support Senator Obama if he is nominated, I believe that Wesley Clark would be a great fit as his VP. General Clark has the experience of running form President and actually winning some primaries in the south. He is cerebral while having the military experience to offset Sen McCain. Wesley Clark is eloquent and speaks to why a decorated war hero chose to be a Democrat. He can help Obama with a demographic he has struggled with while projecting a positve vision.

My sentiments exactly. Clark is as good a fit as Webb, but with less potential negatives and a big plus of bridging the gap between the Clinton and Obama campaigns. Don't discount the need to bring the factions together, and the symbolic olive branch this selection would make. Very sound decision. The only questions are whether Clark would accept, and whether his heart would be in to it.

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Agreed. If one must go with a military guy, Clark is a better fit temperamentally and politically than Webb.

Brian Schweitzer hands down.

An incredibly popular (70% approval) Democratic governor from a red state. He puts the entire mountain midwest in play.

He has a masters in soil science, worked as an irrigation developer all over the world, speaks several languages including Arabic, and was a member of the Clinton USDA.

He's a Real ID and Iraq was critic and strongly pro-alternative energy (and clean coal but mostly wind etc).

His only drawbacks as far as I can tell is his support for the death penalty and the fact that he's pro-gun. However, he's brilliant, unorthodox, from outside the Beltway, able to put key areas into play, and all around an awesome candidate.

I think it will probably be Kaine, but Schweitzer has been my dark horse for a while now and I really really hope he gets the nod.

Brain Schweitzer could put Montana in play, but with only three Electoral College votes, the reward would not be worth the risk.

I am practicing how to insert links, so pardon me while I link to a beautiful picture of Square Butte:

Square Butte

If I mess my link up, I would appreciate if someone would advise.

First off, I think he could put more than just Montana and it's puny 3 EV in. I think he'd pull in the entire mountain midwest and make Obama more competitive in CO, a key swing state for him.

Secondly, in order to link to a photo, you type this:

"title of photo"

Re davybavy:

I view that article as an asset, because it allows Schweitzer to pivot and say "well you know I used to like some things about these politicians, but then all this happened, and now I support Obama." That sort of pivoting is what Obama needs in order to pick up disgruntled Obamacans who are Republicans disenchanted with the current GOP. They see kindred spirits in Schweitzer and will come over more easily.

lets try this tutorial again:

a href="url of photo"> title of photo

now just put an open and close carrot before the a href and after the /a respectively and you're good to go!

Thanks Petey05.

This should be a beautiful Montana sunset.

Square Butte/a>

Whoops. I think I will stick to posting links without the fancy abbreviations.

href="http://www3.nationalgeographic.com/places/photos/photo_montana_montana.html"> Square Butte/a>

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Schweitzer is unacceptable. His infamous NYT Magazine interview in 2006 was a career-killer in national Democratic politics.

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/10/08/magazine/08governor.html?pagewanted=all

I was just appalled to read the following:

Schweitzer remains an iconoclast; he says he supported John McCain's presidential bid in 2000, though he has since soured on McCain because of the way he has courted the religious right, and he says he is now intrigued by the possibility of a presidential run by Mitt Romney, the Republican governor of Massachusetts, in 2008. "If he gets the nomination, I might support him," Schweitzer told me.

Romney for President??? I am willing to overlook a lot, but this crosses the line.

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Agreed.

Would really suck if McCain had Romney on his ticket...

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I like the Brian Schweitzer idea. His appeal would stretch far beyone Montana throughout the west and the midwest. His pro-gun credibility would help Obama in many swing states such as Colorado, Nevada, New Mexico, Iowa, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Michigan, Ohio and Pennsylvania.

He would add a new dimension to the ticket.

As a Colorado Dem somewhat involved in state politics, I had no idea who Schweitzer was until a few weeks ago. I don't think he's gonna pull much weight here. Richardson would be much better as a boost in Colorado. We all know him and most like him even more than our Clinton-era appointee Federico Pena, former mayor of Denver.

Even if you didn't know who he was until recently, you don't think his policies and person would play better to CO people?

I mean Schweitzer is pretty much the American's American, which would be great for Obama to counteract all the whisper campaigns.

Wesley Clark would be a great choice for VP. He's out of the DC loop, quadruple (star) trumps any military cache Mccain has and is an eloquent speaker who has charisma to spare. As a Clinton supporter, he'd help bring the HRC people into the game.

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I'm with you on Wes Clark up to the part about being a Clinton partisan. If I'm Obama (which I'm not :), no way do I want a potential Clinton mole inside the White House.

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I'm with you on Wes Clark up to the part about being a Clinton partisan. If I'm Obama (which I'm not :), no way do I want a potential Clinton mole inside the White House.

Wes Clark is a great, but does he ever blink? It's a bit weird.

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I like Evan Bayh. He's a Clinton supporter. He's young (52) but experienced (8 years as governor & 10 as senator). He would help in the Midwest (OH, MI, WI, & MO--and possibly bring Indiana in play). Most importantly, he's the safe choice; he won't cause any problems for Obama either during the campaign or in office.

He's also vacuous. He does have nice hair though.

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Is it dyed? True, it's not "Jim Webb Red," but it doesn't look quite natural to me.

Webb is viewed by many women as misogynist--not a good follow-up to the primary.

Schweitzer, Edwards or...what about Jay Rockefeller?

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John Kerry?

Dude... that is an idea!!

Given the wildly successful job Obama, Axelrod et al have done in thinking through and executing a successful primary strategy I expect they'll figure out and select the right candidate.

We'll all know soon enough.

I strongly agree with Wesley Clark as the choice. In addition to the points made by Suznaz, he has been in the barrel as a presidential candidate before and his experience with that process should be helpful.

I'm all over the lot on this one. I do not see a sitting
Senator because of Obama's thrust of 'new politics'
and 'change', maybe Nunn, or maybe someone completely
off the scope.
Richardson has strengths and weaknesses; not sure he can
survive a serious vetting. Maybe a man for foreign affairs such as Richardson or the economy, Bloomsburg, or a woman governor to bring in disgrunted Clinton supporters. These are the highest polity areas for Obama. Who? Don't Know!

Wes Clark.

Obama/Biden '08

You have to have a Politician that has already proven that they can win a fairly large state wide race. That is one way of vetting their campaign skills. Wes. Clark has not ever done so. He is too much of a risk. You need a seasoned political big time winner.

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How about someone whose won a nationwide race--in fact, 3 of them. Al Gore! Seriously. Who better to head up the global warming/energy portfolio, and he has heft and credibility on most issues. I think he's the best choice given that all the other possibilities have some (in some cases major) flaws. Plus he'd be good. He could do it for the first term, and someone else could come up the ranks for the second term and thereafter.

Webb's my choice.

Just like the guy's grit. Shallow reasoning, but honest.

I don't care what baggage he may have. He completes the ticket as the enforcer.

who's with me??

Gov Brad Henry (D-OK)

You heard it here first.

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Oregon's former governor John Kitzhaber (61), an emergency room doctor who has built a credible political movement around universal health care coverage, also has strong credentials as an environmental steward. He may run for governor again in 2010 and does not want to live in DC, but is an energetic campaigner and inspiring speaker.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Kitzhaber

if it weren't for webb's (possible) negatives with women, he'd be my first choice by a mile.

this time last year richardson was my first choice for the top slot. but he showed himself to be a total doofus on the campaign trail ('homosexuality is a choice' + 'my fav scotus = white') and wouldn't even consider him for a high profile cabinet position let alone VP.

i'm a big fan of clark but i think he works better on paper than in real life.

edwards is my top choice and though i would've voted for him in the primary had michigan not mucked everything up, i've only recently come to see him as the best choice for VP.

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I hate to recommend a David Brooks column, but I actually like his last one:
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/05/27/opinion/27brooks.html

He argues that the VP is more important for governing than for winning elections. I think that he undervalues the role of the VP candidate in elections, but his analysis of who would best be able to help Obama govern is interesting. He argues that Obama needs a Washington insider who can help to press his change agenda on a recalcitrant Congress and federal bureaucracy. For that job, he suggests Daschle or Nunn.

I see the need for such a person. I don't think that person would have to be VP, but the clout of the office could help.

I'm on board with this. I don't think the Dems need to pick a VP to help them win. Everyone's pretty sick of Bush and a 3rd term is not going to cut it. Pick someone who can help AFTER the election:

1. A LBJ-type, seasoned Senator or Congressman who knows how to get things passed.

2. A governor who is a good administrator and can help keep things organized.

3. Someone with military bonafides who can help keep the DOD generals in line (or a SecDef with the same qualifications).

I don't think Nunn is anywhere near Obama politically. I know he supported him this election, and it would pull Obama to the center which is usual come the GE, however it would alienate a lot of Obama's grass roots activist types that play a huge role in getting him to where he is today.

I think Pawlenty is McCain's smartest choice, but I wonder if Pawlenty would want to be on a McCain ticket, or rather wait four years and be able to have a fresh national stage start and be his own man. If you are linked with McCain/Bush now, you would be probably for the rest of your career.

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...it would alienate a lot of Obama's grass roots activist types that play a huge role in getting him to where he is today

I hear this concern most often with regards to the possibility of Clinton as VP. I don't buy it. A VP choice might attract a reluctant voter, but I do not see it causing active supporters to abandon their candidate. It might piss them off perhaps, but it would have to be a pretty fickle grassroots supporter to turn against their own candidate because they disagree with his VP choice. That said, I think that policy differences could be a problem. For that reason, I agree that Daschle would be a better choice (though I do like Nunn's military creds).

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Obama's road to the White House goes through CO, NM, NV. Therefore, Bill Richardson.

However, does anyone else wonder if a Black-Hispanic ticket is too much?

Sorry, Richardson is a good guy, but he would be a red cape in the face of the eager-to-stampede Clinton wing. He's a no-go on that basis, I'm afraid.

That's what I'm thinking. As a CO Dem, I know that Richardson is very well regarded in CO. He would especially help with the eastern and southern rural areas where there have been hispanics farming since before Colorado was US territory. Ken Salazar country.

How the rest of the country would look upon him, I'm not sure. I also believe that Colorado is going for Obama without help from a sympathetic VP pick so it might be best to look for help in another area that need shoring up.

My top three:

Jim Webb -- combines national security credentials, economic populism, appeal to working class voters, a take-no-shit attitude and probably brings along Virginia's electoral votes, too.

Kathleen Sebelius -- gubernatorial experience, success in a Republican-dominated state, shows that Hillary's anything but the only woman qualified to serve as president or capable of being elected.

Bill Richardson -- gubernatorial experience, national security credentials, the whole package, plus the possibility of unprecedented Latino turnout.

All three reinforce the message of change, all three should be very compatible with Obama, and all three bring to the ticket experiences he doesn't yet have. Plus, Webb and Richardson probably move swing states to the Dem column.

Others whom I think would be good and I'd be happy with: Wesley Clark, Ted Strickland, Ed Rendell, Joe Biden, Chris Dodd, Tom Daschle, Janet Napolitano, Tim Kaine and, maybe, Michael Bloomberg.

People whom I do not want:

Sam Nunn -- a corporate conservative DLC-er who would do for Obama what Lloyd Bentsen did for Dukakis. Also does not swing Georgia.

Evan Bayh -- Mr. DLC, boring, and isn't likely to swing Indiana.

Chuck Hagel -- might be a great choice for Defense secretary, not too conservative on most other issues to work.

How could I have forgotten? Also on the no way list -- Hillary.

Wassamatta U?

Ah, my beloved alma mater!

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Why not include Barbara Mikulski of MD. Tough, white, female, short, blue collar and a lot of fun on the campaign trail. She could also, by the way, totally do the job of president if she had to.

Baggage.

Why not pick a VP who represents the Hillary voters - someone like me? This choice is female, white, over fifty, well-educated, and has experienced degrading gender and age discrimination up close and personal. She supports universal health care, family friendly work environments, choice, academically strong K-16 education, immediate withdrawal from Iraq, equity of opportunity, and economic strategies that will reduce the gap between the rich and poor. California's two senators fit this category and would make excellent, experienced VPs.

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Sebelius. No-brainer.

Obama needs to narrow down the field to two or three people who he could live with, who have possible appeal to the Clinton wing of the party: maybe Ed Rendell and Kathleen Sebelius, or Strickland and Napolitano. (Maybe throw in Edwards, though I tend to prefer Governors.)

And then...?

Turn to Hillary. Have her choose from among the finalists.

It would be an unprecedented show of respect to a defeated candidate, and would ensure a united Convention.

Me? I like Rendell.

To the victor go the spoils.

If he wins (which it appears he will) then he chooses. If clinton had won (which it appears she won't) then she would have chose. If she doesn't like it: tough, she should have won!

Hey, Paul Maud d'ib:

I know we won the nomination. Now we'd like to win the GE, wouldn't we? That means making room on the Obama-train for the large group of fellow Democrats who just want to be asked aboard. It's time to pivot, dude! Make nice.

Insert pithy quotation from Princess Irulan here.

I'm completely off the Webb VP Bus after reading Kathy G's case against Webb. She's right and everybody pushing/considering Webb should read it.

I think Edwards made too many statements strongly for the war and re-iterated his stance in order to appear tough with Kerry in 2004 when the talk was all about not wanting to change horses midstream.

I really like Joe Biden, however could his credentials undermine Obama more than help him? I know Biden has said he has no real interest in the VP spot, but that could be just playing the game. His straight talk on issues could get him into some trouble on the campaign trail, however the Dem's probably don't have a better attack dog. He'd much rather be Sec. of State though, but the key is for Obama and the Dems to get elected first.

My darkhorse is Brian Schweitzer, however given he is up for re-election in Montana this election, I don't think he is a viable option. I'd love Mark Warner, but he seems to want certain stability for his young family and he's pretty much a lock to grab the Senate seat in Virginia, and could probably keep it as long as he wants it - that's stability (and it wouldn't hurt him if he wants to make a Presidential run himself in four or eight years).

I read it--noteworthy and factual, in part-- then read the dissenting opinions.

Webb is not a god, just seems to me to be the right guy... unless a woman steps-up with a Bronze/Silver/Navy Cross and a son who's served in Iraq that can appeal to the Rust-Belt crowd and can side-kick Mitch McConnell in the sternum at a dead run while drinking a beer and bar-b-que-ing a Boston Butt on Boehner's flaming carcass. She must be able to field-dress Sean Hannity with the sharpened shoulderblade of Rush Numballs and be able to reload her own .308 brass while writing op-ed's and blogging for TPM.

'Bama/Webb

I'm incline to believe that Virginia will be the "Florida" of this election. Obama will be well-served to pick one of the three prominent Dems(Webb, Kaine, Warner) with VA connections. Of the three, Webb is the most unlikely despite the buzz around him as a veep candidate. Webb is way too blunt-spoken and does nothing for female Democrats(a group Obama needs to win). Warner would be a great choice, but it appears that he's set on running for Senate. Kaine looks like he might be the one. Given the term limit restriction on VA executives, he is the most likely pick for veep.

Thoughts?

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I agree that Wesley Clark would be right. He'd be a big plus to the ticket. The fact that he strongly backed Hillary doesn't hurt (and he may well have been her planned choice for VP).

No to Webb: I like him but in addition to not wanting to potentially harm the Dems' majority in the Senate, there is just too much baggage in his past writings and statements. Obama needs someone who isn't going to produce a lot of headaches in the next few months. Webb's writings & comments about female soldiers alone will become a big distraction.

Wes Clark provides all the military experience Webb has without the negatives.

Wesley Clark is more attractive as a blank-slate idea than as an actual flesh-and-blood candidate. In my opinion.

it's gotta be Wes Clark.

his military credentials and war hero status are unparalleled in Democratic politics (Silver Star and more in Vietnam, rappelling down a mountain to recover the bodies of American troops?), and his foreign policy credentials on military matters are easily enough to neutralize McCain's biggest and best argument. he's an authoritative, stern older white guy from the South that allows the hillfolk of the Appalachians and those like them something to connect with if they lean Democratic but are wary of someone with a funny name. by virtue of his military background, knows how to take orders and prosecute them firmly (the guy who told Milosevic "if they tell me to bomb you, i'm gonna bomb you good") from his superiors. and, maybe most importantly at this point, as a longstanding and loyal Clinton supporter Obama can offer the position to him instead of her as an acceptable alternative while assuaging all but the most vehement (but insane) feministas among her supporters.

he's perfect for the role in more ways than any other potential candidate is.

Senator Chuck Hagel: There are ways to deal with' a president who says 'I don't care' - strong and great name recognition.

or

Edwards!

No Republicans! That is the opposite of a bulletproof vest for Obama.

Regarding Hagel: However we may love his anti-Iraq stance, the man is a pro-life Republican

He's not just pro-life, he's strongly anti-environmental and,... well, just a right-wing Republican. On everything but the Iraq War, he's been one of Bush's biggest supporters.

Isn't diversity of thought and opinion a good thing? Shouldn't we be more inclusive? Must we only have a dialogue with those who agree with us? Isn't that like preaching to the choir?
Please read George McGovern's book, oops, it's not done yet, or Doris Goodwin Kearn's "Team of Rivals", regarding Abraham Lincoln' bipartisan cabinet, and so too his bi-partisan ticket in 1864.
I'm down with w4rusty2 on this one: Hagel!
Wesley Clarke would also be a fine choice, but unfortunately, he is not not a Democrat.
Methinks Obama will rise to his own challenge!

I don't think it's likely but I like an Obama/Gore ticket.

Gore is from Tennessee so I think it helps with the white working class Appalachian (aka. racist) vote.

I know Gore has said he isn't interested in the presidency because he has found a "bigger calling" vis-a-vie the climate crisis but maybe in the Veep position he could affect more positive change in that area.

And after all he did win the popular vote in 2000.

I didn't include Gore or Edwards on my list based on the assumption that they wouldn't do it -- "been there, done that." But I do think either would be great and, if I thought they were in the running, would definitely put them in my top tier.

I think both are looking towards 2012 themselves...

Besides the fact that he would never do it, he didn't even win the state of Tennessee.

It sure seems like alternative energies will be a huge general election issue. If Obama promised to let Gore oversee a Manhattan Project for alternative energy I wonder if Gore might be tempted to sign on for four years. Then next election Obama could annoint his successor. Gore is an odd dude and I think he just might go for this.

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Yes! Al Gore. For all the reasons I stated above and yours as well. I think he'd do it because he realizes how little time we have left to get global warming/energy sustainability right, and he would only have to campaign for 2+ months.

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I believe it's imperative that first and foremost, Obama choose a President. Not a VP candidate--a President. A known, vetted figure who will instantly be recognized as being ready to ascend to the highest office in an instant.

To me, that means the short list is limited to:
Edwards
Webb
Dodd
Clark
Biden
Richardson
Clinton

My order of preference:
1. Edwards
2. Webb

For lots of the various reasons we have all read about in the last few weeks. Although I'm cooling a bit on Webb, after having read the arguments of Kathy G and Ezra.


If Edwards or Webb are ruled out or rule themselves out, then my number 3 choice-which is actually my fave--is:

3. Christopher Dodd.

Upsides: Uber-competent, Irish Catholic, trustworthy, laser-sharp fast-talker, virtually gaffe-free. Great chemistry. Top-shelf attack dog. Fluent in Spanish. Champion of the Constitution. Brings necessary metabolism and urgency; his generally sharp, sometimes fiery mien complements Obama's cool reserve perfectly, but with none of Webb's awkwardness. But sense of humor leavens all that easily, and he and Obama really seem to get along well. Like Clinton, recites policy in his sleep. Like Biden or Clinton, eminently ready on Day One. Will likely solidify MA and NH support. Has two young daughters similar in age to Malia and Sasha.

Downsides: Senator; loss of CT Senate seat; no potential for continued leadership post-Obama.

I see Dodd as an anti-Cheney: he can go in with the explicit portfolio of restoring the Constitution, and destroying the structural framework of the unitary executive. Given his institutional knowledge and respect, he can completely realign the lines of power and communication among each branch of government, and with a great AG help rebuild the necessary walls between politics, policy, and prosecution. In essence, he and Obama will reassemble what John Dean rightfully calls our "Broken Government."

I think he also could be a one-term VP: help the Party win a historic election, fix the government, head into retirement (and continued joyful fatherhood) on the highest note possible. Give the President a chance to choose a new potential leader for the next generation.

re his Senate seat: he is fairly firm that he is resigning in 2010 anyway. So if he's the choice, I say he resigns his seat upon accepting his place on the ticket. This would allow Gov. Rell to appoint a temporary replacement, but just for a few months--the special election would be on the next CT General Election day: Nov. 4. I think Ned Lamont would have no trouble ramping up a new Senate run within 30 days of Dodd's resignation, and his numbers against any CT Republican other than Rell would be very strong. The risk is that Rell resigns and has Fedele, her Lt. Gov., appoint her to the seat. A Lamont-Rell race would be tough, but perhaps with Obama/Dodd coattails, it would be easier this year than in 2010.

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dammit. sorry about that. pls delete if you like, and I can repost.

Along,

If the following is really your most important criteria then why isn't Gore on your short list?

"I believe it's imperative that first and foremost, Obama choose a President. Not a VP candidate--a President. A known, vetted figure who will instantly be recognized as being ready to ascend to the highest office in an instant."

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absolutely correct, but I have assumed Gore has unconditionally ruled himself out of consideration. I believe he would consider it for the sake of serving his country, but I think he would make the rational case to Obama that he is not needed, that Obama can win handily with one of the other top choices. It would really be great to hear who Gore himself would recommend.

I think Webb would be bordering on disastrous.
I'm with you on Dodd. I think he's the best of all of them. He'd inspire confidence as the alternative President. He's terrific.

Does anybody know any negatives? (Other than he's another Senator, not a governor)

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I'm with you on Wes Clark up to the part about being a Clinton partisan. If I'm Obama (which I'm not :), no way do I want a potential Clinton mole inside the White House.

It just has to be Gov. Richardson.


1) They like and trust each other.

2) Richardson provides foreign policy continuity, as he has been integral not only to the Clinton presidency, but, on occasion, in the Bush43 administration as well.

3) He doesn't give an assassin a white guy as a replacement, should Obama be targeted.

As much as I really like the idea of Obama/Richardson I think Dems lose because of the racist vote if that's the ticket.

so you think racists will vote for a black president but not a black president with an hispanic VP??

I think they will vote for a black president IF they see someone standing next to him that allows them to believe that "darkie" isn't coming for them.

Obama lost WV by 40 points. People actually believe that he is Muslim because his name is Hussein. There is a interesting episode of the Daily Show that has some interviews with democratic WV voters that openly say on camera that they don't trust the black man. It might be ridiculous, but it's true. If we lose a couple of blue Appalachian states we lose in November.

I used to think there was no way there could be an all person-of-color ticket. Now I think it's entirely possible and in some ways would be akin to Clinton choosing Gore -- two candidates who break the mold and represent change.

I really don't see Obama losing votes because his running mate is Latino. On the flip side, imagine the Latino turnout Richardson being on the ticket could generate and how it might impact states like Arizona and Texas (in addition to N.M.). A ticket like this could also go a long way toward ameliorating some of the African American-Latino hostility (or perhaps mistrust is a better word), reinforcing the fact that Obama is a united.

Plus -- and obviously, this is most important of all for any VP pick by any nominee of any party -- in terms of his experience and achievements, Richardson may well be the most fully qualified person in either party to be president.

Sebelius: Popular Dem governor in a red state, good economic record, Woman (cougar), delivered a democratic response to the SotU address that was about as lame as Gov. Kaine's (VA) before.

Richardson: Best overall resume, likable, Latino, Delivers New Mexico and increases chances in south western swing states, possibly Florida. Once in a while though he totally shits the bed when asked questions most democrats should be able to give a decent answer to in their sleep.

Edwards: I could listen to him talk or not talk for hours about the two Americas in his southern accent. I'd rather see him run Justice or take seat on the supreme court.

Webb: I think he'd be more effective as a Senator. I was on the fence about him until I was reminded yesterday that he has a pretty long record of saying fucked up things about women serving in the military. That won't win women over in the GE and certainly won't win over any Hillary supporters. Plus, back when he ran for the senate, my republican dad swore that he wrote a book that has a line about a man putting his mouth on a little boy's junk. I don't know if that's true, but if he's on the ticket, people like my dad will be telling everyone they can, which makes it true enough.

Kaine: As mentioned in another post his vacancy would put a republican in charge of VA, and as I noted about Gov Sebelius, his democratic response to the state of the union address was really weak.

Wesley Clark: Counter's a lot of McCain's national security and military cred. In 2004 when democrats were still being called French Kissing Surrender Monkey's, I thought Kerry/Clark would be a strong enough national security/military/war decent ticket to counter the swift boating. His own presidential campaign was pretty lame though. His early support of Hillary smacked of VP desperation too. Same thing with Vilsack.

Rendell: He has serius diarrhea of the gaffe. As a Philadelphian I can also say he was just OK as mayor and as governor of PA he's rubbish. Not one of his policies has made my life better. Indeed most of them have made my life worse.

Napolitano: Yoinks AZ from McCain and adds the female cred to the campaign I think this election needs.

BTW, my personal order of preference goes:

1. Richardson
2. Sebelius
3. Edwards
4. Dodd
5. Napolitano

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Let me make a few suggestions on who should NOT be the VP choice:

a. No one who switched from the Republican Party after being elected to an office.

b. No one who has mounted a failed Presidential campaign.

c. No one who is a current or former Senator.

d. No one associated with the leadership or consultariat of the DLC.

e. No one who voted for the AUMF.

--------------------------

Personally, I favor a West-of-the-Mississippi governor like William Ritter or Kathleen Sebelius.

Bill Ritter has only been Governor for 17 months.

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I agree with those above who say not to pick a senator -- this election is the first ever (I think) where all the candidates are senators, and senators don't have a history of winning.

Whatever veep candidate Obama chooses needs to be able to pull in substantial votes in toss-up states or among specific demographics. Richardson can help in the Mountain states -- NM, CO, NV, and maybe MT -- and also can pull Hispanic voters. He's also pro-gun, which could help a lot in the mountain states. And, he has the best possible foreign policy credentials (and history of successful negotiation) for mending relations with all the countries that Bush has alienated. If not veep, then he's the first choice for Secretary of State.

Janet Napolitano can also bring the mountain states into play (maybe even take AZ away from McCain), could help bring back the women who want Hillary, and also carries a strong portfolio for sensible, equitable resolution of immigration issues.

Edwards has the primary advantage of being able to help take NC, but I doubt he'll pull anything else in the south and he'd probably hurt efforts in the west. Could Kathleen Sebelius bring in anything more than Kansas and maybe the Dakotas?

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I like Richardson a lot but he's a horrible capaigner. He kind of disqualified himself with his dissapointing primary run, I think.

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I don't think that Richardson is that bad a campaigner. He was primarily killed off by the media when they decided early on that they only wanted to focus on three candidates -- Clinton, Obama, and Edwards. Richardson got almost no media coverage outside of the debates, where he did pretty well.

i was an early supporter of richardson. HE alone is solely responsible for losing my vote, not the media. melissa etheridge gave him every opportunity to correct himself in the LOGO presidential forum when he claimed to believe that homosexuality was a choice - it was painful to watch him turn what could've been a simple gaffe into a total blunder. and that's what his campaign ended up being: a total blunder.

edwards actually helps bring in virginia in the 'south' and new mexico in the west.

i have this urge to rescuscitate the career of Gary Hart. He is scholarly and thoughtful, and has a strong resume on the environment, National security, and foreign policy. He would balance the ticket in terms of experience without losing the strong change message.

HAving read all the previous thoughtful comments, I am impressed both ny the nominations and the logic behind them.
Hillary-despite the hype, Hillary would not bring in Red States into play-Her vote in Ky and West Virginia probably reflects that either candidate would loose those states, they simply preferred her to Obama but would prefer McCain to either.Last Obama/Clinton give the Republicans the chance to use all the prepared attacks they have prepared for either if nominated. I frankly do not wish another, Whitewater, Clinton scandals campaign.
I like the idea of Clark balancing McCain, Sebelius would give both the women HRC backers, the red state issue and the non Washington insider factors.
There was something appealing about the Obama/Edwards endorsement rally about the chemistry and attractiveness of the duo.
Sebelius, Clark, Strickland are my short list, Edwards as a sentimental favorite.

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Tom Brokaw.

(1) He's spent his whole life being an objective journalist, so he's a blank slate. Nobody can complain that he's too liberal or too conservative on some issue. He won't have to backpedal from views that differ from those of the nominee or the party (cf. Lieberman and affirmative action).

(2) He's spent his whole life on TV, so he'll certainly do well in the VP debate.

(3) He can make a case for Obama among old while people (i.e., the people who actually used to watch Brokaw/Jennings/Rather every night), who trust him and don't trust Obama (because, on average, they're more prejudiced than younger people).

(4) How better to emphasize that the Democrats are the party of reality than to put a lifelong news reporter on the ticket? People are more likely (for good reason) to give weight to the opinion of someone who rarely voices his opinions -- when he does, it's an event. Brokaw can say, "I spent my whole life reporting the news, finding out the facts, interviewing people, trying to get the whole story. And over that period of time, I've come to my own conclusions about politics and our political system." And then he can say that he has come to the exact same conclusions as Obama. Brilliant.

(5) Obama represents a lot of change. Brokaw would be a change, too, because he's not a politician. But he also represents continuity with the past -- with the "Greatest Generation," with the era of the network news, with all the historic events that he reported to us over the years. He can provide the feeling of continuity that you would get from an old, familiar politician from the Clinton-era past (Gore, Rendell, etc.), but without the associations to the old politics that Obama is trying to get us to leave behind.