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I’m going to disappoint everyone here. I have some general ideas about solutions to the political problem we face, but they are not specific or sharply defined. For example, I think we need a more robust debate over economic issues in this country, one that isn’t bounded by the Wall Street Journal on the right and Thomas Friedman on the left. I think that if Democrats rediscover their populist, liberal, blue-collar roots, it would be a tonic for them in about ten different ways, and it would be extremely troublesome for Republicans, also in numerous ways.

For a glimpse of why, check out this post that somebody emailed me—the author says it better than I ever, ever could.

I agree with Greg that the Social Security issue is a perfect rallying point for Democrats to rediscover who they are and what they stand for—and also to rediscover the power of economic liberalism. I mean, look at the Republicans scurry on this one, after they’ve spent fifteen years and millions of dollars on PR campaigns badmouthing Social Security! (A digression here to plug my own work on Social Security privatization, which appeared in Harper’s Magazine back in 2002. Please be sure you read to the end, which is where my one good idea comes up: http://www.harpers.org/TrillionDollarHustle.html )



But the messenger is also important. So is the culture that surrounds us. And by this I mean more than simply the infamous conservative propaganda machine. On bad days, in fact, when I wake up and it’s raining and my head hurts, I sometimes believe that there is nothing liberal politicians can do to reverse the direction we’ve been heading all these years. The ideas that made figures like Roosevelt possible have disappeared from the conversation; the social movements that led to the New Deal are no more. And at the end of the day, the Democratic Party is a product of social movements, not a causer of them. If the movements—the small farmer movement, the labor movement, etc.—aren’t out there pushing anymore, why should the Dems continue to echo their concerns? (Actually, this is an interesting point in its own right, and I hope somebody takes it up. The Republicans, strategic thinkers always, do look out for their constituent social movements, while going out of their way to punish the other side’s. Meanwhile, our team, even when it had the majority in Congress, didn’t do much to make it easier for unions to organize.)


What’s more, the other team has perfected a way of responding to mass culture—1. get pissed off at what you see on TV. 2. blame liberals for it. 3. vote Republican—that we don’t even come close to touching. In fact, we don’t even think about it, since it’s not formally “political.” But as long as mass culture is out there doing what it does, Republicans will continue to draw the votes of the angry and the alienated.


But then I read posts like the one referenced above and my faith is restored: If only our guys would talk the language again, would put on that sunny disposition, would speak to people out in the midwest, why, everything would snap back into place.

 


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One answer to a question posed to you by other TPMCafe denizens is that you're not saying that cultural hot-button issues aren't important (at least I don't interpret that to be what you're saying).  

The problem is that many GOP voters are simply uninformed on economic issues and think that it's a wash between the two parties, when clearly the Dems' economic policies are far better for them.  The Dems are viewed with an unearned untrustworthiness due to these cultural issues.  Their perceived closeness to rich Hollywood liberals is equated to the GOP's actual closeness to CEOs and corporate interests, particularly those that do business with or benefit from decisions made in D.C. (which at some level is pretty much all of them).  However the Dems aren't acting as a wholly-owned subsidiary of Hollywood, unlike the GOP and corporate America.

Not sure this is the place to raise this question but what is the attitude toward Wal-Mart in Kansas as employer and as store?

If only our guys would talk the language again, would put on that sunny disposition, would speak to people out in the midwest, why, everything would snap back into place.

Me too. All the time. The last time only a few moments ago elsewhere on this page devoted to your work:

http://www.tpmcafe.com/comments/2005/7/27/132639/768/5#5

BTW The nattering nabobs liberals vengeance against Bush/impeach/why can't "they" see, if we just keep talking about those memoes, if we just keep bashing,

see how well it is working:

A majority of Americans think the country is on the wrong track, with the war in Iraq the most frequently cited cause for concern. But that discontent has not translated into gains for the Democratic Party....a new poll from Democracy Corps in which 56 percent of Americans say the country is headed in the wrong direction....Some 43 percent of voters said they had warm feelings about the Republican Party, while only 38 percent had positive feelings about Democrats. "Republicans weakened in this poll ... but it shows Democrats weakening more," Greenberg said. He attributes the decline to voters' perceptions that Democrats have "no core set of convictions or point of view."....

Negativism is not a popular product.

You're too modest.  Getting Democrats to talk consistently about the ways that workers get screwed would be wonderful.  Getting them to deliver tangible gains to workers, even better.  


Before the party gets to that, however, we have the demoralizing spectacle of the upcoming vote on CAFTA.  It's another door opened for U.S. corporations to profit from the abuse of foreign labor by hawking in US markets goods priced low from savings taken out of workers' hides.  The "freedom" that such free trade produces is hard to find, but too many Democrats will hide behind the free trade rhetoric, caricature critics as anti-capitalist protectionists, and again leave voters like the one who wrote to you to conclude that the Democratic Party has no consistent message for workers.  


Thanks for writing a great book.

"I think that if Democrats rediscover their populist, liberal, blue-collar roots, it would be a tonic for them in about ten different ways, and it would be extremely troublesome for Republicans, also in numerous ways."


This is fundamentally correct.


I have a huge amount of sympathy for the DLC. I think they are generally excellent at crafting good politics that is good policy.


And so their odd blind spot of the good policy and good politics of lunchbox liberalism completely confounds me.


It's just so obvious.


------


"I agree with Greg that the Social Security issue is a perfect rallying point for Democrats to rediscover who they are and what they stand for--and also to rediscover the power of economic liberalism"


Very true.


And the bankruptcy bill was a missed opportunity.


And the estate tax is an ongoing opportunity.


Valuing work over wealth should be the unifying thread for Democrats. It brings us together. It drives our opposition apart. It's an expression of our core values. And it leads toward a governing majority.

I see this problem in my everyday life, there's a class divide in this country.  I cross over from one side to the other as I go through my day.  When I talk to the college-educated, nice corporate job types, I speak standard English, throw in as much vocabulary as I think they will understand, wear my best clothes, and keep my face fixed in a smile.


When I talk to working class people, I drop the standard English, revert to my childhood language, use a fairly small vocabulary rich with idioms, and make my face as expressive as possible.  I talk about my family but mostly I listen.  


The condenscension I see from so many well-educated liberals towards the working class and middle class is almost palpable.  The working class wants a better life for themselves and their children.  If pushed, they often choose a better life for their children over themselves.


The people of the working class aren't fools, but, increasingly, they and their children are being frozen out of the good-paying jobs.  The schools aren't good enough, there's no money saved for college, and sometimes even the college graduates end up working retail.  


Democrats need to make it clear that they want those working class kids to make it in the world.  Democrats need to speak to people in their own language, not the standard English the elites use.  Democrats need to show how government can help people realize their dreams.

I originally posted this to yesterday's discussion but I'm reposting it here since most readers are not looking at yesterday's posts. Apologies if you read it twice.

After reading all these comments, I noticed that no one wants to acknowledge the "elephants" taking up so much of our political space: racism and religion. There were a few brief hints about these issues, but to me they are front and center.

Working class whites no longer see the government as protecting their wages and jobs- they believe the government now only does that for non-whites. So they won't support unions or government job efforts because they believe that these things will only benefit "the others". They fully understand that they have benefitted from past discrimination and will have to sacrifice their positions of privilege as part of the remedy. And they don't want to.

And the bigger elephant is Fundamentalist Religion with anti-abortion, gays, and evolution as the big guns. Fundies are terrified because they realize that to acknowledge the rights of gays and women's reproductive rights, or to accept evolution as true means that the things they always believed in are FALSE. These beliefs are the very foundation of their existence and they will do anything to sustain those beliefs. When they hear politicians who support those issues, they vote for them with a clear understanding that the office holder will use the power of government to promote their religious beliefs and make them feel that their beliefs are TRUE.

In short, they are not interested in sharing or sacrificing anything for other people they don't consider deserving, but will sacrifice anything to please God. If they could be convinced that God would be pleased by less poverty, more equality, civil rights, and shared sacrifice, they would vote that way.

But who are they going to believe, a politician or their pastor?(unless they agree) Just like we want to see moderate Muslim leaders renounce violence, we need Christian leaders who will expose the right for the frauds they are. They have to communicate their perception of what is TRUE for believers and explain why progressive positions are not in conflict with their religion. I see progressive religious writers being just as timid as Democrats in confronting the right. It's more of the "I share your goals, just not your methods."

We need religious leaders who will teach their flock about the values of a successful society and why it's consistant with their beliefs to work toward it.

I think that if Democrats rediscover their populist, liberal, blue-collar roots, it would be a tonic for them in about ten different ways, and it would be extremely troublesome for Republicans, also in numerous ways.

I think the part of the problems the dems are having at the polls is because they are trying to be more like the GOP.  Some dems incorrectly deduced that to gain at the polls we need to be more like the GOP in terms of our policies.  We have abdicated our position as the party of the people.  I know the DLC honestly feel their positions are good for America but the DLC positions have moved us away from the people.  And it is a losing strategy because the American voting public is more saavy then given credit for.  They realize when politicians take positions that are only intended to get them elected instead...and our credibility suffers.  Rather then trying to be more like the GOP we need to rediscover the roots of the democratic party.

"Some dems incorrectly deduced that to gain at the polls we need to be more like the GOP in terms of our policies."


If your policies are broadly unpopular, then you try to move toward the center. Both parties do this. Why do you think George Bush delivered Medicare prescription drugs and increased aid to schools?


"I know the DLC honestly feel their positions are good for America but the DLC positions have moved us away from the people."


On the issue of economic populism, I agree with you.


But for the most part, DLC policies have moved us closer to the people. The DLC took intellectual control of a 42% party and transformed it into a 48% party.


And most of what they propose today is a solid plan toward building a majority party. But they certainly have an odd blind spot for economic populism, and it would behoove them to rethink the subtleties of that portion of their worldview.

The elephant in the room that Mr Frank points out but that hardly anyone of any national stature seems to want to own up to is the incredible growth of the corporation at the expense of the average working man and woman. And the dems are the recipients of the anger on display in the comment Mr Frank linked to because they are the ones who pretend to be speaking for the "little" guy. This feeling of betrayal will only be assuaged by a courageous and honest voice that speaks to the fact that big money is hurting the country in a multitude of ways.

I just used this book club as an excuse to move Mr. Franks' book to the top of my reading pile. Thank you for writing such a well-written and thought-provoking book. 
I think one way that the Backlash narrative seems so daunting is that it anticipates its own critics, and so insulates its true believers from change, much like doctrinaire Marxists or Freudians. The narrative presents some real challenges for those of us who seek to reverse its effects on America. 
I am reminded of the recent pate of "democrats have no ideas"/"what do you mean? Dems have plenty of ideas" teapot tempests recently and thinking about how they relate to the Backlash. The weakness of the Dems isn't a lack of ideas, but the lack of an Idea--that one totalizing narrative that distinguishes a movement from a mere coalition. Without that Idea, then Dems will have a hard time looking like they stand for something with the authentic zeal that the backlash adherents see in their own leaders (whether real or not is a separate question). Other writers have shown the nitty gritty workings of the current GOP coalition, that allows some business interests to defer their own demands in favor of others, knowing that their turn will come; the Dems have no big Idea that can give people a sense of place. 
I think Frank points in the right direction--a re-connection with working class issues in a more economic frame--but how to get there from here will require more door-to-door, neighbor-to-neighbor politicicking than we are used to. I think also of more daunting personal barriers--as a professor at a small college, there are bound to be people who simply see me as one more oppressive professional when I try to pursue my own politics, thereby feeding the very monster I am trying to oppose. 
Any help in figuring out these things will be appreciated, but I'm afraid that we are in for a long slog indeed. 

I'm very much in favor of discussing economic issues in an honest way as they relate to working people.  The problem I see is that many on the left who do attempt this conversation are unable or unwilling to speak or write in a way that connects with those without a PhD or several Masters degrees.  To borrow from and paraphrase Malcolm X, we really need to speak about these issues in a language we can all easily understand.

And most of what they propose today is a solid plan toward building a majority party. But they certainly have an odd blind spot for economic populism, and it would behoove them to rethink the subtleties of that portion of their worldview.

I think the term "rethink" isn't strong enough petey.  If left up to me I say scrap it and start over.  DLC permissive economic positions favoring the corporations have damaged our efforts and support in the organized labor and environmental movements.  And if weren't for the move to the right, away from our core constituents, would all those people voted for Nader and the Green Party in 2000?  I am one who won't criticize Ralph Nader, he has consistently run for president for a long time under the progressive banner.  But more and more the base is looking for alternatives to the GOP-lite candidates.  I look at it this way...we had control of Congress up until 1992, people liked our policies and didn't vote us out because of our policies.  That is when the DLC started to assert itself.  I am not blaming the DLC for us losing Congress but they surely haven't made any strides in us retaking Congress.

And I vehemently disagree that the reason we lost power because our policies are "broadly unpopular".  We were victims of a masterful repug PR campaign smearing us about the House Post Office and Bank scandals.  We are about to make strides in the House and Senate not because the people like the "new and improved" democratic positions but because they don't like blatant corrpution in their elected GOP officials...the same thing that got us in '92. 

Dr. Frank,  I don't think you're getting it. You apparently believe that economics is the only fit object of politics, and you fault Republicans for seizing values issues. You wax nostalgic for FDR's "ideas" but you ignore the national and global crises that made those ideas relevant. And then you essentially sneer at the common folk for not embracing your particular variety of populism. As long as this attitude dominates the Democratic Party, the Repubs have nothing to worry about.

It's not clear that the government of one particular country can do all that much to shape the world economy, but it certainly is clear that it can do a great deal to shape personal behavior within its own borders.
 
The genius of the Republican program of recent years is its focus on those things that the government can affect. The Republicans are listening to the voters when they talk about their moral agenda. The average American father or mother doesn't want their teenage daughter dressing like and emulating Paris Hilton. This is a moral value, and the people who hold it are neither deluded nor ignorant.

Rather than sneering at working people for being concerned about the things they're concerned about, a reformed Democratic Party will take their concerns to heart and give them what they want: schools that perform and enforce discipline; a stock market that grows steadily and 401Ks that are worth something; affordable housing and consumer goods; and TV that doesn't offend moral decency.

The world we live in today is not about trade barriers and feather-bed union contracts, it's about performance, competitiveness, and accountability.

Instead of looking for The Trouble with Kansas you should be looking for The Trouble with Hollywood.

And stop sneering at The People.

Race may be America's most horrifying and most intractable problem.  We would be fools to ignore it.

The Republicans are listening to the voters when they talk about their moral agenda. The average American father or mother doesn't want their teenage daughter dressing like and emulating Paris Hilton. This is a moral value, and the people who hold it are neither deluded nor ignorant.

So American parents think the GOP will get their daughters not to emulate Paris Hilton?  And should it be the government's role to control legal behaviors of individuals?  I don't think so and I think the American people agree with me...the Schiavo Bill and the outrage it spawned tells me that a vast majority of the American people don't want government involved in their personal lives.  If parents don't want their daughters to emulate a millionaire hussy it is their responsibility to try to modify her behavior...not the government's.

I don't think so and I think the American people agree with me...

 

Do they agree with you at election time? It appears not. 

The condenscension I see from so many well-educated liberals towards the working class and middle class is almost palpable.

I think it's less condescension than frustration.  If you are educated, you may well see through the facts of the spin, (e.g. brainwash them with fear of terror and morph that into fear of gays).   Granted, if you aren't educated you may be even better as seeing through phonies.  The liberals are blocked from the working class by the inside-the-beltway DLC type suits.  So how do liberals connect?  I don't know the answer to that.  I don't think speaking substandard English is the answer.   Good liberals can certainly agree with good conservatives that striving to get a good education is a common value.  But as liberals we ought to be emphasizing not working harder (as in putting in more unpaid hours for Walmart) but striving harder for a balanced quality of life.

Do they agree with you at election time? It appears not. 

The past election had everything to do with Iraq and terrorism, and Kerry's lack of a plan/vision about it.  Not with "moral issues".  I hold up the reaction to the Schiavo Bill as how the American people feel about governmentally imposed morality...

Wow, sumbodhi, thanks for mentioning the real elephants here.  I might add that the fundies are not just trying to get their mistaken views of reality reaffirmed, but have essentially tried to use the political process to legislate those worldviews.  Galileo, watch out.

As a white guy mistakenly assumed to be another good ole boy by actual good ole boys in Red America, I can say from personal observation that the fear of having to compete felt by some racist whites of any color collar is the real driver behind this feeling that whites will lose out to minorities who face less net discrimination than in the past.  I have seen this in the crestfallen expressions of white workers who mutter about all racial groups having to look out for themselves and not provide help to other groups.  They are really complaining that they are not being handed a good paying job for relatively little effort like in the good old days.  They think they need the racism just to keep the playing field level.  Part of Clinton's appeal to white blue collar workers in 1992 was that he asserted that they could compete with anyone if they worked hard and didn't give up.  (Gore and Kerry never made that point.)

In both cases, progressives should be pushing for any non-regressive religious leader or good ole boys to stand up and condemn the regressives who are using race and religion as machetes on American society.  A little shame will go a long way. 

Dems have lost 7 of that last 10 presidential elections, and the ones they won featured Southern Baptist candidates.

The Keep-Schiavo-on-the-tube people screwed up and went too far, Dems and Reeps alike. That's going to happen, and it it's too extreme there will be temporary backlash like the one that re-elected Clinton.

But when it comes to school dress codes, teen sex parties, and keeping trashy stuff off of basic cable, the people are pretty clear about their desires, so don't confuse the occasional over-reach with being wrong on the basic premise. We'd all like to have monster houses and swimming pools, but not at the expense of our daughters' virtue.

But when it comes to school dress codes, teen sex parties, and keeping trashy stuff off of basic cable, the people are pretty clear about their desires, so don't confuse the occasional over-reach with being wrong on the basic premise. We'd all like to have monster houses and swimming pools, but not at the expense of our daughters' virtue.

Again it should have nothing to do with the government.  It is the parents responsibility to raise their children properly and not the government's.  If some people's daughters act like Paris Hilton and the parents are looking for someone to blame they should look no farther then the mirror.  They need to stop trying to be their best friend and put their foot down.  Whatever happened to personal responsibility?  When did it become the government's job to be our collective nanny?

Yes, there is a huge and growing class divide in America.  However, it is mostly self-imposed.

The global economy is presenting a choice to everyone in the western world: follow a certain path to success or suffer poor economic opportunities, shorter life expectancy, etc.  The successful path involves having an education, accepting the world as it is and adapting quickly to its changing circumstances.  Callused hands are not a guarantee of a middle class lifestyle anymore.

No government can alter that choice and still succeed in the world economy.  The competition is too tight and the cost of losing out are too high.

By and large, working class people are tuning that message out and dropping out.  Most are willing to work hard, and do, but not willing to do the type of work needed to lift their living standard and economic opportunities for their kids.  They go to college and drop out, or never go at all even though they know they should. They don't move where the jobs are, but wait for the jobs to return to them.  In how many towns has it been said to these workers "the factory is not coming back"?

The NY Times ran an excellent series on social mobility and laid this issue out quite nicely about a month ago.  These decisions are wrapped up in tradition, culture, family expectations.

So it's mostly sadness that the college educated feel for their working class brethren (including blood relatives!) who bury their heads in the sand and refuse to do better.  If the will existed in the U.S. to follow the route of Ireland, we could change these mindsets.  Putting the pieces in place to make this happen has to be the focus of economic policy for progressives.

What issue is Bush and the elites of the GOP weakest on?

What issue would show that Bush is not the "homeland security president"?

What issue would show that Bush puts corporate interests ahead of the interests of the American public?

[play Jeopardy music here] 

Congratulations! Yes, indeed, it's illegal immigration and border security.

I refer you to the presidential debate held at ASU. Shieffer said that the issue he got the most emails about was that.

Bush issued his stock spiel, and then Kerry showed that he had no clue.

If he had had a clue, he might have won AZ and the presidency.

If you aren't as familiar with this issue as you could be, check out lonewacko.com or any of the other fine sites that cover this.

There's no need to shout, I understand what you're trying to say; it's the same thing Frank says, that the little people are too hung up on the wrong issues, misguided little weak things that they are. You're arguing a position that's at best philosophical, but I'm talking about politics back at you, not philosophy.

So even if you're right, you're not going to win elections until you can think like a voter; not like a voter SHOULD, but like a voter DOES.

I am very confused by this reference to Democratic roots.  What are we talking about?  For much of its history the Democratic party might have been populist but it was the party of slavery and after the Civil War Jim Crow and racism.  Franklin Roosevelts genius was to take the fear caused by the Depression to weld an alliance betweeen the Southern Populist Rascists and  the urban ethnic immigrants and blacks of the North.  


John Kennedy as a Catholic was able to hold  this alliance together even as he began the Democratic Party's move behind Civil Rights.  Lydnon Johnson really propel this movenent and turned many a Southern Democratic into a Republican and many an urban ethnic often union member in an angry person.


This anger was exploited by Nixon, and then Reagan.  We are now in a world that is changing ever faster.  The Republicans have the language down of blame and resentment down.  It semes to me if the elephants in the room are race and religion and they become the central focus of Democratic thought then Republicans will continually ask how come the Democrats are for special interest groups while we are for the nation as a whhole?  This may be a lie but it has worked.


To ask of Thomas Frank didn't William Jennings Bryan lose the presidency three times?  McGovern and Mondale lost in landslides.  

<BLOCKQUOTE>In both cases, progressives should be pushing for any non-regressive religious leader or good ole boys to stand up and condemn the regressives who are using race and religion as machetes on American society.  A little shame will go a long way.</BLOCKQUOTE>

 It's a shame that progressives must seek outside themselves to find a religious leader.  There exist a great many people such as myself who feel that their religion is as fundamental to their being as their race.  We need a progressive vision that can be cast in continuity with the grand American religious tradition rather than one that diverges.

 I seek unity between faith and progressivism, not faith as a weapon to slash back with against the false prophets of fundamentalism.

 

Shout?  Where did I shout?  Shouting is posting in CAPS, I added emphasis to the main part of my point.  I see you have been rating all my POV's low even though I have not reciprocated seeing I disagree with you.  But I will rate your last reply low for calling my emphasizing my point a "SHOUT".

Negativism is not a popular product.

It's a little premature to count the Dems out already, isn't it? Right now, there's no need to be positive, i.e., offer policies, etc, right now.

But when it comes to school dress codes, teen sex parties, and keeping trashy stuff off of basic cable, the people are pretty clear about their desires

Based on what? Because you, or Hillary, or Lieberman, or James Dobson says so?

Or will you cite "polls." (hint: polls are not gospel and can be interpreted many ways.)

I don't think speaking substandard English is the answer.

Sorry, I know it's not all that relevant to the discussion, but the linguist in me can't quite let this go by.  Non-standard English is not substandard English.  Back to your regularly scheduled commenting...

One of the many big problems here in American is the whole meme about free market capitalism.  Sure it is noble to support labor so that they don't get royally screwed and these guys can buy a boat or an SUV... maybe even get some health care.

But this is a society where the meme is "winner take all"... and if you don't get caught you haven't committed a crime.  The republicans are unabashedly about Me, Myself and I ... couldn't care less about anyone else unless they can contribute to THEIR wealth creation.

The Dems or progressives traditionally fought for the little guy and they were doing fine because there are more little guy votes than big guys.  But now everyone is supposed to have investments, and own property and have securities and so on.. so more and more people start to think like repubs... the so called "middle class".  These are the people who vote and think like the rich because America tells them that they CAN be rich.  And some do make it over.

But more and more people are trying to make it over... and identify a good American as one with cash and economic success.  You can't promote worker's issues and make people wealthy.

This means that you need to chip away at the free market capitalism system which can only exploit someone some group and the planet to create wealth for a few.  No one in America wants to give away their wealth.. except the robber barons who have so much that they give to assuage their guilt.

Socialism and communism are so well discredited in this country that there is ONLY free market capitalism to rally behind.  And hey... didn't capitalism defeat communism?  We MUST be on the right path.

The dems try to tweak the system to introduce fairness to an inherently flawed and unfair system.  There are a few winners and the rest are losers and most THINK they can win so they buy into it literally and figuratively.

There wont be a revolution in this country... but there will be a collapse of capitalism because it will consume itself because of the notion of credit and some other factors... such as the ending of cheap energy.  When it comes it will make the depression appear as the garden of eden...

Struggle yes...  but this system is rigged and it will fail on its own. 

We are indeed in for a long slog. But a long-term strategy is precisely what is needed. Right now in this country everybody knows that the Republican Party is the "values" party. Everybody knows they're the small government party, everybody knows they're the fiscal responsibility party. None of these things are true, but that doesn't matter. And everybody knows that the Democratic Party stands for...dunno. Don't underestimate the power of letting them know where you stand. If the Democratic Party will not define itself (by the actions of its leaders and elected officials), then it will continue to be defined by Republicans.

This will require a cohesive vision and a willingness to tell the high-rolling money people to shove it. The Democratic elected officials who exist right now must embrace, wholeheartedly, a willingness to  work against corporate interests when they conflict with people's health and livelihoods and do so consistently. In fact, just make it a point of standing up to big corporate interests in general. They must be willing to work against the interests of the wealthy and powerful, and make sure that people know that they are doing it on behalf of the little guy. The Democratic Party must make a sustained effort to position itself as the doorway that middle and working class folks can use to access the halls of power that have until now been inaccessible. This is done through voting, through fighting power at every opportunity, through refusal to compromise on issues that affect the little guy. Do this for ten years or so, and when you ask people what the Democratic Party stands for, they'll say that it's the party that stands for sticking it to the man.

So step one, stand for something (besides winning elections). Step two, stand for it consistently and loudly. Step three, give it a chance to sink in.

Right now the loss in popularity that the Republicans are experiencing is not being met with a corresponding rise for Dems. This should be troubling enough to cause major disruptive change in the party. 

As I noted in Mr. Frank's previous thread, I have great respect for him and his work. He is a smart, eloquent documentarian.

Yet, I find myself in disagreement I think with at least some of what he says.

With respect to "the direction we've been heading all these years" there should be little doubt that the burden of taxation has been dramatically shifted from the wealthy and corporations to the middle class since LBJ waved his last goodbye to the American people in January, 1969, that the erosion of job security has caused a great deal of pain and anxiety in the lives of ordinary Americans (and has probably contribued to certain social ills), that the extraordinary inflation in housing, higher education, and health care has had an impact on our quality of life, that corporations probably have far more influence on government policy than they did a geneartion ago, that small and family farmers are *still* suffering twenty years after the first Farm Aid, that the bankruptcy bill is an almost unprecedented assault on the middle class, and so on...

On the other hand "the direction we've been heading all these years" affords women, people of color, and gays more liberty and protection under the law than they have ever enjoyed in this country. At the height of the new deal era, in the 1940s and 1950s, women could be denied contraception and terminating an unwanted pregnancy could mean time in prison, people of color were still being lynched and forced to ride at the back of the bus, and gays faced near certain ruin and possibly arrest for being honest about who they were.

Artists, whether poets, painters, songwriters, or filmmakers, have a measure of freedom to speak their minds that America never before allowed them, and while certainly some of our worst, most banal culture is laden with violence, sexuality, and profanity, a good deal of our best contemporary culture - that will be preserved and revered hundreds and thousands of years from now - is also as "degraded." For every Britney Spears and Temptation Island there is a Tupac and Pulp Fiction. American culture is beautiful, and NWA, Nirvana, Sleater-Kinney and Eminem are the rightful heirs to the great western cultural legacy that begins with Aeschylus and Sophocles and runs through Shakespeare and Whitman and Eliot and O'Neill and Crane and Hemingway and Ginsberg and so many others. American culture is part of what is right about America.

Furthermore, we have democratized higher education. Virtually anyone who wants to attend college today in America can. We have more academic PhDs than there are academic jobs. Jews and women and people of color are no longer systematically kept out of the Ivy League, as they were as recently as the 1950s. Women and people of color and gays become CEOs, television hosts, editors of major newspapers (hats off to the new African-American editor in chief of the LA Times),  elected officials, Oscar winning directors and actors, multi-millionaires and philanthropists. There is training available now for virtually every job that can be done in this society, and more democratic access to capital than anywhere on the planet, ever.

I am a liberal. I have almost always voted for Democrats, and when I have not it has been for greens or independents or libertarians. But as I look around me I see just as many if not more problems in this society that would be solved with less government intervention and regulation, and not more. The astromonical cost of housing is the single biggest strain on the middle class today - especially in blue states, and even before the current speculative run - and it is only going to be solved by building more (and hopefully sustainable) housing where it is needed most. Our public schools - especially our high schools - have come to resemble medium security prisons in the last quarter century. Too many smart, creative, promising kids (and not just in the inner cities and rural areas) are falling through the cracks, while teachers struggle against byzantine beuracratic rules that prevent them from disciplining or having real human interaction with their students. The Dutch experience with school vouchers has been largely a positive one, and I see little reason to believe that a progressively funded voucher system with oversight from the state and a guild for teachers would not be a positive alternative to our nineteenth century school system.

Do we need universal health care coverage in this country? You bet, but we also need to introduce market forces to lower costs so we won't have to resort to rationing. Do we need to close tax loopholes on the wealthy and corporations? Absasmurfly. Do we need to break the big ag trusts and cut off their subsidies? Yep to both. Does Wal Mart need to start paying its workers a fair wage? Of course. Do we need to repeal the bankruptcy bill? In it's entirety. Do we need to improve access to capital for small business and funding for retraining? Yes, yes. Do we need to limit corporate influence over government? For sure.

But as far as I'm concerned these are only tweaks and adjustments. America is the most prosperous and most free country in the history of this planet, and what it does not need is President Huey Long demagoging women, and immigrants, and gays, and artists, and enterprise in a bid to save the last five manufacturing jobs in America, not least because they are disappearing worldwide. I agree that liberals and Democrats more generally need to be more optimistic again, but that means having faith in the America that is and can be, and not an America that no longer exists.

I’m going to disappoint everyone here. I have some general ideas about solutions to the political problem we face, but they are not specific or sharply defined.

Mr Franks,

You didn't disappoint those of us who are by now long used to your particular blend of sarcasm, cheap shots and cultural snobbery. One would have to be deluded, or insufferably full of himself, to think anyone would look for "inspiration" to a man whose stock in trade is spite -- as indicated by this closing statement and so many others:

... my faith is restored: If only our guys would talk the language again, would put on that sunny disposition, would speak to people out in the midwest, why, everything would snap back into place. 

A gentle suggestion: RESPECT the workingman. Listen to him, to his wife, his parents, his children. Accept the fact that white working class Americans, no less than black or hispanic working class Americans, are religious and are concerned above all with instilling decent values in their children amidst an environment in which there is next to no security of any sort. 

Before you respond with your customary sneers, would you kindly explain to us whether you think that hispanic Americans, who increasingly are turning to the Republicans (Bush gained ca. 9 percentage points last autumn vs 2000), also deserve your cheap "false consciousness" rap? If not, then why are whites alone presented as caricatures in your book of grotesqueries? What is it about religious, homophobic lower-class whites that makes them, and not religious homophobic lower-class blacks and hispanics, fools and monsters? Conversely, do you think that an upper-middle class suburbanite who fails to vote his class interest is a dupe of some kind of "false" class consciousness?

Orwell described Dickens with admiration as "generously angry." You'd do well to add some generosity to your anger. In its absence all you have is spleen.

 

The average American father or mother doesn't want their teenage daughter dressing like and emulating Paris Hilton. This is a moral value, and the people who hold it are neither deluded nor ignorant.


Wow! You can repeat what you are told, even when it is obvious nonsense. That suits you for the job as a Walmart greeter you so obviously deserve. Who do you think watches Paris Hilton on TV ? The New School faculty? Who owns the networks that serve up crap like that? The Sierra Club? Like many people who repeat republican bullshit, you have almost certainly zero contact with ordinary Americans and you have a paper thin and blasphemous idea of morality. While children are being raped in Iraqi jails under OUR watch the republicans want to sneer about the slime television their contributors pour on the public and tell us about how fucking moral they are. This is nothing new, the pharisees and hypocrites are always with us.




To what purpose is the multitude of your sacrifices unto me? saith the LORD: I am full of the burnt offerings of rams, and the fat of fed beasts; and I delight not in the blood of bullocks, or of lambs, or of he goats.When ye come to appear before me, who hath required this at your hand, to tread my courts?


Bring no more vain oblations; incense is an abomination unto me; the new moons and sabbaths, the calling of assemblies, I cannot away with; it is iniquity, even the solemn meeting.


Your new moons and your appointed feasts my soul hateth: they are a trouble unto me; I am weary to bear them.


And when ye spread forth your hands, I will hide mine eyes from you: yea, when ye make many prayers, I will not hear: your hands are full of blood.


Wash you, make you clean; put away the evil of your doings from before mine eyes; cease to do evil;


Learn to do well; seek judgment, relieve the oppressed, judge the fatherless, plead for the widow.


"The American beacon helped to teach people everywhere to aspire to self-realization and to rebel against powerlessness. Now, it seems, the former students must re-educate Americans in the meaning of their own faith. Perhaps that is when the American moment will begin: when Americans find the courage to speak honestly again in the language of democracy."

William Greider - Who Will Tell the People

I'm not sure I agree with all your points, but a five to offset the heartless jerk who gave you a two for no good reason. This is a community people. Downrating civil, thoughtful comments for no apparent reason doesn't help to create a productive atmosphere, and sadly not enough TPM cafe-ers have apparently familiarized themselves with the norms of the scoop-based blogosphere. Ones and zeros are for right-wing trolls. Twos are generous warning shots for right-wing trolls. And threes suggest you have nothing better to do with your time than rate comments that don't interest you.

I'm not sure I agree with all your points either, but I uprated you (as I did another poster) because someone inappropriately downrated your comment. *Please* everyone show some civility, generosity, and common sense. Zeros and ones are for right-wing trolls and ad hominem. Twos are warning shots across the bough for right-wing trolls and ad hominem. Threes suggest you have nothing better to do with your time than rate comments that don't interest you. And fours and fives are for everything else. We're liberals, remember? We use positive reinforcement. We don't spank our kids except in the rare circumstances they're acting like super trolls, and we don't spank each other unless we're dating and into that kind of thing.

I don't know that I'd define Friedman as "on the left" especially after his July 22 column in the Times where he basically calls for a blacklist of people who "undermine" our war on terrorism by trying to explain why our opponents are doing what they're doing.

He said the State Department should monitor "excuse makers."
"After every major terrorist incient, the excuse makers come out to tell us why imperialism, Zionism, colonialism or Iraq explains why the terrorists acted. These excuse makers are just one notch less despicable than the terrorists and also deserve to be exposed."

So, I mean - not left.

Mossback: I don't think Frank says economics is the "only fit object of politics," only that it should be paid a hell of a lot more attention than it is. But the part of your post that I really don't understand is this: you claim that "government...can do a great deal to shape personal behavior." Really? Do you really think that inveighing against Paris Hilton is either (a) a proper task for government, or (b) something it's at all effective at?

Fact is, trash sells. That doesn't mean we can't do anything about it...but what needs to be done is to connect the right's Market Uber Alles philosophy with the very "immorality" the right condemns. They're force-feeding you nothing but Twinkies and then telling you it's the damned liberals' fault you're fat and pasty.

One way to try to reverse the marketization of everything is to note that if no values other than the bottom line are considered, the bottom line quickly turns to the lowest common denominator. Instead of a broad array of producers with varying concerns both aesthetic and ethical, we get nothing but buck-whoring shysters. But it's not "government" that should shape personal behavior - it's the people.

"Dems have lost 7 of that last 10 presidential elections, and the ones they won featured Southern Baptist candidates."

Without 9/11 and the threat of Islamist terrorism, the Republican Party would be facing roughly the same fate as the Tories in Britain. Just in case it hasn't been said enough by many people much smarter than me, John Kerry lost the last election because a majority of independents were afraid to trust him with national security in the age of Islamist terrorism, didn't believe he would be a proper steward of Mr. Bush's (apparent) effort to democratize Iraq and the broader Arab-Muslim world, or that he offered any alternative grand strategy in the so-called war on terror.

Values were, as they say, a red herring. The values vote has actually declined from its high in 1996 (an election you'll recall that was won by a Democrat, and one who couldn't always keep his zipper up), and John Kerry actually received a greater percentage of this bloc than any Democrat in recent years.

If you want to go ancient though, Bush Sr won in 1988 because the country was fat and happy and his opponent was a wuss who might raise your taxes. Reagan won in 84 for doing the things he was elected to in 1980, which was deregulate the economy, slay the inflation monster, and spend the Soviet Empire into ruin. And just in case it needs to be mentioned presidents from Nixon to Bill Clinton were all reasonably good stewards of the cultural liberalization that had begun in the late 1960s. Governor Reagan legalized abortion, and as president opened up daytime TV to all manner of glorious filth. 

Here's the deal: either the Democrats decide to become the war party, and make the democratization and liberalization of the Arab-Muslim world their cause, or the American people will not hand them the keys to the White House in 2008, and probably not 2012, 2016, or 2020 either. Domestic issues are in the near term just not the decisive factor  they were in the 1990s.

But don't get me wrong, and don't shoot the messenger. I'm not the personal ball washer of Bill Kristol and Richard Perle, and I'm really not advocating any course of action. Just layin it out. Both major parties are insufficiently libertarian for me, and I could really care less that some thirty-something mother of two in the Riverside County exurbs believes Grand Theft Auto is the greatest threat to western civilization since gay marriage (which is like so 2003, right?).

 Well it is a two-way street isn’t it? The fellow on the loading dock makes very valid points but what is he doing about it? Voting republican? I have worked on the dock, I have dug ditches, I have done logging, I have driven trucks, hell, I even got to bury a dead cow once. I also went back to school more than once so I wouldn’t have to dig ditches and bury dead cows. I became a mechanical designer where I have worked on everything from satellites to machines that simulate the electro-magnetic pulse of a nuclear explosion for testing instruments on military equipment. When computers entered the work scene I learned how to use them, I continued to go back to school to keep up with new programs for designing. The last time I went I spent six thousand dollars of my own money to pay for it. When I spoke out against free trade someone told me I should look in a mirror because that is where the problem was. Fooey.


 On top of all that according to right-wing pin-head pundits tell me I should pull myself up by my bootstraps even though is goes against all the known laws of physics.


 Folks, this is a government for the people and by the people and that means it is our government, not their government. Yes the democrats should reach out and they do need to change the way they are perceived but people also need to go out of their way a little bit to be involved, to be informed, to contribute even a small amount.


 Bloggers could help by speaking plain English so even dock workers can understand them. Dock workers neither speak Latin, nor do they speak French and they never say nattering nabobs of nepotism.

LBJ carried the South after passing the Voting Rights act. And polls showed that in 1968 Wallace supporters listed RFK as second choice.


If we had even a Mass Democrat with some spine and populism, the South would be competitive.

Quite frankly I think the spine is the key not the populism.  It was Clinton's willingness to fight back not any of his policies that helped gain him support against the Republicans.

That 6 word phrase of yours says it all.  In order to succeed, it takes a certain mind-set, as well as class advantages -- a conservative mindset, just like the author's.  The interesting point here is not that as long as you are conservative and pursue the educational path etc. you will succeed (how naive!) but that competition has become so tight that you can no longer succeed if you are 'against things'.  Times used to be that such attitudes were not incompatible with success (and still aren't in  many professions) -- but you have admitted what many conservatives have gone to great pains to deny:  there is no disadvantage to being conservative, including in academe on the whole.  There are still pockets of liberalism where (horrors to Betsy!) the RW is regarded with disdain, even though they hardly face severe real discrimination, let alone actual persecution, a claim they have expropriated from authentic progressives.

     Some will say that those who have not "succeeded" didn't have the right 'attititude'.  "I see it all the time" -- the shibboleth.  But it is just the same as those who claim that you can go to heaven -- provided you have the right purity of faith.  Success in society is becoming more and more like that.

I think you exaggerate both the 'timeless' greatness of "Pulp Fiction" (one of the better 'pop culture' positive examples you cited) and VASTLY UNDERSTATE the degree of the suppression of ideas and views in the world we live in.  As soon as ideas might matter -- such as in the possibility of providing a 'wild card' of a unique spur to opposition to wars, they are in serious danger.  Just ask John Lennon.

    And that one dramatic example might seem isolated, but there are many many authentic progressives, including artists, facing severe difficulties all the time in the real America.  I for one have never been able to get my poetry reputably published, although my poetry, as an aspect of my work, might not be the best example one could cite in genera (too subjective a standard.)   But overall, our culture is, like our news as described by Chomsky, a propaganda system and not a market, enforced, as Chomsky does NOT fully confront, not only by conformity but by brutal, usually veiled (Lennon an exceptional case there, Fred Hampton even moreso) repression.  Of course, it is veiled precisely so that it can be denied, and those who point it out can be pilloried -- both as false and pilloried with underground repression at the same time.

   How is Franks' approach any more snobby than anyone else's?  And as Ruy Teixeira has convincingly argued, at his website on the emerging Democratic majority (much of what he says I disagree with as pollyannaish and too DLC oriented) the Latino vote for Bush was initially vastly exaggerated, especially outside of Texas.

 <img class="mceButtonNormal" title="Bold" height="2" src="/tinymce/jscripts/tiny_mce/themes/default/images/bold.gif" width="11" border="0">  When it comes to spleen, you will find that those complaining about spleen or in general reacting supposedly against it often have the most of anyone.

Two things strike me of interest in Frank's posting. 
First, was the mentioning of Friedman on the left (egad!)  and the second was the gratuitous reference to a sunny disposition, which had not to my knowledge been supported by any of the evidence presented -- that Democrats have to speak to gut lunchpail issues more effectively, and, I might add, more substantively as well. 

    Just a semi-relevant paranthetical, before going into those two points: the posting from DU with 107 votes for greatest page (which might be at or near the all time record!) indicates much by that response from DUers.  The problem is not a cultural bias
on the part of blogosphere lefties, for sure, who are -- with some obvious exceptions on the thread itself -- the great majority of posters at DU.  The problem must be sought somewhere else, possibly in the realm of a blockage somewhere of effective authentic progressive organizing that would otherwise occur.  That is how what may seem an 'arcane' or 'effete' issue of underground repression comes in as key precisely to the addressing of the most basic issues that affect all Americans directly.  If people are not free to other than get with the program and to pursue effective authentic progressive strategies, as Frank proposes -- and if they are only allowed, so to speak, coffee makers that conform to the fire code, as mentioned elsewhere -- then the most basic concerns go unaddressed.  Authentic comprehensive freedom, not just to have performance horsesh** art but to really grapple with issues effectively (eg by having a peace movement organization, modeled after ACORN type groups that canvass door-to-door for members and donations and mobilize members in chapters, on the Iraq War and militarism generally) is the essential missing link, in my view, of why progressives have not been able to mobilize middle America more effectively. In turn, the greatest flaw of the progressives of the 'political class' (as the snooty expression goes) is the failure of courage to explicitly point out and confront that underground repression, the justifying of the lying, etc.  You can't have a canvass, say, on Iraq across the country until you confront the 'glass walls' of repression that prevent such a large scale idea from even being effectively pursued.

Back to the two issues.  First,  I myself am a socialist, and not the nice kind (like DSA) who basically have a liberal world view and then attach that to some Fabian Socialist ideas (with the notion that they, "Democratic" Socialists of America embody the only democratic approach to socialist politics).  I am a radical socialist who is firm in opposition to imperialism and at core is not averse to supporting national liberation movements where they are progressive for their circumstances and pose some reasonable chance of really making positive headway.

But on this site, where Chomsky, let alone my politics, is more or less beyond the pale of discussion (but Bernie Sanders was at table for one) I have put forward a series of bread-and-butter proposals that meet the following criteria -- they are workable and they have at least the potential for majority support.  These ideas include:

*taxes on pollution and scarce resources, and using a portion of those revenues for job creation or the specific protection of workers in their respective spheres.  For example, VERY high rates of taxes on redwood wood not only raising revenue but curtailing demand deliberately (eg to price redwood lawn furniture out for all but the rich) could also generate hundreds of millions or more in revenue in the State of California alone (it could be a State policy).  Much could go to ecological efforts, like buying up stands of virgin redwoods, as well as buying up clear-cut land by eminent domain, with a penalty for the spoilage of resources levied on those responsible, but much could go, overlapping those efforts, to generating jobs for virtually all the unemployed unionized logging workers, including especially in forestry, and not just in DEforestry.   On the issue of agrichemicals, even those toxic or suspected toxic chemicals allowed could be heavily taxed to discourage use, as well as agriwater (over the first acre-foot of usage per year).  These monies could go in part to help farmworkers' health from the damage that agrichemicals have done and continue to do, even with the much stricter regulation that should accompany the tax.  Other facilities (like adequate bathrooms) and enforcement, and public sector type "wealth" (schools, training programs, other public institutions beneficial to the workers) could also be financed from these monies.   (As a socialist I would like to see monies go into economic cooperativization of much agriculture, but I know, no dice). 

*Local unemployment caps -- there are areas of extremely high unemployment, where the rate in a given Congressional District or a contiguous area the SIZE of a Congressional District that have unemployment in the double digits.  A WPA type program could generate including jobs in the kind of small-size but large scale in situ housing development -- building neighborhoods instead of projects, without any need for 'urban removal' at all.
These jobs could include jobs in neighborhood development and housing, but also in eco-industrialization, in programs of training in public needs like health followed by work in community clinics, in urban beautification, and many other areas, like CCC and WPA did.  The areas with unemployment rates over 12% say, could have a number of federal jobs created equal to the official unemployment rate above that for eligible applicants living in the delineated area, with the understanding that the economic multiplier effect would radiate outward in the neighborhood and provide a third layer (over the investment as well as employment in the area) of boost.

It should be recalled that shifts in taxes not only to the wealthy (estate taxes and rollback of the W Bush tax cuts of those making over $200K) but also in the area of pollution and scarce resources could be at least partly offset by decreases in payroll taxes including those paid by employers that act as a disincentive to additional hiring.  Thus the disincentive would be to pollution, rather than to hiring, or production, or sales, within a given industry.  (Coal industry payroll taxes might be reduced as coal industry emissions are taxed, etc.)

These posted ideas (see:
http://www.tpmcafe.com/comments/2005/6/12/12013/3736/13#13
note BOTH comments)
are at numerous locations outlined, with little interest evoked:
http://www.tpmcafe.com/comments/2005/6/28/13391/0559/32#32
http://www.tpmcafe.com/comments/2005/7/19/135925/314/33#33
http://www.tpmcafe.com/comments/2005/6/25/122538/883/25#25

to mention a few. ( I am not coy about plugging my stuff -- after all, I NEVER get published in Harpers', so to that extent I have always had  to be my own parade even more!)

But these ideas are the complement to the kind of discussion raised in the DU post, to address masses of workers (the overwhelming majority of whom, at the low end, are white collar 'proletariat' not blue collar).
 
But these ideas, which I believe could help Democrats, especially in strongly Democratic areas, muster support, and not only enthuse the base but reach out to some skeptical mainstreamers, despite Republican inevitable protestations about too much taxation and too much regulation, are tailored to appeal to the center but are all to the left of Friedman.  I have a hard time coming up with ANY ideas as far right as Friedman that are worthwhile, except those things W Bush does that he opposes, and we both agree!  As far as I can see, the mainstream of the Democratic Party is emerging to the left of Friedman, accept those horrid DLC/Al From "Democrats" crusading to dump abortion from the Democrats' platform, grinding their own most invidious axes.

I agree then with Frank that speaking to the necessary issues, adding a few of my own substantive ones here to illustrate, means being to the left of Friedman, and it means focusing away from issues that are perceived as 'snobby' which Democrats have been trying to do.  I disagree that the Democratic Party must embrace an aggressive foreign policy to have popular support -- it must confront the real power elite's i-word preferences (imperialist) and unite with the mass public on the issues and in the language that most appeals.

But to do that, somewhere activists need to confront the elephant in the room of US politics -- underground repressive machine, 'get with the program' 'justify the lying' politics.  You can't make souffle using horsesh** rather than butter.

independent1,
I don't know how helpful this is to our discussion here, but I can't pass over the glaring contradiction in your comment:
"The condenscension I see from so many well-educated liberals towards the working class and middle class is almost palpable."

So, we shouldn't condescend to the working class, you say - but then you tell us:

"When I talk to working class people, I drop the standard English, revert to my childhood language, use a fairly small vocabulary rich with idioms, and make my face as expressive as possible."

When talking to the working class, make faces and use a small vocabulary.  In other words, talk to them as if they were children - i.e., condescend to them.

"Democrats need to speak to people in their own language, not the standard English the elites use."

Why not?  Because they won't understand it?  Because they're not capable of paying attention if we don't speak in a limited vocabulary rich in idioms?  That's shockingly condescending.

(Maybe you don't mean "condescension" - maybe what you're critiquing is disdain or dismissal.  But I'd think the working class wouldn't want to be condescended to.)

There's a serious strategic point here, too.  Don't people dislike phonies?  Isn't it easier to come across as a genuine, sincere person if you just be yourself rather than trying to imitate someone you're not?  Perhaps you, yourself, are fully at home with both college-educated professionals and the working class, and you naturally know how to talk the talk with both of them, even when it means using "childhood language"and broad facial expressions instead of "standard English".  But what if most Democratic candidates don't?  Does that disqualify them?

Reality Check 1: not everyone is college material, or wants to be. Some people just aren’t good at brain-work but that’s no excuse to denigrate their values as human beings, nor relegate them to some sort of neo-feudalist Helot existence.
Reality check 2: There are, and always will be, plenty of very necessary and useful jobs that do not require a college degree or high intelligence: from ditch digging to waitressing to retail clerking to health care aide work.
Numbers 1 and 2 actually go together quite well: people match up jobs! The problem is that the jobs do not pay decent wages or provide decent benefits., And so that is the challenge: not turning everyone into PhDs, but upgrading the work people do so they can live a dignified and (dare I say it?) middle class existence.

Re: The average American father or mother doesn't want their teenage daughter dressing like and emulating Paris Hilton.
This may well be true, but why in the world is it a political issue? If they don’t want their daughter dressing or acting like Paris Hilton that’s something to be dealt with at home by the family itself—it isn’t something that any politician has any power or concern over.
Meanwhile, the implication that working people are all a bunch of puritanical prigs is pretty well ridiculous. My tool-and-dye maker step-sister and her blue collar friends swear like troopers, drink like fish, love dirty jokes, R-rated movies and the like (who do you think all those Howard Stern fans are?), and have some pretty wild (and fun) parties.

as I myself am a libertarian about those kind of issues, and as someone who has studied lots of American cultural history, I think most Americans still are, deep down, and I think for the GOP to go there was to appeal mostly to socially conservative "bases" and not to the majority,

BUT I appreciate you taking the time to post here, as I think reading your feelings is helpful for everyone.

Still, have you read anything of Mr. Frank's work? I don't know where you get the idea that the "sneering" meme comes in with Frank, nor with a lot of commenters on this thread. It is interesting in itself that you can't let go of that, that you see it here. Reveals a bitterness that I think Dems should be attentive to.

It just seems to me right off by the words you use like you are still buying the whole "liberals are ridiculous p.c. free-loving hippies set to destroy civilization as we know it" culture war of the 60's that was revived in the 80's by the right wing media machine.

How many fans of Paris Hilton, or Barbra Streisand for that matter do you think frequent this website? Did you ever ask yourself where you got the impression that Democrats are "for" Paris Hilton or the decline of quality output by "Hollywood"? Perhaps they just bristle at the idea that the fix for that can be legislated?

I think coming across as a phony is far worse than anything else a candidate can do. John Kerry riding that motorcycle across the talk show stage, or going goose hunting. (Who hunts geese, except for lords of the manor in Dickens? Turkey shooting and deer hunting are the Midwestern hunting sports of choice.) George H.W. Bush professing a deep love of pork rinds and country music when he didn't even know the price of a gallon of milk. Both prime examples of cringe-inducing phoniness.

But, John Kerry windsurfing or skiing? Not phony, because it's what he would have done anyway. I think that moment could have been used to create an image of a virile, athletic individual who enjoys extreme sports, an image capable of blowing away the Right's caricature of Kerry as an effete, limp-wristed elitist. A lot of people windsurf and ski, and they aren't all rich.
Actually there is exquisite irony, and a much more complicated problem with the liberal approach to that which you put in such simple terms.

Those who are ridiculed as the "intellectual coastal elite" by the GOP often make fun of and ridicule "the people's entertainment," the Paris Hilton's et. al. the stuff of the Rupert Murdoch media empire and the like. Laura Bush jokes about "Desperate Housewives," and the liberal intellectual elite snootily deconstructs "Desperate Housewives" and the people who favor such things in academic journals.

The trashy nature of current popular entertainment is something picked on by both left and right. And it is the middle that they are seen as picking on.

I really do think you are buying into political propaganda if you think otherwise. All you have to do is look at what sells and what is popular in ratings for your proof.

This is not even particularly an American problem. I would point people towards reading about what is popular on Arab TV or much of Latin American TV.

As I see it, both the left and right elites dis the entertainment preferences of "the people," and if you buy into another "story" about that whole thing, you are falling for an interpretation that is definitely not populist.

Ask Tipper Gore.

I also live amongst the red-staters, many with necks to match. I too hear the racist comments and fears as well as the constant references to divine intervention in world affairs. It is an identity that these people desperately want to hold on to. They're not looking to be enlightened or educated, just reassured.

"John Kerry lost the last election": well, not necessarily...see the Conyers Report, and the cover article in the latest issue of Harper's, and...

" I for one have never been able to get my poetry reputably published, although my poetry, as an aspect of my work, might not be the best example one could cite in genera (too subjective a standard.) "

Keep at it. Most great work is eventually recognized as such.

" But overall, our culture is, like our news as described by Chomsky, a propaganda system and not a market, enforced, as Chomsky does NOT fully confront, not only by conformity but by brutal, usually veiled (Lennon an exceptional case there, Fred Hampton even moreso) repression."

To some extent I agree. With respect to film, the committee system is really no better than the studio system that preceded it, and its still very difficult to circumvent Hollywood's monopoly on distribution. But the universalization of digital production, post-production, and projection (not to mention the internet) will make possible the kind of entrepeneurial culture that we already have in popular music (many acts now have had significant success outside the big labels in recent decades) and publishing (Chomsky himself is evidence that one doesn't need to a kazillion dollar marketing machine to have one's voice heard these days).

"I think you exaggerate both the 'timeless' greatness of "Pulp Fiction"..."

Doubtful. Tarantino is one the rightful heirs of western culture's postmodern tradition (which begins with Euripedes). The romantics may dislike them both, but their view is too narrow.

"As soon as ideas might matter -- such as in the possibility of providing a 'wild card' of a unique spur to opposition to wars, they are in serious danger.  Just ask John Lennon."

I don't know what a "wild card of a unique spur" means, but I do know that there are many great examples of anti-war culture from classical Greece to contemporary America. Stanley Kubrick as I recall was not stoned to death for making "Full Metal Jacket."

"I'm not sure I agree with all your points either, but I uprated you ... because someone inappropriately downrated your comment."


Rather than trying to game the system, perhaps you should rate comments depending on the comment, instead of how others rated it.


"Zeros and ones are for right-wing trolls and ad hominem. Twos are warning shots across the bough for right-wing trolls and ad hominem."


Perhaps you might want to review the ratings guidelines instead of making up your own.


"Please everyone show some civility, generosity, and common sense."


Which of those does categories your practice of revenge ratings fall under?

"Which of those does categories your practice of revenge ratings fall under?"

I uprate comments inappropriately downrated, and get justice when I have been wronged myself.

There's a reason you were repeatedly evicted from the dailykos Petey, and it isn't your politics.

Just be cool. Why is that so hard?

I'll boil down my response to a hopefully useful meme:

"Clarity should never be made an enemy of intellectual expression, lest we cede the speech of leadership to imbeciles."

It was so shockingly condescending that I assumed it was a joke, a little humorous hyperbole.

It reminds me of when Ralph Reed tried to get blacks into the Christian Coalition tent by speaking in ebonics and talking like a hipster.  He just wound up looking like a mildly brain damaged middle-aged white guy. 

Let's not forget that the system that beat Communism was the mixed economy of the fifties, sixties, and seventies, not the winner-take-all society we live in today.  Had that system been in effect then, the socialist alternatives might have prevailed.

So why couldn't we keep that system?

Me thinks you've exposed some college-educated elitist assumptions here. :)

Reality check on reality check 1.  By education, I primarily meant college.  College is the new high school.  Saying that people are not cut out for it is an amazingly derogatory statement.  College is the key to providing the foundation for being able to move between careers and between those white and blue collars. 

However there are several other education avenues that lead to decent paying blue collar careers.  Machine and tool and dye shops are dying for new blood, as are the construction trades.  There's just plenty of people who are willing to settle for a harder life rather than grabbing the skills needed to get to middle classdom in our ever evolving economy.  Second, the reality is that opportunities are often driven by geography and skills training.  If you refuse to go where the jobs are, like everyone's ancestors did at some point, you suffer the consequences.  Plenty of working people are doing this with their eyes open.  And of course, there's always the possiblity of starting your own business in something you love, educated or not.

Reality check on reality check 2. Holy snobbism, Batman, did you say that there's plenty of useful jobs that do not require high-intelligence like ditch-digging and waitressing?  They never were and never will be a path to a middle class income.  And many of these jobs do require "high-intelligence" just not the kind that gets you straight A's in college.  If you've ever watched a plumber "dig a ditch" and then explain the fluid dynamics behind the sealing of a water service line sleeve to a totally confused post-grad, you'll know what I speak of.

Finally, I wholeheartedly agree that people will match up to jobs very well that pay well, but only if they follow their passions and their talents and pay some attention to where the opportunities exist.  Problem is, lots of working class people believe it's not possible to acheive that and don't bother trying.  The social feudalists have convinced them that they can't change their station in life and that's better to rail about where one can find a copy of the ten commandments in public buildings.  It's not the work that needs upgrading (whatever that means), it's the negative mindset that needs challenging.

I agree with this post.  Even liberals here in the Deep South often get frustated and disgusted with the condescending attitude of the stereotyped "northern liberal cultural elites" who are the boogeyman posited by the radical right.  The problem is this attitude actually does prevail in the Dem party oftentimes.  Kerry lost at least partly for this reason.  Even though it was mostly values and national security that defeated him, tthe labels of flip-flopper, soft on terror, etc. stuck because much of the country (even some of us who voted for him) thought he had a morally relative, big city elite mentality that would not allow him to level with the American people.  While I believe the labels were unfair, a Kerry/Dukakis/Mondale type is not going to win a general election.  We need more Clintons to win the heartland voters.

As a footnote, a big problem here is the advice from consultants and other campaign workers who almost universally fit into the cultural elite category.  I worked this past cycle in a southern Senate campaign and it was amazing the contempt our staff (who were all trucked in from New Hampshire, Vermont, Boston, and California ) held for Southernors.  Northerners simply do not know how to appeal to Southern voters.  Blame the Bob Shrums of the world (deservedly), but have campaign staffs know the area they are working in or Dems will be stuck as the minority party in Congress for a very long time.

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