Born Again Voters No Longer Favor Republican Candidates
That's the headline from the Christian pollster, The Barna Group. Whether you're fretting or glowing over tonight's returns, take a moment to gladden your Democratic heart:
In the 2000 election, the born again constituency gave Republican nominee George W. Bush a resounding 57% to 42% margin over Democratic challenger Al Gore. In 2004, the born again segment again sided with George W. Bush, giving him a lopsided 62% to 38% preference over Democratic hopeful John Kerry.In the past couple of elections, the born again vote represented about half of the total number of votes cast in the U.S. Given the razor thin margin of victory achieved by President Bush in 2000, and the close tally in 2004, the born again vote was vital in both of the Bush victories.
Compared to recent presidential elections, the current leanings of the born again constituency have reversed. The new Barna study shows that if the election were to be held today, 40% of all born again adults who are likely to vote in November would choose the Democratic candidate and just 29% would choose the Republican candidate. The remaining 28% are currently not sure whom they would choose, preferring to make their selection on the basis of the candidate than strictly on the basis of his or her party affiliation.
My purpose here, emboldened in boldface, is not to thunder that Obama stands the better chance to run off with these newly liberated voters, though that may well be true. My purpose is to remind you that this is still our race to lose. Eat your heart out, John McCain.
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Oh no, God People.
And lest anyone think I'm being dismissive, the God People have weird and wrong beliefs about evolution, stem cell research, reproductive choice, homosexual rights and freedom of expression, just to name a few...
February 6, 2008 12:50 AM | Reply | Permalink
The GOP will never have as much power as they've had, they will never have the press as much in their pocket, the opposition will never be as cowed, dissent will never be taboo as it was under Bush. They can't be more cynical, ruthless or unethical. They won't raise as much money. Their base can't hate us more, they will never be as energized as they were -- and we're still standing.
They've given us their worst, when we were the most trusting and naive, and we're in the best position we've ever been in.
They can't touch us.
February 6, 2008 2:26 AM | Reply | Permalink
By "God People", do you mean all Christians? Or just those that consider themselves "born again"?
I guess it doesn't matter, because either way, you're being prejudiced and stereotypical. Just because you know Mike Huckabee's views on all those issues doesn't mean you know about all "God People".
You seem to assume that all religious folk seek to implement their "weird and wrong beliefs" as public policy. (And while we're at it, who are YOU to dictate which beliefs are right and wrong?)
I'm a Christian, and while my personal beliefs on these issues may differ from yours, I am certain (if you're a liberal) that our political beliefs on them are almost entirely in line.
So let's just analyze the two sides here: Many Christians are supportive of stem cell research, reproductive rights, and gay marriage, even though those things might clash with their personal beliefs. You, however, insist that your beliefs are correct (not "wrong and weird") and seem to be mocking others' personal beliefs.
Oh, those crazy, close-minded "God People"!
February 6, 2008 9:03 AM | Reply | Permalink
Lots of people have all sorts of strange beliefs as far as I'm concerned. I hadn't noticed that evangelicals had a proportionally larger number of weirdos than any other group. Of course the nuttier ones do tend to attract more attention.
However, many evangelicals have now realized that value issues generally are not amenable to political solutions. Legislating morality is antithetical to the principle of separation of church and state but I doubt that has much to do with it. They just notice that GOP politicians promise a lot and then aren't ever able to get anything accomplished.
The only relevant question about anyone's beliefs when they are running for office is how would it affect policy. I have personal beliefs that if a politician proposed legislating them I would vote against him.
February 6, 2008 9:26 AM | Reply | Permalink
I'm not convinced they'll go Democratic. Too much is at stake for them. They're dealing with feeling "used" by the GOP right now, so less mobilized and more likely not to turn out in droves again. But wait for a little manipulation as we get closer to the election. I don't know what. I don't know if the trick of putting more gay marriage issues on the ballot in a key spot or two will work twice. But I don't share the optimism, especially if they've got Clinton around to demonize. I hate to generalize and incur Nick Kristof's wrath, but let's not forget they're plain nuts.
February 6, 2008 10:37 AM | Reply | Permalink
I doubt that they'll go democratic, too. In a general election, they'll vote republican - because they always do.
February 6, 2008 11:13 AM | Reply | Permalink
Yeah 'tee gee,' "god people." I think we all mean those obnoxious wack jobs that go around claiming that evolution is a myth, that the world is only 5000 years old, that Jesus cares whether you masturbate, that stem cells are sacred, and that there is a war on christmas. The morons and idiots who rail against the Homosexual Agenda, who fight the culture war but are fine with global warming. People who want to rewrite the American constitution to make it a Christian theocracy. People who are afraid of calico cats, who cover up statues breasts, and who couldn't be bothered to worry about terrorism because you know... girls gone wild videos are being shot and rented. People who endorse abortion... for the Chinese. People who are okay with Dictators and Warlords, as long as they're ours. Those people. 'God people.' That's who we're talking about. People who feel that their religious liberties are infringed when they're not allowed to oppress others.
But you say you're a Christian and you're not one of those crazy guys? You say you're offended when 'God people' are referred to disparagingly?
Well, allow me to give a rats ass. Two rats asses. A whole bucket of rats asses. That's how much I care.
Because you know what? I don't see your 'kinder gentler saner' Christian around. When Eric Rudolf is blowing up planned parenthood clinics and gay bars, I don't see your bunch taking any positive action. When James Dobson or Jerry Falwell or Pat Robertson runs amuk, I don't see your bunch denouncing them for perverting Christianity. In fact, I don't see your bunch doing anything at all. Instead, you sit quietly like good little doormouse as the screaming lunatic contingent takes up the Christian brand and uses it as a club to beat anyone they don't like. But you never stand up for anyone. I guess that would be dissension among Christians. Can't have that.
So guys like you sit back and let the right wing appropriate Christianity, and then you let them drag it through the mud. Why are you guys silent? Where is your Dobson? Where is your Falwell? Where is your Robertson? Where is the sort of progressive moral voice that a guy like Martin Luther King represented? Why haven't 'progressive white Christians' ever produced that guy, and why hasn't he ever been heard?
Ah, but let a progressive make a disparaging remark about 'God people', once the Christian brand has been dragged through the mud and degraded into a bitter parody of itself...
And up pops a guy like you to pretend offence, to announce that you accept evolution, support stem cell research, believe in global warming and oppose gay bashing.
Well, big fat hairy deal.
Understand, I'm not attacking you personally. I'm attacking the narrow minded and petty attitude expressed in your post. In a larger sense, I'm attacking a failed culture of liberal and progressive Christianity. A culture which has failed because of its own cowardice and silence.
Go and read Martin Luther King's letter from a Birmingham jail. Read what he had to say about the moderate and liberal white clergy of Birmingham.
Then decide which side you want to be on.
February 6, 2008 11:50 AM | Reply | Permalink
Valdron,
(I got logged out while trying to post my reply the first time, so hopefully I can recreate the absolute brilliance and sheer irrefutability of what I wrote).
You provided a much narrower definition of "God People" than destor23 seemed to. I was not defending the people that fit into your definition of "God People". I was defending the people you went on to criticize for not somehow stopping the "God People".
I'm not offended (or try not to be) by any open exchange of ideas and beliefs. But yes, I am offended when average Christians get lumped in with the "God People" as you defined them. And that's what destor23 seemed to do, which is what I was replying to.
Mostly, I want to know what your suggestions are for "progressive white Christians" to stop the "God People". Should we shout them down, or shoot them down, or what? We don't condone their words or actions. We DO believe they pervert Christianity. And... what? How do we stop them?
Most of all, I take issue with your statement, "I don't see your bunch taking any positive action." Really? You see no Christians taking any positive action? If you don't hear Christians denouncing Robertson, Falwell, abortion clinic bombers, and so forth, you probably aren't paying attention. No one just stands idly by, but we don't have some magic power to shut them up or stop them.
I don't know why average Christians are obligated to stop crazy Christians any more than average secularists are obligated to stop crazy secularists. Both groups have their idiots. What are you doing to stop non-Christians or non-religious people from being stupid?
So I have to decide which "side" I want to be on? Are you saying I have to renounce Christianity to be a liberal? That, or I have to form some grand movement, comparable in scope and size to that of Martin Luther King Jr., to stop the "God People"? Are those my choices?
Or maybe I'll just live my life and be a rational, logical, Christian -- even if some believe that such a creature doesn't exist.
February 6, 2008 1:49 PM | Reply | Permalink
If you want to be president of everyone but God people, you're the president of a country the size of New England, more or less.
February 6, 2008 12:20 PM | Reply | Permalink
Colour me skeptical Todd. If you're claiming that a majority of Americans are bug eating whack jobs who believe that the world is only 5000 years old and evolution and global warming are a secular humanist plot, then its game over already. You might as well retreat to a cave while the 'God People' turn the place into Afghanistan West and start stoning women and gays.
The reality of America is that there are more bars than churches, there's more porno store clerks than preachers, Survivor got better ratings than James Dobson, and Britney Spears gets more tabloid coverabe than Jesus.
February 6, 2008 12:50 PM | Reply | Permalink
more porno store clerks than preachers
more bars than churchs
those are the plain facts
and anybody claiming that America is a "christian" nation has more cognitive dissonance than common sense
btw tee gee,your kneejerk defense of the whacknut christians is proof that you are indeed one of the whacknuts
true christians don't use the blanket defense to shield the pharasees in their midst
February 6, 2008 2:01 PM | Reply | Permalink
Wow, free patriot, I'll have to assume that you didn't actually read my post(s). I don't recall offering any blanket or kneejerk defense of "whacknuts" (and are they the same as the "God People"? I'm having trouble keeping track of my groups here).
The only defending I have done is of Christians who don't fit Valdron's description of "God People", which is most of us. Just because we're not as loud and obnoxious as the minority doesn't mean we don't exist.
February 7, 2008 1:35 AM | Reply | Permalink
Let's remember that not all Christians are "born again" and not all born-againers are part of the Religious Right (which group also includes non-Born again Christians and even a few non-Chrsitian religious people). And does anyone here really want to chase Christians out of the Democrat party? If so you're getting rid of a lot of reliable Democratic voters, notably Black Evangleicals. Indeed, you're getting rid of Barack Obama!
February 6, 2008 2:03 PM | Reply | Permalink
The burning question is whether Huckleberry's supporters are really Christians and do they really want to establish JesusLand?
February 6, 2008 2:38 PM | Reply | Permalink
Lot of voters are going to be home on the republican side. they really have bought into the idea that govt can stay out of managing the economy. but in the last century there has not been one administration, republican or democrat, that has affirmed that notion to be politically feasible.
February 6, 2008 3:23 PM | Reply | Permalink
""many evangelicals have now realized that value issues generally are not amenable to political solutions."
If and when liberals also realize the same is true of their own social agenda, we will be making some progress.
February 6, 2008 3:34 PM | Reply | Permalink
Nonsense, Duncan. The truth is that archconservatives have never been afraid to dabble in social engineering. Go back and look at Jim Crow. What was that, except a massive piece of social engineering. An eighty year campaign to keep the negro disenfranchised, impoverished, helpless and disadvantaged. Did it succeed? Wildly. Almost fifty years later, we're still wrestling with the massive social damage done deliberately by Jim Crow.
In contrast, actual progressive social engineering doesn't quite have that long and storied history, and it isn't accompanied by psychotic hatred. But Child Labour Laws, Minimum Wage Laws, Divorce Laws, Rape and Assault laws, extending the vote to Women, Civil Rights legislation have all had a positive effect. It's slow, and unsteady progress. It's often marred by the relentless opposition of hate ridden screamers. But it's working.
Y'see Duncan, the Liberal Social Agenda... it's not perfect. But it works. And it helps people to live better lives.
The Right Wing Social Agenda works too... if you like corpses piled up as high as the sky.
Sometimes it really is as simple as G vs E.
February 6, 2008 3:43 PM | Reply | Permalink
The liberal social agenda as I understand it is to create enough space for everybody to make their own decisions.
February 6, 2008 10:56 PM | Reply | Permalink
Erm, just like to remind those using the term "born again Christian" to describe a type of person they don't like, that just maybe they'd like to consider that two recent Nobel Peace Prize Winners have been known to describe themselves using that term: Al Gore and Jimmy Carter.
February 7, 2008 12:14 AM | Reply | Permalink
So y'all that don't want those who describe themselves as "born-again Christians" in your Democratic Party, can I ask how you plan to get rid of those two recent Nobel Peace Prize winners, Al Gore and Jimmy Carter?
February 7, 2008 1:00 AM | Reply | Permalink
In reply to teegee.
Read my previous letter once again.
Then go read Martin Luther King's letter from a Birmingham jail.
Name me one moderate/progressive/liberal Christian leader/activist around today with the stature of a Falwell, a Dobson or a Robertson.
If you surrender Christianity to these men, then why should we care about your outrage or your wounded pride.
February 7, 2008 11:12 AM | Reply | Permalink