Friday Afternoon Open Thread

To steal from the headline over at the main page, have reports of Hillary Clinton's demise been greatly underexaggerated? Or, to put it more directly: is the media accurately reporting Senator Clinton's relatively small chance of becoming the Democratic nominee?


Comments (26)

I vaguely remember seeing Hillary talking about how many countries Barack HAD NOT visited, compared to her. When this passport thing came up, I really wondered if it was her camp that was behind it. I mean, what if she said all that, and Barack said, "Yes, I did visit blah, blah, blah,"

Turns out she & McCain had their stuff looked at too, but Obama's is far more recent, and they all correspond either to a primary, or a major speech.

Still don't know what to think, but I do think that the media is feeding the fiction that she can catch up. The only way she can win it is to steal it, IMNSHO.

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Too bad MORE facts can't come out across the cable stations. Voters need to KNOW Hillary, short of a miracle, cannot win now.

All she's doing is tearing the party in two.

She could win still. If she won most of the remaining states with significant margins, she's still in it. Who knows what's going on with the super-delegates? What kind of deals? Why aren't these folks ending it now by announcing?

I have to wonder if the Clintons have something left to drop on Obama right before Penn.

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What better way to take the media off YOUR trail, then to have been a victim TOO.

No, the media is not accurately reporting her chances. This is the up-side for Hillary of Clinton rules.

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The political skills of the Clintons were apparently transferred from Bill to Hillary by the press, much like his governing experience was. Why Hillary's claims of experience and electability were never challenged is one of the most frustrating things about this primary campaign. These alleged strengths, which were a complete fabrication fed to and reported by the press, has been the only thing that has kept her viable since her 20-point loss in Wisconsin.

The Clinton campaign set out to control the narrative, and the press meekly obliged, suggesting that their inability to expose the misdeeds of the Bush adminstration, or even to report them accurately, is more an institutional failure than traditional bias. The media will simply report what it is told, and do no further reporting absent catastrophic failure of policy or viable political opposition.

Unfortunately for Hillary, her claims of competence and experience were so vastly inflated, and so easily debunked once the press finally smelled the blood in the water, that her train wreck of a candidacy should remove the aura of inevitability that still hovers around her campaign.

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well, someone's not being truthful. but the media have always been in Obama's camp, so I don't know if we can blame them.

and yeah, I think Clinton's done. and I say that in sadness, because I truly believe she would have made a better president than Obama--who in any case is going to have his ass handed to him by McCain in November.

I can't believe we all just participated in making sure America has another 4-8 years of Republican rule...

well, someone's not being truthful.


but the media have always been in Obama's camp

er...I think I found out that someone who's not being truthful --> gretz!!


To what media are you referring?

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"the media have always been in Obama's camp"

Sure glad they gave him a pass on that whole crazy preacher thing. That could have come back to bite him big time if they didn't hush the whole issue up.

Right! And the media has declared Obama the winner, since Hillary cannot possibly pass him in votes, hasn't it? Because, otherwise, they would be propping Hillary up with the hope that Obama will implode. Why would the media be doing that if they are for Obama?

Gretz? Any ideas?

Yeah, and they sure buried and discounted Hillary's characterization of Obama as "all words" and Bill's as "fantasy." And the experience thing, they completely ignored that, right?

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I find the MSM an increasingly unreliable source of objective news.

Especially investigative journalism. (Credit to those few MSM journalists who actually ask questions before going to print.) It's been the norm to automatically print a white house press release, a pentagon press release or a pre-written AP story and not even think twice about it. But these un-vetted pre-spun stories are now more obviously out of step with the facts.

So who are the modern day investigative journalists? People like Glenn Greenwald, without whom the telecom immunity issue would have never reached the public. With the help of bloggers pitching in more insight and collecting links to the facts, or info that contradicts those facts, wherever they are on the internet.

Granted, it's not easy wading through tons of propaganda, uninformed posts, and brain-cell deficit comments and all the other distractions. But after a while, you can see those coming from a mile away.

I suggested a few months ago that MSM newspapers and national news broadcasts have lost a good percentage of their audience because they are no longer the only outlets for distributing information. More importantly, those who have had the power to control the information flow for have had quite a sobering 8 years. And they don't like it one bit.

(Keep an eye on decisions made by the FCC that favor larger conglomerates, thus causing more and more independent stations in cities across America to go off the air. Newscorp continues to buy up an even larger portfolio of media real estate. It was recently reported that they made a bid for Yahoo, but that's not verified. Net neutrality is as important an issue as
telecom immunity.)

Back to the slow fade of MSM.

Anyone who oversees the advertising budget of a Fortune 500 company knows that their budgets for TV commercials have been reduced and those for the internet have dramatically increased.

There are already people who got rid of their televisions and now use their computers and large plasma displays for watching their favorite programs without commercial interruption, and essentially create their own programming preferences, not those the networks or cable companies choose for you.

Sorry for the long post, little bit of a rant there.

Keep the information flowing.

That's OK. At least you broke it into paragraphs so this poor half-blind middle-aged chick can scan it.

The whole news industry is changing; I betcha in five years we won't be able to remember this. Investigative journalists in the MSM are disappearing faster than Atlantic salmon.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/17/science/earth/17salmon.html).

I mean really, most daily campaign reporting comes straight from conference calls held by the campaigns (and Clinton's are apparently more fun; maybe they serve donuts), for years now our war reporting has come from White House press conferences; and it seems the most interesting reporting is taken by the NYT, CNN, etc. straight from blogs just like this one. So yes, I share your pain.

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I think The Clintons still have a very good chance of winning this thing. I won't feel comfortable about Obama until it's over.

Obama08

Somebody get the fork ready.

That lying monster is done!

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Er, thanking heaven that the Obama campaign has not acknowledged your "work" on their behalf.

"My great affection and admiration for Hillary Clinton and President Bill Clinton will never waver," but he added, "It is time, however, for Democrats to stop fighting among ourselves and to prepare for the tough fight we will face against John McCain in the fall."

--Bill Richardson, March 20

"Now Hillary and I were friends before this campaign started, and we will be friends after it's over."

--Barack Obama, February 21 Texas debate

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Bionic Soy, She might be done, but she's not done making trouble.

Death to the MSM!

Even if Clinton hangs in until PA (probably angling for a good cabinet appointment), once this Clinton/Obama thing is over the MSM is going to be twiddling their thumbs until the fall. I mean, look at what they've got to report: Bush tap-dancing in the Rose Garden waiting for a belated and then dismissive McCain, Bush on a conference call with soldiers saying he thinks it sounds romantic to be in danger and all, and God forbid they should have to send a reporter out to work for a living instead of riding around on a campaign bus.

THIS IS GOOD NEWS!! FOR THE MAINSTREAM MEDIA!!

(where is idiotic, anyways? I miss the li'l fella.)

Well, what do you expect? That they should cover the war? When they could so more easily just transcribe Dana Perino's pronouncements? Remember Vietnam, when we saw our soldiers on the battlefields every night? We also saw their caskets coming home.

Even though the Bush regime has made the latter illegal, the MSM still could cover every single funeral the families would allow; they could cover wounded soldiers; they could cover the forgotten families.

OH MY GOD! They could even cover Bush's personal military and awol time without being afraid of getting screwed like Dan Rather. Where is the courage? Or is it like Bush's, saying (without being challenged) that he would like to be on the ROMANTIC front lines.

I know, I know. It is embarassing to even ask someone who is lying to your face to confront that lie. Sometimes they even ask a good question, but when they get a bullshit answer, there is never a piercing follow-up; never a requirement to respond to the actual question.

I guess Stephen Colbert was right -- these reporters should just go home and write a NOVEL about being a reporter!

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Ironically, perhaps because I don't live inside the US media bubble, I've found MSM reporting to be both more honest and more balanced than anything I've found on a blog. I read TPM for the muck and for the quick news updates, I read the comments because I'm a graduate student and need something that's not my thesis for distraction.

In this campaign in particular I've found most blog sources to be so wholly in the pocket of one campaign or the other that their election coverage is unreadable. I give the example of Matt Yglesias--my go to source for the last few years--who I can't read anymore because his blind man-crush on BHO is so irritating and ruins his ability to report on the campaign in a way readable to anyone but (A) BHO supporters (B) blind HRC fanatics who want a fight.

It's the same here - all the clinton and obama talking points espoused by readers and supporters in the forums cannot substitute for a few ounces of simple, clear, comparitive, analytical commentary from a well-funded, well-trained major news source (TV doesn't count - TV news is the tabloid of the MSM world).

Get off your high horses blogosphere. You're here for a reason and we appreciate it, but replacing honest-to-god investigative journalists whose only agenda is figuring things out not advancing a political/moral/ideological position is not one of them.

Six huge corporations -- TIME WARNER, DISNEY (ABC), Murdoch's NEWS CORPORATION, BERTELSMANN of Germany, VIACOM (formerly CBS) and GENERAL ELECTRIC (NBC) -- now control most of the media industry in the US. More than 1 in 4 Internet users in the U.S. now log in with AOL Time-Warner, the world's largest media corporation.

I'm beginning to think the superdelegates should hold off and tip the scale in June, when the popular vote is tallied nationally, including Puerto Rico.

Except that the caucuses don't count popular vote; they would be excluded.

The caucus participants, the state votes, the ability to raise cash, the nominees net positives and negatives, and how they run against McCain all should be considered, if the superdelgates don't just go for the actual winner of the primaries.

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You're right, the left leaning blogosphere is very partisan with the Clinton-Obama wars and for the record I'm not a partisan of either side. I read the MSM for it's more objective approach to news and events and articles written by real journalists. Do they miss stories and fail to thoroughly investigate others, they sure do and the blogs will continue to point out their shortcomings.

To Andrew's question, yes the nominating process is effectively over. The longer it is dragged out the longer John McCain can travel around the world unchallenged like it's a pre-coronation event. And he has more time to incorporate Bush campaign staff into his own team. Bush may have done in his own legacy but the Republican Party is not dead.

I've been wondering why the number of Clinton posters has declined.

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The media picks the nominee and the media is 100% behind Obama because it will be a better story when the black man gets beat instead of the woman. The media led Obama up the primrose path because they knew McCain would beat him and that McCain could not beat Hillary. The media SWIFTBOATED all of us into getting behind Obama. It was a fatal error on the Democrats part. We bought it hook, line and sinker. It is not too late to get behind Hillary and defeat both the media and the Republicans.

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