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Paul Krugman is Confused

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Hillary Clinton's most eloquent partisan, Paul Krugman says he's "confused by the Obama campaign. With Senator Clinton as the nominee, the coming election campaign is simple--"return with me now to the great days of the first Clinton Administration."

Democrats can justly portray themselves as the party of economic security, the party that created Social Security and Medicare and defended those programs against Republican attacks -- and the party that can bring assured health coverage to all Americans.

They can also portray themselves as the party of prosperity: the contrast between the Clinton economy and the Bush economy is the best free advertisement that Democrats have had since Herbert Hoover.


So is the election of 2008 about restoration or reform? Obama's whole campaign is based upon the notion that our politics have been corrupted and that only a reform agenda will clean them up. Writing about the start of the 20th Century, Richard Hofstadter noted that the progressive reform movement "was the effort to restore a type of economic individualism and political democracy that was widely believed to have existed earlier in America and to have been destroyed by the great corporation and the corrupt political machine."

Obama argues that our task is similar to that faced by Teddy Roosevelt when he took on "the malefactors of great wealth" in 1904. Whether he is the vehicle to engage us in that reform project will probably be decided by the voters of North Carolina and Indiana. But for Krugman to pretend that the influence of money on politics was not critical to the derailing of reform in telecom, health care,media, banking and the military in the first Clinton administration, as it remains so to this day--is to be truly confused.


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Krugman knows Hillary will give him a top post in her administration and he is more than willing to shill for it. It's great for Hillary that she snagged him. It's bad for Krugman that he's become such a shill.

Krugman has an impeccable reputation as a progressive
economist. He is one of the most brilliant thinkers
of our time.
Throw dirt on him. Kill him off.
Obama doesn't need his kind of evil!

So disagreeing with him is now equated with throwing dirt on him? Killing him off? Don't you think that's a tad hyperbolic?

It's like "my economist makes your economist look like dirt" kinda thinking.

In that piece Stiegliz made a brilliant speech on the economy. Funny but I did not heart about it.

In any case Hillary is a policy wonk as Krugman says. Obama is not, to put it mildly.

"In that piece Stigliz said that Obama made a brilliant speech on the economy" it should read

I wouldn't doubt that Krugman would have employment in a Clinton administration, though he denies it.

I've just written about this very same opinion piece here, and my chain was equally yanked by it:

http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/2008/04/healthcare-obama-and-clinton.php

Anyone who does not support Obama is a
corrupt, racist scumbag with an ulterior motive!

Who said that? I think you have a penchant for hyperbole.

.Deluding the masses with transcendent visions of harmony prosperity and peace is NOT change that I can believe in. Obama is not a different kind of politician. He is just a lot cleverer at deceiving the unwary

Almost a pure Ad Hominem fallacy.

Krugman makes point A B and C favorable to Clinton.

TTGZ says that he is looking for a job in a future Hillary administration.

This is the kind of crap that needs to be deleted at TPM Cafe in my humble opinion. I don't care if things get heated between people, it is the sheer volume of stupidity that is going to drown this enterprise.

I noticed that many of the old people do not come around anymore. Instead we have people post who really should not be posting here in the first place not because they resort to personal attacks (that too), but because their commentary is so inane, that it is aesthetically displeasing for the rest of us to have to wade through this sea of crap to hit a reasonable poster.

Don't know what you can do about it in practical terms, but it is a problem we did not have in the old times

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Paul Krugman is Confused
Another day of smear attacks against Paul Krugman by extreme intolerant Obama church of Hate.
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. . . when [Teddy Roosevelt] took on "the malefactors of great wealth" in 1904.

Except for winning the four western "silver states" that Bryan captured in 1900 (and which he didn't need), TR won and lost the identical states McKinley -- the poster boy for "malefactors of great wealth" -- had won and lost in 1900.

TR has had great PR, but it didn't get him elected in 1904 and it won't get BO elected in 2008.

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The last administration Krugman worked in was Reagan's. Nothing that he has ever said, to my knowledge, indicates that he would ever want to go back to government. Between his writing, his teaching at Princeton, and his role as a NY Times pundit, I believe that he feels that he already has enough impact on public policy.

As far as his so-called confusion, I don't see where money is ever off the table. Obama is using money in his campaign as does every successful politician

Mr. Obama was supposed to be a transformational figure, with an almost magical ability to transcend partisan differences and unify the nation. Once voters got to know him — and once he had eliminated Hillary Clinton’s initial financial and organizational advantage — he was supposed to sweep easily to the nomination, then march on to a huge victory in November.

Well, now he has an overwhelming money advantage and the support of much of the Democratic establishment — yet he still can’t seem to win over large blocs of Democratic voters, especially among the white working class.

Whether he is successful or not will depend on how he runs his campaign - on the same playing field as every candidate.

Roosevelt became president by chance. And he only became a Progressive after he was shunned by the Republican party in 1912. And if you remember correctly, Roosevelt was big on American imperialism (Cuba, Phillipines), so I'm not sure that one would want to put him and Obama in the same breath. I think he is one of George W. Bush's favorite presidents.

In any case, all Krugman is saying is that the duty of the senior Democrats, who have the wisdom of experience, to make sure that in this very close contest (nobody seems to make the case that this is one of the highly contested primary races in a very long time - when was the last time there was an actual race this late in the game), the best choice is made in order for the party to win in November. All Krugman is doing is pointing out that possible the point of Obama's campaign "Change" may not bring enough electoral votes to the Democrats.

I know that way before there was any campaign at all, living through the disasters of the current administration, all I wanted in the next president was competence combined with wisdom. That would be change enough.

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I guess I'm confused as to how to use the html tags - only the first two paragraphs in the brown section are Krugman's. Sorry...

It is true that an editing feature would be nice.

You must close the tags. If I understand correctly (I don't see a "brown section", but see a gray section).

After "....white working class." You should have close the blockquote tag with .

Again, assuming I'm correctly understanding.

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This is one of Krugman's most pathetic columns ever. I stopped reading him long ago, once it became clear he'd lost all objectivity. But this one I read, and it's classic.

He sets up a ridiculous strawman about how Obama was "supposed to be" a transcendent figure. And then he manages to tear it down. Wow. How impressive. NOT!

Any two-bit political hack could have written this article. There's barely an ounce of "economic" insight in it. Who does this guy think he is?

-- ARG

So are you saying that Obama IS NOT selling himself as a transcendent figure? What about all his talk about changing Washington and politics as usual? So he is saying that the way things have been done in Washington in the past--both by Republicans and Democrats--is going to change under his administration yet you claim he is not pitching himself as Mr. Transcendence?

There is no straw man fallacy at all. You need to revisit Straw man Fallacy my friend. Straw Man fallacy is committed when a person distorts another's position and then attacks (successfully) the distorted version. Krugman is not distorting Obama's pitch he is merely reporting it and if you think he is distorting it you must not have been paying a lot of attention to the Obama campaign.

Krugman is, like Mr. Taplin, is entitled to express his opinion and should not be vilified for doing so.

Mr. Taplin presents a reasoned, civil response to Krugman's column, which was also reasoned and civil.

Some folks need to learn to separate the politics from the personality, and accept that just because someone doesn't share you opinion doesn't necessarily mean they're wrong, or bad.

“The attacks from the Clinton campaign have been badminton compared with the hardball Republicans will play this fall."

If that is the case, then how does he explain the fact that Clinton and her surrogates have unloaded on the Obama campaign over Rev. Wright, dubious at best connections to William Ayers, and even squeezed in a thoroughly scurrilous reference to Farrakhan, while at the same time many Republicans in North Carolina are repudiating the State party's decision to run a an attack ad featuring Wright in that state. It seems to me that the Clinton campaign is willing to do what even the Republicans are having a hard time justifying.

Maybe he can explain that one in his next column?

I think you're confusing the abc moderators with the Clntons.
What is most strange is the way the media ignores the attacks from the Obama camp.

Never confuse an Obama supporter with the facts. In that respect they are like the Neocons: beyond the reality based community. They are marching inexorably towards...what?...destiny? Not quite sure

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"Krugman knows Hillary will give him a top post in her administration and he is more than willing to shill for it."

"I wouldn't doubt that Krugman would have employment in a Clinton administration."

This thinking is on about the same level as shouting "your mother wears army boots."

Krugman, on the other hand, has a long record of (pretty nearly) impeccable commentary over a period of years. I sincerely hope that there are a lot of Obama supporters who aren't so closed minded that they are unable to appreciate Krugman's critiques of Obama and the Obama Campaign. I'm embarassed for those who mistakenly think that Krugman is a Clinton shill or that what he has had to say about Obama isn't fair, accurate and, in the end, quite helpful.

Krugman has done his share of shouting about army boots over the last 6 - 12 months. This latest column is simply a re-hash of thoughts he's given again and again ever since he decided that he didn't like Obama's healthcare plan.

I think the most worrying thing about Krugman is his sheer hypocrisy. He himself has argued on several occasions for a single-payer national health system. He has defended it vigorously. But now that the Clintons are proposing a mandate, he's singing a different tune, which goes like this:

"M-A-N-D-A-T-E ...

that's the plan from Hill-a-ry!

Man-date, Man-date -

screw Obama, Hillary's great!"

...and it never really goes much beyond that. Do I think there's been a deal between the Clintons and Krugman? No, probably not. I simply meant that he could have a job if he wanted it - he's smart, intellectual and loyal. Everything they need.

I sincerely hope that there are a lot of Obama supporters who aren't so closed minded that they are unable to appreciate Krugman's critiques of Obama and the Obama Campaign.

Yeah, my problem with Krugman is that he's ONLY targeting Obama. Both Clinton and McCain have flaws in their campaign and their policies, but Krugman never addresses them. He's set his sights on Obama for some reason, and unless you're totally dim, you have to assume it's because he has a vested interest in Obama not becoming president.

I would have more respect for Krugman if he grew some balls and said, "I endorse Hillary Clinton."

I don't deny him his "progressive economist" bonafides, but he has certainly been a partisan Clinton support throughout most this campaign. If Obama wins, I hope Krugman will support the democratic nominee and provide his economic insights.

"Well, now he has an overwhelming money advantage and the support of much of the Democratic establishment — yet he still can’t seem to win over large blocs of Democratic voters, especially among the white working class."

Jeez, a black guy is losing the white working class to a white candidate who has reinvented herself as a shot-and-a-beer populist. I can't imagine why he's not winning those voters, who so reliably vote on their perceived economic interests.

I was a big fan of Krugman's, and probably will be again soon. But he is so deep in the tank for Hillary that I think the lack of oxygen is making him stupid.

Hillary Clinton's Last Hurrah!
Hillary Clinton's win in Pennsylvania with a 9.2% margin is indeed decisive and a morale booster. However, this translates into a pledged delegate pick of 10 only Hillary's 84 to Barack's 74. In the overall pledge delegate count Barack leads Hillary by 1494 to 1333, a lead of 161 delegates.

In Pennsylvania, the core constituencies voted in their usual pattern i.e. young, well off as well as African Americans for Obama and women for Clinton. The blue collar white workers however made the difference as they were not able to overcome racial prejudices and tilted the primary in Clintons favour. Most polls did indicate that Clinton will win by between 6 and 10 per cent. A poll conducted by a local university came closest to the actual result.

Pennsylvania is Hillary's last Hurrah as Obama is leading by over 15 points in North Carolina and is almost even in Indiana. Mathematially, Hillary has no chance to gain a lead in pledged delegates. But who cares about them, the Clintons (both Hillary and Bill) used all the dirty tricks they could against Obama to win Pennsylvania. New York Times was quite right to criticise their Republican like tactics. It seems that Clintons are hell bent on snatching the nomination even if their fight destroys the Democratic Party. This has already given respectability to McCain, who was otherwise visibly a weak candidate.

There is however no indication that Hillary will quit after Indiana and North Carolina. Clintons will probably go even more negative and use Karl Rove style strategy (James Carville is beginning to sound more like him every day) in order to muddy the waters and confuse super delegates so they hold off siding with Obama. Their game plan seems to be that if there is no clear nominee until the convention they can then deploy back room bargaining to win on the second ballot. This process will weaken and damage the Democratic Party and their chances of winning the White House in November will be greatly reduced.

According to latest Rasmussen Reports, Hillary is still viewed negatively by 53% voters (highest amongst the three candidates) and despite Pennsylvania they give Obama an 81.1% chance of winning the Democratic nomination (link below).

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/election_20082/2008_presidential_election/daily_presidential_tracking_poll


It is now up to the Democratic Party leaders and elders to decide if they want the fight to go on to convention floor in August and lose the White House in November or decide on a nominee after May 5 primaries. This can be accomplished by asking the 300+ uncommitted super delegates to decide now.

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The election of 2008 is not about either restoration or reform, it is about continuing the same failed policies of the recent past. The rhetoric may differ but don't you believe it. It's 2006 all over again on a grander scale. There is too much money being made by politicians and their corporate friends to change anything, except to make it worse (like forced medical insurance). This election hoopla is merely an opiate for the masses.

Or do you believe that the Dem candidates are compassionate liberals?

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Don - how about a list of failed policies of the recent past... I think that would prompt a stimulating discussion. What should be changed. Also, how are these policies that have been 'recent' failures, different from policies from the further past?

I hope I'm not too off-topic by asking...

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gbrook,
re: failed policies of the recent past

some:
* huge, unjustifiable corporate welfare military expenditures (by far the most significant)
* military aggression as the principal foreign policy option
* uncontrolled presidential powers, including executive privilege, signing statements and executive orders
* increased intrusion into our private lives justified by a hoked-up terrorism threat
* failure of congressional members to represent citizens
* inadequate health care
* drug war
* "free trade" agreements which are really covers for exporting jobs and corporate welfare
* insufficient priority on domestic needs including education and mass transit
* general disregard for global warming
* continued bias toward Israel vs. its neighbors
* poor enforcement of labor rights
* immigration

I used the word "recent" to emphasize the worsening trends in all of these (especially in presidential power and military aggression) and to eliminate any confusion that I might be referring only to the Clinton administration.

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* ethanol subsidies
* agricultural price supports
* Cuba embargo
* Dodd/Frank lender bail-out bill
* 2005 screw-the-consumer Bankruptcy Bill

True; they're not new policies, just timely in their egregiousness.

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Thank you, Jonathan Taplin. This latest effort on Krugman's part is a real doozy, ain't it? I wonder how many folks actually bothered to read the entire piece before weighing in here. Go ahead, I dare any of you, it's execrable on so many levels that I'm really curious to see the piece itself (rather than Paul's reputation) be defended by anyone.

Rather than make vague accusations, why don't YOU offer a criticism of it. This is more typical Obama fans level of discussion. “I dare you to support any point Krugman made!!!”. Gee this is what I call cheapening the quality and reputation of TPM

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So, I take it that's your defense of the piece in question? Rousing.

For your information, the Krugman speaks for itself. Generally speaking, when a reputable economist and commentator writes a piece in the NYT, it is not automatically demanded by a reader to "defend" the piece or accept it as worthless trash. That's absurd. And only you Chino Blanco could come up with such a crazy rule of debate. When someone presents an argument to the public you don't demand from the person that s/he should defend it. The defense is implicit in the argument. Duh! You, if you see flaws in the argument have to point these out, the criticism and then wait for a reply.

Yet you Chino Blanco have the absurd belief that you need not point out any flaws in Krugmans argument, but that it needs a defense a priori.

Sorry guy, that's pretty lame even for an Obama supporter.

What bothers me about Krugman is not his desire to see The Clinton's Restoration.

It is that he claims that the voters who support Hillary do so because they know all the policy ins and outs. There is ample evidence that Hillary's support is strongest among rural, un-educated, less-affluent white voters.

That does not mean that ONLY those voters vote Hillary, but it is a fact. To say that under-educated, poor, rural voters choose Clinton because they are smart is not only a stretch, it requires a Clintonian "That depends on the meaning of what 'smart' means" abandonment of reason.

I voted for Hillary twice and Bill twice. I wish I could have my vote back. Hillary, like her husband, cannot get anywhere near 50 percent of the vote. Unless The Clinton's get a Marc Rich or somebody to fund Ron Paul, she will lose against McCain.

Krugman is a Clinton ditto-head, and he is at least as smart as Taylor Marsh, but I have mailed back his books and wish him and The Clinton's and all you Clinton-lovers good luck. When Hillary is President, the Democratic party can start enjoying the endless personal wars and White House Sleepovers for "Special Friends of Bill and Hillary" and remember who cares if we lose both houses of Congress!

Isn't having The Clinton's back worth a little suffering?

a little bit of education and a latte is a dangerous thing. Trust me on that

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Such causality issues.

The way I see it is that if not for Bill Clinton we would have had Republicans in both the executive and legislative branches throughout most of the 1990's. Can you imagine how the Supreme Court would look today?

And my memory is that despite the huge efforts made to prevent him from his job, he was able to compartmentalize and run a pretty decent governing organization, while at the same time dealing with defense attorneys, etc.

I can assure you that if the next president is a Democrat, he/she will be facing the same, dare I call it, right wing conspiracy.

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So the thrust of Krugman's argument is Bill Clinton is responsible for the economic prosperity of the '90's so if his wife is seated economic prosperity will return?

I thought Krugman was an economist. Obviously I thought wrong. Krugman, and the rest of America, has to get that an economy based on the principles of capitalism will be flush for a while and be in the doldrums for a while. Who is president, even a Clinton, is powerless to make it otherwise.

So phelicity, you wouldn't blame Bush for the poor economy either then? The usual ups and downs of the economy will continue as long as we have an economy based on "principles of capitalism?" So we should elect a socialist then?

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You got it, Guerilla.

A socialist? A capitalist? Makes no difference as long as an economy is set up to run on supply and demand. When supply outruns demand, the economy goes into recession. When demand outruns supply, the economy thrives.

Until someone can figure out how to control human behavior, that would definitely be a first, suppliers will continue to reap profits from the demand and ultimately create over-supply which in turn probably screws them and, enmasse, sends the economy into the doldrums.

I think the problem is that we put too much of the blame, if things are bad; or the credit, if things are good, at the feet of the President. Yes, some of the things they do will have an effect on the economy, but no one person can control or drive market forces. There are always multiple factors. For example, the rise of the Internet and the following dot-com boom played a large role in the economy of the 90s. Clinton did a great job reducing the deficit and cutting spending. And NAFTA, despite all the recent campaign talk, was a good thing. It does perhaps need some tweaking but I don't think it should be vilified.

And we like to blame Bush for the shitty economy right now because well, he's just so easy to blame, but it's not really all his fault. Are there things he could have done to avoid the level it has reached? Sure.

It seems to me that every time any "bubble" bursts the biggest culprit is overeager speculation. It would also appear that we never learn. 1819 - the "Panic of 1819" resulted out of excessive land speculation in the West, faulty loan practices, widespread foreclosures, etc. Sound familiar?

I agree that the President gets too much credit for good times and too much blame in bad. In the game of politics, however, it always helps to take the credit or place blame as appropriate to win the election for your side. I wouldn't hesitate to blame the poor economy on Bush - it may be our best argument in the election (yes, ahead of even Iraq). That said, Bill Clinton took some steps early in his Presidency to control the deficit that were deeply unpopular with his base but proved enormously beneficial to the economy and he deserves a good deal of credit. Bush's disastrous tax cuts and costly war did little to improve the economy and have drastically hampered his or the next President's ability to maneuver.

I won't necessarily blame Bush for the recession (I think Greenspan's low interest rates causing unsustainable inflation in the housing market is more of a factor), but running our national budget into deficit the minute he git into office certainly limts what we can do to get out of it.

Forgive me, but a man with a gray goatee should know better than to believe claims that Obama or any other politician is going to bring in a whole new world of reform. And judging by some of the cynicism you've directed at Hillary I find it hard to believe that you are really that naive or that idealistic.

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Paul Krugman's convoluted polemic against Senator Barack Obama essentially boils down to the eliptical concluding statement he made at the end of “Clinging to a Stereotype” (New York Times, April 18, 2008):

... let’s hope that once Mr. Obama is no longer running against someone named Clinton, he’ll stop denigrating the very good economic record of the only Democratic administration most Americans remember.
In the first place (taking undemonstrated assertions in reverse order), those Americans who can only remember the dysfunctional Democratic presidency of William Jefferson Clinton belong to the demographic cohort that graduated from high school in about 1980, which makes such persons at most something like 35-45 years old. That constituency has so far indicated overwhelmingly its preference for Senator Obama. Quite to the contrary, those older demographics (especially the female component) who can remember the Democratic administrations of Kennedy, Johnson, and Carter (if not Truman) as well as the former Bill Clinton administration have most often shown a preference for Senator You-Know-Her in certain (but not all) economically hard-hit states. I simply cannot fathom what on earth professor Krugman meant to imply with this incoherent and self-contradictory demographic reference.

In the second place, it does not constitute a "denigration" -- by Senator Obama or anyone else -- to note that many of us Americans (many with college degrees) now approaching our first Social Security check (in downwardly adjusted, inflated dollars) lost good career jobs with health care and benefits after Bill Clinton took office in 1992. Many of us have remained virtually unemployable due to our "middle age" ever since. For Senator Obama to call attention to this and other unpleasant economic facts of the last sixteen years does not amount to the blanket denunciation of "someone named Clinton" that Paul Krugman alleges.

Third, Krugman speciously implies the unproven existence of a quasi-incumbent "someone named Clinton" (just which person named "Clinton" he cannot bring himself to say). In fact, no such "inheritor" of the presidency exists and spousal co-habitation with a mere-plurality president does not carry with it the presumption of osmotic "experience" transfer to the unelected spouse. Senator Obama, on the other hand, has defined his candidacy in terms of running for President of the United States on a platform of change and not "against" any particular other candidate. Again as a matter of factual observation, two persons named "Clinton," namely Bill and You-Know-Her, have done little since the Iowa caucuses but run against Senator Obama. And Paul Krugman has uncritially followed suit.

I liked Paul Krugman's book The Great Unraveling and occasionally enjoy reading his economic analyses in the New York Times. Yet like many other of his sometime-admirers I find his jihad against Senator Obama -- not to mention his transparent touting of Senator You-Know-Her -- curious if not disappointing. But more than this, and finally, I find it an egregious insult for Paul Krugman to imply that Senator Obama will somehow recant his views on any number of matters once he no longer has two "someones named Clinton" desperately biting at his ankles. The American electorate quite simply wants a change from what we've had to something better that we demand. Something important about the difference between past and future -- and about Senator Barack Obama -- escapes Paul Krugman. He really misses the whole point of this election with his nostalgic obsession for two bedraggled political hangers-on whose many and notable failures a great many of us can still remember without wishing the next Democratic Party President of the United States anything but the best of luck.

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Thank you, well put.

OK, now, I am finally convinced that Krugman is a shill. Clintonomics was, as economist Robert Pollin wrote, a hollow boom.

I like Paul Krugman often agree with him on most issues. However, I disagree with his assessment of the Clinton presidency, which was neither liberal nor progressive; in fact, Clinton's domestic policies were to the right of Republican Nixon. Did Clinton establish prosperity? Certainly he should be given credit for helping to do this but let's not forget that Bush I passed tax increases that aided 1990s prosperity. More importantly however, Clinton must be given full credit for continuing the worst policies of the Reagan years; rather than trying to overturn Reagan's anti-progressive policies, Clinton did much to countenance and legitimize them them. Clinton's DLC "third way" political agenda was and remains little more than GOP lite and I feel it should be categorically rejected by all progressives and liberals. I do agree with Krugman that Clinton's preference for health care mandates is more realistic then Obama's reliance on volunteerism; people won't volunteer to pay for health care if they don't perceive a need. The only truly universal health care system is one that includes everyone and that prohibits opt outs or any form of private coverage.

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Oddly enough, Krugman's position seems to be pretty much that Clinton can sell a lie better than Obama. I say this because Krugman has already written that the financial crisis will require massive amounts of federal expenditure in 2009 - and if that is so, it is hard to see how you squeeze in a huge reform of the medical care system. His predictions about what the economy is going to do, in other words, contradict his reasons for being for Clinton over Obama.

Why is Krugman so anti-Obama? Myself, I don't think Krugman is worried about his career - he's doing pretty well now, I'd say - I think his considerable vanity is piqued. Nineties Rubinomics was, basically, Krugman's policy - he was after all one of the architects of the justifications for the trade policy adopted by the Clinton administration - and he resents like hell Obama's attack on Clinton.

CNBC Friday April 25, 2008 6:32am with 2 Nobel Prize Winners (Economics)
http://www.cnbc.com/id/15840232?video=722561891

2001 Nobel Prize Winner (Economics) Joseph Stiglitz - Obama's speech on the Economy was Brilliant

Barack's Economy Speech:
http://www.barackobama.com/2008/03/27/remarks_of_senator_barack_obam_54.php

2006 Nobel Prize Winner Edmund Phelps (Economics) also thinks that Obama is the best of the 3 remaining candidates on the economy


So is the election of 2008 about restoration or reform?

That's the fallacy of false Dilemma

Krugman never said or implied that Hillary is running on restoration. And reform? what does that mean?

Hillary is running on the platform that she has posted and talked about since the beginning of the campaign.
You can take pieces of that platform and criticize them--perhaps saying that it is a policy proposal that harkens back to something her husband did as President that failed, but you cannot say that she is running on “Restoration” tout court. That's a cheap pejorative that you guys use to demonize the lady.

So is the election of 2008 about restoration or reform?

That's the fallacy of false Dilemma

Krugman never said or implied that Hillary is running on restoration. And reform? what does that mean?

Hillary is running on the platform that she has posted and talked about since the beginning of the campaign.
You can take pieces of that platform and criticize them--perhaps saying that it is a policy proposal that harkens back to something her husband did as President that failed, but you cannot say that she is running on “Restoration” tout court. That's a cheap pejorative that you guys use to demonize the lady.

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Personally speaking, I don't use "cheap" pejoratives when it comes to Senator You-Know-Her. I employ "inexpensive" ones. Since I try to make up my own, they cost me very little. If I wanted to use cheap pejoratives, though, I'd just use You-Know-Her's first name like millions of other "best friends" of hers who who haven't met her either.

You-Know-Her could have won my vote easily enough. She had nothing more to do than vote with 23 other U.S. Senators and 133 U.S. Congressmen against a known imbecile and his sneering Rasputin who fell asleep at the switch on 9/11/2001 and then lied a blue streak stoking mob hysteria towards a country that had nothing whatsoever to do with attacking America -- ever.

Not a lot to ask, but too much for You-Know-Her. She made a very bad decision and now she must pay for it. She needs to go down hard as an object lesson to future "all tough and stuff" poseurs who consider war a parlor game or personal ticket to political self-aggrandizement. The same goes for John McBomb. I want no more Warfare Welfare queens or monkey-on-a-stick militarists in the White House for at least the rest of my life. America needs a civilian president, not another maniacal moron martinet(te).

So she voted for authorization and now she is no better than the "known imbecile and his sneering Rasputin who fell asleep at the switch on 9/11/2001 and then lied a blue streak stoking mob hysteria towards a country that had nothing whatsoever to do with attacking America"

Ok. Somewhat harsh I'd say. Hers was by no means the deciding vote. She has said that had she known then what she knows now she would have never done it"

And what about Obama and his serial funding authorizations for the war? No big deal? Just inconsequential votes? A little double standard here perhaps?
I don't buy that that particular vote is the cause of all your animosity towards the lady.

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