How About the Billionaires?
It seems to me that most of the argument over “The Argument” this week has been about policy and ideas, which is great, this being one of the most idea-driven blogs around. But since the week is almost up, I do wonder if I might redirect things to address a huge chunk of the book that we haven’t discussed. Several of the commenters have made reference, in a complimentary way, to my reporting on the Democracy Alliance and its influence on progressive politics. And yet, while Joan and Ed and others have spent a fair amount of time talking about the bloggers in the subtitle, the billionaires have gone largely unexamined.
I myself am somewhat conflicted about the role that all these wealthy progressive donors play in the movement and in the book. On one hand, as I often say in interviews, there are an awful lot of rich people out there who are enjoying their days in opulence, paying too little in taxes and doing absolutely nothing for their country. And here we have a group of people who are willing to give their time and their cash to rebuilding what they call “the progressive infrastructure,” and that seems admirable to me.
On the other hand, the Democracy Alliance has from the start operated under intense secrecy, on the theory that private citizens can do whatever they want with their money, and they’re not answerable to anyone but the IRS. I reject that notion. As I point out in the book, they list “transparency in government” as one of their core principles—as long as it doesn’t extend to them. Now, don’t get me wrong: I think every American should use whatever they have at their disposal, within legal limits, to engage in politics. If Oprah Winfrey wants to go out and get Barack Obama elected president, well, more power to her. But politics isn’t just a business. If you want to buy a factory that makes widgets, I don’t care how you run it; if you want to dump $100 million into American politics, however, then I think you have to be accountable to the public. That’s why I thought it was critical to breach that wall of secrecy, and I think I succeeded.
The larger question here is whether freelancing millionaires and billionaires are good for the political process and for the progressive movement. Since several commenters have remarked on how much they appreciated reading about the inner workings of the Alliance, I’d be curious to have their thoughts. Thanks.



Comments (77)
Accountable to the public? Or accountable to the rank and file of the Democratic party and the voting constituencies who most look to it for effective representation?
These are different types of accountability. The first, accountability to the public, mostly seems of concern to the media when the billionaires are Democrats. I don't, for instance, remember much worrying over accountability for the powerful interests and wealthy players, many later represented in Ronald Reagan's "Kitchen Cabinet," who spent years supporting him (financially) while grooming him for the presidency. Nor much concern about accountability (to the public) in the relationship between the Bushes and Ken Lay -- until after W was in office, Enron was a disaster, and the administration's support helped its energy trading abuses wreck serious damage to the economies of California and the Pacific Northwest.
That kind of accountability -- accountability for the pursuit of their self-interest -- needs to, always and consistently, be applied to the wealthy backers of both parties. But rarely is.
But the second type of accountability -- to the party and its (less individually powerful) constituencies -- is, I think, more of an issue for the Democrats.
Why? Because the Republican party's powerful backers are straight-forward in their pursuit of their own best interest. They follow their self-interest and sell support for it to their rank and file. During the 1980 presidential campaign, for instance, I worked for an ad agency that represented one of the nation's largest defense contractors. Our client was a significant behind the scenes Reagan supporter and its executives were jubilantly up front about the reasons for their support -- big increases in defense spending and lower taxes. They took this position because it benefited them -- not because they thought they were representing, and thought it would benefit, lower middle class Evangelicals in Alabama. But, if required in pursuing their self-interest, they certainly knew how to, and had the money to, make an argument (that at least sounded plausible)for why it might benefit those Evangelicals too.
Wealthy Democrats on the other hand most often claim to be working, and sincerely intend to and believe themselves to be working -- and speaking -- in the common interest or the best interest of others.
And this, while perhaps noble, can be dangerous to the best interests of others.
In a political conversation, shaped by the gigantic cost of media access, the huge voices of the wealthy few, in either party, drown out everything else.
So when those Democratic billionaires, through the media time they buy, the consultants they support, the surrogates they put before the public, decide to speak for the rest of us, they sure as hell better know what they're talking about. And we, and they, have to make sure that when they speak, and act, they are correctly representing and furthering our interests rather than, out of ignorance, arrogance, prejudice, lack of experience, etc., undermining them.
September 28, 2007 7:19 AM | Reply | Permalink
Right, liberals with money are hypocrites, and look how much their haircuts cost. Liberals without money are just bloggers, motivated by no ideals greater than personal hatred of Bush. Thankfully, there is hope for the Democratic party if it abandons liberalism altogether and buys my book.
John
http://www.haberarts.com/
September 28, 2007 7:34 AM | Reply | Permalink
I find the points and analysis you present immaterial. If there 100 millionaires who give money or are active Democrats, what is this of any significance.
Actually, I don't understand the whole hoopla around your book. I am as progress as one can get (without crossing the Chavez line) and find your arguments ignorable.
September 28, 2007 7:42 AM | Reply | Permalink
This is an interesting argument, but I don't necessarily agree. The problem is that Republican donors may be acting in their self-interest, but they usually don't present it that way. There is usually a lot of flim-flam about "freedom" and "entrepreneurship" and so on. Sometimes there's a grain of truth to it. Often it's just a way of presenting selfishness and greed as a legitimate political philosophy. (Not that there's anything wrong with greed, IMHO. Just don't make the rest of us pay a price for it).
So when, say, Republican billionaires give money to support lowering their taxes but present it in terms of how much "freedom" their proposal promotes, I think it is worth shining a bright light on just how much THEY will be saving.
September 28, 2007 7:56 AM | Reply | Permalink
.
Makes one wonder a bit.
.
sPh
.
[1] Disgraced only because they pushed the Radical line a bit too far and got caught out; not disgraced in the Radicals' eye but heros.
September 28, 2007 8:03 AM | Reply | Permalink
I agree with you that they don't sell it that way. My point is that, unlike wealthy Democrats, they don't presume they are speaking FOR or working in the interest of others. They know that they can't get power without making a plausible sales pitch.
September 28, 2007 8:18 AM | Reply | Permalink
Actually, you might be surprised to know that's not true--I was. In the course of researching the book, I found, for instance, a very long multi-part series from the Washington Post in the mid-'70s on Joseph Coors and the organizations he was funding, including the Heritage Foundation. (It was actually written by a guy who was later a professor of mine.) It was suprisingly prescient, even tough Coors and other funders refused to cooperate. I just thought I'd share that. In any event, whatever work was or wasn't done on the conservative donors hardly seems like a reason not to demand some transparency from the funders in my book. Thanks for your thoughts.
Join The Argument.
www.mattbai.com
September 28, 2007 8:18 AM | Reply | Permalink
Some examples of the conservative super wealthy and their influence on policy:
Estate Tax Report (PDF)
the report details how just 18 families have pushed for the repeal of the estate tax. They have spent millions but stand to save billions.
Charles Koch
Koch and his brother have contributed to establishing the CATO institution and were responsible for buying a libertarian economics faculty for George Mason University. They own the largest privately held firm in the country. I'm betting you never heard of them.
Once again Matt Bai reveals his real agenda by picking on Soros, whose activities do nothing to benefit him personally and aim to promote democracy, while ignoring the much bigger right wing "philanthropic" effort which is designed to personally benefit the funders and is fundamentally anti-democratic. There is nothing new about apologists for plutocracy and denying that one is such a person is part of the modus operandi.
Rather than discussing plutocracy we get thinly disguised efforts to pretend to deal with philosophical issues on their "merits".
I do agree that the wealthy have too much power and this is antithetical to a functioning democracy, but let's be realistic about where this power lies.
--- Policies not Politics
Daily Landscape
September 28, 2007 8:22 AM | Reply | Permalink
Millionaire-oriented intermediary politics is a very real problem in Texas.
The TDP is operated for the benefit of one creditor: A wealthy, bored, essentially retired Dallas trial lawyer who resides in North Carolina and mostly piddles around in national campaigns -- specifically the EDWARDS campaign.
In Bernard CORNWELL's "Copperhead" series, there is a rich planter who raises a Confederate "Legion" named after himself but has to be promoted to Brigadier and given a staff-job in Richmond so as to not reduce the actual effectiveness of his unit and interfere with its own and LEE's competent officers.
The cornpone Democratic parties of ex-Confederate states are politically-correct and even cringing-liberal now, but the Texas one is still just a Jim Crow patronage-chain. It tries to govern in coalition with the GOP, but has no patronage to dispense as a party. The GOP here "don't need no stinkin' coaltion" now that they are a "majority" in this state with the lowest and most economically biased political participation rate in the nation.
Indeed, check out "earmarks" in Harris County:
The "Democratic Congress" allocates more earmarks to junior GOP reps than to senior Dem reps here.
No, this is a "red state" by virtue of a dysfunctional Democratic party, operating under a Jim Crow election code that we preserved but that is deeply subversive of our own latent Democratic majority.
The pathetic part is at least three more rich, bored lawyers operate independently of the party. A brace of other candidates -- much more credible than trial lawyers can be by their very nature -- are routinely sabotaged by a state and national party that says it "targets" races scientifically but actually simply maximizes the income of a few pimp-consultants who win by losing with their their max $/vote "best-efforts" media-campaigns.
But, that economic insantity is true of "infrastructure" regardless of the source. For instance, in the course of turning the DNC field staff over to the DCCC HQ staff in Texas, Howard DEAN did force the state party to buy a costly "voter file" package from his cronies in Boston, not, say, ICKES' cronies in Chicago.
Ironically, the DEAN package -- he is a doctor not an engineer -- is a fine package for running a few, targeted, single-member district campaigns in dinky states. It cannot be deployed or maintained on the scale of even North Carolina much less Texas, and it is useless for (a) developing the latent majority statewide or (b) running a straight-ticket "sweep" campaign in, say, Harris County, Texas, which is begger than 25 of the dinky states.
Remember those earmarks: The junior GOP reps do not so much get them as the bond-lawyers and lawyer-lobbyists who run the bi-partisan, political "ATM machines". They get these and allocate them to their clients. Both the Dems and Reps involved are of essentially no significance.
This lawyer-mediated, hence legal, corruption is a regime that alienates at least three other bored, rich millionaire trial-lawyers. But, it also feeds a Republican "populism" that allows the GOP to raise money as the patronage party with actual patronage but to run against a "government" that is thoroughly identified with Democratic "by-standers".
As a practical matter, the TDP is run by a former legislative aide for a former DCCC honcho, now self-styled "Politico", Martin FROST.
The TDP central staff control a field staff that is funded by the DNC. The net result: The DNC-funded, "party-building", field staff implemented the "targeted campaign" strategy in 2006 and minimized the "Blue Wave".
In fact, the party narrowed and channeled money and efforts into delivering two more "Bush Dogs" -- Ciro RODRIGUEZ and Nick LAMPSON to the Steny HOYER camp.
Currently, the DNC-funded field staff are busy maintaining a facade of support for the EDWARDS campaign, pandering to trial lawyers, and trying to co-opt the net-roots into helping to perpetuate the racial patronage-chain that passes for a party.
What passes for "party-building" are, first, attempts to "leverage" the one source of high-dollar with a variety of high-overhead, low-dollar fund-raising deals: These are sleazy telemarketing and direct-mail exemplars of segemented marketing.
Second, the HQ and field staff are piddling around with the "voter file", the wrong tool, and, for instance, not paying attention to matters involving the statewide voter-roll -- the right tool for GOP vote-suppression -- that the state and national party do not even fathom, much less have a plan to counter.
Look a party of doctors, lawyers, and preachers throwing around terms like "infrastructure" while playing petty games is infuriating to every other profession, especially accountants and engineers who, for instance, know the difference between a "file" and a "database".
But, also, there is simply nothing republican or democratic about a patronage-chain or, worse, a patronage-chain with no patronage, just a stupid foil for GOP pseudo-populists.
I look forward to reading BAI's book.
But, it probably won't be as good as Cornwell's, you know where every rich, bored planter bought raised a few hundred light-horse and made themselves a Colonel. LEE and JACKSON had to send the expensively-educated peacocks somewhere out of the way, dismount the men, and use the horses for wagons and caissons.
Even then, it did not work. Those idiots in Richmond would not arm the blacks and let Lincoln free the slaves here, eventually, rather than getting LEE to liberate them in Maryland.
Hell, I would rather fight for oil than for the vanity and cowardice of a smug, complacent, cowardly elite -- and that is just the Democratic enablers, not the GOP I cannot refer to further without using profanity.
::JRBehrman
September 28, 2007 8:44 AM | Reply | Permalink
I think donor groups, both Democratic and Republican, deserve more scrutiny. So tentative props to you for shedding light on the little-known Democracy Alliance (tentative only because I haven't yet read your book).
And let me wholeheartedly thank you for really engaging the community here and wading into the comments.
On a less flattering note, I just replied to you re levity and the state of our public discourse in an old thread.
September 28, 2007 9:23 AM | Reply | Permalink
Yeah, it's worrisome. But even though this doesn't express my views about transparency, I can see why the Democracy Alliance people don't want it.
For one thing, their own outsie-of-the-mainstream beliefs can reflect badly on the people and initiatives they want to fund. In 2004 Soros' support for the legalization of marijuana and his support of John kerry was twisted by Denny Hastert, on national television into: "George Soros gets his money from drug cartels and then gives it to John Kerry."
And of course on Fox news, of all places, we're told that Soros is funding some sort of liberal army that's out to destroy Bill O'Reilly.
Imagine it... a hedge fund manager dismissed as a radical. But it's working. It's getting to be that George Soros is the new Noahm Chomsky -- beloeved by college kids but otherwise unfairly protrayed as a crackpot extremist.
The thing is, the secrecy makes all of this worse. Ultimately, the billionaires have to trust the progressive rank and file to protect them a bit in the court of public opinion.
thosethingswesay.blogspot.com
September 28, 2007 9:29 AM | Reply | Permalink
Yeah, I've found the problem to be not that no one has ever covered these guys on the right (the Olins, the Scaifes and Mellons, Bob Perry of Swift Boat infamy) but that their significant roles have never become known widely (or demonized for how much they have damaged America).
I also got lectures in 2004 about the socialist atheist George Soros who supported John Kerry and the Dems. That's a huge Fox News talking point, something they discuss at least every few days still now. It's all part of the GOP focus on emotions and in-group, out-group relations rather than ideas.
I think that's part of why so many Dems focused first on tactics and taking the fight to the GOP rather than ideas.
September 28, 2007 10:19 AM | Reply | Permalink
C'mon, it's important for us to discuss how we want to proceed on our side.
Yes, we should all know much more and be aware of the funders of the right and how the Kochs poison both our politics and their oil companies release benzene in Texas. Can't we do both? Why can't someone choose to write about one side and not the other?
September 28, 2007 10:24 AM | Reply | Permalink
Ugh, everyone should go to that link.
September 28, 2007 10:26 AM | Reply | Permalink
Soros isn't exactly secretive about where he gives...and the treatment he has received would certainly reinforce Democracy Alliance members' desire for secrecy.
Soros is a real hero. Someone who made a fortune and is spending in on real ways to spread democracy throughout the world, financing elections infrastructure and civic engagement capacity-building all across the globe. All that he has accomplished, however, is ignored by vicious reactionary republicans who feel compelled to demonize everyone who opposes them, so he is accused of being a Nazi collaborator while a child (a child!!!) and the list goes on.
Why would anyone volunteer their name in this atmosphere -- particularly when those on the left who are getting money from his foundations and from him directly are so unenthusiastic about his work and do such a poor job of sticking up for him when these ridiculous charges are made. There seems to be a pathological need on the left to denigrate our financial supporters to prove we aren't bought - so we collude in the right's mistreatment with our silence.
September 28, 2007 10:28 AM | Reply | Permalink
They are misplacing their trust if they do. We just can't counteract Fox News and AM talk radio effectively yet.
September 28, 2007 10:28 AM | Reply | Permalink
Well, I can't have everything, right? Thanks.
Join The Argument.
www.mattbai.com
September 28, 2007 10:32 AM | Reply | Permalink
You know, I think this is a good point, and I was probably remiss in not addressing it in the post, although I do mention it in the acknowledgements section of the book. That is, while most of these donors do operate in the secrecy I describe, Soros is different. His commitment to transparency, which has motivated him to spend hundreds of millions of dollars overseas, also animates his political work, and he has repeatedly spoken with me at my request over the years, entirely out of principle and nothing else. I do respect that, and I think his fellow philanthropists could learn from the example.
So thanks for bringing that up out in Oregon.
Join The Argument.
www.mattbai.com
September 28, 2007 10:35 AM | Reply | Permalink
It is a very popular right wing talking point and the bumper sticker version (shorter Bai?):
Soros= bad lefty billionaires
Ya' don't hear any criticism of all the righty billionaires, from the Catholic fundies to the old school Birchers to the Ahmansons and the list just goes on and on and on.
Want secrecy? Try getting into the annual Conservative soiree. Dobson don't want no stinking press in there while he kibbitzes with all those dirty sinners like Grover.
September 28, 2007 11:00 AM | Reply | Permalink
"if you want to dump $100 million into American politics, however, then I think you have to be accountable to the public."
Disagree. I think the essence of the Constitution is that you don't. It is the elected who are held accountable to the public. Absent criminal influence, the First Amendment protects everyone else, journalists like you as much as wealthy foundation supporters. There are many media organizations that easily spend $100,000,000 a year on news gathering and dissemination. I can't conceive of a First Amendment theory that says they are held accountable to the public, and I can't conceive of one that would distinguish $100 million spent in news gathering and $100 million spent in political organizing.
Plus, "the public" that cares about this in any more than a superficial way is really only a small subset of the the total public.
September 28, 2007 11:12 AM | Reply | Permalink
That kind of levity that's just fine by me. ;)
September 28, 2007 11:15 AM | Reply | Permalink
The open source security model basically says that all security systems should be known and in the open - the resulting scrutiny and open communication among the user base exposes and fixes flaws faster than closed proprietary systems and their secretive vendors. The National Security Agency used this model in selection of the standard public encryption algorithm to replace the 1970s-vintage Data Encryption Standard; the selected algorithm came from a Dutch research team and had been widely discussed on the net for several years during the selection process. Of course, this model drives the closed model advocates crazy.
Personally I think that an open political model is best, and that the Democrats should try to adhere as best they can to this way of doing things. However, there is clearly a problem when one argumentor has managed to inject at least $2 billion into the political process over 20 yeras and the only scrutiny that injection has received in the traditional media is a WaPo thumbsucker _in 1975_.
sPh
September 28, 2007 11:16 AM | Reply | Permalink
Why?
Fair and Balanced my friend.
Repeating right wing talking points about the evil Soros does nothing to promote Dem ideas that I can see.
And if billionaires want to spend money on worthy causes for others instead of self, what the hell is wrong with that? Must the very wealthy always be selfish? What about the Rockefellers, the Fords, the Vanderbilts, Carnegie, Pew, etc. "public interest" funders? Are they under suspicion just because there was no immediate financial self benefit to their largesse? Bill Gates can send me several millions and I promise to never tell if he so wishes seeing as I'm a great progressive cause.
The Koch family Birchers are and have been evil and self serving but somehow deserve no scorn? I don't understand why that would be when those who try to support good causes are somehow suspicious!
Too much money in the political process is bad and corrupting. Corporatocracy is not democracy. But the Democracy Alliance donating money to bring balance to the massive inputs from the righty billions for the past 40 years is nto a bad thing. When the Fascist Alliance is shut down, I'm pretty sure the Democracy Alliance will be willing to abandon arms.
September 28, 2007 11:21 AM | Reply | Permalink
Well, I think that's an interesting but unfortunate way to look at American politics. There is not, of course, a constitutional prohibition against one exercizing one's first amendment rights secretively. (And the Supreme Court had made clear that political money is in fact an expression of one's first amendment rights.) But that doesn't mean there isn't a larger responsibility to account for that spending, be it conservative money or liberal money. That's the only hope we have for keeping money from completely skewing the political system--to know who's spending it and how. Your argument might hold up in a courtroom, but it's bad for democracy.
As for whether or not the public cares, I thought progressives were always the ones telling us in the media that we ought not to pander but to tell people what they need to know. I'm not especially interested in whether the public is clamoring for this information. I believe they ought to have it.
Thanks.
Join The Argument.
www.mattbai.com
September 28, 2007 12:00 PM | Reply | Permalink
Matt,
One of your issues with Social Security is that it "punish[es] the self-employed (who didn’t even exist in the 1930s)". As Emma Zahn explained in an excellent comment it is true that the self-employed pay more, but the effect is only about 1% of earnings. Sure, that's not perfectly equitable, but is that really such a big deal? (Or are you looking at this ignoring employer contributions? If so, IMHO, that's pure demagoguery.)
Your parenthetical about the 30s is also strange. As Zahn pointed out, before the Reagan era revamp of Social Security under Greenspan, the self-employed actually had a big discount.
This reminds me a bit of the misleading statements that Russert and other pundits are so fond of, that people are living so much longer than they did in the 30's as if the Roosevelt administration didn't know that life expectancy was increasing. In fact, as your colleague Paul Krugman has documented, the FDR era demographers if anything erred a little on the conservative side: In 1934, they estimated that 12.7% of Americans would be over 65 in 2000, the number turned out to be 12.4%.
On a more trivial note, of course the self-employed existed in the 1930's. What you meant to say is they weren't covered by Social Security until 1950.
(You've been very good at replying to questions. So if you already addressed this somewhere and I missed it, my apologies.)
September 28, 2007 12:10 PM | Reply | Permalink
Matt-
Here's my takeaway of what I take to be the crux of your argument here:
"the progressive movement as a whole seems mostly unconcerned with making any argument about the modernization of government, vastly preferring, instead, to vilify Republicans and exalt the virtues of party discipline and tactical superiority"
So I have a couple of quick responses to that:
1. What you describe is taken directly from the Republican playbook. This, IMHO, is necessary but not sufficient. It's part of catching up, and leveling the playing field
2. When you say "modernization of government", I assume you're not referring to best management practices, but rather to developing a new paradigm, just as the New Deal was a new paradigm, and Ronald Reagan embodied a new, neo-conservative paradigm.
3. The surface of the real problem is that Democrats/liberals/progressives haven't established a meaningful narrative that ties the different elements of their new paradigm together. This is, in large part, because that new paradigm hasn't yet been developed. I think that's what you mean when you say "modernization of government."
4. I think there isn't a new paradigm yet because there hasn't been a fundamental discussion about values, and what values will be fundamental/necessary/sufficient to that new paradigm.
5. Right now there are "value clusters" in the Democratic Party, roughly represented by the Clintons, Edwards, Obama, Kucinich, and Biden. The struggle is on to see which value cluster will predominate.
6. Somewhat off topic, Clinton is trying to win over the other value clusters by virtue of potentially being the first woman US President.
(apologies for cross-posting)
September 28, 2007 12:12 PM | Reply | Permalink
It seems to me that what is needed is some kind of "AFL-CIO" of progressive organizations. By banding together under a common umbrella group, the progressive organizations could raise more money and have the power to focus that money on specific candidates or issues.
MoveOn got a lot of donations for their General Betray Us ad. Moreover the Democrats, by voting to condemn MoveOn, continue to alienate their own base in their search for the ever-elusive "bi-partisan" support. I suspect that in the next election, more political donations will find their way to MoveOn or other progressive organizations instead of going to the DCCC.
Starting a third party is an uphill battle; and everyone usually starts at the top by trying to get a third party candidate elected President. What is needed is a broad national coalition of organizations with common ideals and principles who can work together to get progressive candidates elected and who have enough financial clout to break the corporate monopoly on the news.
Possibly MoveOn, VoteVets, True Majority, NARAL, the Sierra Club, the ACLU -- and any other progressive organization -- could get together and hammer out some kind of coalition that presented a united front for progressive values.
Progressives can not count on the Democratic party to represent their interests.
September 28, 2007 12:13 PM | Reply | Permalink
I still disagree. If there's one thing I've learned over the years, it's that if people repeat the same bullshit over and over, at some point, many of them will start to believe it and to them it ceases to be bullshit. I have no doubt that even the most nakedly self-serving Republican billionaire has rationalized their position on tax cuts, to take the most obvious example, as being in the best interest of all. And over time, that rationalization gives way to actual, sincere belief.
September 28, 2007 12:30 PM | Reply | Permalink
Democracy? Try cash-ocracy...
September 28, 2007 12:48 PM | Reply | Permalink
yeah, OK, this is way into the weeds, but a few small point that probably won't persuade you, but for what it's worth:
1. Yes, there were some self-employed then, but they were mostly business owners, I presume, and not nearly at the numbers that they are now.
2. OK, it's a 1 percent punishment, but not when you consider that the self-employed pay both parts of the tax, whereas other workers pay just one. So that's misleading--it's actually a big issue for people. (Yes, as a writer, I am self-employed, and so I do feel some modest sting from this, but the real issue here isn't me--it's the people who make less than I do. Not that I'm rich, but anyway...)
3. Not just the numbers of the self-employed, but the nature of them, are changing. And this is why I make a big deal of this point. Increasingly, independent contractors aren't business owners or self-contained enterprises like me; they're people with computers at home and a marketable, if not highly-paid skill, and for the first time in American history these people (especially women) have the opportunity to get some control over their lives. They can telecommute now, which means they can see their children, and they can make their own hours, and they can work in a healthy environments, and they don't spend hours in traffic polluting the planet and wasting their lives. This is a good thing. No, it's a great thing. And I think a truly progresive agenda would be targeted at giving more new economy workers that flexibility and freedom, rather than tying them to a workplace. Ayone who works in an office and has small kids and pays for childcare knows what I'm talking about.
So what do we need to make that happen? Well, we need real healthcare apart from the workplace, no question. We need portable benefits. But we also need a fairer tax code, and that means the payroll tax, because it's not fair to make those workers pay the employer's share and their own share--it's a lot of money, and it's a significant disincentive.They represent a new and growing segment of workers and a new opportunity for the American workforce, and we ought to make it easier for them to make the choices that are good for their families and good, ultimately, for the economy.
All of which is to say that, in my book, the payroll tax really is antiquated.
Now, somewhere else in this morass of posts--I think under my "Word Games" post--I answered another commenter who asked why I wanted to throw out everything old. I'd refer you to that answer, as well.
Hope this helps. Many thanks.
Join The Argument.
www.mattbai.com
September 28, 2007 1:46 PM | Reply | Permalink
There's a lot here that I think makes sense. It's a strong set of observations. I do have to say, though, that while I appreciate your having the discussion, I don't think you can summarize the "takeaway" from a 300-page book without reading it. I'm just saying, there's a lot more there, and if you have this level of interest, I wish yuu'd just take the time to digest it all, rather than try to get me to got through the Cliff's Notes. It reads really quickly, I promise, and as the other posters have all said, it's fun. And when you're done, I'd be glad to have a longer conversation ovr at my website. Thanks.
Join The Argument.
www.mattbai.com
September 28, 2007 1:51 PM | Reply | Permalink
The payroll tax is "unfair" to the self-employed only if you disregard the fact the regular employees are paying the other half as well. This is just hidden in the form of lower wages. The same thing is true of fringe benefits as the issues with GM made painfully obvious.
We are entering a new era where even "regular" employees are being treated as conditional workers. They get no benefits, their pensions are self administered 401K plans and their value to the firm as long-time workers is regarded as a liability. Just look at the recent cases of Circuit City and Walmart. Circuit City explicitly fired experienced workers just to save money. Apparently customer service is no longer a worthwhile offering. Walmart has initiated a program where all workers have to bid for hours worked and has capped salaries. These steps are designed to push longer-term employees out. Comments from workers indicate the strategy is working.
The solution to this is a new type of workplace is a labor organization which I call a worker's affinity group. My suggestion is loosely modeled on AARP. The group would offer portable pension and health plans as well as services to help support job mobility. More workers are being called upon to be self directed (think real estate agents, or advertising account execs, or lawyers) and less subject to the old model of assembly line worker vs supervisor model.
An affinity group that is geared for this new working environment could help restore some of the balance of power between the workers and the employers.
If you are interested in more details of my suggestion:
A proposal for a worker's affinity group
--- Policies not Politics
Daily Landscape
September 28, 2007 2:13 PM | Reply | Permalink
Re: 1. Yes, there were some self-employed then, but they were mostly business owners, I presume, and not nearly at the numbers that they are now.
Most doctors, dentists, lawyers and other professional people were self-employed back then too. It's only been in the last generation or two that the professions have been herded into employee status. Also, small business owners were not exactly a negligible group in the 30s, well before the rise of the big chain stores, resturants etc.
Re: OK, it's a 1 percent punishment, but not when you consider that the self-employed pay both parts of the tax, whereas other workers pay just one.
Ultimately though the "employers share" comes out of the worker's income; it represents wages that the employee must forego.
Re: We are entering a new era where even "regular" employees are being treated as conditional workers. They get no benefits,
At least for skilled work, most consulting firms do provide benefits, although the consultant usually must pay for them directly.
September 28, 2007 2:24 PM | Reply | Permalink
Hey, this is a good idea, and my understanding is that Andy Stern and SEIU are working on a very similar project, though it was supposd to be up and running a long time ago. You're really onto something. Thanks.
Join The Argument.
www.mattbai.com
September 28, 2007 2:34 PM | Reply | Permalink
Right. All of which is why, rather than try to force employers to somehow behave like they used to, I think we need to think about a modern social contract, starting with healthcare and pensions that aren't tied to an employer.
As for this argument about regular workers forgoing wages, that may well be, and I'm no economist, but I've not heard of anyone going to self-employed status and suddenly being given a salary hike because they no longer cost money in healthcare. Have you?
The only other thing I'd say, again, is that I think this isn't only an economic issue--it's a quality of life and freedom issue. I don't know why progressives won't get behind that. A new kind of social contract should mean not just more security if you leave your employer, but more control over your life.
Anyway, thanks.
Join The Argument.
www.mattbai.com
September 28, 2007 2:39 PM | Reply | Permalink
So much as I love talking economic theory, does any of this mean that any of you guys are actually going to read my book? (this being a book discussion.) Just curious. You know that none of this is in there, right?...
Join The Argument.
www.mattbai.com
September 28, 2007 2:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
Thanks for the detailed reply. This time, I'll give you one out of three. ;)
Re #2: Uh, no. The 1% number does take into account that the self-employed must pay the employer portion. I'm not sure if you're being coy or if you honestly don't understand the economics here, but Emma Zahn explained it nicely. The basic point is that if you are an employee, economically it doesn't much matter what the employer/employee breakdown is. If the self-employed only had to pay the employee portion, that would constitute a massive subsidy for the self-employed. Now maybe as a public policy matter you think we should subsidize the self-employed; if so, that's fine, but make the case straightforwardly.
Re #1. It's neither here nor there, but there were a great many self-employed in the 30's. Most of them were farmers. Not that this has much to do with Social Security, which didn't apply to the self-employed until the 50's.
Re #3. Eloquently put. I agree with what you said, modulo the payroll tax per my comments above.
September 28, 2007 3:21 PM | Reply | Permalink
As for this argument about regular workers forgoing wages, that may well be, and I'm no economist, but I've not heard of anyone going to self-employed status and suddenly being given a salary hike because they no longer cost money in healthcare.
Well, lots of people take a pay cut of some kind as part of the transition to self-employment. But the bottom line is: Wages + health insurance cost more than wages alone... including when you're self employed. Either you pay for health insurance and as a result take home less money, or you don't have health insurance, and take home more money than you would have if you'd paid for health insurance.
September 28, 2007 3:59 PM | Reply | Permalink
My father was a highly skilled craftsman, union, of course, who worked, for a very wide variety of employers on a huge number of projects, all over the country and the world, in the 50s, 60s and 70s. I can't tell you how many jobs he had over the course of his career -- but, about midway through that career, when I was in high school, he had to, for a security clearance required for a project in Thule, Greenland, recreate his entire employment history to date and asked me to help him type it up. The count was already well over 60 at that point.
Despite the fact that his work life was mobile in the extreme, portability of benefits was never an issue -- because he was a member of a union and had what was called a "traveling card."
I bring this up only to 1) point out that the "assembly line worker" is not the only (or the oldest) union model, 2) make the point that the common assumption of incompatibility between organizing and the modern economy's need for flexibility should not go unquestioned.
My father, when he was alive, would have been amused by the idea that there ever was a time, or could ever be a time, when workers were anything other than "conditional." He was a strong union man, but he didn't belong to a union because he believed for one second it would guarantee him work -- he knew that only his skills (and a robust economy) could do that. But, he also knew that skills alone can't guarantee fair compensation. What he expected to get from his union was leverage, a seat at the negotiating table, and a voice in the national dialogue.
Workers, including the most highly skilled, can't expect to get any of those things handed down to them from above -- by politicians or employers. They are going to have to take the risk of standing up for themselves, and standing with others, to demand a place at the table. And, of course, they will have to, as you have tried to do here, come up with some ideas to put on the table.
September 28, 2007 4:15 PM | Reply | Permalink
Barbara Ehrenreich has started such a group since I wrote my essay. Here's the link. Since you are a freelancer you may find the group personally usefully as well as providing you with some fodder for a future article.
United Professionals
--- Policies not Politics
Daily Landscape
September 28, 2007 4:40 PM | Reply | Permalink
Can you point to the place on this thread where you think someone is doing that? I'd sincerely like to know, so I don't use the same language inadvertently.
September 28, 2007 6:04 PM | Reply | Permalink
I said I'd just give up, but the social security discussion is really fascinating, so I hope you don't mind if I enter again. Many things to be said. Let me praise Matt for it. It's a substantive issue, and I'm not the only one who wondered if he had issues beyond slogans. It's also a liberal issue: it hits at the payroll tax for not being progressive. My thanks.
But now I've qualms. First, there's the straw man again, and it continues to annoy me a whole lot. Are there seriously liberals who don't favor progressive taxation? Indeed, it's not an aspect of "social security reform" much debated, so is there really an old left contingent dead against it?
Second, it's of course a political call. One wouldn't wish to place that on the table if it means a concession on something like privatization. One who wasn't eager to pursue it would thus not necessarily be close minded. One might be worried about giving into the wingnut agenda.
Third, is there really a core vision here? I was aware of the extra burden when I was freelance, and it helped convince me to take an office job, but far more significant was the cost of health care. More important than my experience, does it relate seriously to a vision of equity? It may discriminate against freelancers, but they're not a class in any political sense I care about, whereas affordability of health care and its ramifications for all clearly is. At most, it makes us more competitive in a world that outsources and may rely more on freelancers, but that's a complex case to make. Unlike health care, it just does not relate to core concepts like equity and equality, and those have been part of the liberal vision and the vision I instinctively share (and, I think, the vision voters share) for a long time.
In other words, is this truly a new idea, a new vision? Or is it just a policy that magically has been dredged up to justify that Matt has any ideas at all? Sorry to take that tone, and I'm not a fan of the blogosphere. I just want some evidence I'm dealing with something here rather than a reporter who got to go to conferences I've never heard of and became an expert by deriding those who don't.
John
http://www.haberarts.com/
September 28, 2007 6:17 PM | Reply | Permalink
I can only offer small anecdotal personal experience. When I spent a lot of time on another forum, during all the Social Security hullabaloo that Josh covered, there were several young people, all techie types, all politically liberal in many ways, who were very strongly in support of reform of some kind of Social Security. Change of that system doesn't appeal to me in the least beyond raising the age of benefits as the age of lifespan changes. But reform along the lines of more control over one's own paid in funds seems to appeal to certain types of young workers who have only had the experience of very independent, self-employed work, and expect to be able to make their own choices on everything regarding personal life. Same mindset would of course make them in favor of health insurance being both not tied to an employer, and yet still offering a lot of personal choice.
September 28, 2007 6:35 PM | Reply | Permalink
Republicans have done a good job of selling this message to younger voters and it naturally appeals to them. Of course, they haven't necessarily thought through the impact of making a lot of bad personal choices. If it were all good choices and sunny days, we wouldn't need Social Security at all.
September 28, 2007 6:36 PM | Reply | Permalink
I am a DA partner. I don't think that DA is particularly secretive. The DA website lists the board members --- this information wasn't always there, but certainly anyone in politics who wanted to know who was on the board could find out. How the organization operates has been reported widely, before Matt's book as well as in the book. Some reports are accurate, and some are not, just like any other topic in the press.
There are thousands of donors in the US who contribute large sums to political organizations: progressive, conservative, libertarian, populist, or otherwise. Most of those donors are people you have never heard of (like me). A relatively small number of them are DA partners, most of whom you have also never heard of.
Matt may have "breached the wall of secrecy" around roughly 100 of those people to the extent of their DA participation (although most DA partners also do lots of stuff outside DA as well), but that's still only a tiny sliver of political philanthropy (and political philanthropy, itself, is only a small slice of overall political giving, which includes direct contributions to candidates, PACs, hiring lobbyists, etc.). And I'm not convinced that DA is really so important or significant that it deserves this degree of special attention (although it is flattering to DA to suggest that it is so unique and special that it does). When those same DA partners were giving the same millions of dollars to many of the same groups (or similar groups) before DA ever existed, did that mean that their giving was less important?
I respectfully would disagree with Matt if he claims that the disclosure or publicity obligations of donors who become DA partners are any different from those of any other political donor. If he's arguing that all donations to all political groups should be public, I would have no problem with that (I'm happy to tell anyone who wants to know, the groups that I support), but it doesn't really have anything to do with the DA specifically.
To me, the DA is like a political advisor. It doesn't control any of my money, it just makes recommendations about good things to do with it. Then I choose whether or not I agree. My relationship with DA is like George Soros's relationship with Michael Vachon. And I don't expect that whenever the two of them meet they put out a press release to let everyone know what they talked about.
DA needs to be somewhat closed to non-partners for a few reasons. Because it needs dues from partners in order to have any staff and do anything at all, and so participation is a benefit of partnership. Because, while some groups are offended when they don't get recommended by DA, the number of groups that would find something to be offended about if every internal discussion at DA were completely open would be that much greater, and that would be divisive and harmful. And because, from the point of view of the partners, one of the things they are seeking is the interaction with other like-minded people.
But I don't think there needs to be any secrecy about what DA does (as opposed to the privacy of the individual meetings or interactions between partners and staff), and to the extent that that secrecy can be reduced (or has been reduced by Matt's book) then I think that is a good thing.
September 28, 2007 7:16 PM | Reply | Permalink
Paycheck deduction is a powerful pyschological tool, for good or ill. Most people simply do not think of that which as deducted as "their" money; that's why many sign up for forced savings by paycheck deduction, for example. (It doesn't work on every single person, of course--a minority pour over the pay stub and smoke starts coming out of their ears. :-))
September 28, 2007 7:38 PM | Reply | Permalink
David, good to see you in this discussion, and I appreciate your comments.
I do think the DA has some special obligation to be transparent, because it isn't simply acting as a funnel to groups that have always received the same donations; it's actually seeking to control which groups get those donations and to channel that money in the proportions that it deems most efficient. As such, it's exercizing a disproportionate control over the progressive landscape, and that is its goal, after all--to coordinate and direct resources under a single strategic vision. This means that some groups will gain money while some will lose. That unified approach makes the organization very influential, and for that reason I do believe that the right course--and the one in keeping with the Alliance's own stated principles--is to be open about its membership and its portfolio. Of course, it's my job to think that way--there would be something wrong with me if I didn't.
All that said, the book ended on a very positive note for the DA, because I think it was reaching a more stable phase, and also one with more transparency. (There's even a website now.) So this, like everything else, is in a constant state of evolution.
Thanks again for taking part.
Join The Argument.
www.mattbai.com
September 28, 2007 8:55 PM | Reply | Permalink
This post made a ton of sense. Thank you.
Join The Argument.
www.mattbai.com
September 28, 2007 9:01 PM | Reply | Permalink
When someone buys a widget factory the whole society certainly cares how it is run, although the oversight varies some whether privately held or not.
When it comes to politics, the last thing any society needs is secrecy, cabals, hidden agendas, lack of responsibility for actions. That's part of the problem with the trends in society, political and economic, today as already pointed out.
We need and must have transparency (and honesty), the more the better without preventing function, from the president and administration, the legislative bodies, and the party apparatus. Money being the lubricant, the sources and disbursements necessarily require to be seen to prevent corruption or illegalities.
Otherwise we might as well build a society as the incumbent and his cadre would like to have it.
September 28, 2007 9:13 PM | Reply | Permalink
John, at the risk of further frustrating you, on the core vision, I think you and I just have a different notion of the future. I'm not talking about a policy that discriminates against the self-employed. As you can see from my post above, I'm taking about building a policy that encourages and enables people to BE self-employed, because that's where some sectors of the economy seem to be headed, and it's a real opportunity for people to create better lives. If you de-coupled benefits from employers (enabling them to compete more easily), and if you reformed the tax code, then a lot of people who now drop off their kids and drive to offices could stay at home and mange their time and maybe even make people compete for their services. I'm talking about a social contract for the workforce of this century, not the last one. Andy Stern and SEIU have been working on just such a program for the self-employed, and I hope they pull it off; they understand that the idea of a union may have to expand to keep pace with the proliferation of free agents in the workforce.
And I don't think you do these things in a piecemeal way. I think you have to tell Americans a story about where the economy and society is headed, and I think you need to make the argument for why all of these things--health care, retirement, taxes--are interrelated and part of a system that's changing. Bill Cinton started this conversation, and I admire him for it. But, like so much else in the country, it has stalled under the current administration, or even gone backward. The same could be said of our foreign policy future.
I don't have all the answers here, obviously--if I did, I suppose I would have written THAT book. I'm not a policy expert, really. But I sense a great potential here, and I talk to a whole lot of voters around the country who have both anxiety about the present and a sense of expanding possibilities for the future, and I think a truly progressive movement would try to meet that challenge, even if the agenda weren't immediately politically practical. That's why we care about politics, right? Because it can move us forward.
Of course, I talk about this stuff, and then somebody says something--as he or she did elsewhere on one of these threads--about how I don't care about poor women and their sick babies. And yI think, is it really even worth having this discussion? Can people debate without turning it into an issue of who cares and who doesn't? Don't we all care? Isn't that why I do what I do, and why you come to this site and do what you do?
My answer, after a week-long discussion here, is I don't know--but I think you can. I think there are enough people who really want some better brand of politics and some more useful form of conversation.
Anyway, thanks you for this, and for all of your comments this week. You can always contact me through my website if you have more to add. And by the way, I don't go to conferences. They bore the hell out of me and I miss my family.
Join The Argument.
www.mattbai.com
September 28, 2007 9:39 PM | Reply | Permalink
Soros and other billionaries can play a powerful role by providing startup money, on a competitive bid basis, to jumpstart or ramp up grassroots network-building and mobilization around publicly identified, high priority issues. Specific examples are:
*UHC moving towards single-payer financing
*publicly financed alternative energy research and development
*election integrity
The funding should be with the understanding that within, say, five years, these networks would need to become self-sustaining if they plan to continue to exist once the seed money is spent.
I note that Mark Schmitt indicated (as an addendum to one of his earlier posts in this discussion) that while working for Soros he advocated non-issue specific infrastructure building. If he's checking in here, I am curious to know whether he thinks issue-specific or non-issue specific infrastructure building is the preferred way to go now. Likewise if you, Matt, and others have thoughts on this.
If one objection is that, if billionaries can fund "progressive" (I'd argue that they are "public interest" causes which have trouble getting traction because of collective action problems and because they are up against powerful special interests or built-in political inertia) causes they can do so for regressive ones, my reply would be that they already do.
September 28, 2007 11:27 PM | Reply | Permalink
There is something fundamentally intellectually dishonest in Bai's post.
Bai is basically attacking the concept of noblesse oblige, wrapped in the language of egalitarianism and ideological purty. He's equivocating all wealthy people; evading whether some billionaires are better than others.
Noblesse oblige is less than ideal, but is still far better than outright self serving greed. Some are legitimately attempting, and sometimes succeeding, in doing good.
There's a huge difference between, on the one hand, a hyper wealthy humanitarian who freely admits he pays too little taxes, the system is rigged in his favor, and he wants to give back by helping facilitate awareness and promote a more egalitarian and prosperous society; and on the other hand a hyper wealthy executive of an oil company or such who simply wants to perpetuate the oligarchy of his class and ensure the continued success of his industry and proteges without consideration for the greater good.
Self serving greed is typical of the hyper wealthy, particularly those who are loyal to their empires above all else, and seem to lack any humanitarian aspirations.
The problem isn't foremost the humanitarian billionaires. It's the lack of them and the proliferation of nearly cannibalistic attitudes towards humanity among the hyper wealthy.
September 29, 2007 3:12 AM | Reply | Permalink
True, though I think "sincerity" is a bit of a stretch.
It's more like an addiction. They're drunk on wealth, status, power, etc. And like all addictions, it becomes an irrational preoccupation and gains a momentum of its own.
For example, do alcoholics "sincerely" argue it's a good thing? No. Not really. Everyone knows deep down it's a bad idea.
But they'll still passionately, and even angrily argue for it if pressed! Especially if drunk. Doubly so if surrounded by peers at the bar having a good time of it.
That's the whole point. To be able to get drunk enough to tell yourself it's great and surround oneself with the like minded. There's a Pavlovian quality to it.
Does Lee Raymond really thin keeping the US addicted to oil and stifling alternative energy is good? No. But it's fundamentally what he does by definition of his position in life, which he surely enjoys, and I'm sure he's adept at not thinking about it. Did all the ENRON execs really think what they did was right? No. But they were enjoying the party and didn't want to think about it because then the party might have to end.
September 29, 2007 3:34 AM | Reply | Permalink
That was a non sequitur. What does encryption and open source specifically have to do with open government? Is this another hobby horse thing?
Are you trying to say open government is a good idea, so we all know what's going on and democracy functions? Ok, yea, fine. Obvious. That was Tocqueville's main point.
If you want to say that Open Source is analogous to the democratization of software, fine. But saying democracy should be the Open Sourcing of government... well, that's a bit backwards. It's getting your cart before your hobby horse, so to speak.
September 29, 2007 3:49 AM | Reply | Permalink
So far, I have been doing OK in the everyone's-a-consultant, manage-your-own-risk, winner-take all economy. Of course I am under 50; quite a few of my colleagues have been shocked to find that the jobs and calls stop coming once they hit that barrier and they can't work the 20 hour days anyway. But still, there is no question that some percentage of the population does quite well under this model.
I am concerned about the citizens who _can't_ handle this way of life. Quite a few of my high school classmates literally went from 12th grade into the steel mills, where they put in 8-for-8 and built fairly decent lives for themselves and (eventually) their families. They had no desire and no innate ability to become world-trotting high-tech consultants - which is fine, because there are many different types of people in the world and a strong society requires them all.
Except in the last 10-20 years we have been systematically breaking the compact of 1945-1965 and squeezing all the jobs and all the places for a substantial percentage of society right out of the economy. 4 of the 5 steel mills near my old neighborhood are gone and the fifth is highly automated. Good, solid jobs leading to a good solid middle-class life with /manageable risk/ are all being taken away and replaced with high-risk "opportunities". Funny how a high-risk life is more appealing when you already have $2 million in your trust fund from daddy.
sPh
September 29, 2007 7:25 AM | Reply | Permalink
Thanks again for the thoughtful engagement. I'd definitely like to see some changes, including raising or removing the payroll tax cap. It was sad to see Clinton hedging on this, another reason I'm not convinced that looking to moderates for a new vision isn't the answer.
John
http://www.haberarts.com/
September 29, 2007 10:45 AM | Reply | Permalink
AmericanDreamer writes:
Of course, those donors are already doing all of these things. I could name several DA partners who are active in each of these areas. As well as others active in progressive politics who don't choose to belong to the DA. (Of course, most of these people are not really "billionaires"---I assume you use that just as a figure of speech, just as Matt does.) It's just a matter of what their particular interests are, and to some extent what personal expertise they have (you would rather see donors in a particular area who actually know something about that area, right?).
There is, of course, always ongoing discussion within the DA about which issue areas should be part of DA's priorities, and which not. DA simply doesn't have sufficient resources to work in all of these areas. I have my own list of neglected areas, as do you, and I'm sure many others. No two of those lists are the same, and that creates a challenge. The sum of all of the lists is way beyond what DA can support. But I am not sure that just because DA doesn't recommend any organizations in a particular area, that means that area is less well-funded (just as DA recommendation doesn't bring an instant stream of money---it's still up to the partners to contribute or not). It just means that those organizations have to appeal more directly to donors.
The one thing I'm not sure about is what you mean by "competitive bid". It doesn't really make sense to me to solicit proposals from several different "election integrity" organizations, and then try to measure which one can generate the most integrity per dollar. Any philanthropist, of course, has to make decisions about where their money is best spent. Large foundations tend to do this by soliciting formal proposals. Individuals tend to do it more through personal interactions and their own subjective determination of value. I am not sure that either approach is inherently superior to the other; both have their places.
September 29, 2007 11:37 AM | Reply | Permalink
I can imagine that the same argument could have been made during the industrial revolution. People could no longer work on the farm and eke out decent lives. It seems that politicians, particularly “progressives”, should be looking for ways to adapt government to compliment the new economic realities, not try to drag the economy back four decades.
September 29, 2007 11:57 AM | Reply | Permalink
Millionaires and billionaires are fantastic, so long as they are on the right side. Contrary to Republican bullshit, people don't hate the rich for their money. Nobody of any significance wants to punish the rich.
However, nobody amasses any significant amount of wealth without government. Suppose Gil Bates drove on public roads, studied at public schools, and deposited in the public sewers for free when he was growing up and not yet earning enough to pay taxes. If he rejected his obligation to cover the cost of younger generations doing the same, it would be damned annoying.
Gil didn't become a billionaire without the bundle of privileges and immunities of his corporation. If he took the attitude that he earned it all himself and never took a dime from anyone, and that it's unfair for the government to steal his rightful earnings and give it to losers who are poor because they're stupid and lazy, then Gil would be regarded as a selfish jerk.
People don't generally hate Gil, because he isn't like that. If Gil were an obnoxious douche bag, people would hate him for that reason, not for his money.
September 29, 2007 11:59 AM | Reply | Permalink
I think you are quite naïve if you think there are not a lot of people who simple want to punish the rich. Just look around this site as an example. Now, whether they are of “significance” is open to debate.
September 29, 2007 12:07 PM | Reply | Permalink
Matt writes:
This is simply not true. DA does not, now, even have specific dollar targets for its partner organizations, much less any "control" over what funding level is achieved. Of course, the purpose of DA is to help its partners allocate their funding in a more efficient way, and, for example, when there is a significant perceived gap in the infrastructure, it is likely that DA staff and partners will attempt to persuade other partners to fill that gap. But DA does not have any "control" over whether this happens. All that DA has is persuasion, the same tool that any group uses when fundraising.
It is not accurate to say that the goal of DA is to direct funding under a single strategic vision. There are as many strategic visions within DA as there are partners. There are partners who have very different interests from mine, and don't contribute to any of the same groups. There are partners who are "Establishment", and partners who are "insurgents". There are partners who consider themselves moderate Republicans (if such a thing still exists).
Do DA recommendations have some influence with its partners? Sure, I hope so, otherwise what would be the point? But is the DA process less transparent than the "old way" (which is still predominant) of organizations making direct appeals to donors, exchanging board positions for large donations, etc.? It doesn't seem so to me, and so the DA seems a positive contribution to the funding landscape.
September 29, 2007 12:08 PM | Reply | Permalink
There's so much I (like, apparently, many others here) can't stomach in what Bai has been saying that it's hard not to keep adding more. But here I go.
First, I had been noting that his first model for a "new idea" was to revamp the payroll tax not simply to make it more progressive, but to eliminate the disparity between how it affects the self-employed and others. I was basically arguing that progressive taxation, protecting your retirement, and agreeing that the social security benefits you've been paying into belong to you are all big ideas, while rejigger a scheme few understand between how deductions are counted is the ultimate small bore. I still stick by that, just as I'll stick by noting how many people, from Edwards in public to dozens of wonderful members here in their comments, have lots of ideas.
Second, though, he came back and said that he meant that as part of a large economic transformation. He apologized that, speaking not as an economist, he couldn't really articulate it. (So why the burden on others? Anyhow...) It's cornerstone is incentive to be self-employed, as that's where the future is. Now, to me, that's already not a big idea, as it's not about key issues of governance: who benefits, and to whom does government belong? But also, why is it realistic? I'm in publishing, and I went self-employed for a while when one job wasn't working out and when I wanted to do some personal writing. My industry isn't more productive if editors all go off on our own. How many others are? Is that the solution to call centers in India, that we all work from our home phone? Where's the proof?
There seems at some level in this desperate call for new ideas that it doesn't matter what they are, as long as you have a transformational slogan that might be unveiled at a shareholders meeting. Shouldn't it count not only what policy and what vision of democracy it corresponds to, but also whether it works? Obviously big ideas like the Laffer curve, privizatization, and combatting terror by breaking centuries of morality and invading Iraq unprovoked all failed. Gren Anrig's book says a lot with its title: why conservative ideas fail. Shouldn't we count in the equation not just whether their ideas exist or are new, and they don't and aren't, but whether they work? Bai obviously doesn't think so.
John
http://www.haberarts.com/
September 29, 2007 12:16 PM | Reply | Permalink
Let me continue on yet another point. I read some of Matt's book today, a section on Democracy Alliance. Now, I've said before this was overblown, in that the group didn't seem to me sufficiently important in the scheme of progressive movements. Call it my ignorance that I hadn't heard of them, but I'm still wondering.
Now, a lot focuses on secrecy. As Matt himself says, a donor does not surrender certain rights to privacy. I'd add that secrecy may be impractical, if it impedes debate that'd foster better action. But I don't often know about billionaires and donors, and normally I worry most about secrecy in government: who is getting repaid with what? Thus, we complained about Cheney's energy commission not because an oil company was secretly planning to stick to oil and old technologies. We complained because they were s