Of Monkeys and Senators

For the record yes, obviously George Allen was trying to use a racial slur against S.R. Sidarth. The reason you might not think it was a slur is that the slur in question was terribly obscure. It's obscure, however, because it's a French slur. And Allen's mother is . . . a white Frenchwoman who grew up in Tunisia, exactly the sort of person who would know all about French racial slurs. And Allen speaks French. And, of course, in Allen's youthful California days he was a white supremacist fond of flying the Stars and Bars.

There, again, for a southern person of a certain age to have an affection for the Confederate Flag might mean any number of things. But for a Californian to have an affection for the Confederate Flag isn't open to a lot of interpretation.


Comments (14)

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I hate to be a frequent comment troll, but I wonder what you think of a person who "grew up on the move, attending more than a dozen different schools across the U.S. and in England" and "graduated from high school in Bellevue, Nebraska", and yet says the following:

The Confederate Memorial has had a special place in my life for many years. ... And there were many, many times that I found myself drawn to this deeply inspiring memorial, to contemplate the sacrifices of others, several of whom were my ancestors, whose enormous suffering and collective gallantry are to this day still misunderstood by most Americans.

...

I am not here to apologize f or why they fought, although modern historians might contemplate that there truly were different perceptions in the North and South about those reasons, and that most Southern soldiers viewed the driving issue to be sovereignty rather than slavery. In 1860 fewer than five percent of the people in the South owned slaves, and fewer than twenty percent were involved with slavery in any capacity. Love of the Union was palpably stronger in the South than in the North before the war -- just as overt patriotism is today -- but it was tempered by a strong belief that state sovereignty existed prior to the Constitution, and that it had never been surrendered. Nor had Abraham Lincoln ended slavery in Kentucky and Missouri when those border states did not secede. Perhaps all of us might reread the writings of Alexander Stephens, a brilliant attorney who opposed secession but then became Vice President of the Confederacy, making a convincing legal argument that the constitutional compact was terminable. And who wryly commented at the outset of the war that "the North today presents the spectacle of a free people having gone to war to make freemen of slaves, while all they have as yet attained is to make slaves of themselves."

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I'm sure the partisans will come up with some ridiculous excuse why Allen's a racist but the person who said that isn't. Please.

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That simply proves that Allen has a good PR person and Speech writer.

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Maybe we could start with: because Allen mocked a South Asian with a racist slur and Webb did... not?

"I hate to be a frequent comment troll..."

No you don't. Seriously dude, if that's what you like doing, cool, roll with it, and let people make their own determinations based on your history. Just don't pretend that you "don't like it." Nobody is forcing you to make the comments that you make.

So you are trying to defend what Aleen said with a baseless ad hominem attack on Webb?  I guess that tells me there is no defense for what Allen said...

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I'm not trying to defend Allen against the macaca thing. I'm responding to Matthew's second paragraph.

As to Matthew's second paragraph, I just note that, it seems to me that if Allen's interest in the confederate flag means that Allen is racist, then Webb's praise of the confederate memorial makes Webb a racist too. Do you disagree?

I don't think that's an ad hominem attack on Webb. It's a comparison between Webb's racial attitudes and Allen's racial attitudes. Which seems to me perfectly legitimate, since those are the two people vying for the election.

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Sorry - I was trying to make a joke based on Matthew's post yesterday.

. . . those Americans of African ancestry are the people with whom our history in this country most closely intertwines, whose struggles in an odd but compelling way most resemble our own, and whose rights as full citizens we above all should celebrate and insist upon. James Webb

Somehow -- at least to my ear -- those words sound different from calling someone a "macaca."

But then, what do I know.

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Ah yes--Al always is ready with the tu quoque. Anyway, 1)we already saw this at the Corner yesterday, 2)and who the hell cares? (In addition, it's not even comparable; Webb said stupid things about the Confederacy as party of a political speech, in a context in which politicans are expected to do such things. Allen proudly wore a Confderate pin as a high school student in California.)

Why don't you try to respond to the point Matt is making in the entire post...

 

But to your specific "allegation" that Webb is a racist because he visited a Confederate War memorial.  He said:

 

I found myself drawn to this deeply inspiring memorial, to contemplate the sacrifices of others, several of whom were my ancestors

 

His appearance there and comments in no way, shape or form was in praise of what the Confederacy stood for or a defense of it's symbol the "Stars and Bars".  He had ancestors who fought in the War of the States and was commenting on sacrifices that all soldiers make.  So all people who had ancestors who fought for the Confederacy in the Civil War are racist if they express pride in sacrifices those ancestors made?  So what was Allen's reason(s) for flying the Confederate flag?  A flag I haven't seen Webb defend at all...   

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I tend to agree with one reaction I've seen that the most offensive part about all this is Allen saying "Welcome to America" to an American--particularly one who's young and politically involved.

I find the "macaca" business intriguing though. There's enough circumstantial evidence to connect it with a racial slur, and I find that fairly convincing. I just wonder if Allen was completely aware of what he was saying.

I was reminded of a post on Brad DeLong's blog about Jeb Bush's reference to "unleashing Chang." In DeLong's analysis, this came from Bush Sr.'s allusion to Chiang Kai Shek http://delong.typepad.com/sdj/2005/10/unleash_chiang_.html but the Bush kids remembered it without really grasping what he meant.

I can picture Allen simply remembering his mom using the funny name "macaca" for some people and intuitively attaching it to Sidarth without ever making any rational connection of why. This hardly excuses the behavior. I just find it interesting to speculate on what could have been going through his mind. Somehow I doubt he said "Heh, I can throw in an obscure French racial slur here and no one will ever be the wiser."

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What I find particularly bizarre about the whole incident is that Allen, with his seemingly calculated wanna-be redneck, good ol' boy vibe, still somehow found a way to get in trouble for making a racial slur in French. Surely, after freedom fries and all that else, that can't sit all that well with Allen's base, can it?

"...a comparison between Webb's racial attitudes and Allen's racial attitudes. Which seems to me perfectly legitimate, since those are the two people vying for the election."

But we're not talking about the election. We're talking about a stupid racist remark that George Allen made.

It's not legitimate for the same reason that it wouldn't be legitimate if we were talking about some crazy-ass homophobic thing that Rick Santorum said, and you come along and say, "But Bob Casey doesn't support gay marriage!"

And - and - I can't believe I'm engaging you point for point on this, but it's not only Allen's more than interest in the confederate flag that makes him racist, it's the fact that he has a long history of doing all sorts of other racist stuff, of which this is just the latest example. That's what makes him a racist - being a racist.

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I hate to respond to a frequent comment troll and take his question seriously, but I actually think there's something that needs to be said about this.

Making excuses for the cause of the Confederacy, as Webb did... and as a great many Southerners of all political stripes have done... is a foolish and misguided thing to do. No matter how much they insist the Civil War wasn't about slavery, this is disingenuous. The Civil War itself was fought over the right of the Confederate states to secede from the Union. But the Confederate states seceded for only one major reason-- to preserve the institution of slavery.

If you don't believe me, read South Carolina's Articles of Secession. The first half is a legal argument about sovereignty. Once you get to the list of grievances, however, it becomes painfully evident that they were concerned about their sovereignty because those damn Yankees weren't returning runaway slaves and were passing laws to circumvent the Dred Scott decision. It becomes difficult to claim the Confederate cause was "freedom" without choking on the word.

On the other hand, Webb is almost certainly correct that most of the guys in grey were simply following what they believed to be their duty and defending their homes. Honoring the sacrifices made by Confederate soldiers is a perfectly decent thing to do when someone is standing at the Confederate Memorial.

I think criticism of Webb's statement is justified. He's making excuses, where none should be made. But, in context, this is a military man paying respect to fallen soldiers at a war memorial. It's a view that many non-racist Virginians hold. It fails to accept the moral failings of their ancestors, and that's a mistake. And coming from a non-native Southerner it's even less excusable. But there's nothing inherently racist about it. Hell, I'm from Indiana, and there's a statue at Tippecanoe erected to honor one of my ancestors who is noted for torching the last Shawnee village in the state. The South isn't the only part of the country with a checkered past. It's not always easy to strike the right balance between revering our history and coming to terms with its dark side.

But when a rich, redneck-wannabe kid in California flies the stars and bars on his pickup truck in the era of George Wallace, and then grows up to insult someone with a different skin color and imply that he is not a "real" American... he was not paying homage to fallen Confederate soldiers who died fighting to defend their homes from the torches of General Sherman. He was not honoring Virginia history. He was simply being a bigoted jerk.

I don't think one needs to be a "partisan" to detect the difference.

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